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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Sinusitis / November 2004sinuses getting worse when rinsing - am I the only one?
Thanks for reading - I am a first time poster here. After reading many good things about sinus rinse, I bought off-the-shelf Saline and tried to rinse my nose once/twice a day. But I had to stop after a few days because my symptoms are getting much worse: sinus pressure, headache, congestion. I have tried this several times. Each time with the same negative result. Has anyone else been getting worse with rinsing? And why? I really don't think it is caused by the additives in the Saline, but I am willing to try other solutions if you think so. In the last few years, I have had a very dry, stuffy nose, pressure. No running. No mucus. No significant postnasal drip. CT-scan doesn't show much. Allergy test didn't reveal anything. My nose seems to react to pollution (have to limit city biking in summer) and to dust (maybe dust mites - vacuuming the house will do it). Currently using Zyrtec generic 10mg and Nasonex each once a day. Thanks! > Thanks for reading - I am a first time poster here. > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Has anyone else been getting worse with rinsing? And why? Even the directions that come with Sinus Rinse warn about this possibility, and suggest seeing a doctor. It may mean that your sinuses are so blocked that all that saline you're squirting into your sinuses isn't draining out properly. The saline in your sinuses will then add to the congestion rather than relieving it. > I really don't think it is caused by the additives in the Saline, but > I am willing to try other solutions if you think so. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > seems to react to pollution (have to limit city biking in summer) and > to dust (maybe dust mites - vacuuming the house will do it). Did an ENT do a nasal endoscopy on you? They should be able to tell whether your nasal passages are indeed swollen. A steroid nasal spray like Flonase or Nasonex might knock down any inflammation caused by air pollution. Vacuuming your carpeting won't get rid of dust mites. There are some chemicals (like tannic acid) that can cut down on the infestation. But if you're real sensitive to dust mites, replacing your carpets with hard floors (perhaps with throw rugs that can be laundered periodically) is the best solution.  SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. .... ... > Did an ENT do a nasal endoscopy on you? They should be able to tell > whether your nasal passages are indeed swollen. .... Thanks for all the advise. I very much appreciate it! I did get a CT scan and the ENT told on a scale from 1 to 10, 10 being worst, I am a 2. I am also taking Flonase. Do CT scans show the whole picture? Should I still get this nasal endoscopy? Andre > .... > ... [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Do CT scans show the whole picture? Should I still get this nasal endoscopy? Even CT scans can miss things. Not often, but it does happen. It certainly did happen in my case. A nasal endoscopy allows the ENT to view the sinuses directly. Even with CT scans and MRI scans, there is no substitute for a trained physician looking right at the problem. SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. >> .... >> ... [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >with CT scans and MRI scans, there is no substitute for a trained >physician looking right at the problem. Hello, No, youare wrong: the MRI is perfect, and limited only by the zero doing the reading. The CT scan doesnot need to be used for sinus pictures - it is no good for sinus pictures. The MRI is no good for stroke finding, while the CT scan is perfect, and/or only if the zero doing the reading isnot drunk etc. when he/she/it is doing the reading. + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/benjamin.htm MustRead! http://WWW.PAMINIFARM.COM "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" Hosea 4:6 > > .... > > ... [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > with CT scans and MRI scans, there is no substitute for a trained > physician looking right at the problem. I did schedule an apointment with ENT. Now, if I take a decongestant and then do a nasal rinse, should that work better? Should the Saline come out easier / better that way? >>>.... >>>... [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > I did schedule an apointment with ENT. Now, if I take a decongestant > and then do a nasal rinse, should that work better? I don't know. You could give it a try. But I find a good time to do a nasal rinse is just before bedtime; and oral decongestants can cause insomnia, so I wouldn't want to take an oral decongestant just before bedtime. SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. >Now, if I take a decongestant > and then do a nasal rinse, should that work better? Personally, I wouldn't take a decongestants just to ease rinsing. They have side-effects..... >> > .... >> > ... >> > >> >>Did an ENT do a nasal endoscopy on you? They should be able to tell >> >>whether your nasal passages are indeed swollen. >> > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >and then do a nasal rinse, should that work better? Should the Saline >come out easier / better that way? Hello, Pay no attention to the spammers: If you want to do it the way i do it: take the guaifenesin only (Robitussin (green label)) in your colon cleanse, which is usually in the morning if you want to poop on the job. Or you can do it as soon as you get home from work,so that you arenot pooping when you should be sleeping, not that the colon cleanse should do that, however it does get things moving if you have been lax in such areas. The guaifenesin does nothing but liquefy your mucus - the rest is up to you on how to get it out. I would only use the salt solution as a gentle spray when using guaifenesin. I donot use it all the time, because it is a chemical, and i have chemical allergy along with all my other "normal" allergies. This is a case of the blind leading the blind, because we all respond differently to everything under the Son. You will have to "work" with it to see how it does for you, however it does work, if you try . . . + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/benjamin.htm MustRead! http://WWW.PAMINIFARM.COM "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" Hosea 4:6 A lot of ENTs don't do this though, at least not often. I guess it's quicker for them to write a prescription for a CT scan. > A nasal endoscopy allows the ENT to view the sinuses directly. Even > with CT scans and MRI scans, there is no substitute for a trained > physician looking right at the problem. >A lot of ENTs don't do this though, at least not often. I guess it's quicker >for them to write a prescription for a CT scan. I have noticed that while most (not all) of the University-based ones I have seen did one one every single visit, some of the private ones did not do them at all. I found a high correlation between the thoroughness and skills of the specialist and how often they did them. At U. Penn., Dr. Kennedy has even trained one of his nurses to do them (although he did them himself on me). They have sinus-specialist nurses there who are quite expert, which I have not seen elsewhere. The specialized nurses also do post-surgery debrisement. The scopes stop working eventually and are very expensive ( I have seen how concerned the are when "yet another" one goes bad), so some hesitate to use them in their offices. There also seem to be various styles, various angles, so the cost probably is very high for a full array of equipment. There may also be reimbursement issues with insurance companies. >> Thanks for all the advise. I very much appreciate it! >> I did get a CT scan and the ENT told on a scale from 1 to 10, [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > CT scans and MRI scans, there is no substitute for a trained physician > looking right at the problem. A nasal endoscopy cannot see inside the sinuses. The sinuses only have very tiny tubes like hairs to drain. A scope cannot see into the sinuse. It can merely look at the external opening of the draining tubes. Tony >..... >.... [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >Andre Hello, CAT scans are no good for sinus. MRI should be used for sinus - CAT scan is great for stroke etc. Donot agonize over the "endoscope", my Doc never uses it. One time i told him to, then i got a Staph. infection from it- they cannot be properly sterilized . . . + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/benjamin.htm MustRead! http://WWW.PAMINIFARM.COM "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" Hosea 4:6 >Thanks for reading - I am a first time poster here. > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > >Thanks! Hello, First thing: make your own salt solution out of sea salt from the Health Food Store that has no additives (Morton Kosher Salt has a nasty additive in it READ THE LABEL). I think it is 2 teaspoons to 1 pint of water (that is what i use). Now then: itis the really big "f" word . . . fungus . . . OR Staph. You arenot being careful to not plunge the solution far up into your head; heading toward your eyes and brain. Youare pressing hard against your nairs with the bottle tip, thus causing "force", which does nothing more than plunge the bacteria and fungus deep into your head and sinuses. Stop it! Now that i have done all this damage, i would at this point use real Listerene in place of the salt solution - just dump the salt solution out and replace it with a Listeren solution strong enough that you can stand. Hold the little spray bottle away from your nares and spray hard - well . . . not too hard, then after you recover; go blow, and if you can- do it again. Then do the other side (be brave) in the same manner. The next day or that evening when you do it again you will find it doesnot sting so much. Then each time after, you will find it stings less and less; that means the infection is cleared up, however now you need to go deeper, which means starting all over again with the brain-popping sting. Use your imagination as to how to get it in deeper. I will tell you how i do it (everyone in here will cuss be out, but pay no attention to them, as i havebeen doing this for years). I lie on the bed on my back and hang my head over the side; pointing the top of my head to the floor, and fill up the nasal/sinus cavity; then get ready to stand up: pinch your nostrils closed; (say first part of K to stop from swallowing the Listerene solution); then bend over, pointing your head top to the floor; then run to sink and let it run out. This isnot force you are using; it is only gravity, and does no harm to me. I suspect this will do little for the fungus except for reliveing this: Remember the "Saying": Where there is irritation; There is blockage; Where there is blockage; There is swelling; Where there is swelling; There is infection. You will need this info if it is the really big "f" word: Killing the Fungus: http://www.mall-net.com/mcs/afung.html Stuffy Nose http://www.drmirkin.com/morehealth/G220.htm + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + Men fear truth as they fear nothing else on earth - more than ruin - more even than death... Truth is subversive and revolutionary, destructive and terrible, truth is merciless to privilege, established institutions, and comfortable habit. Truth looks into the pit of hell and is not afraid. Truth is great and swift and free, the light of the world, and the chief glory of man. Jesus is the Word and the Word is Truth. `````````````````````````````````````````````` + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/benjamin.htm MustRead! http://WWW.PAMINIFARM.COM "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" Hosea 4:6 Hello, Sorry, i forgot to tell you after you have the infection cleared up (about 2 days should be enough), you should go back to your salt solution; doing it in the manner of a habit - as brushing your teeth. Here is something i would like to say: I just did my salt spray (sea salt), and the bad side swelled up, however it soon began to water, which is what you want. I will probably give in and use my Nasalcrom as Doc said i should, even though i think it is wrong . . . I will continue to trust Vit. E "application" in that nasal passage, because Vit. E (oil)is healing and controls scarring (i just had surgery in July). >>Thanks for reading - I am a first time poster here. >> [quoted text clipped - 95 lines] > <><><><><><><> The Worlds Uncensored News Source <><><><><><><><> > + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/benjamin.htm MustRead! http://WWW.PAMINIFARM.COM "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" Hosea 4:6 Most off shelf prepared solutions have preservatives including Benzalkonium which is known to irritate the nose of nasal patients. Switch to a preparation without preservatives. Various formulas are here. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com Do you believe .9 as opposed to the usual sprays of .65 that I have found works better. I use Simply Saline, .9 sodium chloride and purified water dispenses from an aerosol can. On 29 Oct 2004 03:31:01 GMT, entconsult@aol.comnospam (ENTconsult) >Most off shelf prepared solutions have preservatives including Benzalkonium >which is known to irritate the nose of nasal patients. Switch to a preparation >without preservatives. Various formulas are here. >Murray Grossan, M.D. >http://www.ent-consult.com Simple Saline is a preferred product with normal saline and no preservatives. Breathe.ease XL is similar but has the electrolytes that improve cilia function. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com > Do you believe .9 as opposed to the usual sprays of .65 that I have > found works better. I use Simply Saline, .9 sodium chloride and > purified water dispenses from an aerosol can. A much less expensive way to get saline solution in aerosol can without preservatives. One can find it as a contact lens solution in 12 oz cans. The cheapest--Wal-Mart's "Equate" brand, $1.88 per 12 oz. can. (In Wal-Mart stores. Not online.) It is saline solution, no preservatives. The contents say: sterile, isotonic buffered saline solution containing sodium chloride, boric acid, and sodium borate. (I think the latter two items do the "buffering", regulating the pH, similar to using baking soda mixed with salt in irrigation solution.) Compare the prices--12 oz. for $1.88, versus "Simply Saline" $6 or so for 1? ounces! You can also get non-preserved saline solution for contact lenses in 4 oz. squeeze bottles. Unisol brand, or generic equivalents. They come in boxes of three 4 oz bottles, so still 12 oz total. Unisol is available from Amazon.com at $5.08 for a box of three 4 oz bottles. Also at various drug stores. Most sprays only only contain .065% sodium chloride, Simply Saline by Blairex Labs has .9 and just purified water and sodium choride. No preservatives. Comes in an aoresol can. Has given me much relief. >Thanks for reading - I am a first time poster here. > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > >Thanks! I am one of those people that has found much relief using a gentle sinus irrigation with homemade saline solution. I have had my first good exam in two years which was such a relief. I was using nasal steroid spray and it stung so badly I had to quit, weird that it was made by bauch-lomb and they didn't seem to get the ph right...since they make products that don't sting the eyes. Before that none of the nasal steriod sprays bothered me. Anyway, I make my solution daily with 1 quart water, 1 rounded teaspoon kosher salt, 1/2 teaspoon baking soda...boil it, let it cool, then use that throughout the day. Trudy. It isn't stated in the directions here, but I know I need to shake my head in all sorts of directions (over the bathtub, kneeling, head bent over it) after irrigation, and much comes out that way. If I didn't do that, I'd probably feel worse afterwards. > Thanks for reading - I am a first time poster here. > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Thanks! > It isn't stated in the directions here, but I know I need to shake my head > in all sorts of directions (over the bathtub, kneeling, head bent over it) > after irrigation, and much comes out that way. If I didn't do that, I'd > probably feel worse afterwards. Sinusitis causes impaired ciliary function. Perhaps saline solution that a healthy person's cilia might quickly sweep away may linger longer in the sinuses of a sinus sufferer. Might make an interesting research study for Dr. Grossan (if he hasn't done it already). SignatureSteven D. Litvintchouk Email: sdlitvin@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me. |
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