 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Tinnitus / October 2003Speaking of obsession
For the sake of clarity and to answer questions of who said what when and to whom, here is the post from Ron from May 5, 1999 ------------------ My lord, is this how you spend your time? Have you thought of reading a book instead? Even reading comic books would be more valuable to you than reading these idiot archives. Have you thought of seeing a movie? That would be highly theraputic too to cure your obsession. You can rent movies now so you still wouldn't have to leave the house to interact with humans. You could even play them through your computer so you wouldn't have to leave the house. They can be mailed to you. Or exercise. that is also a therapy. Anything but studying this crap from four years ago! And worse, spitting it out. Every person who treats tinnitus has recommeded as therapy not to constantly dwell on the subject. By studying these archives from 4 - 5 years ago, you are making your tinnitus and your compulsion worse. Now I am repeating myself just like what's his name. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.hydromedonline.com/presentingthehydropulse/ >For the sake of clarity and to answer questions of who said >what when and to whom, here is the post from Ron from May 5, 1999 [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] >http://www.ent-consult.com >http://www.hydromedonline.com/presentingthehydropulse/ You are right Murray. One only has to go back a few days to find the kind of posts that show the lack of character this "doctor" has, however, you'd think that someone that claims to teach ethics would behave as if he had some. Terri http://pub219.ezboard.com/btinnitusactivismandsupport Sorry Murray and no, this isn't how I wish to spend my time. The reason I re-published this post is that it clearly shows the time frame of and the content of the "released information". It answers the question and puts to rest as to whether or not the information was released to the newsgroup by Nagler or Yoli. This shows in Ron's case it wasn't. It was Ron himself who freely released the information to the internet. Not Nagler. I knew this was there and I sought it out. So everyday, day in and day out, as Nagler is marched out in front of the firing squad and his crimes repeated and read, these charges of Nagler's release of Ron's confidential patient information will be known to be false. Thank you for your concern. Bruce > For the sake of clarity and to answer questions of who said > what when and to whom, here is the post from Ron from May 5, 1999 [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > http://www.ent-consult.com > http://www.hydromedonline.com/presentingthehydropulse/ Can you also quote the Word's series winners for 99 and the Rose Bowl too? That will get you free beer and socializing at almost any bar and therefore is of use. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.hydromedonline.com/presentingthehydropulse/ > Sorry Murray and no, this isn't how I wish to spend my time. > The reason I re-published this post is that it clearly shows [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Bruce Hi Bruce As usual: nice to see you around. Ignore the attack. Murray Grossan: Wasn't that a bit of a HARSH (understatement) comment to Bruce if I may ask?!!!!!!!! I thought it was pretty obvious why Bruce posted what he did, so need to fly off the handle and write a lot of hard words so someone like Bruce of all people about obsession etc. If you think he stirrs up things by posting this, I think you stirr up things even worse with your "kind" response. And I, myself, should probably just have ignored this sad post of yours instead of adding further, but I think Bruce got an unfair treatment here. All he really tried is for support and peace here. Those who fail to see that: just too bad/sad. Susanne > > For the sake of clarity and to answer questions of who said > > what when and to whom, here is the post from Ron from May 5, 1999 [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > http://www.ent-consult.com > > http://www.hydromedonline.com/presentingthehydropulse/ Susanne, I wouldn't characterize it as an attack, although I think the use of the word obsession was not called for. Instead, Murray was being very direct, probably too direct and blunt, with someone he cares about. He's concerned that Bruce is spending too much time on these issues involving his tinnitus. By so doing, he is allowing his brain to concentrate on the tinnitus and so allowing it to continue to be an issue. These same comments would be lost on Terri, Martin, and Winston/Alex/whatever. They lost the forest for the trees. The same is certainly not true of Bruce. Those who want to condemn Nagler will do so, no matter what is posted and no matter what the context of the interaction at that time. And Martin will continually and obsessively jab Murray because of a link that is included in his sig. They're beyond help and I don't really care about the status of their tinnitus. Howard N. Gutnick > > Sorry Murray and no, this isn't how I wish to spend my time. > > The reason I re-published this post is that it clearly shows [quoted text clipped - 57 lines] > > > http://www.ent-consult.com > > > http://www.hydromedonline.com/presentingthehydropulse/ >And Martin will >continually and obsessively jab Murray because of a link that is included in >his sig. It's not an obsession. I would type the words every time if that were the case. I just got a program called Quickeys from a friend. You record what you want to post and then hot key it. I'm just waiting till Murray's birthday as I promised I would not chastise him again till after his birthday. After that I will resume asking Murray why he is posting a nasal irrigator in his sig line on a tinnitus support group. Oops, I forgot. It just happened to end up in his sig line. How silly of me to think anything else. Martin Aquinas Huh? That's a meaningful distinction to you? Obsession = you re-type it every time. Non-obsession = you use some software routine to enter it. You're really goofier than I thought, Mr. Sussman. Howard N. Gutnick > >And Martin will > >continually and obsessively jab Murray because of a link that is included in [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Martin Aquinas >Huh? That's a meaningful distinction to you? Obsession = you re-type it >every time. Non-obsession = you use some software routine to enter it. It certainly is a "distinction." If one were truly obsessed one would type the same thing 10 times with words constantly misspelled and run through keyboards like The Incredible Bulk, or at least use a program to post it 10 times. But I think the latter would just be for mere annoyance/entertainment. >You're really goofier than I thought, Mr. Sussman. Thank you Mr. Gutnick Martin Sussman Aquinas My question qualified that by using the adjective "meaningful'. Certainly it is a distinction. But one that simply means that you've given some thought to automating your obsession to reduce your keystrokes. Your last statement about "mere annoyance/entertainment" is interesting. Your need to ask Murray the same question repetitively certainly has already achieved the threshold of annoyance and is not even close to being entertaining. BTW: Have you finally settled on a name? Is it Martin? Is it Martin Sussman Aquinas? Is it Martin Sussman? Is it Nathan Jessup? Howard N. Gutnick > >Huh? That's a meaningful distinction to you? Obsession = you re-type it > >every time. Non-obsession = you use some software routine to enter it. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Martin Sussman Aquinas >Is it Nathan Jessup? Yes, it is Nathan Jessup. Nathan Jessup Uh huh. Sure it is Martin. Howard N. Gutnick > >Is it Nathan Jessup? > > Yes, it is Nathan Jessup. > > Nathan Jessup I just got a program called Quickeys from a friend. You record what you want to post and then hot key it. Do you expect ANYONE to believe that you have a friend??? Quit kidding us. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.hydromedonline.com >Do you expect ANYONE to believe that you have a friend??? You're my friend, Muzzy. May I call you Muzzy? Now, why do YOU pollute this newsgroups with ads for a nasal irrigator? Martin Aquinas - strap in Muzzy, the birthday is over and as I said before, I think you're a damn hypocrite talking about insurance rates, and some crap about workers deciding a disability when you used to see patients and cash the insurance checks all the time. Martin/Nathan, What kind of work do you do and do you expect to get paid for that work? You portray yourself as a conservative. Isn't it one of the tenets of conservatism that people work, are productive, and get paid. It hardly is hypocritical to be concerned about insurance rates and then also accept insurance checks for services that are provided. The people to whom he provides services most often have insurance, which pays him for those services. The cost of insurance and therefore the rates that you and I pay has many variables, one of which of course is the fee that is paid to professionals. Fees for professional services, at least in the office, are one of the lesser contributors to the cost. . You also might want to compare the hourly expense for insurance company execs to the fees paid to professionals, which not only pay the salary of the professional, but also pay all of the office expenses. BTW: His name is Murray Grossan. His first name is not Muzzy and I don't believe he has given you permission to call him that, nor will he. You do so only to be demeaning and disrespectful. That says alot about you. Howard N. Gutnick > >Do you expect ANYONE to believe that you have a friend??? > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > and some crap about workers deciding a disability when you used to see > patients and cash the insurance checks all the time. Martin/Nathan, You haven't responded to this post and I have to wonder why. Do you work? Are you productive enough to earn a salary or even an hourly wage? Inquiring minds want to know. Howard N. Gutnick > Martin/Nathan, > [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > and some crap about workers deciding a disability when you used to see > > patients and cash the insurance checks all the time. >What kind of work do you do and do you expect to get paid for that work? Names, friends, jobs, etc. are not germane to the issues at hand. >You portray yourself as a conservative. I have common sense. Call the political affiliation/belief anything you like. If the democrats ever stopped lying and destroying my country I'd be a democrat, most likely. >Isn't it one of the tenets of conservatism that people work, are productive, and get paid.< I thought that was an American tenet that built this country. But I would agree that liberals throw money at problems only to make them almost always worse. >It hardly is hypocritical to be concerned about insurance rates and then also accept >insurance checks for services that are provided. You need to reread Muzzy's words. He railed against people causing costs to go up but almost assuredly never said "I can't see you today....I don't think you are that sick...the insurance rates must be kept low." >The people to whom he >provides services most often have insurance, which pays him for those >services. The "insurance" is merely the agent that pays. They likely keep 25% of the total premiums paid in. You should know that. >The cost of insurance and therefore the rates that you and I pay >has many variables, one of which of course is the fee that is paid to >professionals. Fees for professional services, at least in the office, are >one of the lesser contributors to the cost. Feel free to tell us where the problems lie with insurance rates going up considerably every year. I say it's illegal immigration to a very large degree as well as malpractice insurance because of a number of variables - a few greedy lawyers, a few doctors that should not be practicing, and the mistaken belief that doctors are gods. >You also might want to compare >the hourly expense for insurance company execs to the fees paid to >professionals, which not only pay the salary of the professional, but also >pay all of the office expenses. Insurance company execs make outrageous salaries. This is not an unknown issue. >BTW: His name is Murray Grossan. His first name is not Muzzy and I don't >believe he has given you permission to call him that, nor will he. You do so >only to be demeaning and disrespectful. That says alot about you. He's lucky that I don't call him a lot worse, Howie. Nathan Jessup > >What kind of work do you do and do you expect to get paid for that work? > > Names, friends, jobs, etc. are not germane to the issues at hand. It took you a long time to think up this little bit of sophistry. > The "insurance" is merely the agent that pays. They likely keep 25% of > the total premiums paid in. You should know that. Actually the insurance is a way to share risk. > >The cost of insurance and therefore the rates that you and I pay > >has many variables, one of which of course is the fee that is paid to [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > He's lucky that I don't call him a lot worse, Howie. And I'm sure he goes to bed every night being thankful of that fact. That cowardly pedants who hide behind the anonymity of the internet don't call him worse names. Howard N. Gutnick >It took you a long time to think up this little bit of sophistry. Nagler has tracked someone down in Canada and had them charged with a crime that never truly occurred, IMO. Nagler has spoken of a patient's contents of his medical file. Nagler has used someone's Social Security number in what would seem to be an illegal fashion. Now, look up a post about why one should NEVER use their real name here and tell me again why anyone in the right mind - when they are deal with a few that are apparently not in their right mind - should offer them their bio? >> The "insurance" is merely the agent that pays. They likely keep 25% of >> the total premiums paid in. You should know that. >Actually the insurance is a way to share risk. Tell that to the illegal immigrants that Mexico is sending us as their welfare state. Ask how much they are paying towards the average $30,000 delivery per child. >> He's lucky that I don't call him a lot worse, Howie. > >And I'm sure he goes to bed every night being thankful of that fact. I don't care how he goes to bed. I hope he sleeps well and wakes feeling refreshed. I also wish he would stop advertizing on a support board. >That cowardly pedants who hide behind the anonymity of the internet don't call >him worse names. Tell me, Howie, how would anyone's words be different - and you can focus on mine solely if you like - be different with a real name and address posted? What, you think if I gave you latitude and longitude that I would speak any differently? Nathan Jessup P.S. Sorry I couldn't get back to you more quickly. I have other responsibilities. I didn't know you were pulling a 24/7 here. > >It took you a long time to think up this little bit of sophistry. > > Nagler has tracked someone down in Canada and had them charged with a > crime that never truly occurred, IMO. That was not the opinion of a Canadian court. So I must agree with you. It is only your opinion. Nagler has spoken of a patient's > contents of his medical file. This has been discussed ad nauseum. One statement that a file was 60 pages long and another that the contents were "not pretty" constitutes release of medical information to you. It's nonsense but it fulfills your need to strike at anything and everything that Nagler does. Nagler has used someone's Social > Security number in what would seem to be an illegal fashion. "would seem to be" Was he prosecuted? Was he sanctioned in any way by any governing body? This has been has > Now, look up a post about why one should NEVER use their real name > here and tell me again why anyone in the right mind - when they are > deal with a few that are apparently not in their right mind - should > offer them their bio? Because of course you're in your right mind, and you would not provide your real name. Which means you've lied to us that your name is Martin, or Sussman, or Nathan Jessup or whatever. You don't have to provide anyone with a bio to answer the question whether you productively work and earn a salary or an hourly wage. So what is it. You live with Mommy and Daddy. You're independently wealthy. You're on disability. You're retired. All very general categories that wouldn't allow anyone to actually know who you are. > >> The "insurance" is merely the agent that pays. They likely keep 25% of > >> the total premiums paid in. You should know that. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > welfare state. Ask how much they are paying towards the average > $30,000 delivery per child. Huh? When in doubt, bring up your favorite whipping boy, regardless of it's relevance to the actual discussion. Mexican immigrants? lol Nice diversion. > >> He's lucky that I don't call him a lot worse, Howie. > > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > feeling refreshed. I also wish he would stop advertizing on a support > board. Recall your definition of insanity. Again you bring up this silly point to demonstrate your finely honed sense of internet ethics. > >That cowardly pedants who hide behind the anonymity of the internet don't call > >him worse names. > > Tell me, Howie, how would anyone's words be different - and you can > focus on mine solely if you like - be different with a real name and > address posted? It might demonstrate that you are not the coward that your need to hide behind anonymity demonstrates. For instance and for giggles, what if you are really Steve Conlon using all these aliases. Do you not think that would explain your obsession with Nagler. So if a real name and address really don't matter, I'll just call you Steve. How about that? > What, you think if I gave you latitude and longitude that I would > speak any differently? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > P.S. Sorry I couldn't get back to you more quickly. I have other > responsibilities. I didn't know you were pulling a 24/7 here. Sure you do. Busy man, Steve. Howard N. Gutnick >That was not the opinion of a Canadian court. So I must agree with you. It >is only your opinion. Mike Tyson went to a hotel room with a woman - as Kobe Bryant is now being tried for - and the jury got it wrong. IMO, the Canadian court got it wrong. In fact, reading the incident the Canadian court slapped him on the wrist and likely had to do something because someone claimed he was targeted for death. Nathan Jessup The reason I re-published this post is that it clearly shows > > the time frame of and the content of the "released information". > > It answers the question and puts to rest as to whether or not > > the information was released to the newsgroup by Trust me when I say you would be better off worrying about the football scores. By the way, this is not a flippant statement. I cure my patients in the same way. His headaches stopped when I ordered him to watch only comedies and not the Viet Nam News Her pains left when she followed my instructions to have music constantly turned on. This constant perusal ao he said she said simply builds up circuits in the brain to reinforce an illness. Can't reacal the author, but he was dying in the hospital. He and the doctors had given up all hope. His friends brought in Comedy movies, set up a projector and in 2 weeks he walked out of the hospital well. So, what I am saying is not idle chatter. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.hydromedonline.com/presentingthehydropulse/ >Can't reacal the author, but he was dying in the hospital. He and the doctors >had given up all hope. His friends brought in Comedy movies, set up a >projector >and in 2 weeks he walked out of the hospital well. >So, what I am saying is not idle chatter. Norman Cousins. Susan Yes it was Norman Cousins and after he recovered he taught this to doctors at UCLA. We all know that the mind can make you sick or sicker. In one study the women with advanced breast cancer survived much longer with proper visualization. We see cases that were "gone". Then the son announced he would be married in 3 months. Despite all medical expectations, she lived to attend the wedding. And the guided visualization where you spend time before you had the tinnitus seems to help some persons. This makes sense because you are speding less "energy" reinforcing the tinnitus as some do here. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.hydromedonline.com > Susanne, > [quoted text clipped - 62 lines] > > > > > > > > My lord, is this how you spend your time? Howard Gutnick said: Susanne, I wouldn't characterize it as an attack, although I think the use of the word obsession was not called for. Instead, Murray was being very direct, probably too direct and blunt, with someone he cares about. He's concerned that Bruce is spending too much time on these issues involving his tinnitus. By so doing, he is allowing his brain to concentrate on the tinnitus and so allowing it to continue to be an issue. Ok, Howard Gutnick. Having seen the real attacks here, Murray Grossans comments probably shouldn't be characterized exactly like an attack. Glad you think the word obsession was uncalled for though. However, having said that. If Murray Grossan care about Bruce and his T (and I believe he does), then there would be loads of better ways to express that care and concern than the way he did. IMO that is. Susanne > > > > Have you thought of reading a book instead? Even reading comic books > would be [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > > > http://www.ent-consult.com > > > > http://www.hydromedonline.com/presentingthehydropulse/ > > Susanne, > > [quoted text clipped - 88 lines] > > Susanne hey.... hey... hey.... : )) Thanks to everyone but it's OK. : )) I haven't been silent because I'm miffed but rather because I know deep down Muuray's right and I'm pondering all this. If anything Murray is putting his concern with my well being over everything else here. He knows me well enough to know when to use the 2x4. His Bora Bora Root will never come close to the effectiveness of EERIE WAX, though. Though the willowy South Pacific maidens are nice. I certainly feel the friendship of you all, and mighty fine friends you all are. Bruce PS: I'm still glad I found that post On 9 Oct 2003 10:06:45 -0700, sagesseinfinie2002@yahoo.com (Susanne Sourire) wrote: >Murray Grossan: Wasn't that a bit of a HARSH (understatement) comment >to Bruce if I may ask?!!!!!!!! I thought it was pretty obvious why [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >really tried is for support and peace here. Those who fail to see >that: just too bad/sad. And some think it's me! What a shocker. Murray has leveled baseless accusations at me, likened me to a Nazi thug, and continually put words in my mouth. I ask him to defend just an iota of the words he writes and he goes mute. Murray da merchant...go figure! Martin Aquinas > And some think it's me! What a shocker. Murray has leveled baseless > accusations at me, likened me to a Nazi thug, and continually put [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Martin Aquinas It IS you as your post clearly demonstrates. It has your recent objects of obsession with Murray on display. I agree with Murray's assessment of you acting like a Nazi thug as you: 1. You are mean-spirited. You bully people and try to exploit what you perceive as weakness in others in a support group. As the Nazis have. 2. You will use all devices at your disposal to attack, demonize and dehumanize those who disagree with you including lies and distortions using your own 'dogma' as an excuse and justification for doing so. As the Nazis have. 3. You tolerate no views different from your own while attempting to force others to accept your views. As the Nazis have. In a support group mind you. These are only three examples. There are more. These are laced throughout your posts. If you want examples simply read nearly everything you've written. The exceptions are rare. >These are only three examples. Bruce, Bruce, Bruce, you de-humanize yourself with such absurd comments backed by nothing but your own demoralized mind. Such a pity...a tragedy in fact. You have no standards so anyone trying to point out society's problems is to you, a "Nazi." It's far easier for people like you to try and label than to give real reasons J'accuse! Martin Aquinas >My lord, is this how you spend your time? There are some people here who feel that certain people could pose a danger to others mental health. It's called community service. Martin Teresa > >My lord, is this how you spend your time? > > There are some people here who feel that certain people could pose a > danger to others mental health. It's called community service. > > Martin Teresa I understand. |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2008 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.