Medical Forum / General / Vision / August 2005
Is There Any Hope for My Dad's Eyes?
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Fred Mann - 17 Aug 2005 23:27 GMT Hello, My Dad has been told he has "incipient cataracts", and that lasik is too risky at this point (he could go blind if they attempt lasik). His doctors have said that they would feel more comfortable performing the lasik once the cataracts have fully formed. (that sounds depressing!!) His symptoms include problems with depth perception and occasional double images which have gotten gradually worse over the last two years. Also, he has the occasional dizzy spell (fairly rare) In 1991, he had laser surgery in his right eye to heal a tear (he wasn't sure if it was a muscle tear). However, he did not experience these symptoms back then, so this may be unrelated. His right eye has been *much* worse than his left for a long time, with no depth perception troubles. He wears corrective contact lenses, and this has worked fine for many years, until recently. I am also considering the idea that his depth perception problems may not necessarily be related to the incipient cataracts, but may be due to other factors (i.e. posture-related inner-ear problem -- just a guess). Any thoughts on that? I had him try bilberry for a couple months as a cheap and harmless attempt to improve symptoms, but that did nothing. My Dad likes to play tennis, and this is making it very difficult for him to get his exercise. Obviously, he'd love to solve this problem without having to wait until the cataracts are fully formed. So, any thoughts on this matter would be GREATLY appreciated!! Thanks!!! Fred
EyesRBAD - 18 Aug 2005 00:52 GMT Fred, don't you DARE do LASIK on your dad. When his cataract surgery happens as long as he has NOT had LASIK he will be able to be fitted with an intraocular lens that should bring him to 20/20. It will not fix his close vision, he will need reading glasses for that.
Older people have problems with failing night vision. LASIK causes loss of contrast sensitivity (inability to see well and distinguish things in dim light) and also causes visual aberrations at night called GASH. You don't want your dad to be stuck with these problems.
Also, as we age, our eyes become drier. LASIK cuts a flap severing corneal nerves... shown by the MAYO clinic to not recover fully after surgery. Your dad may have constant discomfort after LASIK and not be able to stand to be outside, especially in a breeze. What would THIS do to his tennis game?
YOUNG professional tennis players have lost their comptetive edge because they had LASIK and can no longer see the ball very well.
Your dad may have had surgery to heal a retinal tear. If he had a retinal tear he may be susceptible to retinal detachment. This means all the extra suctioning on the eye by the suction ring to make the LASIK flap would endanger your father's sensitive retina.
Studies by Emory show all LASIK eyes have permanent pathology. This means they are all sick.
Best to take your dad to a 2nd opinion surgeon who may be encouraged to do the cataract surgery a little sooner.
Your dad may have a refractive imbalance, properly fitted IOLs from cataract surgery can correct this. If he does not have a refractive imbalance, he should be taken to a specialist who focuses on binocular vision problems. LASIK can cause problems with double vision and depth perception. Again, not the surgery that would fix anything for your father.
He should be evaluated medically for the dizzy spells as well.
Please steer your father away from refractive surgery of the cornea. Of any kind.
> Hello, > My Dad has been told he has "incipient cataracts", and that lasik is too [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > Thanks!!! > Fred William Stacy - 18 Aug 2005 02:34 GMT Sure, more than hope. Cataract surgery should be done by a cataract specialist (a surgeon who ONLY does cataract surgery), due to the problems he has and does have, esp. with what sounds like a retinal detachment. He may want to go to a retina specialist first, and if everything there is ok, you might even ask the retina doc for the best cataract guy/gal in you area.
Forget lasik, as the other poster said, as there should be no need or desire for it before or after cataract surgery.
I'd also recommend staying away from the multifocus/focusing IOLs.
w.stacy, o.d.
>Hello, >My Dad has been told he has "incipient cataracts", and that lasik is too [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > Fred Mann - 18 Aug 2005 04:00 GMT Thanks for the responses!! Is it possible to correct his vision immediately via surgery (or other means), or does he have to wait for the cataracts to be fully formed? Also, why would cataracts cause a depth perception problem? His eyes have certainly been unbalanced for a long time with no such problems. I'm concerned that we *may* be on the wrong track with respect to curing his symptoms. I spoke to Pete Egoscue today who said he has seen MANY cases of depth perception problems in older people solved by postural correction. He explained that if the head is sufficiently forward in the posture, then depth perception gets out of whack. (Pete Egoscue has about 300 clinics in the US -- they do stretching/strengthening programs custom-made to bring individuals back into postural "alignment" , to use a cliche term -- i.e. the ear is directly over the shoulder and the pelvis is not rotated forward and the feet are not splayed out, etc). I think that this is at least plausible. I have positive first-hand experience with this type of thing. Also, assuming cataracts ARE the problem, how does one find a qualified surgeon? Thanks again for the warnings about lasik!!!! Fred
> Sure, more than hope. Cataract surgery should be done by a cataract > specialist (a surgeon who ONLY does cataract surgery), due to the [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > >Thanks!!! > >Fred serebel - 18 Aug 2005 04:23 GMT I would be very leery about someone saying that they can correct depth perception by postural correction. Cataracts cause all sorts of visual problems including depth perception difficulty. You do not have to wait til the cataracts are fully formed too have them removed. Most people wait that long because their insurance won't cover it til they cause extreme visual disturbance.
SErebel
Scott Seidman - 18 Aug 2005 13:25 GMT "Fred Mann" <fredmann@bellsouth.net> wrote in news:EQSMe.23933$XM3.9382 @bignews5.bellsouth.net:
> I spoke to Pete Egoscue today who said he has seen MANY cases of > depth perception problems in older people solved by postural correction. Nobody has seen any cases of depth perception problems solved by postural correction. Anybody who told you that does not deserve to be treating patients.
 Signature Scott Reverse name to reply
William Stacy - 18 Aug 2005 15:10 GMT > Thanks for the responses!! > Is it possible to correct his vision immediately via surgery (or other > means), or does he have to wait for the cataracts to be fully formed? As someone said, it is mostly an insurance question. If the surgeon says the insurance may not or will not pay until they are worse, you have a financial decision to make. In the scheme of things, cataract surgery is pretty darn cheap.
> Also, why would cataracts cause a depth perception problem? His eyes have > certainly been unbalanced for a long time with no such problems. I'm > concerned that we *may* be on the wrong track with respect to curing his > symptoms. I spoke to Pete Egoscue today who said he has seen MANY cases of > depth perception problems in older people solved by postural correction. Posture has nothing to do with depth perception. Nothing at all. This guy is a charlatan, a well meaning one, perhaps, but a charlatan. Depth perception of course is dramatically affected any time one eye sees better than the other. All you have to do (if your eyes are normal) is cover one eye to see what happens to your depth. You can assume any postural position you want and your depth will not be affected at all.
(Pete Egoscue has about 300 clinics in
> the US A very successful charlatan indeed.
w.stacy, o.d.
Ragnar - 18 Aug 2005 11:36 GMT Well..specializing in cataracts and doing cataracts exclusively are two different things. I would avoid going to a surgeon who does cataracts exclusively or any procedure exclusively for that matter. Here are two reasons: 1. If you have a problem with your eyes and you go to a surgeon who only does one procedure... that surgeon is sure to perform the procedure he does rather than suggest you get the best procedure for your condition. 2. There are mills of every type of surgery. You do not want a surgeon that schedules mass amounts of people in queues like a cattle drive and performing McProcedure on all of them. I currently have a similar problem with a dentist. He overbooks and he doesn't finish his work because he runs out of time between patients. I have a few teeth in my mouth that are half-finished and I am rapidly losing patience with that man. I am probably going to have to look him in the eye and tell him to FINISH what he is doing on me and tell his other patient to go home. He's a young dentist and trying to do more than he is capable of. At least he is young enough that I can get him to do what I want for the most part.
>Sure, more than hope. Cataract surgery should be done by a cataract >specialist (a surgeon who ONLY does cataract surgery), due to the [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] >> >> William Stacy - 18 Aug 2005 15:04 GMT I do recognize the difference, and can certainly appreciate the fact that in many parts of the world you can't find a cataract specialist within many miles. But I disagree with your reasoning.
> 1. If you have a problem with your eyes and you go to a surgeon who > only does one procedure... that surgeon is sure to perform the > procedure he does rather than suggest you get the best procedure for > your condition. This doesn't hold water because you are not going to go to a cataract specialist unless you have cataracts already diagnosed by your o.d. or your general o.m.d. The cataract specialist is not going to do anything but the best procedure for that condition. He/she will be performing the most up to date procedure available, unlike the general o.m.d.
> 2. There are mills of every type of surgery. You do not want a > surgeon that schedules mass amounts of people in queues like a cattle > drive and performing McProcedure on all of them. Yes you do. The best cataract surgery requires 3 things. A very good surgeon with good hands and the innate skill to do the work. A very experienced one who does "mass amounts" of the procedures so his/her techniques are flawless. And you want it to be done in the latest, best equipped surgery center, something that general o.m.d.s may not have access to. By the way, cataract specialists do not do the same exact procedure on everyone. They are the ones who can and do handle the difficult cases that require very special procedures.
One thing you don't want is a novice or who does one or 2 procedures a month, and there are lots of those out there.
I currently have
> a similar problem with a dentist. He overbooks and he doesn't finish > his work because he runs out of time between patients. I have a few > teeth in my mouth that are half-finished and I am rapidly losing > patience with that man. He sounds like an idiot, not a specialist.
I am probably going to have to look him in
> the eye and tell him to FINISH what he is doing on me and tell his > other patient to go home. He's a young dentist and trying to do more > than he is capable of. At least he is young enough that I can get > him to do what I want for the most part. He is not a specialist, is he... He's a very busy generalist who needs an office manager to run his life.
w.stacy, o.d.
Sandy - 18 Aug 2005 15:34 GMT Christopher, once you said that you were going to participate in this group as long as I do.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.lasik-eyes/browse_frm/thread/d26276db4ba062d2 /471436ff312c0d8a?dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DU TF-8%26group%3Dalt.lasik-eyes#471436ff312c0d8a
If I quit, would you?
I'm concerned about you. If you had a job, you could pay for your dental work, and your dentist would gladly finish it, or may be you could even go to an experienced dentist and the work would be done right.
Deal? I quit, you quit. Let me know.
Neil Brooks - 18 Aug 2005 16:50 GMT >Christopher, once you said that you were going to participate in this >group as long as I do. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Deal? I quit, you quit. Let me know. Feel free not to cross-post this to s.m.v. We have enough petty bs without adding this one.
Thanks,
The Peanut Gallery
Ragnar - 18 Aug 2005 11:22 GMT Tell dad that LASIK is not for him. IOLs are for him.. and if he wants to spend your inheritance, the Crystalens IOLS are better.
>Hello, >My Dad has been told he has "incipient cataracts", and that lasik is too [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] >Thanks!!! >Fred Dr Judy - 20 Aug 2005 02:19 GMT > Hello, > My Dad has been told he has "incipient cataracts", and that lasik is too > risky at this point (he could go blind if they attempt lasik). His doctors > have said that they would feel more comfortable performing the lasik once > the cataracts have fully formed. (that sounds depressing!!) Once he has the cataracts removed and IOLs placed, he is likely to have close to plano refraction and will not need LASIK. As the cataracts develop, his refractive error will change, having LASIK done now will correct his current refraction but not the future changes.
> His symptoms include problems with depth perception and occasional double > images which have gotten gradually worse over the last two years. Also, he > has the occasional dizzy spell (fairly rare) Dizzy spells are seldom, if ever, due to the eye, they are more likely due to inner ear problems or problems with the vestibular system in the brain. Mini stroke or incipient stoke can also cause dizzy spells. Eye muscle problems can cause double vision, so can vestibular problems. An onset of double vision in an adult with no previous history and no eye muscle problems means that stroke and other neurological causes need to be investigated. He should mention both these problems to his family doctor for further workup and referral.
> In 1991, he had laser surgery in his right eye to heal a tear (he wasn't > sure if it was a muscle tear). However, he did not experience these [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > factors (i.e. posture-related inner-ear problem -- just a guess). Any > thoughts on that? What do you mean by depth perception problems? Is he having trouble judging distances or is he having balance problems? If one eye is very blurry, it might affect distance judging but if it were that bad it would be bad enough to justify cataract surgery. If he is having balance problems like tripping, falling, stumbling, trouble walking then those are definitely not due to the eyes and he should see a neurologist.
Dr Judy
> I had him try bilberry for a couple months as a cheap and harmless attempt > to improve symptoms, but that did nothing. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Thanks!!! > Fred Mark - 20 Aug 2005 16:02 GMT His surgeon should tell the insurance company that the surgery should be done NOW. I had cataract surgery done last year - both eyes in 3 months - and the cataracts were nowhere near 'mature'. My surgeon also said that the surgery is faster and easier in earlier cataracts as well. The key seems to be for the surgeon to tell the insurer that the surgery is necessary for the patient to work and function properly. It certainly was in my case.
Mark
> > Hello, > > My Dad has been told he has "incipient cataracts", and that lasik is too [quoted text clipped - 51 lines] > > Thanks!!! > > Fred serebel - 21 Aug 2005 03:54 GMT I think Mark has the right idea here. Who would want to wait till you can't see in order to have a surgery that you're going to need anyway? To me, that's just needless suffering.
SErebel
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