Dear Friends,
There are many people who have had success with
Lasik. However, it is well to consider and
evaluate "adverse" results as reported below.
Since this man states that he was not
adequatly "warned" about this, perhaps
this post will serve as a reminder of
a possible outcome.
Best,
Otis
Engineer
*******
Information from:
~ Roger ~
Roger Bratt
LASIK in La Jolla, near San Diego, in Southern California, by
"Doctor" Michael Gordon ==>
In 1998, unaware that the experience would leave me with the
opinion that many, if not most, refractive surgeons consider the
health of their patients' corneas to be expendable, I consulted 2
high-volume LASIK surgeons, Michael Gordon and Glenn Kawesch.
This was before LASEK or all laser LASIK. I did not consult
with Perry Binder, Lee Nordan, David Schanzlin, Mitchell
Friedlaender, Sandy Feldman, Douglas Miller, or Lusby. In my
opinion, it was a huge mistake to rely on either Gordon or Kawesch
for accurate information about LASIK or refractive surgery.
In my opinion, "Doctor" Gordon withheld key information about
known LASIK complications, about "dry eye", about chronic pain,
about the difference between seeing 20-20 and seeing well. At the
time I was myopic and had myopia, with a little bit of astigmatism
... I hear they're now peddling LASIK, LASEK, and all laser LASIK
for hyperopia, as well.
Opthalmologist, optometrist, MD, OD, surgeon -- terms which
once evoked respect ... unfortunately now frequently involved in
sweeping information about LASIK casualties under the rug.
"Doctor" Gordon's "informed consent" form didn't say anything
about living life with constant eye pain - eye pain which onset at
the time of my LASIK surgery.
Links to Related Websites:
LASIK SOS http://www.LASIKSOS.com/
LASIK Letters http://www.lasikletters.com/
Ask LASIK Patients http://www.asklasikpatients.com/
LASIK 101 http://www.lasik101.com/
Enclosed herein is a description of my experience in the
"medical care" of "Doctor" Michael Gordon.
Within a year after the surgery, it was clear that my vision
was deteriorating. This is a letter I wrote to the FDA asking for
help, augmented by the belief that they should "know what is
happening", in terms of LASIK. This letter serves to describe my
condition at about 1 year post-op.
Did my Experience with "Doctor" Michael Gordon Involve a
Deliberate Act of Consumer Fraud ?
My LASIK surgery was on August 14, 1998. "Doctor" Michael
Gordon was my LASIK surgeon.
During a pre-op consultation, I asked "Doctor" Michael Gordon
a question about LASIK, tantamount to the inquiry, "OK, what's the
downside of this here LASIK, Doc ?" Michael Gordon responds.
"Well, I've had laser surgery, and I use a few eye-drops every now
and then."
There's only one thing - at that time, Michael Gordon had had
PRK, not LASIK. PRK does not involve a micro-keratome cut - the
first half of a partial corneal transplant. The first half of
LASIK is like the first half of a partial corneal transplant - a
cut is made through the stroma, the middle layer of the 5 layers
of the cornea. In LASIK, the cut stops just short of a complete
cut. What's left is called the "flap."
In a partial corneal transplant, the cut is all the way
through. No flap. At the time, I didn't know that. I thought
Michael Gordon was answering my question about LASIK by describing
his experience with LASIK. He didn't. He deliberately answered
my question about LASIK by describing his experience with PRK.
Then, during the pre-op consult, Michael Gordon neglects to
ask me the simplest of questions about a clear contra-indication
to corneal surgery - contact-lens intolerance. I am contact-lens
intolerant, at that time that was the only sign of ocular surface
disease. In addition to double-vision associated with a crossed
left eye, I experienced a step-function increase in the symptoms
of ocular surface disease on the day of my LASIK surgery. I was
subsequently diagnosed with full-blown Dry Eye Syndrome,
Blepharitis, and told to move to Florida - for the humidity.
I believe it was Michael Gordon's responsibility, given that
he held and holds himself out to the public as a "Doctor of
Medicine", with all the rights and responsibilities pertaining
thereto, to ask me a simple question which would have directly
addressed my suitability for elective corneal surgery. All he had
to do was ask, "Are you contact-lens intolerant ?" He neglected to
do so. In the old days, I used to think that the doctors were
supposed to know more than the patients. Not any more.
Should "Doctor" Michael Gordon ever wish to discuss LASIK
complications on San Diego television, I am prepared to do so.
Maybe we could do it in game show format. I've spent thousands of
dollars on eye-drops since my LASIK surgery. I could use the
money.
~ MY PRESENT CONDITION, 3 1/2 years post-op ~
These symptoms onset at the time of my LASIK surgery, and have
become progressively worse since then. My eyes were
disease-free until the day of my LASIK surgery, at which time
I was 40 years old.
* Escalating, chronic pain in my left eye. I now lay with my eyes
closed about 4 hours a day because they hurt, and that is the
only way I've found to make them feel better. I am not
referring to sleep. I'm saying that, of the approximately 16
hours a day that I am awake, I spend approximately 4 hours of
that time with my eyes closed, because it hurts to have them
open.
* Crossed left eye - causing me to see double when I look at
anything more than 5 feet away.
* Reading hurts my eyes so i stopped doing it ... I used to read
10 magazines an hour.
* No more making stuff. I used to be able to make things with my
hands. Of course, this means being able to see up-close,
without eye-strain. As an ophthalmologist told me, "Yes,
LASIK burns away your near-sighted vision. Your surgeon
should have told you." Before LASIK, I was good at making
things with my hands -
my computers
my jewelry
my web programming
Not any more. Now, my tools collect dust. I do not have the
"eye-time", evenings and weekends, to "make stuff" anymore.
As my corneal dis-ease has progressed, I have been forced to
allocate less and less time for exercise, from which I once
extracted a huge amount of enjoyment. I now work out once a day
on weekends, and about once during the week. That's a big change
- from 12 rigorous workouts a week to 3; I don't have a shortage
of discipline - I recently cranked out a 5K swim and hit a
second-best personal time. I have a shortage of eye-time.
* Early Retirement. Given the degradation in the condition of my
eyes, Prudence says: prepare for forced early retirement.
In fact, I've met another patient, an RK patient, whose eyes
were over-corrected during RK surgery. When presbyopia
onset, she became unable to do her job, and she was forced to
retire early. She advised me to prepare for the same fate.
Coincidentally, her refractive surgeon's name is ... very
familiar.
"Doctor" Michael Gordon has, via LASIK, introduced me to the
world of corneal dis-ease and disease. The list of symptoms above
describes my present eye condition. Based on the escalation of my
eye pain, the decrease in my daily eye-time, and the loss of
vision required to build things with my hands - that ability that
I practiced daily for the last 40 years, from playing with Lego
bricks to building cell-phone base stations, the experience that I
am having is - the experience of going blind, and living with
chronic pain in my eyes.
Following the LASIK surgery performed by "Doctor" Michael
Gordon. Unfortunately, many other patients have many other
stories to tell.
In a state of true informed consent, the rate of reduction of
new casualties is reduced. That is one of the purposes of this
website - to participate in the act of informing potential pre-op
LASIK patients about the true medical and lifestyle effects of
LASIK surgery.
Thank you for visiting. This website does not have a forum.
Online forums for people who need help with refractive surgery
problems and questions can be found at Surgical Eyes, and also at
the USENET Newsgroups named "sci.med.vision", and also
"alt.lasik-eyes"
I have a friend, on disability, with torturous, frequently
excruciating, constant pain, following her own LASIK, performed by
a high-priced surgeon associated with a large publicly held laser
chain - a surgeon with academic affiliations and "famous"
patients.
That friend used to love to read. But not any more. Now she
listens to Books on Tape. She is 3 years post-op and no doctor
has stepped forward to champion the marathon project of helping
her see without pain.
She has seen 20 ophthalmogists, seeking medical help. It is
impossible for me to be in her company without realizing that I am
witnessing a medical dilemma that is appropriately treated as an
emergency, warranting massive efforts by the medical community to
come to her assistance.
Yet, no such efforts are forthcoming, yet. We need to help
this woman. She deserves a dream team of doctors dedicated to the
restoration of her vision. What good is seeing an eye-chart 20/30
if your eyes hurt, and opening your eyes makes the pain worse ?
Again: the symptoms of that patient's ocular disease onset
at the time of her LASIK.
I did not expect to learn so much about ophthalmology, in
general, and refractive surgery, in particular.
Other patients are welcome to email me at the address below.
Nor can we forget the patients who have been harmed by PRK and RK,
older forms of refractive surgery.
I was once, and may still be, a darn good hands-on design
engineer. Because of my vision, I run a 21" monitor at 800 x 600
resolution. Before LASIK, though I was near-sighted, in terms of
pixels, my vision was better than 8000 x 6000 pixels, and my eyes
were open and seeing effortlessly 16 hours a day. Now, I'm down
to 800 x 600, and my vision is rarely effortless. Because my eyes
hurt, I close them 4 hours a day.
I can still see some of the letters on "Doctor" Michael
Gordon's Snellen charts.
I wonder if he considers me a surgical success ?
Thank you for visiting this website.
Sincerely,
~ Roger ~
Roger Bratt
PS Patients are welcome to email me at rodger@organic-electric.com
Please note ... that's "roger@" ... no "d" in "roger".
Just a web programming technique to avoid email-harvesting spyders
that roam the web. Copyright 2002
More LASIK Websites & Online Forums. Websites Run By
"Patients"
I use the term "Patients" in quotes because most of the
useful medical assistance I have received - the anti-inflammatory
for my eye-pain, the Salagen to increase tear-flow - were
suggestions that came from other patients - resulting in a
prescription written by my general practitioner.
In other words, the patients I am meeting during my
refractive surgery experience seem to know more about
ophthalmology as it pertains to complications of refractive
surgery, than the refractive surgeons themselves. You be the
judge.
The Surgical Eyes Foundation
http://www.surgicaleyes.org/ Surgical Eyes Bulletin Board
http://surgicaleyes.atinfopop.com/4/OpenTopic
Brent Hanson's Website
http://www.lasikcourt.com/tlc/brenthanson/ LASIKDisaster.com
QUESTION: "Doctors" Michael Gordon and Perry Binder: Do
they have any refractive surgery patients who have experienced
"sub-optimal" outcomes ?
ANSWER: YES.
Jan - 24 May 2004 12:08 GMT
> Dear Friends,
>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Otis
> Engineer
Pleas Otis, do me and maybe others in this newsgroup a favour.
There is a special newsgroup for this kind of stuff.
''alt.lasik-eyes''
BTW, already capable to proof or just beat the retread?
Jan (normally Dutch spoken)
Jan - 24 May 2004 12:31 GMT
> Dear Friends,
>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Otis
> Engineer
Please Otis, do me and maybe others in this newsgroup a favour.
There is a special newsgroup for this kind of stuff.
''alt.lasik-eyes''
BTW, already capable to proof or just beat the retread?
Jan (normally Dutch spoken)
Glenn Hagele - Council for Refractive Surgery Quality Assurance glenn.hagele@usaeyes.org - 24 May 2004 17:05 GMT
Otis,
Unless you want sci.med.vision to be rife with anti-LASIK zealots and
publication spam, you may do well to post refractive surgery related
information at alt.lasik-eyes.
Additionally, Roger Bratt and his shenanigans are well known at
alt.lasik-eyes and many of his claims have been debated to death. A
search there will be very revealing to the "other side" of Bratt's
accusations.
Glenn Hagele
Executive Director
Council for Refractive Surgery Quality Assurance
Email to glenn dot hagele at usaeyes dot org
http://www.USAEyes.org
http://www.ComplicatedEyes.org
I am not a doctor.
Jan - 24 May 2004 18:19 GMT
<Glenn Hagele - Council for Refractive Surgery Quality Assurance
glenn.hagele@usaeyes.org> schreef in bericht
news:f674b0dh07lusd0s2uv08bimndgmns0b1p@4ax.com...
> Otis,
>
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
> I am not a doctor.
Thank you
Jan (normally Dutch spoken)
Rishi Giovanni Gatti - 25 May 2004 20:11 GMT
> Dear Friends,
>
> There are many people who have had success with
> Lasik. However, it is well to consider and
> evaluate "adverse" results as reported below.
Thanks Otis for having published this.
The fact that science and medicine do not cope very well is much clear
from this related experience.
It is strange that the pro-idiots that write here are so scared about
this simple fact, that the medicine based on vision-science is totally
wrong.
Robert Kopp - 27 May 2004 03:42 GMT
Because of my vision, I run a 21" monitor at 800 x 600
> resolution. Before LASIK, though I was near-sighted, in terms of
> pixels, my vision was better than 8000 x 6000 pixels,
I don't think so. And Otis, as an engineer, should be good enough at math to
realize that.
Someone with 20/20 vision can resolve to a minute of arc. They can divide a
full circle into 360 x 60 = 21,600 parts.
If your eye is at the center of a circle, and its circumference is at an
appropriate reading distance, it will have a length of 100 inches. You will
be able to resolve two points separated by 1/216 of an inch.
If you have a monitor with a horizontal resolution of 8000 pixels, and I
wouldn't want to pay for it, and a width of 16 inches, that will be 500
pixels per inch. To make use of all this information you would have to have
a visual acuity better than 20/8.

Signature
Robert T. Kopp
http://analytic.tripod.com/ .
Otis Brown - 28 May 2004 04:49 GMT
Dear Robert,
Of course I am aware of the resolution of the
human eye for the Snellen chart under room illumination
conditions as 1 minute-of-arc. (Snellen characters
are 5 minut-of-arc wide for 20/20 vision.)
This man describes a "bad outcome" for his surgery.
His description of what he sees is his -- not
my description.
People considering Lasik should consider this
possibility -- before it develops.
For some one with 20/50 vision (and 45 years old)
I would think it very un-wise.
For all I have said -- there is an advantage to
being SLIGHTLY nearsighted at age 45. Your
NEAR vision will last for a very long time.
If you can pass the Snellen-DMV test of
20/40 and 20/70 or-better, you have no
LEGAL reason to wear glasses.
Further, the difference in refractive status
(of about 1/2 diopter) gives you "mono-vision"
which means you can see clear for both distant
and near without glasses.
(Where is Bates when we need him?)
The subject was to BE CAREFUL with Lasik.
Yes I have friends who have had it. It is indeed
impressive. But I would not have it done.
It is indeed a presonal descision -- but you
should consider ALL the risks before you
take the plunge.
Best,
Otis
Engineer
*****
> Because of my vision, I run a 21" monitor at 800 x 600
> > resolution. Before LASIK, though I was near-sighted, in terms of
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> pixels per inch. To make use of all this information you would have to have
> a visual acuity better than 20/8.
Rishi Giovanni Gatti - 28 May 2004 07:48 GMT
> Further, the difference in refractive status
> (of about 1/2 diopter) gives you "mono-vision"
> which means you can see clear for both distant
> and near without glasses.
> (Where is Bates when we need him?)
Where is him?
> Yes I have friends who have had it. It is indeed
> impressive. But I would not have it done.
> It is indeed a presonal descision -- but you
> should consider ALL the risks before you
> take the plunge.
Check if the lasiked persons you know REALLY are happy.
How do they cope with the sun?
How do they cope with lights in the night?
How do they cope with dry eyes?
How do they cope with pains, nightmares, etc.?

Signature
If you are interested in learning more about vision and the cure of
imperfect sight by treatment without glasses, contacts or surgery,
please visit http://TheCentralFixation.com or write to me privately.
Dr. Leukoma - 28 May 2004 12:52 GMT
> For all I have said -- there is an advantage to
> being SLIGHTLY nearsighted at age 45. Your
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> 20/40 and 20/70 or-better, you have no
> LEGAL reason to wear glasses.
There it is folks. Another good reason not to use plus lenses if you are
slightly myopic.
DrG
Otis Brown - 29 May 2004 05:32 GMT
Dear Friends,
The statement below is a suggestion of a number
of MDs and ODs. The issue is that, "... it is an
ill wind that does not blow some good".
Dr. Dave Guyton made that type of statement
to me -- and I agree with him.
The real issue was to determine the "balance" between
remaining at 20/40 (passing the Snellen-DMV) test
versus runinig very real risks from Lasik.
A person at 45 years of age will have restrict
range of lens travel (presbyopia). Lasik is not
exact. After the operation, the person could
have a refractive status of +1/2 diopter or more.
He will have 20/20 , yes, but will now have
lost most of his near vision.
This is simple optical physics -- as YOU should know.
You really like to play games with the people on this
site -- don't you?
Just be honest about this situation. I know I try
to be.
Hope this clarifies.
Best,
Otis
Engineer
> > For all I have said -- there is an advantage to
> > being SLIGHTLY nearsighted at age 45. Your
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> DrG
Dr. Leukoma - 29 May 2004 13:07 GMT
> This is simple optical physics -- as YOU should know.
> You really like to play games with the people on this
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Hope this clarifies.
I like to deflate bogus theories. I don't know why, but I just do.
DrG
Otis Brown - 30 May 2004 02:33 GMT
> > This is simple optical physics -- as YOU should know.
> > You really like to play games with the people on this
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> DrG
I like to deflate stuffed shirts. I don't know why, but I
enjoy it.
Best,
Otis
Engineer
Dr. Leukoma - 30 May 2004 14:03 GMT
>> > This is simple optical physics -- as YOU should know.
>> > You really like to play games with the people on this
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> Otis
> Engineer
Otis, we should be careful to restrict our arguments to the discussion of
facts or lack thereof. The facts are on my side. Since you haven't enough
facts to support your contentions, then your arguments are really about
your beliefs, for which you have no substantiation. That's why I correctly
call your theory bogus. It has been debunked already.
Note that I did not say you were bogus. I saud that your stated beliefs
were bogus.
DrG