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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate BPH / April 2008

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Leila - 08 Apr 2008 03:08 GMT
Hello,

I have been reading posts on this group for several weeks now, in
order to help my husband make better medical decisions. (I'm the
research person around here, which I'm glad to do for him, since he
now has trouble staying in a sitting position at the computer due to
an indwelling catheter they put in on March 24.)

Here's a precis of his situation:

He has been blocked from passing urine for about five years now, and
we did not have any insurance, so we had to wait till he turned 62 in
order to qualify for Medi-cal and Medicare--thus he just had to handle
things his own way. He would push on his abdomen to urinate and for a
long time he had no bad symptoms.

Initially, about nine years ago, he got a prostate infection, and we
could hardly get rid of it before another infection would come again.
This went on for a couple of years, when we caught on that he had to
stay on the antibiotics longer. We spent cash ordering Cipro online,
and the next time an infection arose, we kept him on for three weeks
instead of the ten days they kept him on at the hospital outpatient
clinic ( which he could go to for free). That seemed to do it, as the
infection did not come back for several years. Plus he started taking
saw palmetto, but could not urinate on his own from then on.

Just last month he got another infection, and this time his blood
pressure soared really high and he was close to total lock-up. So
after the infection was over, we went to the Veteran's Clinic and they
catheterized him and put him on Doxazosin. They said he had BPH and
his bladder was very stretched out of shape. The Doxazosin made his
blood pressure get dangerously low, plus we figured it couldn't be
helping his bladder contract back to normal size, so he just stopped
taking it after a few days. He did very well with the catheter for
about two weeks--only occasional spurts of blood if he bent over or
squatted down the wrong way. And we could tell the bladder was slowly
shrinking back--his abdomen no longer protruded, and got slowly
flatter and flatter. We couldn't figure out why they gave him the
Doxazosin, since it was so crucial that his bladder regain its tone.

We went back to the clinic today, but they said they would not do the
flow test because he had not taken the drug, and they gave him Flomax.
These alpha blockers do not seem to be the right thing for him at all.
First, as I said, it is crucial that his badly stretched out bladder
regain its tone; second, they dangerously lower his blood pressure;
and third, he wasn't just retaining urine, he was completely blocked
for a long time.

We feel surgery is the only viable option. We're trying to communicate
this to them. We had hoped for PVP, but they said the Vet hospital
hasn't OK'd that in California yet. We would go to any doctor that
would do it. We live in Humboldt County (Northern California). But he
says he will even go through TURP if he has to.
We do not want the problem to drag on while taken questionable drugs.
We want to solve the problem in the best possible way.

Sorry for this long post, but the one question I have is--aren't the
alpha blockers sort of foolish to prescribe for someone with a
stretched bladder? And where can a PVP urologist be found?

Many Thanks,

Leila
Chockman - 08 Apr 2008 05:50 GMT
Check out the site below which gives you a place to located a PVP Uro

http://www.greenlighthps.com/consumers/

> Hello,
>
[quoted text clipped - 59 lines]
>
> Leila
Leila - 08 Apr 2008 16:37 GMT
> Check out the site below which gives you a place to located a PVP Uro
>
[quoted text clipped - 65 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

Thanks! I'm looking into it. We may not be able to afford these
doctors. I'm not sure. My husband syas he will undergo TURP if
necessary--but he does not want to take drugs that really can't solve
a problem that only surgery can solve.

But my number one question now is, aren't the alpha blockers counter-
productive for a case where the bladder has been seriously stretched
and it is crucial that the bladder regain its tone and elasticity--
otherwise no kind of surgery will help if the bladder is shot.

The clinic is demanding that he take the flomax for one week before
they do a flow test. We're in a quandary. How could such a long
standing blockage be cured by a muscle relaxer? And what about the
side-effects? His blood pressure already gets very low sometimes,
probably from the abrupt removal of pressure off his kidneys when the
catheter was put in. He hasn't taken one dose of drugs to date.

Any input on this question?

Thanks again,

Leila
Ramón - 09 Apr 2008 12:37 GMT
> Hello,
>
[quoted text clipped - 59 lines]
>
> Leila

Hi Leila,
Have been and are, with all the symptoms your husband's going through.
Gave in to a TURP in '05 thinking it would save my marriage, NOT. Luck
would have it,  the uro did not do a complete scraping, per comments
from other uros.
I TAKE NO DRUGS, and will not succumb to any surgeries, PVP, TUNA,
etc.
Started on Avodart and stopped after taking three pills, knowing of
future consequences, especially lost libido, erections, etc.
None of the uros will show me how much they care, but they'll tell me
how much they know. 99% of THEM are only out to make as much money as
they can. No different than a sales-person with no regard to improving
or eliminating the patient's suffering condition.
In rural China the practitioner will not get paid unless the patient
gets well. Don't know if that practice continues.
Last time I followed Dr's orders to go home and yes, go to work with
the catheter-foley attached to the leg, it brought dire consequences.
My protocol:
Kegels daily
When urine retention sets in, a 16 french is used, releasing stored
urine. this takes only 02 mnts. H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide 3% in & out of
catheter, k2 jelly for smooth insertion)
Eliminate, or cut down drastically on: coffee, alcohol, meats, sugars,
dairy, processed, fried foods.
Fast one day and no restaurants for seven days.
Drink h2o. I boil the water. Hebal caffeine-free teas (Rooibos, green)
H2O therapy: Apply hot and cold water to the prostate area for five
mnts twice daily.
I am 66, 6'0, 190, non-smoler,  swim, and stay physically active
Let us know after seven days.
Ramón
Leila - 09 Apr 2008 16:06 GMT
> > Hello,
>
[quoted text clipped - 93 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

Thank you Ramon, for your response. Right now we are communicating
with the uro at the clinic to let her know our reasons for not going
the drug route. She seems responsive so far. We go back to see her on
the 28th of April. My husband has been with the foley catheter since
March 24--a little over two weeks. It will be almost three more weeks
before we see her again. So we're stuck with the foley catheter till
then. Maybe longer--we just don't know. My husband is 65, weighs 155
(5' 8" tall), non-smoker, no alcohol, excellent vegetarian diet. Of
course, he is very restricted right now, because it seems if he does
too much, or the wrong things, he gets a spurt of blood. We're trying
to figure out just what he can and can't do at this point.

Also, we would like to know if there is anything else we should be
doing while the foley catheter is in. Does it need to be flushed out
or anything like that? We are super clean around here, and every time
the bag is emptied or changed, we are very careful. So there's no real
danger of infection. He is in good health and his blood pressure is
now much lower than before the catheterization. So we are really
grateful that the first step (foley catheter) was finally taken, as
his bladder was seriously stretched from years of not being able to
urinate naturally--he had to push on his abdomen to urinate for a long
time.

As I said in a previous post, we see this as two problems--one,
allowing the bladder to regain some of its former tone and elasticity;
and two, taking steps to remove the blockage, either surgery of some
kind, or perhaps self-catheterization, as you suggest (or perhaps
both). The thing is, sex is no longer an issue. We both came to an
understanding several years ago that that part of our life together
had passed and we are now developing along other lines--not that we
denigrate sex in any way. It's just that, for us, it has passed. We
just want him to be able to regain health and mobility in the wisest
possible way.

So any info on how to live with an in-dwelling catheter is what we are
looking for now. I am also trying to see if we can go the PVP route
instead of TURP--but that's later on.

Many Thanks,

Leila
 
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