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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Tinnitus / January 2005Is my hearing really perfect, as told by my audiologist?
Hi, I just had my first professional hearing test few days ago. I have a slight T in my right ear, and I have been very careful with my hearing since a long time ago. The results showed that both of my ears have 10-15 dB deviation from the 'ideal threshold' of hearing. But my audiologist informed me that "Almost all people at my age"(21 yr old) naturally have this hearing and told me that my ears are 100% perfect. But I am suspecting if the audiologist is being possibly casually ignorant, considering that my hearing is not anything terribly subject to much concern like most of her patients. Since long I thought that any deviation from the ideal threshold of hearing(0 dB) is considered a hearing loss, except on extremly low frequency and high frequency. Am I correct in this? Surprisingly, the 10-15 dB deviation in my hearing occured at mid frequency (500 - 2500 Hz) which is supposed to be the most sensitive range. Is my audiologist correct when she says that 0 dB deviation on this range is impossible for people at my age? She said something like "It might be possible for some crazy 14 year old, maybe." Do almost entire population at my age have around 10-15dB deviation from the ideal threshold of hearing, at least at the mid frequency(500-2500 Hz)? Any input is greatly appreciated. At age 21, it would be expected that your scores would hover just near the zero dB mark across the board, give or take a five or ten dB difference. A mid fq bite is often associated with head injury. Like car accidents. Unusual. Often see a dip round four thousand to six thousand, from noise exposure. However, it is impossible to tell if your deviation has been there for your entire lifetime. You would have passed all screening tests as a kid. Hope this helps. Have it checked in 1 year. Marsha Johnson, M.S., CCC-A, FAAA Thanks Marsha for your help. I find my case to be somewhat confusing. Deviations in the frequency range(4,000 - 6,000 Hz) which you described as associated with noise exposure, didn't occur in my hearing. The test indicated 0 db deviation in the high range. Maybe playing a french horn for 7 years could possibly attribute to this dip in the mid range? It has some sound pressure notably in the mid and lower frequencies, not much high. Not only the midrange, but my low frequency range also have, or take that as all frequencies below 6,000 Hz have 10-15 dB deviation. Graphically it looked somewhat liked this, my hearing was shown as being gradually worse as you start to go below the 6,000 Hz. 0+ 0+ 0+ 0+ 0+ 3+ 5+ 7+ 9+ +10+10+15+10 Never had any car accidents the whole life, but I do remember one incident during a intense karate training when I was in second grade. I smashed the top part of my head into the concrete wall very hard, I couldn't wake up for 30 minutes. It was too long ago to remember whether it affected my hearing. Maybe that could be a reason for this dip in the mid,low range? Now I realize when I hear music or people's voice, things do sound somewhat as if treble boosted. Many persons vary in the 8,000 tone. Someone with good hearing up to 6,000 and then a severe drop at 8,000 is still considered normal hearing. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com Thanks Marsha for your help. I find my case to be somewhat confusing. Deviations in the frequency range(4,000 - 6,000 Hz) which you described as associated with noise exposure, didn't occur in my hearing. The test indicated 0 db deviation in the high range. Maybe playing a french horn for 7 years could possibly attribute to this dip in the mid range? It has some sound pressure notably in the mid and lower frequencies, not much high. Not only the midrange, but my low frequency range also have, or take that as all frequencies below 6,000 Hz have 10-15 dB deviation. Graphically it looked somewhat liked this, my hearing was shown as being gradually worse as you start to go below the 6,000 Hz. 0+ 0+ 0+ 0+ 0+ 3+ 5+ 7+ 9+ +10+10+15+10 Never had any car accidents the whole life, but I do remember one incident during a intense karate training when I was in second grade. I smashed the top part of my head into the concrete wall very hard, I couldn't wake up for 30 minutes. It was too long ago to remember whether it affected my hearing. Maybe that could be a reason for this dip in the mid,low range? Now I realize when I hear music or people's voice, things do sound somewhat as if treble boosted. Thanks Marsha for your help. I find my case to be somewhat confusing. Deviations in the frequency range(4,000 - 6,000 Hz) which you described as associated with noise exposure, didn't occur in my hearing. The test indicated 0 db deviation in the high range. Maybe playing a french horn for 7 years could possibly attribute to this dip in the mid range? It has some sound pressure notably in the mid and lower frequencies, not much high. Not only the midrange, but my low frequency range also have, or take that as all frequencies below 6,000 Hz have 10-15 dB deviation. Graphically it looked somewhat liked this, my hearing was shown as being gradually worse as you start to go below the 6,000 Hz. 0+ 0+ 0+ 0+ 0+ 3+ 5+ 7+ 9+ +10+10+15+10 Never had any car accidents the whole life, but I do remember one incident during a intense karate training when I was in second grade. I smashed the top part of my head into the concrete wall very hard, I couldn't wake up for 30 minutes. It was too long ago to remember whether it affected my hearing. Maybe that could be a reason for this dip in the mid,low range? Now I realize when I hear music or people's voice, things do sound somewhat as if treble boosted. That is an odd configuration but not unheard of..........seems like your ears are strong in areas that should be open to noise damage.......an MRI might show some odd malformation of the cochlea if you care to pursue it although it is expensive and noisy. However, other than that, any other strange results? MJ No other strange results. Only spouting thoughts and assumptions concerning the possible origin of the dip in the low and mid range that I have. I did play mellowphone, frenchhorn loud for a long period of time. and also saxophone in a big band in front of 5 trombones for over 7 years. But my high frequencies are perfect... I did had an accident where my head banged against a concrete wall. As a memorabilia I have humungous sized pump on the spot on my head, big enough to work an entertainment. Another thing that springs to my mind is the possibility of my eardrum flexibility. How would differently would the amount of signaling of high/mid/low frequencies be different on the flexible eardrum and inflexible eardrum? Do you think my assumption that too flexible eardrum would vibrate and signals more high frequency sound and less mid/low frequencies sound, like a rattling empty go-cart? I am tired of the everything sounding bright. When I listen to music, they sound unbalanced and I get real picky, while others don't seem to complain as much. I am afraid when I turn fifties or sixties, my mid range is so bad that I would have trouble communicating, because mid range is where most of the interpreting 'information' resides at. wow, sorry for so many spelling and grammar errors. This might be explained the semi-head injury incident. And another thing to add. When I listen to my headphones or in-ear-canal phones, and after a short while when I take them out, my ears get this stuffed, full feeling just like when you are on a descending airplane. This occurs even at a low volume listening, which I find to be kind of uncommon. I think this explains the possible unusual flexibility of my eardrum. I would like to hear your opinions on this. >I did had an accident where my head banged against a concrete wall. As >a memorabilia I have humungous sized pump on the spot on my head, big >enough to work an entertainment. That sounds ominous. Have a look at http://eebee.net/TinnitusIsaPainintheNeck.shtml There is a very good likelyhood that there has been damage of some kind to your neck muscles as well. Tinnitus is a pain in the neck Elly's Tinnitus Resources http://eebee.net/ a spelling error I made there. pump -> bump I may have had exagerrated a little on that, but nevertheless the bump is larger than an average bump some people normally have. I did play mellowphone, frenchhorn loud for a long period of time. and also saxophone in a big band in front of 5 trombones for over 7 years. But my high frequencies are perfect... Please don't begrudge yourself that YOU caused your tinntus. We see just as many accountants who never shot a gun or went to a rock concert, yet have hearing loss and tinnitus, so it is pontless to try to place blame on yourself and some past "indiscretion". the best course is to get examined and find out what treatment is available. I once had a woman literally dragged into my office by her daughter for hearing loss. She kept objecting to the exam, saying that her hearing loss was God's Will. After I removed the wax she could hear again. So before placing blame, esp on yourself, find out the treatment. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com >We see just as many accountants who never shot a gun or went to a rock concert, >yet have hearing loss and tinnitus, Murray, this is so good. Elly's Tinnitus Resources http://eebee.net/ She kept objecting to the exam, saying that her hearing loss was God's > Will. After I removed the wax she could hear again. I'm sure you remember that old story about a guy who is in a house on the shore of a river, and the river is rising. A car comes by and the driver offers him a ride. But he says no, God will see to his needs. The river rises more and a boat comes by offering him safety. Again no, God will see to his needs. Finally he's on his roof because of the height of the water and a helicopter comes by. And again he responds no. After he drowns and goes to heaven, he asks why God didn't see to his needs. And God responds, I sent a car, a boat, and a helicopter. What more did you want? HNG > She kept objecting to the exam, saying that her hearing loss was God's > > Will. After I removed the wax she could hear again. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > HNG First, don't worry about your audiogram! A 10-15 dB hearing loss is not that much, for several reasons. The 0 dB line is an average that was taken to represent the hearing threshold for 'normal' young people. There are deviations! If you have a higher threshold maybe you always were a bit higher. Also, anything below 20 dB is not considered hearing loss. It is possible that playing an instrument has damaged your hearing *a little*, especially if you play in an orchestra (e.g., in front of the trumpets). The remark above about an MRI scan of the cochlea, that's useless. First, even high-power research MRI scanners cannot get high enough resolution to show anything interesting about the cochlea (which is the size of a pepper corn, roughly), unless it is totally malformed, in which case you'd have much bigger problems. Second, even if the resolution was high enough, what would you look for? We don't know enough yet to know what kind of structural 'abnormality' would lead to what kind of hearing deficit. But to come around to your original question "is my hearing really perfect, as told by my audiologist?" The answer is obviously "no", as you do have a hearing loss, even if it is small and something you wouldn't worry about. What he meant was that its not abnormal for a guy your age to have 10-15 dB loss, and that, I would say, is true. Also, an audiogram doesn't tell you everything about your hearing, tell that to your audiologist :) Erik Exactly. Hearing loss and Tinnitus share a long distance relationship at best........you can live a solitary quiet life and still develop tinnitus...... MJ
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