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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Sinusitis / May 20081: Curr Opin Otolaryngol Head Neck Surg. 2008 Jun;16(3):237-41. About ham time.
The relationship of biofilms to chronic rhinosinusitis. Hunsaker DH, Leid JG. Otolaryngology-Head and Neck Surgery, Naval Medical Center, San Diego, California, USA. darrell.hunsaker@med.navy.mil PURPOSE OF REVIEW: To provide an update on the state of biofilm research in otolaryngology. RECENT FINDINGS: Chronic rhinosinusitis is a polymicrobial infection, which includes planktonic and biofilm infections with bacterial and fungal elements. The importance of genetic shift in microbes, when converting into a biofilm state, as well as the multiple phenotypes in each bacterial colony cannot be overemphasized. This creates a very sophisticated community of pathogens, some of which will likely survive a simple chemical treatment. Sinus cultures cannot be expected to provide a complete knowledge of the cause of chronic sinusitis. A new diagnostic method and innovative treatment plans will be necessary to provide a lasting treatment of chronic rhinosinusitis. Surgery combined with postoperative treatment is the most effective mean of controlling the majority of chronic rhinosinusitis infections. The challenges associated with the treatment of chronic rhinosinusitis patients may be met by focusing more on the community of microorganism present in the sinuses. SUMMARY: The understanding of the implication of chronic biofilm infections is growing rapidly but will require an enormous effort to completely control chronic rhinosinusitis. PMID: 18475078 [PubMed - in process] Note they still are not shy about cutting into an area where they have not really figured out how to control the post operative biofilm, but they can' t say that surgery on chronic sinusitis is a bad idea and only gives about one good year after about a year of recovery because they would then have to turn in the BMWs until they found a real cure, which is probably going to be the vaccine against beta amyloid, and then the 20K surgeries will be confined to the people who have inverted papimillias , broken noses and real deviated septums in other words people who will really benefit from surgery. > Note they still are not shy about cutting into an area where they have > not really figured out how to control the post operative biofilm, but > they can' t say that surgery on chronic sinusitis is a bad idea and > only gives about one good year after about a year of recovery because The summary makes it sound like they think the only way to break up the biofilm is to physically get at it. Aside from anecdotal evidence from people using say, pecan tannins, is there research showing the effect of tannins on biofilm? What is the status of people who've posted here using tea and pecan irrigations? I've made it a once-a-week thing. > > Note they still are not shy about cutting into an area where they have > > not really figured out how to control the post operative biofilm, but [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > What is the status of people who've posted here using tea and pecan > irrigations? I've made it a once-a-week thing. The tea and tannin thing is my own. It is cheap and as effective as it is. It is a home remedy. It is what it is. If you have a large area of involvement, though I think every day for a minimum of 4 weeks would be better than once a week. The problem with the knife approach is that there is a really huge area in the sinuses which has a lot of fine microchannels. They can't get into those and when they create a wound scoured clean of the biofilm it takes no time for the bacteria from adjacent hidden spots to repopulate the area unless there is effective infection control. Fortunately most antibiotics which are ineffective in fighting, disbursing, or eradicating an existing biofilm are effective when used to stop one from forming in the first place. It is the greatest irony that most of us have sinusitis because antibiotics were not prescribed to treat the flu. (NO antibiotics will not cure the flu, they will just keep the bacteria from establishing a biofilm that will hag ride you for the rest of your life.) And several other agents have been shown to effectively disburse one biofilm or another, among them phages, nitrites, gallium, furones, algenese (the enzyme that digest alginate.) and there was a French study back in 2003 which I havn't been able to find recently that reported IB and eurythromycian did the job. It is just that not a lot of agents have been studied against sinusitis biofilms with any awareness of what a diverse collection of microrganisms are there. But they pretty much all hold themselves in place with beta amyloid, alginate, or fibrin. With immunity to A-beta, e-coli can't attach. Use phages or a vaccine against the staph which uses coagulese to make the fibrin goo, and alginese to digest the alginate, and keep it up for long enough for the epithieal cells which have the bacteria hiding inside the cells walls to slough off, and Volia" Bob's Your Uncle. > If you have a large area of involvement, though I think every day for > a minimum of 4 weeks would be better than once a week. Everyday would be too much in my case. Now I'm using 2 pecans, distilled water, and Breathe-ease, and after irrigating around 6 PM yesterday, my nostrils are just beginning to clear up. It was very productive, mostly clear and thick stuff, but some greenish thick goo at times (as late as this morning). Also feels sore for hours. > Fortunately most antibiotics which are ineffective in fighting, > disbursing, or eradicating an existing biofilm are effective when used [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > just keep the bacteria from establishing a biofilm that will hag ride > you for the rest of your life.) But there is the problem of over-prescription of antibiotics. Maybe irrigation with antibiotics or antiseptics is the way to treat a flu. > And several other agents have been shown to effectively disburse one > biofilm <...> It is just that not a lot > of agents have been studied against sinusitis biofilms with any > awareness of what a diverse collection of microrganisms are there. But > they pretty much all hold themselves in place with beta amyloid, > alginate, or fibrin. Any idea which of these is loosened by the tannins? > > If you have a large area of involvement, though I think every day for > > a minimum of 4 weeks would be better than once a week. [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > Any idea which of these is loosened by the tannins? Fibrin. Tannins hydrolyze proteins. Methyl Blue disburses amyloid and the blue pigment in grapes might also. > > > of agents have been studied against sinusitis biofilms with any > > > awareness of what a diverse collection of microrganisms are there. But [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Methyl Blue disburses amyloid and the blue pigment in grapes might > also. Hmm... Wikipedia says the methyl blue is only a stain. How do you get methyl blue; any common substance that has it? I saw some search results stating NSAIDs break down amyloid... irrigation with Ibuprofen?! > > > > of agents have been studied against sinusitis biofilms with any > > > > awareness of what a diverse collection of microrganisms are there. But [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > I saw some search results stating NSAIDs break down amyloid... > irrigation with Ibuprofen?! Of course. http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?IA=NZ2003000009&DISPLAY=CLAIMS > > I saw some search results stating NSAIDs break down amyloid... > > irrigation with Ibuprofen?! > > Of course.http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?IA=NZ2003000009&DISPLAY=CLAIMS- Off and on I add a pinch of turmeric to the irrigation solution, just on general principles, I suppose, since it is supposed to be good for everything. After this discussion, I punched it into a search, and sure enough, it attacks amyloids. 4 days after my weekly pecan irrigation, I'm sniffing in gunk a few times a day. No sheets so far though. > > > I saw some search results stating NSAIDs break down amyloid... > > > irrigation with Ibuprofen?! [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > irrigation, I'm sniffing in gunk a few times a day. No sheets so far > though. I don't think once a week irrigation is likely to do a lot of good. Try holding a pecan center membrane in your mouth all night, every night for 3 weeks and you will get somewhere, but even every other day a gives the bugs time to recover completely between each application, and the contact time achieved by irrigation is too brief if you plan on breathing. > > > > of agents have been studied against sinusitis biofilms with any > > > > awareness of what a diverse collection of microrganisms are there. But [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > I saw some search results stating NSAIDs break down amyloid... > irrigation with Ibuprofen?! http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?IA=NZ2003000009&DISPLAY=CLAIMS |
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