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Medical Forum / General / Vision / August 2007

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Sandy Duncan's Glass Eye

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The Real Bev - 22 Mar 2005 01:01 GMT
Sandy Duncan has a glass eye, but both eyes move together and you can't tell
which is the phony one.  How does this work?

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Cheers, Bev
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Why should I be tarred with the epithet "loony" merely
because I have a pet halibut?           --Monty Python

andrewedwardjudd@hotmail.com - 22 Mar 2005 03:51 GMT
> Sandy Duncan has a glass eye, but both eyes move together and you can't tell
> which is the phony one.  How does this work?

Its an interesting question

I expect you can tell the eye is not quite right if you were to know
him better.  Many people for example dont notice George Bushes eyes.
These kinds of eye deviations are quite commonly observed but most
people are unware of seeing them or having them.

Apparently (I just learnt) Glass/Acrylic eyes are adjusted to be
looking straight ahead in a natural manner at 3 feet for Americans and
18" for Europeans because Americans prefer more personal space.

There seem to be two mechanisms controlling eye movement.

1. Is that eye movements are in some manner connected together via
crossover of the optic nerves and accommodation or focus.

But

2. What you are actually looking at seems able to over rule the effect
of 1.  this can be demonstrated because you see a picture best when the
two images are precisely and accurately overlaid. (various none
accurate overlays are possible where binocular vision is apparent but
it can never be as good as an accurate overlay because the correct
information is unavailable to the brain)

For example if you get two identical pictures its possible with
practice to place them on the floor, stand up tall and move these
pictures to various distances and still merge them together as a single
picture.  (I tried this for stereoscopic pairs but with the greater
distance it is not noticably 3D)

Alternatively if you get two identical coins you can merge them into a
single coin at the near point in a variety of positions including some
where the eyes are pointing outwards from being parallel - this starts
to feel seriously weird though because the eyes are physically looking
majorly away from the coins, while your attention  attempts to keep the
pictures together.

Supposedly some people have learnt to do that without the pictures
looking straight ahead but i have never personally seen it.  It sounds
possible though.

Finally just to add some additional complexity, in behavioural
optometry its commonly known that when stressed our eyes do not
accurately point at the same object, but outside of behavioural
optometry this is often regarded as being impossible even though
strabismic and temporarily exo/esotropic eyes can be observed and
phorias are easily revealed.

Andrew
Mark A - 22 Mar 2005 04:24 GMT
> > Sandy Duncan has a glass eye, but both eyes move together and you
> can't tell
> > which is the phony one.  How does this work?

There are a lot of reputable sources that say that Sandy Duncan does NOT
have a glass eye, although she is blind in one eye.
http://www.charlottetheatre.com/extras/04-05extras/sandyduncaninterview.html

A little searching can find other sources about this apparently false rumor.
retinula@hotmail.com - 22 Mar 2005 04:28 GMT
you really like to write don't you.  I've never read so much BS that
has so little truth and information in it.   your quite taken with
yourself aren't you?
Mark A - 22 Mar 2005 04:35 GMT
> you really like to write don't you.  I've never read so much BS that
> has so little truth and information in it.   your quite taken with
> yourself aren't you?

Would you mind including some of the post you are responding to? With most
newsreaders, people cannot tell which post your response is for.
retinula@hotmail.com - 22 Mar 2005 20:04 GMT
> > you really like to write don't you.  I've never read so much BS that
> > has so little truth and information in it.   your quite taken with
> > yourself aren't you?
> >
> Would you mind including some of the post you are responding to? With most
> newsreaders, people cannot tell which post your response is for.

I was responsing to andrewJudd.  he continues to post BS in this forum.
he is worse than another Otis and almost as bad as Rishi.  i believe
Otis even knows who he is.  Surprise! misery lovers company.
andrewJudd apparently thinks he is quite intelligent.  he believes
stress, anxiety and parental conflicts are the causes of ammetropias.

Sorry.  my newsreaders all show clearly who is posting in response to
whom.  i will be more careful in the future.
andrewedwardjudd@hotmail.com - 22 Mar 2005 04:39 GMT
retin...@hotmail.com wrote:
> you really like to write don't you.  I've never read so much BS that
> has so little truth and information in it.   your quite taken with
> yourself aren't you?

This sounds like encouragement to say more

Maybe i can just type faster?
Jan - 22 Mar 2005 15:54 GMT
> you really like to write don't you.  I've never read so much BS that
> has so little truth and information in it.   your quite taken with
> yourself aren't you?

Retinula, who are you responding too?
It is common to respond with a header like the above.
Do not take it for granted your message appears just below the one you are
responding too.
Thank you.

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Jan (normally Dutch spoken)

no@address.invalid - 22 Mar 2005 04:50 GMT
>Sandy Duncan has a glass eye, but both eyes move together and you can't tell
>which is the phony one.  How does this work?

I can't speak for hers, I didn't know she had one, but my prosthetic
eye isn't glass, it's some kind of plastic material.  My right eye was
removed, and replaced with a hydroxy-apetite (sp?) ball, with the eye
muscles then sewn around it.  After that healed, this clay-like stuff
was injected into my eye socket to get an impression, then when that
was shaped and hardened they painted it to match my other eye.  This
"eye" which kind of looks like a half clamshell, then just fits in
front of the ocular implant; it's a perfect fit, so when the eye
muscles move the ocular implant, the prosthesis moves with it.

From what I have seen, true "glass" eyes do not move or look like the
real thing.  I'm betting Sandy Duncan has the same type I do.

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Smokin' Joe

Kopan Family - 22 Mar 2005 07:07 GMT
Sammy Davis Jr. had the same thing.  He had a metal mesh ball to which the
muscle tendons were attached.

Dr. Tom Kopan

>>Sandy Duncan has a glass eye, but both eyes move together and you can't
>>tell
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> From what I have seen, true "glass" eyes do not move or look like the
> real thing.  I'm betting Sandy Duncan has the same type I do.
The Real Bev - 23 Mar 2005 05:47 GMT
> Sammy Davis Jr. had the same thing.  He had a metal mesh ball to which the
> muscle tendons were attached.
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> > front of the ocular implant; it's a perfect fit, so when the eye
> > muscles move the ocular implant, the prosthesis moves with it.

Does it require a re-paint every once in a while?  I seem to remember
something like that on a Law&Order or something -- where the guy had a
prosthetic eye but couldn't afford the upkeep...

> > From what I have seen, true "glass" eyes do not move or look like the
> > real thing.  I'm betting Sandy Duncan has the same type I do.

A cow-orker had what she called a glass eye and said it was made by the
same people who made Sandy Duncan's, but I never saw her take it out --
she did wear a pirate patch sometimes, though.  OTOH, she lied about a
lot of stuff.

Somebody said Sandy Duncan DOESN'T have a glass eye and gave a
reference.  OTOH, http://www.answers.com/topic/sandy-duncan .  Snopes
has no entry.  

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Cheers,
Bev
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Why is it so hot and what am I doing in this handbasket?

no@address.invalid - 24 Mar 2005 04:07 GMT
>Does it require a re-paint every once in a while?  I seem to remember
>something like that on a Law&Order or something -- where the guy had a
>prosthetic eye but couldn't afford the upkeep...

At $1500 a pop, it had better not require repainting!  :-)

Actually, the whole thing is quite a work of art.  After they shape
and harden the impression, they paint it with a VERY tiny brush (like,
maybe 3 hairs in it,) and something like 20 different colors which
blend in to look realistic.  They also paint the nasal side pink, and
attach very small red fibers from a piece of string to simulate blood
vessels.  When the whole process is finished, about 3 hours if I
remember right, they dry it and take a clear cap that has been shaped
exactly to the impression, then place that over the painted part and
seal the two pieces together.  Once this is done it is permanent, and
the only maintenance is to get it cleaned and polished once a year,
which doesn't cost that much.  (I don't remember, it has been a few
years since I have been back there.)  I never take it out anymore
myself, although I can do it without any trouble at all.  When I first
got it at 15, I was taking it out and showing everyone, and I ended up
geting an infection.  Now it only comes out when I see my
opthalmologist once a year, and he does a quick cleaning job on it.
And tells me to get it polished.  Perhaps I will in the summer.  It's
a long drive to the ocularist's office.  Do you think maybe they'd let
me mail it in?  :-)
The Real Bev - 24 Mar 2005 05:21 GMT
> When I first
> got it at 15, I was taking it out and showing everyone, and I ended up
> geting an infection.  

"Kids..."

> now it only comes out when I see my
> opthalmologist once a year, and he does a quick cleaning job on it.
> And tells me to get it polished.  Perhaps I will in the summer.  It's
> a long drive to the ocularist's office.  Do you think maybe they'd let
> me mail it in?  :-)

Why not?  Even better if you can find a nice sturdy clear plastic box to
mail it in.  Use some of that Easter grass as packing and make sure it
looks like it's peeking out.

OTOH, the mailperson probably wouldn't even notice :-(

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Cheers, Bev
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It's true that Smokey the Bear deserves praise for his
campaign against forest fires, but nobody ever mentions
the boy scouts he kills for their hats.

bfrey - 22 Mar 2005 22:39 GMT
It depends on the structure under her blind eye, if she has part of the
blind eye remaining or if the entire eye has been removed, and the type
of prosthesis she wears.  Many prosthetic eyes (not made of glass) move
in accordance to the seeing eye.  My son's prosthesis (scleral
shell--kind of like a large, thick contact lens) has some movement and
you'd really have to pay attention to know which eye is real and which
is not.
Ann - 23 Mar 2005 23:40 GMT
>Sandy Duncan has a glass eye, but both eyes move together and you can't tell
>which is the phony one.  How does this work?

This is a good website that explains it all.  It's the site that I
read in depth when I was having my plastic implant replaced with a
hypoxyapatite (coral) one.

http://www.ioi.com/

Ann
andrewedwardjudd@hotmail.com - 24 Mar 2005 04:39 GMT
> This is a good website that explains it all.  It's the site that I
> read in depth when I was having my plastic implant replaced with a
> hypoxyapatite (coral) one.
>
> http://www.ioi.com/

Amazing that sea coral is chemically treated to produce the identical
chemical composition of human bone:-)

In the New Scientist recently there was an article that showed that
totally blind people can learn to get an awareness of what was 'out
there' using an artificial eye connected to their tongues and some had
learnt to catch a rolling ball and play 'rock paper scissors' walk thru
a door frame or dance for the first time in many years without holding
something for balance.   I suppose it is only a matter of time before
these artificial eyes are actually seeing eyes in some manner.
The Real Bev - 24 Mar 2005 05:27 GMT
> <bashley@myrealbox.com> wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> http://www.ioi.com/

Damn, I couldn't see the movie.  Sort of deflates the idea of taking
your eye out and putting it in a drink to surprise the bartender or a
friend, doesn't it?

Signature

Cheers, Bev
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It's true that Smokey the Bear deserves praise for his
campaign against forest fires, but nobody ever mentions
the boy scouts he kills for their hats.

Dianne - 26 Aug 2007 04:19 GMT
>Sandy Duncan has a glass eye, but both eyes move together and you can't tell
>which is the phony one.  How does this work?

I know this is an old thread but I am new and just saw it.......Sandy Duncan
DOES NOT have a glass eye. In the early 70's she was treated for a tumor
behind her eye. This left her blind in that eye but the muscles still track
with the other eye. This is just a rumor that was started. Though I DID see
an interesting segment on "How They Make It" on the science channel and they
gave a great segment on the making of a prosthetic eye.

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