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º-- Idea Man --º - 09 Apr 2004 21:51 GMT

¸,.·´¨`·., ¡ | i | ,.·´¨`·.,¸ ¡ i | i¸,.·´¨`·.,

Hey geeks.

(<^><(o¿o)><^>)

Over the last few weeks there has been a lot of discussion here in the
newsgroup about the basic equipment designed to serve the general public in
order to identify those with particular characteristics resembling invasion
of the body by pathogenic microorganisms and how this basic equipment
designed to serve the general public is rather poor, outdated, and needs
urgent improving.

We have also been discussing microorganisms that can infect epithelial
cells, viruses that are flesh invading contributing to chronic inflammatory
muscle disease, and virus's again, that have the ability to insert their own
DNA into a bacteria's chromosome and live on further by replicating into
their daughter cells.

It's all very interesting and scores of us have our concerns with regards to
whether or not any of this is happening in ourselves and other CPPS
patients. We can only hope that scientists and researcher's bring more
clarity to this subject in the very near future with unbiased investigation
and study.

With that being said, I think all of us should keep an open mind with
regards to other possibilties and that's why this website which has a
library full of relevant information is very important for you go over.
http://www.chronicpelvicpain.us/

At this discussion group, ( http://www.chronicpelvicpain.us/ ), you can
read posts, here what other's are saying, and join in with the discussion
adding more benefit to yourself and your quest of becoming symptom free on
day.

I hope you do take the time to take a look there and also hope that one day
you'll find something that works for you.

God bless.

¸,.·´¨`·., ¡ | i | ,.·´¨`·.,¸ ¡ i | i¸,.·´¨`·.,

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Robert - 10 Apr 2004 03:43 GMT

> ¸,.·´¨`·., ¡ | i | ,.·´¨`·.,¸ ¡ i | i¸,.·´¨`·.,
>
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> designed to serve the general public is rather poor, outdated, and needs
> urgent improving.

In Canada maybe, because the government got involved with trying to clamp
down the evil capitalist companies.
In the US any doctor can order any test he wants to and there are labs able
to fill that request. The real question is does the doctor want to order
such a test with meaningless results or consequences.

> We have also been discussing microorganisms that can infect epithelial
> cells, viruses that are flesh invading contributing to chronic inflammatory
> muscle disease, and virus's again, that have the ability to insert their own
> DNA into a bacteria's chromosome and live on further by replicating into
> their daughter cells.

What the bacteria does or whether it is infected or not with virus does not
impact on antimicrobials.
There are many intracelluar organisms, Rocky Mountain spotted fever and even
chlamydia are obligate intracellular and antibiotics are effective against
them. It makes no difference whether bacteria invade the epithelial cells in
terms of antibacterials. Flesh invading viruses that invade muscle are not
susceptible to antibiotics generally. Viral myocarditis means getting of
plenty of bed rest as there is very little they can do.
Bacteriophage infection of bacteria does not alter the bacteria's
susceptibility to antibiotics. A lamda infected diptheria bacteria is
susceptible to the same antbiotic as one who is not infected. The only
difference is that the infected one causes disease while one that does not
is harmless. It is one of pathogencity not one of susceptibility.
No one needs to know any of this, why? Because either antibiotics will work
or they won't.

> It's all very interesting and scores of us have our concerns with regards to
> whether or not any of this is happening in ourselves and other CPPS
> patients. We can only hope that scientists and researcher's bring more
> clarity to this subject in the very near future with unbiased investigation
> and study.

They have and antibiotics have failed and that is more important than any
B.S. theories.

> With that being said, I think all of us should keep an open mind with
> regards to other possibilties and that's why this website which has a
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> adding more benefit to yourself and your quest of becoming symptom free on
> day.

Just don't mention antibiotics or I or another Moderator will can your a.s.

> I hope you do take the time to take a look there and also hope that one day
> you'll find something that works for you.
>
> God bless.
>
> ¸,.·´¨`·., ¡ | i | ,.·´¨`·.,¸ ¡ i | i¸,.·´¨`·.,

Reply to this Message

º-- Idea Man --º - 11 Apr 2004 21:58 GMT

"Robert" wrote...

> It makes no difference whether bacteria invade the epithelial cells in
> terms of antibacterials.

This is absolutely wrong. It's like speaking to a child with you.

> Flesh invading viruses that invade muscle are not
> susceptible to antibiotics generally.

This discussion isn't exclusively about antibiotics geek, so why are you
infatuated with them? Everyone here knows that antibiotics usually don't
work for CPPS patients!!! The whole message in my post is that standard labs
available to the general public are practically useless at identifying many
intracellular bacteria and viruses that are just now being recognized as
causing inflammatory disease, and these basic standards need improvement so
that one day antibiotics and other medicines might just be more effective!
You stupid little man. In one example of this there are studies which prove
e.coli do flux in and out of the human epithelial cell and avoid detection
at culture time. This infiltration protects itself against the medicine used
to kill it, the every antibiotics your telling everyone here that work every
single time. You mislead people with misinformation and ignorance. Mostly
ignorance though.

> No one needs to know any of this, why? Because either antibiotics will work
> or they won't.

You should work for Bayer or one of the other big antibiotic dug companies.
Antibiotics work every time......yep, flawless. Maybe you are already are a
shill? How much do they pay you? Your kinda sounding like a poster named Jim
who used to post here too.

> Just don't mention antibiotics or I or another Moderator will can your a.s.

Who are you threatening? Threats are meaningless to me. But, this is
interesting. You mean to tell me your a moderator at c.p.com? Wow! But,
this vague threat about discussing antibiotics sure doesn't sound like
anything the moderators over there would threaten people about? I mean from
time to time antibiotics are discussed there. How long have you been
speaking for c.p.com and been moderating there for, Robert?

p.s. Last thing I wanna say, but it won't make no difference to you. I think
your an idiot who's posting here for your own self serving purposes which
just happens to be feeding your own perverted ego by wanting to be
recognized as an internet troll. With that being said, it will be a very
long time before you ever get a response back from me to one of your posts.
So just remember this, Robert: everytime you post some utterly stupid and
inflammatory comment to the group and expect that I will answer you back,
and I don't? Well, the reason I won't participate in anymore discussion with
you is because you are a disasterous fool with the brain the size of a
peanut. That's why. But, guess what? With your hand on your dick, I bet
you'll be responding daily to my posts trying to compete for my attention
won't you? Robert, I don't like you and I'm not gay! I like women!!! There
are all kinds of internet sites that can feed your perverted nature, so go
away.

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Makaveli - 12 Apr 2004 03:01 GMT

> "Robert" wrote...
>
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
> shill? How much do they pay you? Your kinda sounding like a poster named Jim
> who used to post here too.

Wow, lol, i thought we were all suppose to get along? I agree Robert
can be annoying, and usually scares ppl , and give sarcastic remarks.
Robert, you need to change this or ppl are going to stop visiting this
newsgroup.

If you have a problem, you should discuss it and not take it out on
others.

makaveli

Reply to this Message

Robert - 12 Apr 2004 06:16 GMT

> > "Robert" wrote...
> >
[quoted text clipped - 33 lines]
> Robert, you need to change this or ppl are going to stop visiting this
> newsgroup.

I don't have any problem with that Makaveli as your views are pretty much in
agreement with mine. I don't see anything in my above post that was
annoying, scary, or sarcastic. Point for point anwsers can aggrevate many
people.
Canda has a national medical socialized health system. Not so in the US,
where many canadian doctors have come to. The other are examples are
specific and to the point. If you look at Idea Man's response to that is
pure hate speech.
Many people have been damaged by excessive antibotic use and to keep on
harping on unseen bugs only wants to make people take more antibiotics which
don't work. People need to move on to more treatment modalities and they
won't do that if somebody is out there saying that the labs are always
missing something.
If you read Dr Guercini's response on UTI acquistion you will see that the
UTI's were all diagnosed with urine cultures. The swabs were used for
Chlamydia etc. Even if all the cultures are negative most doctors give a
broad spectrum antibiotic but after 5 antibiotics then you have to say,
"come on".
Sarcasim is the nice way to say,"you are full of sh.t", so if people don't
like the sarcasim them let me be more blunt and direct.
There are a lot of people here that seems as though the only thing they have
to post is to bitch about everything. That gets pretty idiotic and useless
pretty quick. If people don't think cultures are reliable then great, don't
have any then and save yourself the agrevation. If you don't like your
doctor then don't see him and find something else. If you live in Canada and
aren't allowed to see anybody else because of the system you have then don't
try and make the US have the same system.

> If you have a problem, you should discuss it and not take it out on
> others.

You really need to read those posts and if anyone out there does not take
it out on others then it is the exception.
Hey Mak, I'll try to let you in the site. I will use my clout with Mr. Web.

> makaveli

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