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Medical Forum / General / Vision / February 2006Return of orthoK, we called this center and they claim it corrects -8 myopia and -4 astigmastim
Return of orthoK, we called this center and they claim it corrects -8 myopia and -4 astigmastim! Their quoted price was $600-900 for both eyes which is a reasonable price. I could not believe the claims, but the sectractary insists its possible. I told her I heard on the internet one optometrist could only achieve a maximum of -4 diopter correction, he never got a patient corrected more than -4 and anyone with more than -4 of myopia got a partial correction. I also read that websites say orthoK can address up to -6 in theory but -3 to -4 is the pratical limits. No matter, ill be happy with a -3 diopter reduction in my myopia, this will slightly undercorrect me but enough to reduce my dependancy on glasses while still not needing reading glasses. I may make an appointment there asap :) Dear Ace, Subject: Verify claims. I have heard many claims of this nature. Ask them for a money-back guarantee of 20/40 or better -- by your own verification. If they clear your vision to 20/40 or better -- pay them. If they do not -- they do not get paid. See if they will sign that type of contract. Best, Otis >Dear Ace, > >Subject: Verify claims. Pot ... kettle ... black ... >I have heard many claims of this nature. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >See if they will sign that type >of contract. More importantly, Ace: ask them whether they have read "The Printer's Son," or if they can claim to have prevented their own nephew's myopia? As long as they have, then it's a certainty that their claims are legitimate. No further inquiry is required.  SignatureLive simply so that others may simply live > Ask them for a money-back guarantee > of 20/40 or better -- by your own [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > See if they will sign that type > of contract. No legitimate medical person would sign such a contract. In particular, OrthoK requires patient compliance. SignatureDan Abel dabel@sonic.net Petaluma, California, USA Actually, I give that guarantee already. Rarely does it need to be initiated, but 3 or 4 times in the past 12 years it hasn't worked well enough to get a satisfactory result. Then there was athe girl who got perfect 6/6 and had a reaction so I pulled her from the lenses and refunded the money. dr grant update: We called the doctor himself and he refuted the sectary's claims of it correcting -8. This much myopia isnt possible anytime in the near future if ever due to the nature of molding your cornea. I guess its analogious to fitting a size 10 foot into a size 3 shoe. He said difficult cases are -4 to -5 diopters. That sounds more like it. He wouldnt make any guarantees except that the less myopia, the easier and to have relistic expectations. Some are disapointed to end short of 20/20(they would never make good lasik candidates either!) But with orthoK you can simply stop this procedure and have your pescription revert back. Thats the thing I like about it. "I have heard many claims of this nature." Most will claim -6 or more but in reality, -4 is the pratical limit where you can expect a full correction. I know one optometrist who never fully corrected more than -4 but others have claimed to correct as much as -5. "Ask them for a money-back guarantee of 20/40 or better -- by your own verification." Most places dont offer this guarantee because they spend the time and money doing orthoK on you. Others will give a partial refund. "And you're going to rush right down there to hand over $600-900? sign me up -:)" We will call all the orthoK centers first, but $600-900 is probably going to be the best deal. "Actually, I give that guarantee already." You probably wouldnt guarantee anything for higher myopes like me except that my vision will improve at ALL and that I wont develop a reaction or infection. "They do it -- and then "nothing happens"." Define nothing happens. If their myopia went down at ALL then something indeed did happen! Whatever astigmastim I have will be taken care of, its very small, should be no more than -1 so this isnt the issue. My myopia isnt an issue either since some of it is pseudomyopia plus I have "presbyopia" so as long as I achieve enough reduction in myopia to greatly reduce my dependancy in glasses, its a success! All I ask is to be less myopic than where I am now! Courtray to what you think, -5 is quite bad! I will read more about orthoK and get back to you Heres my comments from what ive read so far: 1. OrthoK is the safest way to reshape your cornea. No cornea is removed, ablated or destroyed. Its analogous to a belt shaping your waist to a slimmer shape. 2. OrthoK is about a third the price of refractive surgury. 3. OrthoK not being permaent is much more of a blessing than a curse. Get lasik or PRK and if you arent satisfied, too bad your stuck with it, theres no "undoing" surgury. Not happy with orthoK? Just stop wearing it and in short time youll revert back to the way you were and go back to glasses. 4. Theres people arguing that lasik is quick, effective and permaent while orthoK takes time. Whats the hurry? Slow and steady is where its at :) 5. someone said "That could put the laser centers out of business in a hurry!" We have yet to see this happen but once contact and orthoK technology experiences a breakthru, it very well could. Who would risk their eyes with lasik when orthoK will give you clear vision for a week with just one night wear? 6. no drugs nor chemicals are needed for orthoK, just sometimes artifical tear drops which are just mostly water anyway without medicines or chemicals 7. I obtained good result in orthokeratholy up to 4.00. I asked an ortho-k OD and he said that ortho0k is good for people with up to -4.00 Ace: I agree with that! My myopia is only a little more than that so most of it will be removed with orthoK and besides I have a little pseudomyopia that will work its way out so ill end up with excellent distance vision anyway. 8. Depending on the corneal shape of the patient, changes as much as 4 to 5 diopters of myopia/astigmatism can be worked with. Typically the best results are in the 3 to 4 diopter range. Ace: not a problem for me, in fact a slight undercorrection is beneficial for a "presbyope" like me. 9. I tried Orthokeratology about a year and a half ago. I was left -4.75 and right -5.25. It was great at first. I have never been able to leave the molds out for more than an hour or two before my eyes started regressing. Ace: I am not looking to correct this much myopia, more like -3 to -4 diopters of my myopia and if I regress I can just use glasses durning that time or move closer to see clearly. Anything is better than my terriable vision now! 10. OrthoK is great for those who work in dusty or dry environments where contact lenses would dry and irritate ones eyes. My contacts dry my eyes in short time, especially when im outside and the wind blows! With orthoK I can sleep in them and keep my eyes closed and moisted at all times > Return of orthoK, we called this center and they claim it > corrects -8 myopia and -4 astigmastim! Their quoted price [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > still not needing reading glasses. I may make an > appointment there asap :) Did I understand this correctly? 1) The center claims it corrects -8 (the sectractary) 2) Internet optometrist has one achieved max -4 correction. 3) Websites say -6 theoretical and -3 to -4 practical And you're going to rush right down there to hand over $600-900? sign me up -:) -Quick Dear Quick, I have seen reports by some "disgruntled" Ortho-K users. They heard all the "promises". They get the Orth-K lens They do it -- and then "nothing happens". Then they give up -- and there bank account is $800 to $1,600 lighter -- and nothing has changed. Just on man's opinion. Best, Otis > I have seen reports by some "disgruntled" Ortho-K users. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > They do it -- and then "nothing happens". How many "disgruntled" plus-lens wearers have you encountered? -MT >> I have seen reports by some "disgruntled" Ortho-K users. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >-MT Only those who didn't try hard enough. It takes great personal resolve, you know.... SignatureLive simply so that others may simply live > It takes great personal resolve, you know.... I thought it was "determination and fortitude." No wonder it didn't work. -MT Dear Mike and Neil, Forget it. > Forget it. Meaning you have no comment on the actual number of doctors practicing "myopia prevention?" Or that you have no comment on Colgate "curing" his myopia at 14 years old? Or do you mean you're going to stop advertising your lack of education and training? Or do you mean you'll find another newsgroup where you can rewrite the dictionary? Or that you'll stop telling doctors how to treat their patients? Will you stop offering over-simplified solutions for complex problems? No, sir, we will not forget it. We will be right here, next time you insist our textbooks should be rewritten. Which no doubt you will. -MT > Dear Quick, > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > is $800 to $1,600 lighter -- and nothing > has changed. I wasn't questioning Ortho-K. I was questioning going to a practice which you suspect of making highly exaggerated claims. To be crystal clear I'm not even addressing the claims. The OP said they thought the claims were highly exaggerated. -Quick I had Ortho-K decades ago (early 70s), when I think it first came out. As with you, the promise of seeing without glasses was appealing. (Up until then I hadn't worn contacts either. Those were my first.) Well, I have never been able to see without corrective lenses. If the ortho-k helped my myopia at all, it was slight, not a noticeable improvement. Yet, I think the ortho-k might have given me astigmatism, or made my astigmatism worse. I'm very skeptical of this procedure, a gimmick to make money IMO. > Return of orthoK, we called this center and they claim it corrects -8 > myopia and -4 astigmastim! Their quoted price was $600-900 for both [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > dependancy on glasses while still not needing reading glasses. I may > make an appointment there asap :) What was your pescription back then? What is it now? Back then, orthoK was only good for -.5 to -1.5 diopters and once in a while someone would improve by -2 diopters. Todays orthoK is much, much more advanced and can improve large amounts of myopia like -3.5 to -5 diopters! Its also much faster and more effecient >Todays orthoK is much, much more advanced > and can improve large amounts of myopia like -3.5 to -5 diopters! Its > also much faster and more effecient That's what they say, the people advertising this thing, who want to make money from it. That doesn't mean that it's true. actually it is true. Todays orthoK is far different than orthoK of 20 years back. Its also a great solution to reduce your dependancy than glasses and a much safer alternative than lasik > Its also a great solution to reduce your dependancy than > glasses and a much safer alternative than lasik How do you know that? Have you used it? Ive read about orthoK and they say its much safer than lasik. Those who disagree were challenged to prove that orthoK is as dangerous as lasik. Of course no one could prove it because I am correct. If by chance someone does prove it and its true that orthoK has risks comparable to lasik, I will forget about orthoK as I am not willing to take such a big risk. But the truth is orthoK is pratically as safe as regular contact lenses! > Ive read about orthoK and they say its much safer than > lasik. Those who disagree were challenged to prove that [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > take such a big risk. But the truth is orthoK is > pratically as safe as regular contact lenses! Well. It sounds like you have it all sorted out and all the proof you need. Was there a point to your post? -Quick > Ive read about orthoK and they say its much safer than lasik. Those who > disagree were challenged to prove that orthoK is as dangerous as lasik. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > big risk. But the truth is orthoK is pratically as safe as regular > contact lenses! Again, when you write "the truth is", how do you know what "the truth is"? Because that's what the ortho-k practitioners say. But yes, I'd agree, that ortho-K is probably far less risky than Lasik. Not comparable. On the other hand though, I think it is far less effective than Lasik. Not even close. (I'm not advocating Lasik, btw. Just since you compared those two procedures, in terms of riskiness, in which case you are correct, I thought you should also compare the efficacy of the two procedures.) Lasik is probably more effective and can correct a wider range but its still not guaranteed to keep you out of glasses and if your not happy with lasik theres no going back. Ill stick to natural vision improvement and take whatever reduction in myopia I can get |
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