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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate BPH / June 2006

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Anybody been helped by Proscar?

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root - 02 Jun 2006 08:51 GMT
My uro has given me a prescription for Proscar but he says it
might take over a year to see any benefit. Have any of you
taken Proscar for that duration and seen a benefit? Flomax
has provided an immediate benefit, will that decrease in
time?

TIA
Ed - 02 Jun 2006 17:27 GMT
>My uro has given me a prescription for Proscar but he says it
>might take over a year to see any benefit. Have any of you
>taken Proscar for that duration and seen a benefit? Flomax
>has provided an immediate benefit, will that decrease in
>time?

I went on Flomax (0.8 mg) a year and a half ago and Proscar (5 mg)
around March of last year. My problem was slow flow at night, or any
time my bladder was too full. And at night especially it sometimes got
too full. This meant very poor flow, labored peeing and occasionally
complete blockage, requiring catheterization.

My prostate was 150 g, probably too large for PVP or TURP.

The Flomax provided a benefit in a few days. For me it was not a great
benefit, but it helped. I still had trouble at night but less
frequently. I had some side effects, not too troublesome, but I did
seem to have a permanent cold. The side effects diminished very
gradually with time.

The Proscar worked much more slowly, by shrinking the prostate. It's
not expected to relieve symptoms much. The main benefit, I guess, is
that the prostate stops growing and hopefully shrinks a bit. It worked
for me. After some 10 months symptoms had improved noticeably and
allowed me to reduce the Flomax to 0.4 mg.

I was thinking that halving the Flomax would alleviate the side
effects, but the opposite happened. They got worse... and after that
are very gradually diminishing again.

Anyway, it has now been several months on 0.4 mg Flomax and continuing
on the Proscar... and symptoms are still very gradually improving. I'm
starting to think about reducing the Flomax even more, either by
alternating days or maybe by splitting the contents of the capsule and
putting in new capsules (as described in this NG before) ... or maybe
that is just too fussy and I should just eliminate the Flomax as a
trial.

So basically, the Proscar has brought me back from a very difficult
situation to a situation that I think I can tolerate indefinitely, and
I have been able to avoid surgery.

Just my experience... good luck.

Ed
Stocks06 - 02 Jun 2006 17:39 GMT
I'm on Avodart and it has helped tremendously.  My PSA has gone from
3.6 to 1.3.
I noticed improvement within 6-8 weeks and it has continued to improve
over a year and
a half.  I think Avodart is preferable to Proscar.   Ask your doctor.
Ed - 02 Jun 2006 17:47 GMT
>I'm on Avodart and it has helped tremendously.  My PSA has gone from
>3.6 to 1.3.
>I noticed improvement within 6-8 weeks and it has continued to improve
>over a year and
>a half.  I think Avodart is preferable to Proscar.   Ask your doctor.

My uro said much the same thing to me. Proscar was the med of choice
back when it was prescribed to me, but he said now he would recommend
Avodart.  

But Proscar is working for me, so I will stay on it for now.

Ed
lawrence@psychological-hug.com - 03 Jun 2006 00:09 GMT
> My uro has given me a prescription for Proscar but he says it
> might take over a year to see any benefit. Have any of you
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> TIA
I am on Flomax and Avodart (a newer 5-alpha-reductase inhibitor than
Proscar).  My medical oncologist, who specializes in prostate cancer (I
have both prostate cancer and BPH), increased my Avodart dose from 0.5
mg to 1.0 mg because my blood test showed that one capsule did not
sufficiently lower my DHT (worsens prostate cancer at least 4 times
more than testosteerone).  It took about 9 months for my Avodart to
help reduce my urinary symptoms. (Avodart was approved by the FDA for
BPH but has an off-label use for slowing prostate cancer growth).

My urologist, after two years, increased my dose of Flomax (an alpha
blocker) from 0.4 to 0.8 mg, in an effort to improve my BPH symptoms,
which were worsening.

Being on both Avodart and Flomax eased my urinary problems about 2
years ago. A 2002 study showed that taking both Proscar and the alpha
blocker doxazosin (Cardura) was more effective than either drug alone.

Research has found that Proscar was most effective in men with large
prostates and with PSAs of 1.4 or higher.

For more info about BPH, go to a new BPH website,
http://www.ljblgb.com/index.htm
Lawrence J. Bookbinder
Ed - 03 Jun 2006 03:03 GMT
>For more info about BPH, go to a new BPH website,
>http://www.ljblgb.com/index.htm
>Lawrence J. Bookbinder

Excellent web site, Lawrence!

Ed
Pete - 03 Jun 2006 22:30 GMT
>> My uro has given me a prescription for Proscar but he says it
>> might take over a year to see any benefit. Have any of you
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> help reduce my urinary symptoms. (Avodart was approved by the FDA for
> BPH but has an off-label use for slowing prostate cancer growth).

Lawrence...I find this very interesting (regarding the off label use for
slowing prostate cancer growth - since I have read just the opposite for the
sister drug Proscar), and hope Dr. Sancha will comment on this.

Regarding Proscar adverse effects, the following was taken from the
"Essential Guide to Prescription Drugs 2005", by James J. Rybacki, Pharm
D. -

"Higher grade prostate cancer - possible associated higher grade cancers if
a cancer does happen".

"Possible increase in more aggressive tumors if cancer (neoplasm) does
happen - possible".

What is interesting, Rybacki also states that Proscar may help reduce the
risk of prostate cancer by 25%, but apparently you may get a higher grade
cancer if it happens (this is stated in the lead in "benefits vs. risks
table" for Proscar.  This is kind of confusing at best, and I asked one of
my uro's about this once, and got bullshit back (he didn't know or some
horse sh.t like that).

Could you please list a reference(s) that state the off label use for
Avodart slowing prostate cancer growth.  I checked the package insert and
also did a quick google search and came up empty.  If it is something your
oncologist told you, I would be interested where he got the data from.

Dr. Sancha if you are reading this, please comment.  Thanks...Pete

> My urologist, after two years, increased my dose of Flomax (an alpha
> blocker) from 0.4 to 0.8 mg, in an effort to improve my BPH symptoms,
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> http://www.ljblgb.com/index.htm
> Lawrence J. Bookbinder
Temujin - 05 Jun 2006 20:21 GMT
There have been reports here and elsewhere of good results with
Proscar/Avodart.  However, beware the possible side effects.  In my
case, they included loss of libido, poor erections, greatly reduced
semen flow (possible retro?), and a general feeling of being drugged
(and not in a good way).  I pretty much had to force myself to have sex
every once in a while, and when I did, it hardly seemed worth the
bother.  I put up with this for about 4 months, in hopes of BPH symptom
relief, of which there was none.  I finally decided I didn't care if
there was any eventual BPH relief or not - it wasn't worth it.  Others
have reported the development of man-boobs.  There have also been
unsubstantiated reports that the side effects are irreversible on
discontinuance.  In my case it took several months, but things seem
back to normal (normal for an old man).  All this is not necessarily to
discourage you from trying Proscar, but if you do have side effects
(and not all men do), I don't think I'd take the risk of continuing.
Unknown@InvalidISP.gov - 06 Jun 2006 07:09 GMT
>There have been reports here and elsewhere of good results with
>Proscar/Avodart.  However, beware the possible side effects.  In my
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>discourage you from trying Proscar, but if you do have side effects
>(and not all men do), I don't think I'd take the risk of continuing.

Did you (or your urologist) consider taking Arimidex or similar at the
same time? Did he check your estradiol levels while you were on
Proscar/Avodart?

The rationale goes like this: The testes (and adrenals via DHEA)
produce testosterone of which some is bound to SHBG, some loosely
bound to albumin, some is converted via aromatase to estrogen
(probably estradiol but I'm not certain of the type of estrogen), some
is converted via 5-alpha-reductase to DHT, and lastly there's a little
left over which is "free". If you stop the aromatase function via
di-indol-methane (DIM) or Arimidex or one of the other popular (to the
breast cancer crowd) estrogen blockers you'll see a huge rise in DHT.
I can personally attest to this. My DHT jumped to nearly 200% of the
upper bound of the DHT reference range while using DIM. The question I
don't know (but it sounds logical) is whether suppression of the
reductase function (via Proscar/Avodart) leads to a corresponding rise
in the estrogens.

Man-boobs (quaint but useful term), lack of libido, poor erections,
low level of semen, etc, are all symptoms of excess estrogen. Kill it
off (with DIM or the more powerful anti-estrogens) and (presumably)
the excess T will end up in the free category. You could actually
return to the sexual prowess of a teenager <g>.
 
wlsn2@verizon.net - 20 Jun 2006 01:49 GMT
I just received a letter from the Linus Pauling Institute. They
mentioned to be carefull when taking DIM or I3C.  It has worsened some
animals that already had certain kinds of cancerous tumors.!!

> >There have been reports here and elsewhere of good results with
> >Proscar/Avodart.  However, beware the possible side effects.  In my
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
> the excess T will end up in the free category. You could actually
> return to the sexual prowess of a teenager <g>.
 
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