Subject: Vodoo Optometric Statistics
Re: Response to William Stacy's request to report scientific
fact accurately concerning the "down" rate for
children wearing a single-minus lens.
Otis>> It is obvious that the situation is only preventable
(potentially) -- given the -1/2 dioter per year for children
wearing a single-minus, as shown in a number of
published scientific studies.
Stacy> ok so according to this if the kid starts at -1.00 at age
6:
Stacy> he'd be -2 at age 8
Stacy> -3 at age 10
Stacy> -4 at age 12
Stacy> -5 at age 14
Stacy> -6 at age 16
Stacy> I see that kind of progression in maybe 1% of my patients.
And I'm talking MANY THOUSANDS OF PATIENTS.
Stacy> Come on, Otis. YOUR NUMBERS ARE WRONG. Sorry. Do some
real research, and stick to facts, preferably verifiable
facts.
Stacy> w. stacy, o.d.
________________________
Dear William,
Re: ...and stick to facts, preferably verifiable facts. Stacy OD
Minus vision lenses: - 1.23 D increase (2 years)
Progressive lenses with +1.50 add: - 0.76 D increase (2 years)
Progressive lenses with +2.00 add: - 0.66 D increase (2 years)
Source: Leung JT, Brown B. Progression of myopia in Hong Kong
Chinese schoolchildren is slowed by wearing progressive
lenses. Optom Vis Sci 1999; 76:346, 354. Published 10/07/00.
______________________
The -0.6 / diopter-per-year is the AVERAGE of the population
of children wearing a single-minus lens.
Apparently they did not teach an UNDERSTANDING of statistics
in your optometry school, or you were out-to-lunch during these
scientific statistics courses. Or Stacy depends on the
public's ignorance of these statistics to make his case
that a minus lens is "perfectly safe".
Stacy must be living in a statistical "black hole". or a
profound statistical anomaly.
_________________________
Lisa -- Here is the convenient office-myth, or
office-anectdotes -- ODs tell their patients when they become
"concerned" when their children develop stair-case myopia.
The work of Steve Leung OD, and his use of the plus lens
profoundly disputes Stacy's contention that only 1 percent of
young children show a "downard" change in refractive status when a
minus lens is applied to the eye. See the statistics below for an
accurate assessment statement of scientific facts.
Best,
Otis
________________________________
MYOPIA PREVALENCE IS ALWAYS HIGHER THAN 90 PERCENT
FOR TAIWAN MEDICAL STUDENTS
Re: Changes in ocular refraction and its components
among medical students - a 5-year longitudinal study", Optom.
Vis. Sci., 73:495-498, 1996) found that in a study of 345
National Taiwan University medical students, the myopia
prevalence increased from 92.8% to 95.8%! over the five year
period.
******************
1) In Singapore, the vision of 421,116 males between the ages of
15 and 25 was examined. In 1974-84, 26.3% were myopic; in
1987-91, 43.3% were myopic. Both the prevalence and severity
of myopia were higher as the level of education increased.
The prevalence rate was 15.4% in males with no formal
education and increased steadily through the education levels
to reach 65.1% among the university graduates in 1987-91. The
authors state that their findings confirm indications from
other sources that the association between the prevalence and
severity of myopia and education attainment is real (M.T.
Tay, K.G. Au Eong, C.Y. Ng and M.K. Lim, "Myopia and
Educational Attainment in 421,116 Young Singaporean Males,"
Ann Acad Med Singapore, 1992, Nov;21(6):785-91).
2) Regarding the prevalence of myopia in Asian countries, Lam and
Goh (Lam, C.S. and Goh, W.S., "The incidence of refractive
errors among schoolchildren in Hong Kong in relationship with
the optical components", Clin. Exp. Optom., 74:97-103, 1991)
found that in 383 school children from ages 6 to 17 years, the
prevalence of myopia increased from 30% at ages 6-7 years, to
70% at ages 16-17 years.
3) Lam and Yap (Lam, C.S. and Yap, M. "Ocular dimensions and
refraction in Chinese Orientals", Proc. Int. Soc. Eye Res.,
6:121, 1990) found that in a group of optometry students at
The Hong Kong Polytechnic University, the prevalence of myopia
was 75% in females and 69% in males.
4) Goh and Lam (Goh, W.S. and Lam, C.S., "Changes in refractive
trends and optical components of Hong Kong Chinese aged 19-39
years," Ophthal. Physiol. Opt., 14:378-382, 1994) found that
in 2000 first-year students at the University of Hong Kong,
the prevalence of myopia was 87.5%.
5) Lin et al (Lin, L.-K, Chen, C.J., Hung, P.T., and Ko, L.S.,
"National- wide survey of myopia among schoolchildren in
Taiwan, Acta Ophthalmol.", 185:29-33, 1988) found that in a
national survey of children in Taiwan, the prevalence of
myopia was over 70%.
6) Lin et al (Lin, L.K., Shih, Y.F., Lee, Y.C., Hung, P.T., and
Hou, P.K., " Changes in ocular refraction and its components
among medical students - a 5-year longitudinal study", Optom.
Vis. Sci., 73:495-498, 1996) found that in a study of 345
National Taiwan University medical students, the myopia
prevalence increased from 92.8% to 95.8%! over the five year
period.
7) A recent study in Hong Kong showed what other studies have
shown - wearing less than a full correction will slow the
progress of the myopia. Children selected for the study were
between the ages of 9 and 12. All were nearsighted, with 1.00
to 5.00 D of myopia. The children were separated into three
groups. Each group was given a different type of eyeglasses
to wear for the two-year period of the study. The first group
wore single vision lenses with a full correction; the second
group wore progressive lenses with a +1.50 add; the third
group wore progressive lenses with a +2.00 add. All children
were examined at 6-month intervals to check the progression of
their myopia. Sixty-eight children completed the study. As
expected, more undercorrection meant slower myopia
progression.
Minus vision lenses: - 1.23 D increase (2 years)
Progressive lenses with +1.50 add: - 0.76 D increase (2 years)
Progressive lenses with +2.00 add: - 0.66 D increase (2 years)
Source: Leung JT, Brown B. Progression of myopia in Hong Kong
Chinese schoolchildren is slowed by wearing progressive
lenses. Optom Vis Sci 1999; 76:346, 354. Published 10/07/00.
Mike Tyner - 30 Apr 2005 06:31 GMT
> MYOPIA PREVALENCE IS ALWAYS HIGHER THAN 90 PERCENT
> FOR TAIWAN MEDICAL STUDENTS
Ah, I see you got some help. I know you didn't find these articles on your
own.
Unfortunately you must dismiss the first 6 citations because they have
nothing to do with minus causing myopia or plus reversing it.
You have found one study that appears to bear directly on the Rehm/Brown
theory -
> 7) A recent study in Hong Kong showed what other studies have
> shown - wearing less than a full correction will slow the
> progress of the myopia. Children selected for the study were
> between the ages of 9 and 12. All were nearsighted, with 1.00
> to 5.00 D of myopia. The children were separated into three
> groups.
Excellent design. Hard to argue with. I'm convinced... no wait...
What if there are at least two other experiments with equally careful design
that point exactly opposite? What do we do then?
Care to see citations? No? You've seen them before and you didn't pay any
attention then.
-MT
> Source: Leung JT, Brown B. Progression of myopia in Hong Kong
> Chinese schoolchildren is slowed by wearing progressive
> lenses. Optom Vis Sci 1999; 76:346, 354. Published 10/07/00.
Dr. Leukoma - 30 Apr 2005 13:50 GMT
Or, consider this:
Interventions to retard myopia progression in children: an
evidence-based update.
Ophthalmology 2002 Mar;109(3):415-21; Saw SM; Shih-Yen EC; Koh A; Tan D
Department of Community, Occupational and Family Medicine, National
University of Singapore, 16 Medical Drive, Singapore 117597, Republic
of Singapore. cofsawsm@nus.edu.sg.
RESULTS: ....Five of the six trials on bifocal spectacle lenses with
various additions failed to show significant retardation, and results
of the remaining trial were barely significant (P = 0.047). A trial of
soft contact lenses failed to show significant effects. CONCLUSIONS:
The latest evidence from randomized clinical trials does not provide
sufficient information to support interventions to prevent the
progression of myopia. Long-term large-scale double-masked randomized
clinical trials, including cycloplegic refraction, are needed before
any recommendations about interventions in clinical practice to prevent
high myopia in myopic children are considered.
DrG
otisbrown@pa.net - 30 Apr 2005 15:20 GMT
Dear DrG,
You seem to have forgotten that this issue concerned William's
insistance that only a small percentage of eye move "down"
when a minus lens is placed on them.
He then asked for scientific data to demonstrate this
statement that I made that when a minus lens is
placed on the eye -- it goes "down" at a rate of
-1/2 diopter per years.
I said NOTHING about prevention, and NOTHING
about the plus.
I only questioned Stacy's insistence that I produce
scientific proof that the downward progression
was an AVERAGE oaf -1/2 diopter per year.
In fact it was 6/10 diopter per year.
I think Stacy has "invented" his own statistics,
and has no basis for his statement.
Best,
Otis
Engineer
Dr. Leukoma - 30 Apr 2005 16:16 GMT
> Dear DrG,
>
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
> Otis
> Engineer
Myopes tend to get more myopic. I agree. I don't agree that minus
lenses make eyes more myopic at a greater rate compared to controls
with no lenses. I think that is what you have to demonstrate here.
DrG
Mike Tyner - 30 Apr 2005 17:21 GMT
> I only questioned Stacy's insistence that I produce
> scientific proof that the downward progression
> was an AVERAGE oaf -1/2 diopter per year.
I dunno why he wants proof. I'm sure he knows people get nearsighted. I'm
sure the rate is higher in certain populations.
So your "1/2 diopter per year" can easily be proven "false" by testing a
different population.
I'm pretty sure I can pick a group of HYPEROPES that will get more
FARSIGHTED at that rate or faster. With plus or without!
What does this have to do with the Rehm/Brown theory that minus causes
myopia and plus cures it?
Nothing.
Smoke.
Mirrors.
Rhetoric.
Bluster.
FDA petitions.
Please show me it works so I can advertise it to my patients.
-MT
visionsenz@aol.com - 05 May 2005 08:00 GMT
As a point of interest I refer to my own experience as a myope first
diagnosed at age 12 and prescribed minus lenses. I wore these only for
essential need at the distance for the next ten years and there was no
noticeable change in my vision.
I then began to wear the glasses for all purposes including working at
the near point and soon found I could no longer do without them at any
time with any degree of comfort. Each visit to my optometrist resulted
in a slightly stronger prescription which is what most myopes are
accustomed to. It would seem that it not the minus lens per se which is
responsible for deterioration but the wearing of it unnecessarily for
near work.
Some years later I discovered that myopia is caused by
incorrect reading technique with consequent loss of normal central
fixation combined with a decline of eye mobility. I practised reading
with my attention directed to individual points of fixation and became
able to use weaker lenses until I found it possible to see 20/20 with
my first prescription.
I realise that the professional ODs will scoff but I can only
report my own experiences over 82 years.
Best regards
Robin Parsons
Mike Tyner - 05 May 2005 12:54 GMT
> It would seem that it not the minus lens per se which is
> responsible for deterioration but the wearing of it unnecessarily for
> near work.
"It would seem?"
A group of Finnish ophthalmologists studied 240 myopic children for three
years and reported their results in the 1989 Br J Ophth.
One third of the children removed their glasses to read, one third kept them
on full time, and one third wore bifocals.
Which group do you think got myopic faster or slower?
> Some years later I discovered that myopia is caused by
> incorrect reading technique with consequent loss of normal central
> fixation combined with a decline of eye mobility.
Which tells us you never actually measured reading eye movements.
> I practised reading
> with my attention directed to individual points of fixation and became
> able to use weaker lenses until I found it possible to see 20/20 with
> my first prescription.
What if _most_ myopes experience some improvement between age 30 and 50?
> I realise that the professional ODs will scoff but I can only
> report my own experiences over 82 years.
So let's don't ask ODs. Let's ask MDs and vision-science PhDs who don't sell
glasses. What do they say?
They say the fallacy is called "post hoc, ergo propter hoc."
-MT
Dr. Leukoma - 05 May 2005 12:54 GMT
Please allow me to be the first professional OD to officially "scoff."
And, while I am at it, let me make it a big scoff.
What you have just described is pretty much the natural history of
myopia for most people. When you first got your eyeglasses at age 12,
you had mild myopia and could function without eyeglasses part of the
time. As your myopia increased, you found the need to wear them more
often, and eventually found it more convenient to wear them full-time.
During your adult years you went about your life, finished your
education, developed your career which possibly involved alot of close
work, possibly married and had a family. You didn't have to worry
about your vision because your optometrist kept you seeing clearly and
comforably. As you got older, you became presbyopic, which caused
optical and structural changes within the eye. These changes
contributed to a natural reversal of some -- not all -- of your myopia.
Now, at the age of 82, you look back on it all by mistaking cause for
effect.
DrG
William Stacy - 05 May 2005 15:27 GMT
> Some years later I discovered that myopia is caused by
> incorrect reading technique with consequent loss of normal central
> fixation combined with a decline of eye mobility.
You'll get a lot of argument on the first part of that statement, and
even more on the last part. I've also been a myope for a long time(~45
years) and wore glasses full time for all those years. I too required
stronger glasses from age 18 to ~24 at which time my Rx levelled off and
did not change significantly for over 30 years of constant wear. As an
optometrist, I have never seen the development of loss of normal central
fixation or decline of eye mobility in myopes except as due to
pathologic changes such as macular degeneration and general age related
degeneration of the muscular system. Perhaps you are using those terms
in a different way than they are commonly and scientifically defined.
I practised reading
> with my attention directed to individual points of fixation and became
> able to use weaker lenses until I found it possible to see 20/20 with
> my first prescription.
It would be helpful if you posted "your first prescription" and your
strongest subsequent prescription, so that we could tell how significant
this might be.
> I realise that the professional ODs will scoff but I can only
> report my own experiences over 82 years.
> Best regards
> Robin Parsons
Well I'm not going to scoff, but you might want to investigate the
common meanings of "loss of normal central fixation" and "decline of eye
mobility" and restate your claim.
w.stacy, o.d.
Dr. Leukoma - 05 May 2005 16:32 GMT
Hmmm, don't I remember something about a positive association between
myopia and reading and academic achievement? That would be challenging
for someone with eccentric fixation and lack of mobility.
DrG