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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Sinusitis / November 2004I Got An Electric Shock From My HydroPulse
After many months of saline solution dripping onto my Grossan Hydropulse, it finally shorted out. First it started tripping the Ground Fault Interrupter in my bathroom. Then, I got a nice electric shock from touching the power button. The moisture from the saline solution makes a great electrical conductor. Needless to say, I tossed my Hydropulse and bought a new one.  SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. > After many months of saline solution dripping onto my Grossan > Hydropulse, it finally shorted out. First it started tripping the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Needless to say, I tossed my Hydropulse and bought a new one. Wasn't it covered under warranty? Besides that, you might have cause for a lawsuit. A product should not give you an electric shock from touching the power button. A lawsuit would not be only to get money for yourself and the lawyer, but would get the manufacturer to improve the product. Also--surprised that you bought the same product, after the trouble you had with it. Why not a Waterpik or the Conair irrigator this time, both much less expensive, and with two year warranties? (The Conair would probably have more similarity to the Hydropulse, in that it has a 500 ml tank, contrasting with the 1000 ml tank on the WP, and it has a rotary pressure control on the body of the unit, rather than the button pressure control lever on the handle of the WP.) >>After many months of saline solution dripping onto my Grossan >>Hydropulse, it finally shorted out. First it started tripping the [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Wasn't it covered under warranty? Only for one year. I owned it for about 15 months before I got the shock. > Besides that, you might have cause for a lawsuit. A product should not give > you an electric shock from touching the power button. A lawsuit would not be > only to get money for yourself and the lawyer, but would get the > manufacturer to improve the product. Proving that I wasn't at fault would be difficult. I have done a bit of traveling and have brought my Hydropulse with me. Who knows if it got damaged or banged up in handling my luggage or something. > Also--surprised that you bought the same product, after the trouble you had > with it. Why not a Waterpik or the Conair irrigator this time, both much > less expensive, and with two year warranties? I cannot use the Waterpik because it's too noisy, causing my next-door neighbors in my apartment building to complain. And it gets even noisier as it ages. That was the reason I switched to Hydropulse in the first place. I don't know how noisy the Conair is. SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. >>> After many months of saline solution dripping onto my Grossan >>> Hydropulse, it finally shorted out. First it started tripping the [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > traveling and have brought my Hydropulse with me. Who knows if it got > damaged or banged up in handling my luggage or something. There is one improvement Dr. Grossan should make: Any electrical appliance used in a bathroom should have one of those "Test-Reset" sockets. My Conair hair dryer does. My Hydropulse doesn't. SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. > >>> After many months of saline solution dripping onto my Grossan > >>> Hydropulse, it finally shorted out. First it started tripping the [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > traveling and have brought my Hydropulse with me. Who knows if it got > > damaged or banged up in handling my luggage or something. It shouldn't matter; any product that is intended for use with water should be "intrinsically safe", or have externally-accessable features that are electrically isolated from line voltages. > Proving that I wasn't at fault would be difficult. I have done a bit of > traveling and have brought my Hydropulse with me. Who knows if it got > damaged or banged up in handling my luggage or something. I don't think that normally carrying a product in your luggage could be interpreted that it's your fault if that product electrocutes you. Of course, I'm no lawyer. > I cannot use the Waterpik because it's too noisy, causing my next-door > neighbors in my apartment building to complain. And it gets even > noisier as it ages. That was the reason I switched to Hydropulse in the > first place. > > I don't know how noisy the Conair is. The Conair unit is much quieter than the Waterpik, not comparable in amount of noise. I haven't tried the Hydropulse, so I cannot compare Conair and HP. I don't know if these companies provide decibel specifications. I like the Conair better than the Waterpik, except for the size of the tank. The Conair (I forget the whole name right now, the dental product company owned by Conair) has a 500 ml tank like the HP, while the WP has a 1000 ml tank. I need a lot of liquid to wash out my nose and sinuses. At least one 1000 ml tank, often 2 tankfuls. Using a 500 ml tank means more refills. So I use the WP. But the Conair is quieter, has the rotary pressure dial on the tank, rather than that inconvenient slider on the handle, and doesn't seem to go bad so often as the WP. (The WP company, however, is very good about replacing the unit, or the handle, however, when they go bad.) If 500 ml would suffice for me, I would definitely go with the Conair, which costs less than $30 at your local drugstore. >> Proving that I wasn't at fault would be difficult. I have done a bit of >> traveling and have brought my Hydropulse with me. Who knows if it got [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] >would suffice for me, I would definitely go with the Conair, which costs >less than $30 at your local drugstore. Hello, Have any of you considered alternating (on holidays and special days) with Robitussin (green label). It thins out the mucous. It has one ingredient in it: Guaifenesin Syrup which thins out mucous. My family Doc gave it to me for my sinuses on one occasion. Those irrigation contraptions cannot be sterilized, and scare me - why do you use something so dangerous? I bet i know why, you are smokers - right? You can go to the drug store and get a neat thing for irrigating that you can throw away after a while or boil it. It is called "OCEAN", and already starts you off with salt solution for spraying your nose; then when itis empty you can refill it. Now they are making a larger container along with the smaller one. These are small enough to boil for sterilizing. If you keep using the same thing over and over for months and months it becomes contaminated. What color is everyone's mucous. You can pretty much tell by that what is going on in your sinuses, and if you all have infections, you are playing games with it, of course if mucous is just from smoking, go ahead take a chance, because you are already doomed, and i guess you know it, so think Vit.C + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/benjamin.htm MustRead! http://WWW.PAMINIFARM.COM "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" Hosea 4:6 Why did you put this post in this thread? What does it have to do with an electric shock Steven got from his hydropulse? Nothing, from what I can see. I'll reply to a couple of your statements in any case. Guaifenesin--you can get a prescription tablet with a much higher dosage of it than in Robitussin. I have taken it, and haven't seen any benefit from it. I haven't seen many reports of people for whom guaifenesin works, but perhaps it helps some. No, I am not a smoker, and I doubt that many of the people who write here are smokers. So you lost your "bet". "Ocean" spray is not for irrigating, it is for moistening the nasal passages. A good thing to do, but the liquid does not come out at enough strength for irrigation. "Ocean" (or its generic equivalents) is the spray of that type I would least likely use. I find it much more irritating than the others. Some say that it is because of the preservative benzalkonium chloride. That might have something to do with it, but there are other sprays with that preservative ("Ayr", for instance), that I find much less irritating. "Ocean" also has some other kind of preservative (I think some kind of alcohol) that I find extremely irritating to the nose. No, the color of the mucous does not tell you "everything" that is going on in your sinuses. It can sometimes indicate something, it does not indicate everything. You seem to have a simple answer for everything. Sorry, but life is not so simple. And sorry, but "must read" or not, I have absolutely no interest in reading your web site. > Hello, > Have any of you considered alternating (on holidays and special days) with [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > MustRead! http://WWW.PAMINIFARM.COM > "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" Hosea 4:6 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ > Posted Via Uncensored-News.Com - Accounts Starting At $6.95 - http://www.uncensored-news.com > <><><><><><><> The Worlds Uncensored News Source <><><><><><><><> > Guaifenesin--you can get a prescription tablet with a much higher dosage of > it than in Robitussin. If you're referring to Humibid LA, not any more. It's now available OTC as a product called Mucinex. Each Mucinex tablet is 600 mg of guaifenisin, and the usual dose is two such tablets, twice a day. The same as the prescription Humibid LA used to be. Mucinex helps me a lot. The few times I've forgotten to take it, I notice the difference that very day. SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. > > Guaifenesin--you can get a prescription tablet with a much higher dosage of > > it than in Robitussin. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Mucinex helps me a lot. The few times I've forgotten to take it, I > notice the difference that very day. It's been years since I tried it, since before I had surgery. From your description, I might try it again. Any other readers found guaifenesin to help? I saw the mucinex in the drug store. Rather expensive. I think the generic version of Humibid (I recall different names, I think one was guaifenex) was a lot cheaper. (Certainly for me, with my prescription plan! But I think even the full price was pretty cheap, at least for the generic version. Are you sure it's not available as a prescription any more? Just looked at: www.rxlist.com It looks like the prescription 1200 mg tablets are still available: www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic3/guaifenesin.htm Of course, it's easier to buy OTC, just buy at the store without having to get a doctor prescription, etc. But for long term usage, the prescription version (the generic one at least) would probably be cheaper. (For sure if one has prescription insurance.) What have other's experiences been with guaifenesin? In Europe apparently they used a substance called NAC for years, supposed to thin mucus. Studies have been quite inconclusive though,as has guaifenesin. It's only available in the US as a "supplement". I bought some of the supplement and tried it, didn't notice any "mucus thinning". Anyone else tried that? > I saw the mucinex in the drug store. Rather expensive. I think the generic > version of Humibid (I recall different names, I think one was guaifenex) was [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > version (the generic one at least) would probably be cheaper. (For sure if > one has prescription insurance.) The last time I checked, Mucinex was the only high-dose guaifenisin that had gotten FDA approval since the FDA crackdown in 2002. http://www.pharmacist.com/articles/h_ts_0396.cfm I'll bet the one you cited above, Guaifenex Gy, is no longer sold in the U.S., just like Humibid LA is no longer sold in the U.S. I'm sure they're available in other countries. > In Europe apparently they used a substance called NAC for years, supposed to > thin mucus. Studies have been quite inconclusive though,as has guaifenesin. > It's only available in the US as a "supplement". I bought some of the > supplement and tried it, didn't notice any "mucus thinning". Anyone else > tried that? N-acetyl-cysteine (NAC) has effective mucolytic action in the lower respiratory tract--but only when inhaled as an aerosolized mist (the prescription drug Mucomyst). As an inhaled mist, it gets applied directly to the mucus secretions. As you say, there is no hard evidence that it works when taken orally. I'm not surprised, given its very short half-life, and how much you would have to take orally in order for a decent dose of it to reach the lungs where the mucus is before it's metabolized. I tried oral NAC once out of sheer desperation. It did nothing. SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. > The last time I checked, Mucinex was the only high-dose guaifenisin that > had gotten FDA approval since the FDA crackdown in 2002. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > U.S., just like Humibid LA is no longer sold in the U.S. I'm sure > they're available in other countries. Here is a quote from the article you cited: > To date, no other single-ingredient, extended-release guaifenesin product, other than Mucinex, has been approved by the FDA. That actually doesn't make sense. Apparently the "crackdown" was on OTC products put to market without FDA approval. But medications like Humibid and generic equivalents like Guaifenex were prescription medications. All prescription medications are approved by the FDA. So I'm sure those single ingredient prescription guaifenesin meds had been approved by the FDA. So the quote above couldn't be accurate. If they added the word OTC to it, it may be true. I'm think the Rxlist I quoted shows only prescription meds available in the USA. I've never heard of any negative effects of guaifenesin, although there are a lot of questions about whether it actually works. Did you ask your doctor about whether he could prescribe Humibid-LA or a generic equivalent to you? > > In Europe apparently they used a substance called NAC for years, supposed to > > thin mucus. Studies have been quite inconclusive though,as has guaifenesin. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > I tried oral NAC once out of sheer desperation. It did nothing. > Did you ask your doctor about whether he could prescribe Humibid-LA or a > generic equivalent to you? Yes, and he said it was no longer available. That is what my pharmacist said too. The FDA really intended that Mucinex be the only extended-strength guaifenisin available in the U.S. No exceptions. http://www.fda.gov/foi/warning_letters/g4569d.htm SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. > The FDA really intended that Mucinex be the only extended-strength > guaifenisin available in the U.S. No exceptions. > > http://www.fda.gov/foi/warning_letters/g4569d.htm Just read it. Surprising. It said the makers of Humibid must submit an application for it to be approved as a "new drug", although it has been on the market for many years. (I recall taking it well over 10 years ago.) It must have been approved before, or would not have been a prescription medicine for many years. The following statement is strange: "On July 12, 2002, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approved an application for a single-ingredient guaifenesin 600-mg extended-release drug product. Following this approval, FDA reviewed the marketing status of all strengths of single-ingredient guaifenesin extended-release drug products and determined that those products should no longer be marketed in light of the existence of an approved product." That would be like saying "since one company has been approved to manufacture a car, no one else can manufacture a car". Does this mean they will not allow generic versions of "Mucinex" to come on the market, as there were generic versions of "Humibid" before? This would be unprecedented! Is Mucinex under patent protection from generics, although extended release single ingredient guaifenesin had been on the market for decades, including generic forms of it? I wonder if someone from the company that makes "Mucinex" paid off someone at the FDA, to create a monopoly for them on this med! It's really strange! >> The FDA really intended that Mucinex be the only extended-strength >> guaifenisin available in the U.S. No exceptions. [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] >I wonder if someone from the company that makes "Mucinex" paid off someone >at the FDA, to create a monopoly for them on this med! It's really strange! Hello, Does anyone know from what this guaifenesin is made? Could Fenugreek be a replacement for it? + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/benjamin.htm MustRead! http://WWW.PAMINIFARM.COM "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" Hosea 4:6 > http://www.pharmacist.com/articles/h_ts_0396.cfm > > I'll bet the one you cited above, Guaifenex Gy, is no longer sold in the > U.S., just like Humibid LA is no longer sold in the U.S. I'm sure > they're available in other countries. In looking at a link from the article you cited, I saw the following quote: > As a pre-1962 product, its effectiveness has never been well established, but it causes few adverse effects and is commonly included in many cough-and-cold >products. It says that "its effectiveness has never been well established". Are you sure it's really helping loosen your mucus, not placebo? >>http://www.pharmacist.com/articles/h_ts_0396.cfm >> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > It says that "its effectiveness has never been well established". Are you > sure it's really helping loosen your mucus, not placebo? Obviously there's never any way to know that for sure. But I know this: When I have forgotten to take it before bedtime, I do wake up more congested. It's only after I feel that congested that I realize I had forgotten to take it. If it were a placebo effect, it would be more likely to manifest itself when I am consciously aware of whether or not I took the drug. SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. > Besides that, you might have cause for a lawsuit. A product should not give > you an electric shock from touching the power button. A lawsuit would not be > only to get money for yourself and the lawyer, but would get the > manufacturer to improve the product. Yes, a lawsuit could get the cost of the Hydopulse tripled plus stop Dr Grossan from ever answering another question online. > Also--surprised that you bought the same product, after the trouble you had > with it. Why not a Waterpik or the Conair irrigator this time, both much [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > control on the body of the unit, rather than the button pressure control > lever on the handle of the WP.) When you email Conair with a nasal irrigation question or problem, what do they say? I feel fortunate to have discovered the Grossan Hydropulse which was designed by an ENT specialist who is also willing to answer basic questions related to sinusitis. I appreciate using equipment designed especially for the person with sinusitis. Compared to all the money I've spent over the years, money saved by buying a Conair or Water-Pik is not a significant savings. For me, a day without nasal irrigation means a day full of phlegm and congestion. > I feel fortunate to have discovered the Grossan Hydropulse which was > designed by an ENT specialist who is also willing to answer basic questions [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > savings. For me, a day without nasal irrigation means a day full of phlegm > and congestion. Well, you can spend your money how you choose, of course. If you wish to spend three times as much for a product just because it says "designed specifically for the person with sinusitis", even though in fact it doesn't do anything different than what is done by the oral irrigation products, Waterpik and Interplak Oral Irrigator (I remembered the name, Interplak is owned by Conair), has half the warranty (1 year vs two years for the others), and someone (a regular writer to this board for years) reports having received an electric shock from using one, then go ahead, spend your money on that. As I wrote in another post, I am the same as you about a day without nasal irrigation being a day full of phlegm and congestion. I wish it weren't so, and am not really sure that all the irrigation is really good for the nose. But I couldn't live without it, as I seem to be an extremely phlegmy person, as it sounds like you are also. However, that doesn't mean I would pay three times as much for a product that doesn't do the job any better, and has a much shorter warranty, and could electrocute me, just because it as advertised as being "designed specifically for..........". But to each his own. People are swayed by all kinds of advertising. (Some people might even vote for Bush, due to his ridiculous ads that distort the truth, but that's a different topic.) As far as saying "compared to all the money I've spent over the years, money saved by buying "xyz" is not a significant savings". Well, of course that is true, and could be said for anything one might purchase, that its cost, or the differential between the cost of two products, is nothing compared to all the money you have spent in your life. Of course!!! So what? Does that mean one shouldn't consider cost in purchasing decisions? Of course not! Cost of course is not the only consideration in a purchasing decision, I'd pay more for something if I really think it's worth paying more for, but it certainly is an important consideration. I wouldn't spend $100 (or whatever it is now) for a product that electrocutes me, has a one year warranty, when I could buy a product for $30 that does the exact same thing, has a two year warranty, and wouldn't electrocute me. But, if it makes you feel good (psychologically), do it! You can spend your money as you wish! And if you live here in CA, spending more will help our state budget problems, due to your paying more in sales tax, so I should be happy about that. So go ahead--spend more dough!! > > I feel fortunate to have discovered the Grossan Hydropulse which was > > designed by an ENT specialist who is also willing to answer basic [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > state budget problems, due to your paying more in sales tax, so I should be > happy about that. So go ahead--spend more dough!! What I was objecting to was your suggestion of a lawsuit as a first method of dealing with the problem. I very much value Dr Grossan's personal input. You won't get helpful sinusitis suggestions from Conair or Waterpik. I've seen numerous medical Drs disappear from Usenet or the internet because of the mere suggestion of any legal action. None of my local Drs had ever mentioned saline nasal irrigation as being helpful for chronic sinusitis - they just give out more drugs. Steve admitted he gave his Hydropulse rough care and dripped water over it repeatedly. I'd guess the same fault is possible for any electrical device under the right circumstance plus I'm also sure your Conair warranty would be void if they knew you were running salt water through it. Steve wasn't harmed and lawsuits for no good cause don't help anyone except lawyers. Have as phlegm free of a day as possible. And no - I'm not a Chimp fan. www.smirkingchimp.com > Steve admitted he gave his Hydropulse rough > care and dripped water over it repeatedly. I'd guess the same fault is > possible for any electrical device under the right circumstance plus I'm > also sure your Conair warranty would be void if they knew you were running > salt water through it. But Dr. Grossan certainly knows that we're running salt water thru the HydroPulse, and that some salt water will accidentally splash on the machine from time to time. And salt water is both corrosive and a good electrical conductor. For that reason, the HydroPulse's power cord *must* be equipped with a GFI plug, just like my Conair hair dryer is. But currently, it is not. Nor do the instructions that come with the HydroPulse tell the user to plug the power cord only into a GFI socket. It might also help to relocate the HydroPulse's power switch to the side of the machine (which is where the WaterPik has its power switch). Currently, the HydroPulse's power switch (actually a pushbutton) is right next to the irrigator handle, and it's just below the storage area for the (often wet) irrigator tips. That makes it more likely that saline will accidentally splash on the power switch. > Steve wasn't harmed and lawsuits for no good cause > don't help anyone except lawyers. Well don't worry, I'm not suing anybody. But I may call Hydro Med and discuss this with them. SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. > I'm > also sure your Conair warranty would be void if they knew you were running > salt water through it. I'm not at all sure of that. Right on the box it says that it can be used with mouthwash, and that includes all sorts of stuff, including salt. > Have as phlegm free of a day as possible. I wish!!! Not too likely, unfortunately! > And no - I'm not a Chimp fan. www.smirkingchimp.com Chimps???? I don't think I wrote anything about chimpanzees!!! ;-) > After many months of saline solution dripping onto my Grossan > Hydropulse, it finally shorted out. First it started tripping the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Needless to say, I tossed my Hydropulse and bought a new one. They might have wanted to take a look at your old one to see if there were improvements that could be made. They have been quite receptive to issues when I have called them. Joe >> After many months of saline solution dripping onto my Grossan >> Hydropulse, it finally shorted out. First it started tripping the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > there were improvements that could be made. They have been quite > receptive to issues when I have called them. Then I'll call them, and suggest that they add one of those special "Test-Reset" GFI plugs to the power cord, like my portable hair dryer has. Any appliance that is used with wetness and moisture, and/or is used in a bathroom, should have one of those. They should have realized that. I hope there is enough room inside the power cord compartment for a GFI plug to fit in there. If not, then the instructions that come with the HydroPulse should state that the appliance should *only* be plugged into a wall socket that has its own GFCI (most bathrooms have at least one). Currently, there is no such warning. SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. I didn't get shocked, but mine just pooped out one day. I went to wally worl and bought a waterpik and used the grossen tip on it. still doing well after 3/4 months. how long are the Grossen units supposed to last anyway? I think I had mine a little over a year. Signature----- Ruth Berry Signature Images http://www.berryimages.com 1 Corinthians 2:5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God. > After many months of saline solution dripping onto my Grossan > Hydropulse, it finally shorted out. First it started tripping the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Needless to say, I tossed my Hydropulse and bought a new one. > I didn't get shocked, but mine just pooped out one day. I went to wally > worl and bought a waterpik and used the grossen tip on it. still doing well > after 3/4 months. > > how long are the Grossen units supposed to last anyway? I think I had mine > a little over a year. In my experience, any device lasts the length of the warranty plus one day. :-) SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. I have found Waterpiks often to stop working right (I don't recall after how many months), especially the way we use it, with saline. But the WP company is great about replacement when there are problems. It has a two year warranty. One could probably get a replacement from them after more than two years, if it is a model they made within the last two years. You call them, explain the problem. They might want to hear the motor running over the phone, if it runs at all. They will ask you for the serial and model #. Then they send you a new (or refurbished) unit, or if they think it's a handle problem (as it often is), they send a new handle (easy to put on, with directions). They don't ask to see a receipt, and you don't even have to send the old one in. Just from the conversation on the phone, they send a new one! The Waterpik company has great customer service, which is a plus, especially when the product often goes bad. With the Interplak (Conair) model, it also has a two year warranty. Mine never went bad on me, so I don't know how good their customer service is. I haven't used it nearly as much as the WP (because the larger tank on the WP is better for me), so I can't really say it lasts better than the WP. I get the impression that it (IP) is sturdier (than the WP), but I'm not sure about that. > I didn't get shocked, but mine just pooped out one day. I went to wally > worl and bought a waterpik and used the grossen tip on it. still doing well [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > > > Needless to say, I tossed my Hydropulse and bought a new one. |
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