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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Tinnitus / May 2005Which treatments or methods are most common / helpful?????
Hello people, I?m 28 years old and have had tinnitus for almost 14 years....half of my life... My "variation" is the "normal" high-pitched ringin? which is always there - more or less. I?ve learned to live with it, but the past weeks I think it?s been worse and more "constant".....I just can?t take it.... I?ve never tried any treatment. I?ve been reading this newsgroup for a while and I have a few questions : Which "methods" SHOULD I try no matter what? I mean - which of these are the most common treatments? : 1) Less sugar, fat, alcohol etc. 2) More sleep at night 3) Massage 4) Arcupuncture 5) White Noise or other sound-treatments? 6) Ginkgo Bilboa 7) any other suggestions...? I know there?s no cure, but I would just like to know in which order I should try all the above ment?oned "treatments"...which are the most "famous" and useful? Thanks, Anders Nielsen > Hello people, > [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > Thanks, > Anders Nielsen You must experiment and learn for yourself. Results are different for everyone. Use caution with Ginkgo. It is a blood anti-coagulant (thinner) that may pose health risks for some people. I've found that alcohol and caffeine make my T worse. I suspect cheese also is a culprit, but I'm still not sure about it. Shoulder and neck exercises/stretches seem to help some for me. > Hello people, > [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > Thanks, > Anders Nielsen Everybody has their own biases and preferences. My own are: 1) Be careful with the Ginkgo - use low dose Aspirin instead. 2) Quick relief may be achievable by using mild amplification + earpiece in the affected ear(s). This brings up the sound of the outside world and the tinnitus is heard less in comparison. The hearing system then seems to reduce its 'gain' in response (adjusts to the slightly louder sound) and the tinnitus can then be lost completely even after the device is taken off. Only a very _mild_ sound boost should be used. Hearing everything uncomfortably loud can irritate the hearing and make the tinnitus worse. 3) I've experimented with white noise, and very short click-like rapid bursts of this _at low level_ can be effective in 'discharging' the tinnitus. See www.detinnitiser.com I emphasise the above are my tips alone and work for me. Others may disagree with them. Steve O > Everybody has their own biases and preferences. My own are: > > 1) Be careful with the Ginkgo - use low dose Aspirin instead. But Gingko is a natuaral product and Aspirin is made of chemicals..? How can Aspirin be more "healthy"? > 2) Quick relief may be achievable by using mild amplification + earpiece > in [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > the > tinnitus can then be lost completely even after the device is taken off. What do you mean by "earpiece"? or "mild amplification"? Anders > > Everybody has their own biases and preferences. My own are: > > > > 1) Be careful with the Ginkgo - use low dose Aspirin instead. > > But Gingko is a natuaral product and Aspirin is made of chemicals..? How > can Aspirin be more "healthy"? There's lots experience been gained with Aspirin, gathered over a century of use by a very large number of people. Not a 'natural' product eh?..That means nothing. There are 'natural' plants and substances that can kill you. As for Ginkgo, it gave me nosebleeds; I could have ended up with bleeding inside the eye, who knows? > What do you mean by "earpiece"? or "mild amplification"? Sorry, should have been more specific, though this is discussed on the link I provided. I used a miniature audio amplifier bought from Maplin Electronics for about ?5 with earphones - it does basically the same thing as a hearing aid but is far cheaper. Steve O > There's lots experience been gained with Aspirin, gathered over a century > of [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > As for Ginkgo, it gave me nosebleeds; I could have ended up with bleeding > inside the eye, who knows? Yes, that?s right...but I do not take any other medications and I?m healthy all the way through ...so I guess I should at least try Gingko as no. 1..? > Sorry, should have been more specific, though this is discussed on the > link [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Steve O Thanks for the info. The sound of "Rain" or "boiling water" always helps me WHILE I listen to it, but when I turn it off the T is back again. Do you have any luck with sound therapy that actually "heals" also after the sound is turned off? I mean - maybe 2 or 3 hours of silence..? Thanks, Anders Hi again Anders, > Yes, that´s right...but I do not take any other medications and I´m healthy > all the way through > ...so I guess I should at least try Gingko as no. 1..? I too am healthy all the way through, and don't take any medications (except a tiny one-eighth of a tablet of aspirin a day). I believe (following the advice of someone on this group far better qualified than I - when I reported the nosebleeds) that Gingko could have harmed me. So much of the actual "effect" of every remedy regarding tinnitus seems to be determined by expectation (ie. placebo is strong) that anything that you believe in can be worth trying. The decision on what to do is yours. > The sound of "Rain" or "boiling water" always helps me WHILE I listen to > it, but when I turn it off the T is back again. > Do you have any luck with sound therapy that actually "heals" also after the > sound is turned off? > > I mean - maybe 2 or 3 hours of silence..? The straight answer is 'No'. What you seem to be decribing is simple 'masking'. However, the 'residual inhibition' effect varies with different people and some do reportedly obtain relief for long periods. The idea behind my experiments btw was to make the bursts of sound therapy so short they resembled quiet 'clicks', and this was almost as good as silence anyway. :-) Fortunately long periods of silence often are part of the natural variability of some people's tinnitus. And you already know, as someone who has 'habituated', the whole topic becomes less important with time. But if you've been becoming more preoccupied with it recently and it seems louder, I wonder if there are any other emotional factors at work. Steve O On 4/17/05 9:36 AM, in article 42629078$0$78286$157c6196@dreader1.cybercity.dk, "Anders C. Nielsen" <acn77@vip.cybercity.dk> wrote: > As for Ginkgo, it gave me nosebleeds; I could have ended up with bleeding >> inside the eye, who knows? When I see a patient with a nosebleed from Ginkgo, I am HAPPY. Thank heaven it was the nose and not the eye or brain. Now I can tell him to change meds and PREVENT the worst complication. Here is the Gingko problem A. all products vary as to blood thinning content. B. some are from the leaf, some from the root, etc. C. There is little or no standardization D. there is no way for you the consumer to know which products to avoid while taking Gingko. E worst case is when you don't tell your doctor you are taking this and he gives you a blood thinner. Intelligence and research has nothing to do with it. You can be a PhD, MD and still make mistakes and take a mix that can cause bleeding. Yes, some doctors are taking it. But I assure you that they are very carefull about what else they take. Of course, where I am coming from is that I see the nosebleeds and learn about the other bleedings. On 4/16/05 12:48 PM, in article 3cd8hfF6k9hq7U1@individual.net, "Skycloud" <me@privacy.com> wrote: >> Hello people, >> [quoted text clipped - 57 lines] > > Steve O The thing that definitely positively helps tinnitus is reducing anxiety reinforcement. Anxiety reinforcement: the more it itches, the more you scratch The more you scratch the more nervous you get The more nervous the more you scratch, and so on. This is the primary reason why T patients "suffer". Police and firemen get tinnitus. When they get it they ask "old Joe" and he laughts and assures them its part of being a policeman - everyone gets it, etc. So, they don't reinforce with anxiety and are "symptom free". Its certainly there but its like the tight bra or belt. How to reduce anxiety reinforcement? Whatever works - progressive relaxation, massage, breathing, etc etc . Mirror biofeedback works well for my patients. You can't have anxiety if your muscles are relaxed, so biofeedback works here. <snip> newsgroup for a while and I have a few questions : >>> Which "methods" SHOULD I try no matter what? I mean - which of these >> are [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >>> >>> 7) any other suggestions...? <snip> > The thing that definitely positively helps tinnitus is reducing anxiety > reinforcement. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > my patients. You can't have anxiety if your muscles are relaxed, so > biofeedback works here. Yes, mind over matter works both ways. Acceptance reduces anxiety too, and this facilitates habituation. My T, probably worse today than when it was driving me crazy, doesn't bother me in the least. > 3) I've experimented with white noise, and very short click-like rapid > bursts of this _at low level_ can be effective in 'discharging' the > tinnitus. See www.detinnitiser.com Did anyone try the CDs? Mauro >Hello people, > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >1) Less sugar, fat, alcohol etc. If you want to. Most of the time they make no difference whatever. But at least it doesn't cost anything. >2) More sleep at night Are you lacking sleep at the moment? Try it if you want to. Free. >3) Massage Definitely. It will ease any muscle tension. It will confirm whether you have tension or not. That is THE most important first step. Then you can take it from there. >4) Arcupuncture Many people find it useful. It acts as a relaxant. It does nothing for the tinnitus directly. >5) White Noise or other sound-treatments? Can be very helpful. You can make your own CDs. http://eebee.net/sound/sound.html >6) Ginkgo Bilboa Maybe worth trying. But as already mentioned it is an anti coagulant - so take care. >7) any other suggestions...? Read all the info at http://eebee.net/ >Thanks, >Anders Nielsen Elly's Tinnitus Resources http://eebee.net/ Many Thanks for all the advice and for the link! You say "no loud noises"...does that mean one cannot listen to music or go to concerts (wearing eardrops with -25 db) ? Anders >>Hello people, >> [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > Elly's Tinnitus Resources > http://eebee.net/ Try a tablet of organic gingko biloba with an empty stomach first thing in the morning. At the same time, lower your pillow and observe if it helps. > Hello people, > > I´m 28 years old and have had tinnitus for almost 14 years....half of my > life... > My "variation" is the "normal" high-pitched ringin´ which is always there - > more or less. > > I´ve learned to live with it, but the past weeks I think it´s been worse and > more "constant".....I just can´t take it.... > > I´ve never tried any treatment. > > I´ve been reading this newsgroup for a while and I have a few questions : > Which "methods" SHOULD I try no matter what? I mean - which of these are > the most common treatments? : [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > I know there´s no cure, but I would just like to know in which order I > should try all the above mentíoned "treatments"...which are the most > "famous" and useful? > > Thanks, > Anders Nielsen Try a tablet of organic gingko biloba with an empty stomach first thing in the morning. At the same time, lower your pillow and observe if it helps. The only things we know for sure about ginkgo is that it is ALL organic and sometimes causes internal bleeding. We don't know how to "lower our pillow" and even if we did, we don't know that the bedspread still tucks neatly underneath. > Try a tablet of organic gingko biloba with an empty stomach first thing > in the morning. At the same time, lower your pillow and observe if it [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > pillow" and even if we did, we don't know that the bedspread still tucks > neatly underneath. You tuck your bedspread underneath?? Susan > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Susan Yep. That's the way mom taught me. Fold it down, put the pillows in place, and then lift it over the pillows leaving an inch or so tucked in. I think this is when you are supposed to take the nosebleed stuff but I'm not sure. > Yep. That's the way mom taught me. Fold it down, put the pillows in place, > and then lift it over the pillows leaving an inch or so tucked in. I think > this is when you are supposed to take the nosebleed stuff but I'm not sure. That's how I was taught, too. But not how I do it now. Times change: shams, euro shams, you know, the works. ;-) Susan <8 pillows total when I make my bed> Susan <Susan@nothankyou.com> wrote in part: >Susan <8 pillows total when I make my bed> No wonder you have tinnitus. Not even extra ginkgo can make up for all that extra muscle tension near the ears.  SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG > Susan <Susan@nothankyou.com> wrote in part: > >>Susan <8 pillows total when I make my bed> > > No wonder you have tinnitus. Not even extra ginkgo can make up for > all that extra muscle tension near the ears. LOL... I don't *sleep* on them. I pile them on when I make the bed, then stack them on the floor while we sleep. Susan <forbidden to purchase any more pillows> I always wondered what people did with all those pillows one sees on beds. Too much work for me. I'll stick to 2. Elly's Tinnitus Resources http://eebee.net/ >x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Susan <forbidden to purchase any more pillows> > I always wondered what people did with all those pillows one sees on > beds. Too much work for me. I'll stick to 2. They're pretty, though, just think of them as decorating accessories. Plus, they make the bed a comfy place to sit up in and read, rest, talk on the phone, etc... They're not piled on top of one another, they stand up sideways. Susan ITS ORGANIC! HEMLOCK SNAKE VENOM Poison mushroom. EVERY ONE OF THE POISONS USED BY NERO AND OTHER'S FULL TIME POISONERS WERE ORGANIC. STICK TO ORGANIC. You want to use an artificial product that is calibrated, tested,supervised, licensed etc instead? Thiis is such a very silly argument, especially for a MD - or are you? As for Aspirin - I believe Hipocrates discovered it, and most folk who take it don't die! A recent German study (I think, or was it Welsh?) has proved that Aspirin reduces heart attacks, strokes, and cancer, and many other diseases, and where does it come from - willow bark!!!!! All of N. Americans are eating GM foods which have NEVER been tested on huiman beings at all. Good luck to you all. Ben > ITS ORGANIC! > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > STICK TO ORGANIC. You want to use an artificial product that is calibrated, > tested,supervised, licensed etc instead? "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: >All of N. >Americans are eating GM foods which have NEVER been tested on huiman beings >at all. Good luck to you all. Thanks for the concern. Actually, none of the vegetables, fruits, or grain you eat have ever been tested either. Every single one is unique with its own genetic modifications brought on by meiosis, natural radiation, replication errors, viruses, and who knows what else. Good luck to you, too. SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG > ITS ORGANIC! > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > STICK TO ORGANIC. You want to use an artificial product that is calibrated, > tested,supervised, licensed etc instead? At the risk of being kind of nitpicky, Murray, just because those are natural doesn't mean they're organic by commonly accepted definitions. They's have to be found where no pesticides, herbicides, chemical fertilizers, etc. had been used. We'd have to know what the snake had been dining on. :-) Susan On 4/18/05 2:39 PM, in article 3cinnjF6n7qm9U1@individual.net, "Susan" > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Susan At least at the time of Nero and Lucretia Borgia, all the poisons they used were genuinely pure organic and had no pesticides or chemicals. Must have been a comfort to the victims. > On 4/18/05 2:39 PM, in article 3cinnjF6n7qm9U1@individual.net, "Susan" > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > were genuinely pure organic and had no pesticides or chemicals. Must have > been a comfort to the victims. Yeah, those were the days! Healthier, uncontaminated poisons! Susan Wow!...I can only say that I got some answers to think about ;-) Thanks to everyone for their great input on all these difficult matters! I´ve read some very contradictive statements, but I guess it all depends on who you are... Thanks again, Anders > They's have to be found where no pesticides, herbicides, chemical > fertilizers, etc. had been used. We'd have to know what the snake had > been dining on. :-) Hence organic food is tested by NOT using forbidden untested chemicals on them . GM foods are not crossbred plant with plant, but gene of say, tomato, with a gene of a fish! We have been eating normal plants x plants since the year dot, but only recently GM stuff (well, in N America) and the population IS the test. So again, good luck! Ben >>They's have to be found where no pesticides, herbicides, chemical >>fertilizers, etc. had been used. We'd have to know what the snake had [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Ben So what? Susan > So what? > > Susan So - you are a guinea pig, and gut problems have increased 10-fold in the past 10 years. I wonder why? You don't care what you are eating - probably becuase you have NO idea what youa re eating! ben >>So what? >> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > ben I pay scrupulous attention to what I eat, grass fed beef, naturally raised poultry, etc... and organic produce, for health and philosophic reasons. You don't know jack about my habits, or Jim's. I don't support GM foods for agribusiness, but I don't see any certainty of the unfounded hazards you raise, either. Susan > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Susan Is it better to eat a plant that some pest has crapped on (organic), a plant embellished with a pesticide to kill that pest, or a plant genetically modified so the pest ignores it? Bill wrote, philosophically: > Is it better to eat a plant that some pest has crapped on (organic), a plant > embellished with a pesticide to kill that pest, or a plant genetically > modified so the pest ignores it? Speaking for myself, I'd rather wash off bugshit than choose the other two. Susan > Is it better to eat a plant that some pest has crapped on (organic), a plant > embellished with a pesticide to kill that pest, or a plant genetically > modified so the pest ignores it? Because we are so intent on NOT wanting any sh.t whatsoever, then as soon as something is eaten that is slightly "off" people fall ill quickly because they have built up no resistance to it. You are wrong to suggest that the pest ignores it - the weeds become more powerful, and pests become worse - then what do they do about that? Ben >> Is it better to eat a plant that some pest has crapped on (organic), a > plant [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Ben Several food crops have been genetically modified to be resistant to pests. When I write "pests" I include microscopic organisms. Regardless, I draw no conclusion as to which of the three is best for mankind. I share your concern that living in a sterile environment prevents developing immunities. > I pay scrupulous attention to what I eat, grass fed beef, naturally > raised poultry, etc... and organic produce, for health and philosophic > reasons. You don't know jack about my habits, or Jim's. ALL Americans eat GM, they just don't know it because it isn't a requirement to put it on labels, in fact Gerry's ice cream was BANNED from calling it organic! All chickens are pumped with anti-biotics, and beef with growth hormones, unless you can truly trust your organic supplier? Even then the animals eat GM food. > I don't support GM foods for agribusiness, but I don't see any certainty > of the unfounded hazards you raise, either. Hah! They aren't unfounded because no-one has EVER tested them on human beings. Every time someone on here suggests a "cure" for tinnitus, which is not "medically double blind tested" is laughed at, yet you eat trash! Ben <who doesn't want to know "jack" about anyone's habits, thank you!> "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: >> I pay scrupulous attention to what I eat, grass fed beef, naturally >> raised poultry, etc... and organic produce, for health and philosophic [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > >Ben <who doesn't want to know "jack" about anyone's habits, thank you!> Have some more organic fish 'n' chips and mushy peas. SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: >ALL Americans eat GM, they just don't know it because it isn't a requirement >to put it on labels I'm an American. I know I eat "GM." And I don't care. Many products I buy are marked "non-GM," however. But I grow some of my own food and buy from local organic farmers. The bit of beef I eat is raised on grass. The chickens eat whatever is on the ground. Maybe they get an occasional GM worm or bug, I don't know. Genes have been deliberately changed for millenia now, for better or worse. Some of the heirloom varieties are definitely better tasting. I care more about reducing pesticides, contaminants, and processing. I don't deliberately seek out gm or hybridized products, but I don't avoid them, either. SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG > "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > processing. I don't deliberately seek out gm or hybridized > products, but I don't avoid them, either. As a kid, I spent many days combining wheat and barley. Looking into a combine's hopper one finds all manner of pests, many of which have been chopped-up by the combine's cylinder. When we stored the harvested grain on the farm, we shoveled large amounts of powdered Malathion into it to finish off the pests that had survived. Both of these aspects of harvesting grain are common to GM grains and hybrids. With "organic" grain, the Malathion wouldn't be used but the critter issue remains. Malathion has a relatively short toxic half-life. By the time you eat the bread or pasta made from the grain and critter limbs, it should no longer be toxic. We hope. I just finished the maple syrup harvest. The sap was reduced in an open boiler, as were the carcasses of a narrow spectrum of the insect world and small bits of bark that finds it's way into the boiler. The finished product, thus contaminated, is called "pure maple syrup" and is "organic" in every sense of the word. :-) "Bill" <Bill@myplace.now> wrote in part: >> "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: >> [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] >product, thus contaminated, is called "pure maple syrup" and is "organic" in >every sense of the word. :-) So...your organic bread, pasta, and maple syrup probably contained beetle, black fly, and maybe mouse genes. But at least it wasn't genetically modified! :-) (Gosh...no human hair, I hope!) SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG > So...your organic bread, pasta, and maple syrup probably contained > beetle, black fly, and maybe mouse genes. But at least it wasn't > genetically modified! :-) > > (Gosh...no human hair, I hope!) Certainly every bit as nutritious as the city water in, say, Grand Forks ND. There they drink the sewage from Fargo, Moorhead and Hillsboro, not to mention what the fish themselves excrete and the rotting carcasses from drug deals gone bad. The water is ok, so they say, but the mercury levels in the fish are such that annual consumption is limited. We are what we eat. >> Certainly every bit as nutritious as the city water in, say, Grand Forks ND. > There they drink the sewage from Fargo, Moorhead and Hillsboro, not to > mention what the fish themselves excrete and the rotting carcasses from > drug deals gone bad. The water is ok, so they say, but the mercury levels > in the fish are such that annual consumption is limited. We are what we > eat. Yeah - a load of shite! Though according to Jim I am "fish & chips" :) Was that a racist remark, I ask myself? To assume all Brits eat fish & chips is rather stereo-typing us? I thought capitalism was supposed to be about CHOICE? N. Americans are not given the choice if they don't know what it is in their foods, and Bush is trying his damnedest to blackmail Europe into swallowing his GM crap - that is NOT choice! Not as he counted blocking steel imports to the USA as "wrong" - as long as it suits big business, which now runs America, then no-one in government genuinely cares about choice, or what its citizens are eating either. Ben >>> Certainly every bit as nutritious as the city water in, say, Grand Forks > ND. [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Ben We North Americans are woefully deficient when it comes to analyzing the DNA strands in our food. Our homes our loaded with the latest gadgets (manufactured in China) but one is hard pressed to find an electron microscope at the dinner table. With "no child left behind" and just a few generations this will change, hopefully before we abstain ourselves into oblivion. "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: >>> Certainly every bit as nutritious as the city water in, say, Grand Forks >ND. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >that a racist remark, I ask myself? To assume all Brits eat fish & chips is >rather stereo-typing us? Well, sure. It was in response to your stereotyping Americans. Though i have read a serious paper that indicated that the diet of some segments of the British population was predominantly fish and chips with mushy peas. The report was in connection with an observation that many entering school children do not know how to use silverware, having had nearly all their meals wrapped in newsprint and often eaten while walking. Getting back to the (still off-topic) issue of GM foods not being labeled as such in the US: > I thought capitalism was supposed to be about >CHOICE? N. Americans are not given the choice if they don't know what it [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >which now runs America, then no-one in government genuinely cares about >choice, or what its citizens are eating either. Nothing is as black-and-white as you describe it. Further, I find that I could avoid most GM food if i cared to do so. While products that contain GM item are not marked as such, products that *don't* contain GM items are prominently labeled. For instance, I know that soybeans have been subjected to GM. If my soy milk or tofu or soy nuts isn't labeled as to GM, I assume it may contain GM soybeans. But each of those products is also available in "Non-GM" forms as well. Capitalism at work, I guess. (It's a lot easier to get a bag of non-GM wasabi-spiced, organic, unsalted soy nuts in the US than it is to get an MRI in the UK.) Of course, I buy the GM versions, because I'm not afraid of them. I do think that GM plants and animals need to be managed with care (though they of course won't be), simply because they can crowd out wild species, or interbreed with them. But that's already happened with hybridized and selectively-bred varieties. There's nothing unique about GM varieties. In any case, the Bush-Enron-Halliburton team is hard at work on all our problems, so there is nothing to worry about anyway. :-) SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: >GM foods are not crossbred plant with plant, but gene of say, >tomato, with a gene of a fish! I like both tomatoes and fish. They actually have many, many genes in common anyway. And each individual fish or tomato has some in common that others don't whether they resulted from natural variation, selective breeding, hybridization, or genetic engineering. All foods anyone eats have been genetically modified both by "natural" processes and by man for thousands of years and more. SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG > I like both tomatoes and fish. I wonder how many vegetarians do? Ben "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: >> I like both tomatoes and fish. > >I wonder how many vegetarians do? I dunno. I guess a lot of vegetarians have no idea how delicious a juicy piece of broiled wild salmon can be. But genes just make proteins. Different species need different proteins and have somewhat different combinations of genes. But all indivividuals within a species also have different combination of genes. You may have more tomato genes than I do. SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG > Hello people, > [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > Thanks, > Anders Nielsen Try two drugs alone or in combination to reduce but not eliminate sound: (i) neurontin; and (ii) klonopin Good luck > Hello people, > [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > Thanks, > Anders Nielsen This is my first time replying to this group, although I have been following it for a long time. I've had tinnitus for over 10 years, along with moderate hearing loss. I have found that getting a good night sleep, doing anything you can to reduce the stress in your daily life, reducing sugar in your diet, exersise, avoiding loud noises when you can and using ear-plugs when you can't. Also it would help if you keep a radio or TV turned down low to help distract you from the noise in your ears. Most important is to accept the fact, that at this time there is no cure and make the best of it, and enjoy life the best you can Al >> Hello people, >> [quoted text clipped - 51 lines] > > Al Perfect! > > Most important is to accept the fact, that at this time there is no cure > > and [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > > Perfect! How can *anyone* enjoy life with a loud ringing in one's head, may I ask? It ruins every day. Ben > How can *anyone* enjoy life with a loud ringing in one's head, may I ask? > It ruins every day. Eventually, either by treatment, gradual habituation or both, folks don't notice it unless they try to. I've met folks with unremitting T that sounds like a train whistle or airplane engine who love their lives again, though T just about did them in at first. Susan > Eventually, either by treatment, WHAT treatment??????????????????????????????? > gradual habituation or both, How can one possibly "habituate" to a varying sound? >folks > don't notice it unless they try to. This comment has realy made my day! It is ALL my own fault for listening to it, even though I have felt really depressed and suicidal today - just what I needed to hear, thanks! :( > I've met folks with unremitting T that sounds like a train whistle or > airplane engine who love their lives again, though T just about did them > in at first. I am in my 15th year of it, and have had enough, more than enough, just since Xmas. Ben >>Eventually, either by treatment, > > WHAT treatment??????????????????????????????? It varies. Some folks respond to hypnosis, some to benzodiazapenes, some to TRT, masking with white noise, or antidepressants. In my case, T was caused by an infectious disease, and resolved mostly with antibiotics. >>gradual habituation or both, > > How can one possibly "habituate" to a varying sound? One can recognize that the sound is there, that it's very unwelcome, and that it's not going to kill you. Once you know it won't kill you, you can try to relax via whatever method works for you and focus on other things. >>folks >>don't notice it unless they try to. > > This comment has realy made my day! It is ALL my own fault for listening to > it, even though I have felt really depressed and suicidal today - just what > I needed to hear, thanks! :( No one is blaming you. The reality is that once folks habituate T, they don't notice it unless they try to. Even folks with awful, intrusive, loud and variable T. >>I've met folks with unremitting T that sounds like a train whistle or >>airplane engine who love their lives again, though T just about did them [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Ben Has your T gotten louder in recent months, or have other things changed in your life or your environment that make it more intrusive? What have you tried, in terms of habituation? I can't speak for anyone else, but if I had T that still ruined my life after 15 years, I'd consider Xanax or TRT or both. Susan Think of this analogy. How can you go into a crowded room where everybody is talking and buzzing and making a roar of voices and yet you carry on a conversation with the person beside you like nobody else was there? It can be done and many have learned how to do it and don't even realize they are doing sometimes. I don't fall down when I chew gum. Your brain can multitask. > > Eventually, either by treatment, > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Ben >> > Most important is to accept the fact, that at this time there is no >> > cure [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Ben I have a loud ringing in my head every day, Ben. It is particularly loud at this moment but I hadn't even noticed it until I read your post and started paying attention to it. Before that I'd been watching a 20-20 show on TV, completely oblivious to the noise. You see, I've habituated my tinnitus and it is no longer an issue in my life. For some, habituation comes easily, for others it takes some work. Most can do this on their own, some use Tinnitus Retraining Therapy. The key to habituation, in my opinion, is acceptance. "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: >How can *anyone* enjoy life with a loud ringing in one's head, may I ask? Just fine, in my case. >It ruins every day. Not for me. SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG Jim, That your life is 'just fine' would have meant to me that *your* ringing is NOT loud by *your* standard but it does not mean loud ringing in general is not intrusive to many t patients. Thus your recipee of habituation is applicable, by this logic, to only those who don't perceive loud ringing(loud to them). People with loud ringing should get medical treatment in order to check out where it goes wrong in their bodies, and as such should get it fixed. Habituation is No fixing of the problem, as habituation is for those to whom t is not a problem, as in *your* case. FP Habituation is only an adjustment in your attitude. If your tinnitus doesn't bother you what do you need a cure for? The trouble with medical treatment is there is no medical treatment most of the time. Tinnitus is just like the annoying scrape on your arm. One day you forget about it and when you remember again it is gone. Oh there is still a scar where it once was but it just doesn't matter anymore. When you stop dwelling on your tinnitus it won't be a problem. I used to try to listen to mine and see how bad I could make it. The next thing I knew I was daydreaming about something else. Fifteen minutes earlier I thought I would go insane. Make a game out of it. Listen to it. Enjoy it! Laugh at it. So what? A noise in your head. Think "big deal". Don't let it beat you like a troll responding to everytime he/she pushes your buttons. What if a tree fell in the forest and you were not there to hear it? > Jim, > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > FP > Habituation is only an adjustment in your attitude. If your tinnitus > doesn't [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > in your head. Think "big deal". Don't let it beat you like a troll > responding to everytime he/she pushes your buttons. Perfect, Larry. Nice post! "fyfpoon@hotmail.com" <fyfpoon@hotmail.com> wrote in part: >Jim, > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >FP My ringing was and is very loud. It is also virtually unmaskable. I can hear it while operating a diesel tractor. But I seldom hear it any longer. I think that my habituation proceeded to the point that the tinnitus disappears from my consciousness most of the time. It's not a cure. But it's worth a great deal. SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG Jim, I think you owe it to yourself to have your t 'fixed', if not in the US, somewhere else. I have tuned down mine from a maddening ill to a veeeeeeerrrrrrrrry quiet t that comes from time to time only. Go for an acupuncture treatment. Try another one if one acu specialist does not help. Go to China, and leave alone all that 'controlled' experiments for the time being. Try something! Jim, I think you owe it to yourself to have your t 'fixed', if not in the US, somewhere else. I have tuned down mine from a maddening ill to a veeeeeeerrrrrrrrry quiet t that comes from time to time only. Go for an acupuncture treatment. Try another one if one acu specialist does not help. Go to China, and leave alone all that 'controlled' experiments for the time being. Try something! So Francis, it seems to me that you have nice habituated your tinnitus. It's good to hear that it no longer is an issue for you even though you probably can hear it if you think about it. HNG Bully for you Jim and bugger everyone else? > "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Not for me. "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: >Bully for you Jim and bugger everyone else? >> "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >> >> Not for me. No. Just that it is sometimes possible to habituate. Even after many years. I don't mean to say that everyone will or to minimize your difficulties. SignatureJim Chinnis / Warrenton, Virginia, USA Want to discuss Meniere's? See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MenieresDG There are ways to not hear your tinnitus no matter how bad you have it. Do you hear your tinnitus while having good sex or an orgasm? Does it bother you>? I doubt it. See you can do it and probably already have. Get a distraction and stop focusing on it. Some say "Get a life" - not meant in a nasty way but in a constructive way. > "Ben" <hand.knitter@ntlworld.com> wrote in part: > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > I don't mean to say that everyone will or to minimize your > difficulties. |
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