So is the law.

So it isn't Cialis at all then, is it.  And as an unapproved new drug,
tadanafil-generic is illegal to import to the US unless it is labeled
as clinical supplies under an active IND.

I gave you plenty of evidence that the pharmaceutical industry in
India has a significant problem with counterfeit drugs.  What makes
you think that the Cipla or Ranbaxy labels are genuine?  What makes
you think Cipla and Ranbaxy are quality manufacturers?  What makes you
so confident that what this website is selling isn't fake?

As far as I could tell - and I looked - Cipla does not have a single
approved NDA - not one.  As such, the FDA would not be required to
inspect their manufacturing facilities.  They do have a thriving raw
materials capability but API approval is not the same as an approved
DMF.

Even if the company is as good as you say, there is no evidence that
the content of the package you receive actually came from them.  In
the case of Indian counterfeits, it is reasonable to think that
imitating the local market leader is a viable strategy to pursue.  If
you were to receive a drug with a Cipra label, would you recognize it
as fake?  What would you compare to?

What you are likely to get are people who actually know something
about science and medicine.

You want medical advice from someone who is breaking the law and
misusing drugs?  To each his own.

This is what you said -
"Shoprxonline is reputable but there are those that aren't."
and you know this because soemone on an NG told you so.

Here you go - this is one of this reputable company's policies:

"In order to make your shopping experience hassle free, our qualified
on-staff physician will issue a prescription for each order so we can
legally fill and ship your prescription."

This doesn't raise any questions about ethics in your mind?

And this:

"U.S. medicine names are for reference only. You are purchasing
equivalent medicines from India. The medicines are made under strict
regulations and often by the same pharmaceutical companies that
manufacture in the U.S. such as Pfizer, GlaxoSmithKline and Bayer and
the facilities are FDA approved."

Do you actually believe this is true?  The part about them being
manufactured by big pharma and then labeled locally and sold at
pennies on the dollar?

Or this: "All of our generic medicines are manufacturered in FDA
approved facilities and come in factory sealed packaging with
expiration dates."

Buying offshore over the internet, especially from India, is a foolish
and dangerous thing to do.  I gave you a dozen sources that provide
evidence of the risk - from FDA to BBC to the Indian government
itself.

Are you really that cavalier to suggest that the risk is worth the few
dollars you might save?  Health is about the only thing you can't fix
with money once you screw it up.

And then to argue that it's ok because you have a weightlifter NG
following that has identified the good ones?

That's pretty dumb, in my opinion.  But you are entitled - go for it
and become another example that Darwin was right.

js

If that's what you regard as counterfeit, you're correct but pedantic.
As you're well aware advertising Tadalafil or Sildenafil Citrate is
likely to produce a big "Huh?" from the prospective purchaser so these
companies (all of them) use the US brand names and add the word
"generic". Last time I checked Lilly doesn't sell Cialis in capsule
form either.

By "counterfeit" in connection with medication I (and I suspect most
people) understand that instead of Tadalafil you'd be getting a
capsule that contained no or insufficient active ingredient. Most of
your URL's in fact use counterfeiting in this sense and those from
India are certainly not referring to the products of Cipla or Ranbaxy.

Hmmm, don't think so. All you're likely to get here is the pure
conservative voice of Big Pharma--that is when they're not arguing
about autism or vaccination--just as you're expressing. The people on
the body building groups are ordering/acquiring scheduled drugs so
they not only have to worry about monetary loss but also that the
drugs might be delivered by the DEA. It's extremely important to them
that the source be reliable and discrete so you'll find long term
posters (check google) with a good track record endorsing or
condemning particular suppliers. Unlike sci.med it's a case of users
helping other users.

AFAIK shoprxonline doesn't deal in scheduled drugs and its main items
are the PDE5 supressors so the place to ask about them is
alt.support.impotence. The same attitude of mutual help prevails on
that group.

The Indian press is a bit skeptical of their own pharma industry.
http://www.blonnet.com/2003/08/03/stories/2003080301260500.htm
http://www.sundayobserver.lk/2003/11/30/new22.html

The Indian Parliament is considering the death penalty for
manufacturers of counterfeit drugs - why?  Apparently because they
kill people.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/3331985.stm

Here's more.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/3261385.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/1912170.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/1912226.stm
http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/327/7412/414-b
http://www.who.int/inf-pr-2000/en/pr2000-WHA02.html

The FDA has some pretty specific examples of Canadian drugs that
actually are counterfeits from India.
http://www.fda.gov/oc/initiatives/counterfeit/photo3.html

Here is the FDA's policy statement:
http://www.fda.gov/oc/initiatives/counterfeit/qa.html

I don't buy the argument that the FDA is intersted in anything more
than patient dafety.  And I think the evidence provided to date
suggests that counterfeit drugs is not a trivial or inconsequential
risk, especially if drugs are purchased internationally over the
internet.

They promote a generic Cialis.  This is, by definition, counterfeit.
No one is licensed to make a generic Cialis anywhere in the world.

I don't think NGs are a good source of anything more than opinion.  I
like the links better.  But if you want medical advice, sci.med has
got to be better than drugs.use.illegal.buffmeupp.

js

And increase Big Pharma's profits.

You'll notice that lots of weasel words such as "unapproved" are used
without saying just what that means. In the case of shoprxonline the
drugs, produced by Indian pharmaceutical giants such as Cipla who also
produce some of the US drugs, are approved...by the Indian government
for use and sale in their country. And since they're exported around
the world and we haven't heard of any fatalities (and Big Pharma IS
watching) I guess they haven't killed too many people.

You'll also notice that most of the fda's complaints concern not
counterfeit drugs but things such as "Drugs with dangerous reactions".
They might conflict with other drugs the customers are taking thereby
cutting both Big Pharma and big medicine out of their super-profits.
It's not too hard to read up on the drug using the same (or better)
sources than your average PCP. See Medscape DrugInfo or Rx.com or
Drugs.com (the PDR).

Shoprxonline is reputable but there are those that aren't. However
asking in sci.med is hardly wise. Try one of the weightlifting groups
or the impotence group for up-to-date info.

...

Sure, if you don't mind counterfeit drugs:
http://www.fda.gov/bbs/topics/NEWS/2003/NEW00948.html

Stay away, stay very far away...

I noticed that prescription drugs, such as Cipro, Mevacor or Cialis, are
available at
30% to 50% of the price in the US, if bought by mail order from India. The
website looks just as reputable as most Canadian pharmaceutical websites.

I thought I might try them. Can anyone comment on any problems with ordering
prescription drugs from India?

Example: http://www.shoprxonline.com/srxo-orderinfo.html

Thanks for any input.

--
James
-