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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Tinnitus / May 2005Thank you Elly!
My T started in April of '05. Like most people, I became greatly distressed over it and thus began to do a lot of intensive research. The information provided by you Elly, proved to be the most valuable to me. Long story short; I bought a new extra firm mattress and a 2" thick memory foam therapeutic mattress cover and memory foam therapeutic pillows. I got a deep tissue neck and shoulder massage. I've paid a lot of attention to displaying better posture while at my desk at work, plus doing a lot of gentle neck stretching throughout the day, and on not clenching my jaw or grinding my teeth. I'd say that my T has gotten about 90% better, and has stayed that way for several days now. Thanks, Brian Thank you Brian, that is very kind of you. Elly's Tinnitus Resources http://eebee.net/ >My T started in April of '05. Like most people, I became greatly >distressed over it and thus began to do a lot of intensive research. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >Thanks, >Brian Very good! If you had gone to an ENT doctor or a neurologist, you would have paid megabug and been addicted to aprozolem or ativan. > Very good! If you had gone to an ENT doctor or a neurologist, you > would have paid megabug and been addicted to aprozolem or ativan. Is megabug like a giant beetle or something?? Unfortunately, many (most??) cases of tinnitus cannot be resolved simply by changing pillows, mattresses or sleeping positions. If it were, there would be no need of any of this- tinnitus would simply be a easily treated condition, no more of a nuisance than needing reading glasses for presbyopia. frank Very good! If you had gone to an ENT doctor or a neurologist, you would have paid megabug and been addicted to aprozolem or ativan. But I did go to see an ENT (board certified of course). I feel that it's always best to consult a physician when you're unsure of an aspect of your health. I wanted to rule out ear or sinus infection, and he also ruled out the likelihood of it being the result of a neurological problem or a tumor as well. I was also given a hearing test by an audiologist in his clinic, and some minor hearing damage/loss was established. I've been aware of some small difficulty with hearing for a while, so it was high time to have my ears checked anyway. I was hoping that I just had too much earwax, but that wasn't the case. It's too bad that I wasted my money buying ear drops before receiving my examination though. I already fortunately had some alprazolam (also known as Xanax, a brand name for alprazolam) which was prescribed to me some time ago by my GP for occasional anxiety attacks. I finally took one about the third day of the start of my tinnitus, because the ringing was really starting to freak me out. The alprazolam did wonders! Then a couple of days later, I discovered that it was also prescribed for tinnitus. It really helped me get through the roughest patch and I believe also helped me to better habituate the ringing. I'm back off it for the most part now, so I don't have to worry about habituating it as well (har har). I understand alprazolam can be a real problem addiction wise for some folks. Most of my tinnitus seems to be a result of neck and jaw tension, but I was able to come to that conclusion a lot quicker by ruling out other possible causes via medical examination. The first thing my ENT asked me was if I was under any stress, which went towards to my coming to my current conclusion of mussel tension being the main culprit. Brian On 5/6/05 10:06 AM, in article 1115399215.299093.197350@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com, "Brian K" <bluestucco@hotmail.com> wrote: > Very good! If you had gone to an ENT doctor or a neurologist, you > would have paid megabug and been addicted to aprozolem or ativan. [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > Brian Someone is always condemning Xanax and its terrible effects. But see the other side: She was house bound. Couldn't even go out to shop. Now, with Xanax she is working , taking care of the family and attending night school He couldn't speak up at meetings. Did everything possible to avoid them. Really hurting his career. Now with Xanax he can function at his best. What I see are patients brought back to life with this medication. I personally don't prescribe it for T, but there are certainly advantages to the drug. > On 5/6/05 10:06 AM, in article > 1115399215.299093.197350@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com, "Brian K" [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > personally don't prescribe it for T, but there are certainly advantages to > the drug. Murray, I think someday I may need to take Xanax. Why don't you prescribe it for your patients? Eric On 5/7/05 11:49 AM, in article 117q3duqqkfo32c@corp.supernews.com, "Eric J. Scharer" <scharer@directcon.net> wrote: > Murray, I think someday I may need to take Xanax. Why don't you > prescribe > it for your patients? I use a different approach, mirror biofeedback, antioxidants, etc. but I don¹t' think people should be discouraged from takng it if the doctor recommends it. So often it is painted here as a horrible product. But I have seen the good results with it too. Murry Grossman wrote: Scharer" <scha...@directcon.net> wrote: > Murray, I think someday I may need to take Xanax. Why don't you > prescribe > it for your patients? "I use a different approach, mirror biofeedback, antioxidants, etc. but I don¹t' think people should be discouraged from takng it if the doctor recommends it. So often it is painted here as a horrible product. But I have seen the good results with it too." I've had wonderful results with Xanax. I've been on it for nearly a year now, but have only taken a total of 20% of the 2 tablets a day as needed recommended dosage. That's because I take it as NEEDED, not as desired. For me it was a happy coincidence that I already had it on hand for occasional episodes of high anxiety or outright panic attacks. It all really depends on the individual in my opinion. I already needed Xanax on occasion prior to my tinnitus, so why not continue to take it for the tinnitus as needed, since it really helps that as well? But hey, that's me. I wouldn't recommend Xanax to others for tinnitus if there are other less risky or beneficial methods available. I'd imagine that anyone who is susceptible to getting hooked on any substance like food or tobacco or liquor etc. could probably get hooked on Xanax as well. For me personally, the best and only way to deal with tinnitus has been habituation. Once I came to understand and most importantly accept the concept of habituation, the less important all other remedies have become. After several days of little to no ringing, my ears have been screaming like tea kettles for the past couple of days, and I'm not doing anything to try to stop it. If I NEED it, the Xanax is there for me. The sound effects that I've downloaded into my computer and made CDs of that mask the tinnitus, are there too if I need them. The longer that I can go without them, the less I'll need them. Right now, even though my ears are ringing like hell, I'm happy as a clam. I'm cool and happy without any feedbacks or maskers or drugs, or herbs, or even supplements (the latter only because I forgot to take my vitamins today.) I'm happy because I know that I'm habituating, which means that over a period of time, the ringing will in essence fade away completely. I already notice the loud ringing much less often, and when I do notice it, it doesn't worry me anymore. This is purely due to my acceptance of habituation, rather than my trying to seek some sort of relief. Of course, the fact that I got 8 hrs. of sleep using a very ergonomic sleep system, lending towards a clear relaxed mind along with a relaxed body (especially the neck) makes that habituating all the easier. Xanax, noise maskers, feedback, acupuncture, whatever, I don't need 'em today. It's wonderfully reassuring to know that they're available if I do need them, which of course makes me feel safe, which lets me habituate. Oh, and I'm also calm and reassured knowing that I don't have to shell out thousands of dollars to a TRT specialist. All I had to do was learn the concepts of TRT/habituation, and accept it. But of course it's reassuring to know where one is in my city, just in case. Will I continue working on better posture and less jaw clenching? Of course. Will I continue making sure I get at least 8 hrs. of sound (no pun intended) sleep? Of course. Will I continue to avoid sodium, caffeine and alcohol? Of course. Will I continue consuming vitamins, supplements, antioxidants et al? Of course. All of these lend towards habituation, not attempted relief mind you, but habituation. And those practices might also lend towards a much healthier longer life as well, which makes me actually appreciate my tinnitus in a fashion, which lends towards my habituating it. Brian. I've had wonderful results with Xanax. I've been on it for nearly a year now, but have only taken a total of 20% of the 2 tablets a day as needed recommended dosage. That's because I take it as NEEDED, not as desired. For me it was a happy coincidence that I already had it on hand for occasional episodes of high anxiety or outright panic attacks. It all really depends on the individual in my opinion. I already needed Xanax on occasion prior to my tinnitus, so why not continue to take it for the tinnitus as needed, since it really helps that as well? But hey, that's me. I wouldn't recommend Xanax to others for tinnitus if there are other less risky or beneficial methods available. I'd imagine that anyone who is susceptible to getting hooked on any substance like food or tobacco or liquor etc. could probably get hooked on Xanax as well. For me personally, the best and only way to deal with tinnitus has been habituation. Once I came to understand and most importantly accept the concept of habituation, the less important all other remedies have become. After several days of little to no ringing, my ears have been screaming like tea kettles for the past couple of days, and I'm not doing anything to try to stop it. If I NEED it, the Xanax is there for me. The sound effects that I've downloaded into my computer and made CDs of that mask the tinnitus, are there too if I need them. The longer that I can go without them, the less I'll need them. Right now, even though my ears are ringing like hell, I'm happy as a clam. I'm cool and happy without any feedbacks or maskers or drugs, or herbs, or even supplements (the latter only because I forgot to take my vitamins today.) I'm happy because I know that I'm habituating, which means that over a period of time, the ringing will in essence fade away completely. I already notice the loud ringing much less often, and when I do notice it, it doesn't worry me anymore. This is purely due to my acceptance of habituation, rather than my trying to seek some sort of relief. Of course, the fact that I got 8 hrs. of sleep using a very ergonomic sleep system, lending towards a clear relaxed mind along with a relaxed body (especially the neck) makes that habituating all the easier. Xanax, noise maskers, feedback, acupuncture, whatever, I don't need 'em today. It's wonderfully reassuring to know that they're available if I do need them, which of course makes me feel safe, which lets me habituate. Oh, and I'm also calm and reassured knowing that I don't have to shell out thousands of dollars to a TRT specialist. All I had to do was learn the concepts of TRT/habituation, and accept it. But of course it's reassuring to know where one is in my city, just in case. Will I continue working on better posture and less jaw clenching? Of course. Will I continue making sure I get at least 8 hrs. of sound (no pun intended) sleep? Of course. Will I continue to avoid sodium, caffeine and alcohol? Of course. Will I continue consuming vitamins, supplements, antioxidants et al? Of course. All of these lend towards habituation, not attempted relief mind you, but habituation. And those practices might also lend towards a much healthier longer life as well, which makes me actually appreciate my tinnitus in a fashion, which lends towards my habituating it. Brian. Nice post, Brian. So true for most of us. > Murry Grossman wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > Right now, even though my ears are ringing like hell, I'm happy as a > clam. I think you should find out the cause of it. You have a lifetime to do it. FP ===================== I'm cool and happy without any feedbacks or maskers or drugs, > or herbs, or even supplements (the latter only because I forgot to take > my vitamins today.) I'm happy because I know that I'm habituating, [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > Brian. It's not a question of just condemning Xanax, Murray. There is irrefutable evidence that benzodiazepines can cause *a lot* of harm. No one disagrees that people's lives can be changed for the better by them - under certain conditions, for certain problems, temporarily. I am living proof. It's what happens when people need or want or are told by their doctors to stop taking them that's alarming. I am also living proof of that. Long-term benzo use and withdrawal can cause (among 150-200 other things) long-lasting, possibly permanent, Tinnitus even for people who didn't have it before. Why risk permanent Tinnitus as a side-effect of a drug you take to get rid of Tinnitus? (I know you said you don't prescribe Xanax for Tinnitus, but some physicians do.) Here's a list of clinically documented benzodiazepine withdrawal symptoms: http://www.benzo.org.uk/manual/bzcha03.htm There is still very little research on whether long-term benzodiazepine use causes permanent functional brain damage. But symptoms lasting many years after benzo withdrawal are well-documented. Take a look at what the UK Committee on Safety of Medicines said in *1988* about how benzos should be prescribed, and their risks. (Prescribe only for *severe disabling* anxiety and/or insomnia. Give low doses, taper people when they discontinue, and if used for insomnia, only use it from time to time. Do not prescribe for depression alone.) Note that in *1980* - 25 years ago! - another UK Committee warned that using a benzo for longer than 4 months was not useful: http://www.benzo.org.uk/commit.htm > Someone is always condemning Xanax and its terrible effects. > But see the other side: > She was house bound. Couldn't even go out to shop. Now, with Xanax she is > working , taking care of the family and attending night school > He couldn't speak up at meetings. Did everything possible to avoid them. > Really hurting his career. Now with Xanax he can function at his best. > > What I see are patients brought back to life with this medication. I > personally don't prescribe it for T, but there are certainly advantages to > the drug. On 5/7/05 6:25 PM, in article AUdfe.52631$tg1.34540@edtnps84, > It's not a question of just condemning Xanax, Murray. There is > irrefutable evidence that benzodiazepines can cause *a lot* of harm. [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] >> personally don't prescribe it for T, but there are certainly advantages to >> the drug. Not as bad as that other product that responsible for hundreds of children's deaths and adults too. If this were off the market, could have saved hundreds of children's lives. Yet, FDA won't remove it because of political and other reasons. >> Someone is always condemning Xanax and its terrible effects. > But see the other side: > She was house bound. Couldn't even go out to shop. Now, with Xanax she is > working , taking care of the family and attending night school So, you think a pill should have "cured" this woman instead of her facing up to her fears, or finding out what was wrong, exactly? > He couldn't speak up at meetings. Did everything possible to avoid them. > Really hurting his career. Now with Xanax he can function at his best. With some proper training, or self-confidence building programme, he could have done it the same without drugs? > What I see are patients brought back to life with this medication. I > personally don't prescribe it for T, but there are certainly advantages to > the drug. As long as it used on a short-term basis, then any benzo can help, but the problem will still be there when the patient stops taking it, if the problem isn't tackled properly? In fact, another serious problem arises by taking Xanax on a regular basis - addiction! Ben On 5/8/05 3:42 PM, in article mBwfe.14872$%K6.13651@newsfe5-gui.ntli.net, > So, you think a pill should have "cured" this woman instead of her facing up > to her fears, or finding out what was wrong, exactly? That's good 1950's thinking. Today we have a better grasp of the chemistry. You can draw blood from this patient, and give it to a test animal who will have the same symptoms. You don't tell a hyperthyroid patient to "stiffen up", you control the thyroid level. You don't ask a headache patient to face up to the cause of her headaches, you treat the hypertension that may be the cause. . > > That's good 1950's thinking Maybe it wouldn't hurt us to go back to the 1950's! People coped with an awful lot more without so much bloody griping, and expecting a pill for every ill in those days? . >Today we have a better grasp of the chemistry. > You can draw blood from this patient, and give it to a test animal who will > have the same symptoms. Which is absolutely NO help whatsover to us as animals are different, and react differently. > You don't tell a hyperthyroid patient to "stiffen > up", you control the thyroid level Bawaahahahahah!!! Like my GP wanted me to take 45 mg of carbimazole a day, and the hospital wanted me to take 40 mg a day, when I KNEW I had caused my hyper myself, and I eventually persuaded them to "allow" me to take 5 mg a day and got better *very* quickly! If I had taken the amount the medical people wanted me too I would have been hyPO in next to no time, or dead. . > You don't ask a headache patient to > face up to the cause of her headaches, you treat the hypertension that may > be the cause. . Naturally, if one has high blood pressure then it should be treated,( relaxation being important and overlooked) and I don't deny there are hundreds of cases where medicine is needed, but ALL the cases you mentioned had underlying causes which you choose to suppress with drugs. Addictive drugs too! Ben > That's good 1950's thinking. Today we have a better grasp of the chemistry. > You can draw blood from this patient, and give it to a test animal who will > have the same symptoms. You don't tell a hyperthyroid patient to "stiffen > up", you control the thyroid level. You don't ask a headache patient to > face up to the cause of her headaches, you treat the hypertension that may > be the cause. . But you _do_ tell a patient with anxiety disorder, panic disorder or insomnia to explore the underlying causes of their problem as well, and explain the risks of taking a benzo - don't you? And don't doctors advise patients with high blood pressure, migraines and even thyroid disorders to adjunct their drug therapy with relaxation techniques, dietary changes and perhaps psychotherapy? Not to do so seems to me to be the _real_ 1950s thinking. But the analogies are a red herring. It's now very obvious that benzodiazepines should only be prescribed according to guidelines similar to that of the Royal Australian College of General Physicians: http://www.racgp.org.au/guidelines/benzodiazepines/#reasons As for benzos and Tinnitus, here's a quote from the New England Journal of Medicine (2002): "Benzodiazepines have **not** been effective in controlling tinnitus or have been used in trials whose results are uninterpretable. In a randomized clinical trial of 40 subjects, tinnitus improved in 76 percent of those who received alprazolam [i.e. Xanax], as compared with 5 percent of those who received placebo. However, the study was criticized because of an absence of a crossover design and possible unblinding attributable to sedation. The use of benzodiazepines should be tempered by reports that tinnitus may recur after the treatment ends and cause a greater level of distress.... " http://www.medical-journals.com/real9a.htm On 5/10/05 10:53 AM, in article py6ge.49919$vN2.14071@clgrps13, >> That's good 1950's thinking. Today we have a better grasp of the chemistry. >> You can draw blood from this patient, and give it to a test animal who will [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > and cause a greater level of distress.... " > http://www.medical-journals.com/real9a.htm Worse of all is the side effects we see from placebos - rash, sleeplessness, anxiety, impotence, rapid heart, elevated BP, etc. In average there is a 37% side effect rate when placebos are used. Reminds me of a study I once did on a new drug. 53 patients and no side effects with the drug. None! I tried every which way to get someone to admit to something but no, no side effects whatsoever. > > Worse of all is the side effects we see from placebos - rash, sleeplessness, > anxiety, impotence, rapid heart, elevated BP, etc. In average there is a 37% > side effect rate when placebos are used. That proves just how powerful we are? If we truly believe we are taking some drug then we expect some side-effects. Surely the reverse can happen too? > Reminds me of a study I once did on a new drug. 53 patients and no side > effects with the drug. None! I tried every which way to get someone to admit > to something but no, no side effects whatsoever. Ah...... I see the reverse did happen, eh? :) Ben
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