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Medical Forum / General / Vision / March 2006

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Superior Epithelial Arcuate Lesions

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Neil Brooks - 24 Mar 2006 19:58 GMT
Ugh.

Third try at fitting intra-limbal lenses at SCCO yesterday.  First
pair, inexplicably, lacked cyl (I'm -1.75 and -2.00).  

Second pair had cyl but were, inexplicably, about 2d over-plussed.

Yesterday's pair had *almost* enough cyl, but were at least a diopter
over-plussed ... and hurt like he**.

As they looked at fit w/fluorescein, the doc saw SEAL OU.  Grade 3+

Conventional wisdom seems to say stay out of CLs for a couple of days,
then fit a different brand/type/material of CL (working on it).

My eyes are infinitely better with CLs than with glasses.  With
glasses, I'm fairly well trapped inside (b/c of the severity of dry
eye)....

I'm using drops (Systane and Soothe) and putting in Lacriserts during
the day.  Anything else I can do to speed healing?

Got some Lotemax and some Flarex in ye olde cupboard, if anybody
thinks either is a good idea.

TIA,

Neil
Still a high-hyperope after all these years of near work.  Sigh.
STAIRCASE MYOPIA: WHERE ARE YOU!?!
Scott Seidman - 24 Mar 2006 20:08 GMT
> Ugh.
>
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
> Got some Lotemax and some Flarex in ye olde cupboard, if anybody
> thinks either is a good idea.

Have you considered using a simple plus lens?  That'll fix ya right up!

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Scott
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Neil Brooks - 24 Mar 2006 20:29 GMT
>> Ugh.
>>
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
>
>Have you considered using a simple plus lens?  That'll fix ya right up!

My gut tells me that the chimerical "threshold" is long gone for
me....
acemanvx@yahoo.com - 25 Mar 2006 00:04 GMT
whats that guy doing with surgury? Hes had three surguries and damaged
his eyes and still has a refractive error and needs glasses! Ironic and
sad
Neil Brooks - 25 Mar 2006 01:05 GMT
>whats that guy doing with surgury? Hes had three surguries and damaged
>his eyes and still has a refractive error and needs glasses! Ironic and
>sad

Care to explain yourself there, Ace?
Dr. Leukoma - 26 Mar 2006 15:27 GMT
Getting contacts at a school of optometry is like getting dentures at a
school of dentistry or a haircut at a barber school.  Good luck!

Of course, paving the cornea over with a large piece of plastic will
keep the moisture in.  My only concern with using an intralimbal lens
in this situation is that the entire lens must be supported by the
pre-corneal tear film.  You might enquire about using a soft bandage
lens underneath the intralimbal, in which case the intralimbal will
need to be modified to fit the soft lens.

DrG
http://www.coppellfamilyeyecare.com
Neil Brooks - 26 Mar 2006 17:23 GMT
> Getting contacts at a school of optometry is like getting dentures at a
> school of dentistry or a haircut at a barber school.  Good luck!

Well ... there go my next two questions ;-)

Actually, you're quite right.  I think their faculty is outstanding.  I
wrote on Thursday that I need the faculty to take over my case.  They
can parade my peepers in front of any body they want to, but ... on the
last two visits ... it was all student, and I feel I made zero
progress.  It's also 190 miles round trip :-(

> Of course, paving the cornea over with a large piece of plastic will
> keep the moisture in.  My only concern with using an intralimbal lens
> in this situation is that the entire lens must be supported by the
> pre-corneal tear film.  You might enquire about using a soft bandage
> lens underneath the intralimbal, in which case the intralimbal will
> need to be modified to fit the soft lens.

Interesting.  I will inquire about this.

All things being equal, what CL would you recommend for a high plus,
moderate astigmatism dry eye patient??

Thanks much.
Dr. Leukoma - 26 Mar 2006 18:56 GMT
Probably a scleral with cylinder ground into the front of the lens.
The scleral portion of the lens will prevent it from rotating, unlike
the intralimbal which needs to rotate freely if it has a front cylinder
prism ballast correction.  Or, wear the astigmatic correction in
spectacles over the contact lens.

DrG
Neil Brooks - 27 Mar 2006 17:34 GMT
>As they looked at fit w/fluorescein, the doc saw SEAL OU.  Grade 3+
>
>Conventional wisdom seems to say stay out of CLs for a couple of days,
>then fit a different brand/type/material of CL (working on it).

Follow up....

Had the CLs out since Wednesday.  Used drops, Lacriserts, and warm
compresses to treat the SEAL.  

Tried the CLs last evening to have dinner with friends.  Bad, bad
move.  Fairly ok for first 20-30 minutes (enough time to get to
dinner), but ... awful after that.  Could barely keep eyes open.  Hurt
like he**.

Shouldn't 3 1/2 days be enough to clear SEAL ... if that's what it is?
Also, when I drove up to SCCO on Wednesday, I had been wearing the CLs
like usual ... no problem.  Does it make sense--if the Dx of SEAL was
right--that an intra-limbal GP lens, of app. 11.2mm dia, could/would
cause further damage to the same region that SEAL affects??

I'm really impaired without access to my contacts.  Trying to decide
whether to give a shout out to my usual (UC San Diego's Shiley Eye)
clinic to see if they can evaluate me.

Any advice??

TIA,

Neil
Dr. Leukoma - 28 Mar 2006 06:36 GMT
> >As they looked at fit w/fluorescein, the doc saw SEAL OU.  Grade 3+
> >
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
>
> Any advice??

Er, Neil, I think that SEAL is typically induced by contact lens wear.
In view of the discomfort, I would think that you need to have the
contact lens fit re-evaluated.

DrG
Neil Brooks - 28 Mar 2006 18:03 GMT
>> >As they looked at fit w/fluorescein, the doc saw SEAL OU.  Grade 3+
>> >
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
>In view of the discomfort, I would think that you need to have the
>contact lens fit re-evaluated.

I didn't phrase my question very well.  Let's see if I can do a bit
better this time....

I wear CooperVision Hydrasoft DW lenses normally (nearly every day;
nearly all day).  As you know, I have chronic eye pain and dry eye.

It's my understanding that SEAL *is* induced by soft contact lens
wear.  It's also my understanding that many people who have it are
asymptomatic until evaluated with fluorescein and ye olde slit lamppe.
So there I went ... up to SCCO to be fit for the intra-limbals,
thinking all was well.  I've inserted a total of three pair into my
eyes on two different occasions, wearing none of these pair for more
than ten minutes and experiencing severe pain on each occasion.  

On the first occasion, the intern looked at my corneas after I removed
the GP and told me that he saw SPKs at that point that he did not see
pre-insertion.  He told me to baby my eyes for a bit.  I'm presuming
that he neither looked for, nor saw, the SEAL.

Second visit -- last Wednesday.  Presumably, I arrived with SEAL,
though--again--nobody saw it prior to insertion of the GPs.  The GPs,
again, hurt a great deal.  The doc put in the fluorescein--his goal:
to check fit--and identified the SEAL at that point.

What I'm wondering is this: I came away from each of these
appointments in signifcantly worse shape/pain than I arrived in.  It
surely seems possible that I had SEALs all along from ill-fitting/long
wear of my SCLs, but ... I didn't seem to notice it.  It seems like
the mere trial of the GPs brought it on.

My question is: assuming the SEAL was there all along, does it make
sense that the intra-limbal lens--big and hard and sharp-edged as it
is--at 11.2mm dia--would have rested on, and further damaged, the
superior epithelium with just a couple of insertion, trial, and
removal maneuvers?  I'm picturing the plastic lens scraping over this
raw area of epithelium that my SOFT CLs had made relative peace with.

I'll be calling my regular docs in San Diego this a.m., to see if
anybody can look at my corneas today, but ... I'm certainly confused
... and certainly saddened by this event.

If it IS the soft CLs ... and if they DID cause this SEAL ... then I'm
in a pickle.  Can't really try to refit new soft CLs ... OR the
intra-limbals ... until the SEAL clears, I presume.  That, again,
leaves me a relative captive of the indoors until all is better ...
which is a really draconian sentence.

TIA,

Neil
Dr. Leukoma - 28 Mar 2006 18:18 GMT
As you stated, your SEAL was asymptomatic.  SEAL typically repairs
itself within a couple of days.

You only felt pain with the RGP's.  You FEEL pain, cannot tell what is
causing the pain, and yet feel compelled to blame it on the SEAL.  I'm
not so sure.  Seems like someone knowledgeable needs to take a look, or
at least do a fluorescein stain.

DrG
Neil Brooks - 28 Mar 2006 18:23 GMT
>As you stated, your SEAL was asymptomatic.  SEAL typically repairs
>itself within a couple of days.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>not so sure.  Seems like someone knowledgeable needs to take a look, or
>at least do a fluorescein stain.

Actually, I tend to agree with you: not so sure that it's SEAL at all.
That's just the label that SCCO hung on it, so I've been looking at it
from that perspective.  It surely looks like SEAL's just a weekend
thing....

I'll try to get in to see the local folks asap.  Thanks, as always,
Doc.

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