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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate BPH / June 2004

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How much prostate is removed

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Liz - 23 Jun 2004 23:44 GMT
I am trying to learn as much as I can about this stuff
before I do something. Pls excuse if some of this seems
oversimplified.

With TURP, how much prostate is removed?
With PVP, how much prostate is removed?

My doc says that they destroy some of the
bladder on purpose to allow them to get
access to the prostate, is this optional?
Can I request to leave the bladder stuff
alone and just work on the other parts of
the prostate?
nambucca - 24 Jun 2004 11:09 GMT
> I am trying to learn as much as I can about this stuff
> before I do something. Pls excuse if some of this seems
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
> With TURP they do indeed destroy part of the bladder neck ..........with
PVP theres no bladder neck damage because PVP greenlight only deals with the
red cells in the prostate tissue and nothing else

TURP meand 4 or 5 days in hospital and a stiff catheter ...........PVP means
5 hours in hospital and majority leave without even a soft catheter which in
any case would be out next day

I have 70 gm median lobe removed by PVP a year ago having run like hell from
a uro who insisted on TURP which would without doubt have left me both
incontinant and with retro
Liz - 25 Jun 2004 00:36 GMT
> > I am trying to learn as much as I can about this stuff
> > before I do something. Pls excuse if some of this seems
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> PVP theres no bladder neck damage because PVP greenlight only deals with the
> red cells in the prostate tissue and nothing else

My guy says PVP would also damage bladder. After all, hemoglobin is both
prostate and bladder, and green light vaporizes hemoglobin.

But what I was asking is more like is 90 percent of the prostate removed,
or just the minimum amount to fix the problem. Oh, I just thought of this
too:
how fast does it grow back?

> TURP meand 4 or 5 days in hospital and a stiff catheter ...........PVP means
> 5 hours in hospital and majority leave without even a soft catheter which in
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> a uro who insisted on TURP which would without doubt have left me both
> incontinant and with retro
Lee M. - 25 Jun 2004 00:43 GMT
> > > I am trying to learn as much as I can about this stuff
> > > before I do something. Pls excuse if some of this seems
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
> too:
> how fast does it grow back?

I believe both procedures remove a substantial amount of prostate tissue.
The idea is to really open up that channel and to keep it open for years.  I
think the amount of work in the bladder neck area depends on which lobes are
enlarged.  Bladder neck damage often results in retrograde ejaculation.
TAP - 25 Jun 2004 03:01 GMT
Liz,
I'll do my best to answer your question.

1. The prostate is a gland with fibrous smooth muscle tissue on the outside
and glandular tissue on the inside.

2. BPH causes the prostate to enlarge from the inside as the glandular
tissue grows and tries to expand. This closes off the urethra and pushes
upward against the bladder.

3.  PVP's laser wavelength at 532 nanometers vaporizes this glandular tissue
quite well but it doesn't do a good job on the outer smooth muscle/ fibrous
tissue.

4. So the surgeon takes the PVP fiber into the urethra and blasts outward.
He takes out all the inside glandular tissue of the prostate, stopping when
he gets to  the outer capsule. He should know from experience that once
laser is have a tougher time vaporizing tissue that he is near the outer
capsule.

5. The surgeon's skill is tested if the prostate has grown into the bladder
at the bladder neck.  He needs to remove prostate tissue but leave bladder
muscle, a very difficult and time consuming process.  This is where the
skill and patience comes in.  If too much bladder neck muscle is removed,
retro is likely.  If not enough prostate tissue is removed from the bladder
neck, symptom relief won't occur and the remaining glandular tissue
continues to grow.

So the amount of prostate tissue removed depends on how large the prostate
is and if it is grown into the bladder.  But if the prostate is the size of
a mandarin orange, the goal of PVP is to get all the insides out leaving the
orange skin intact.

I hope this explanation helps.

Regards,
Patrick
PVP June 2002 (first on this newsgroup)
Dr. Te NY

> > > I am trying to learn as much as I can about this stuff
> > > before I do something. Pls excuse if some of this seems
[quoted text clipped - 33 lines]
> > a uro who insisted on TURP which would without doubt have left me both
> > incontinant and with retro
Liz - 25 Jun 2004 05:48 GMT
> Liz,
> I'll do my best to answer your question.
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
> PVP June 2002 (first on this newsgroup)
> Dr. Te NY

Thanks a bunch, this was very useful, cleared up several of my concerns.

> > > > I am trying to learn as much as I can about this stuff
> > > > before I do something. Pls excuse if some of this seems
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
> > > a uro who insisted on TURP which would without doubt have left me both
> > > incontinant and with retro
H. E. - 25 Jun 2004 21:14 GMT
I would like to thank Patrick as well.
I have been reading his comments for more than a year now
and I have learned a lot from him.
I had a TURP 4 years ago and so far I am doing o.k.
But if the time comes when I have to have, what my urologist calls a
procedure, I will go with PVP.

>Liz,
>I'll do my best to answer your question.
[quoted text clipped - 75 lines]
>> > a uro who insisted on TURP which would without doubt have left me both
>> > incontinant and with retro
 
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