hi pete - sorry,  i miss the original post and only got in on the end of
this one.

i did some different search engines research and couldn't find anything
on a dr. larry von.  the only thing close was a person who was a
mechanical engineer and there was nothing in any research studies with
his name on it that he claimed.

as to the proscar discussion.  it was really kicked around fairly well
with all kinds of documentation, but the bottom line really is this.  it
seems that the drug does a great job for the most part.   but when it
comes to prostate cancer and proscar, it they don't know if it mask the
cancer or what - but it's only the really aggressive gleason scores that
appear when a person gets pca.  so, if a person is taking proscar, and
if they were to be dx'ed with pca later in life while still on the drug,
the chances are it will be a more aggressive prostate cancer.  but the
studies don't have any explanation for that.

here is a really big study - 19,000 men - on proscar that will help
explain what's happening.

~ curtis

============

Proscar May Help Prevent Prostate Cancer, But There Are Side Effects

By Daniel DeNoon
By Charlotte Grayson, MD

June 24, 2003 -- A huge clinical trial shows that a drug called Proscar
can also prevent or delay prostate cancer. It also shows that the drug
may increase the risk of aggressive, high-grade prostate tumors. And
while men taking Proscar have fewer urinary problems, they also have
more sexual problems.

Confused? Here are the answers to some FAQs.

Why Would a Healthy Man Worry About Prostate Cancer?

After skin cancer, prostate cancer is the most common cancer in U.S.
men. A man's lifetime risk of getting prostate cancer is 16.7%. But
prostate cancer grows very slowly. In fact, many men who have prostate
cancer never know about it and usually die from something other than the
cancer. That's why a man's lifetime risk of dying from prostate cancer
is much lower: 3.6%.

Currently, the best way to prevent prostate cancer is early detection.
That's why most doctors advise men older than 50 to have annual digital
rectal exams and PSA tests, which are blood tests that look at a
substance released by the prostate. Doctors advise men who are at high
risk for the cancer -- particularly black men -- to begin screening at
age 40.

What is Proscar?

Proscar is a drug approved by the FDA to treat symptoms of enlarged
prostate -- a condition known as benign prostatic hyperplasia or BPH.
The drug shrinks the prostate, improves urine flow, and cuts the risk of
BPH surgery.
Proscar works by keeping a man's body from turning the male hormone
testosterone into its most potent form, dihydrotestosterone or DHT.

Why Might Proscar Reduce Prostate Cancer Risk?

Male sex hormones speed the growth of prostate tumors. Proscar inhibits
the most potent form of testosterone.

What Was the Study?

It's called the Prostate Cancer Prevention Trial or PCPT. The study
looked at whether giving Proscar to normal, healthy men age 55 and older
could cut their risk of prostate cancer.
The study enrolled nearly 19,000 men. Nearly a third were age 55-60,
nearly a third were 61-65, and a little more than a third were older
than 65. All had normal PSA levels and normal findings from digital
rectal exams.
Half the men received daily 5 mg doses of Proscar. The other half got an
identical-looking placebo pill.
The study was supposed to last until all of the men had been treated for
seven years. It was stopped early -- although most of the men had
finished seven years of treatment -- because men getting Proscar had
fewer prostate cancers.
All men with abnormal digital rectal exams or elevated PSA levels had a
prostate biopsy. At the end of the study, all men were asked to undergo
prostate biopsy.

What Did the Study Show?

There was good news for men in the PCPT who took Proscar:

Proscar cut the risk of prostate cancer by 25%.
Proscar cut the risk of urinary problems.
Proscar reduced the risk of having an enlarged prostate (BPH).

But there was also bad news for men in the PCPT who took Proscar:
They had more problems with sexual function -- including erectile
dysfunction and loss of libido.

While their overall risk of prostate cancer was lower, they had an
increased risk of high-grade, aggressive prostate cancer.

Were There Any Problems with the Study?

Overall, nearly 25% of the men receiving placebo in the PCPT were found
to have prostate cancer. That's four times as much cancer as most
experts would expect in the general population. Thus it's possible that
many of the cancers prevented by Proscar are low-grade cancer that
wouldn't be a problem for many years, if ever.
It's going to be important to see what happens to the men in the PCPT.
Follow-up studies are underway.
Should I Take Proscar To Prevent Prostate Cancer?
There's no easy answer. If you're worried about prostate cancer, you
should talk about it with your doctor.
Peter T. Scardino, MD, chief of urology at New York's Memorial
Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center, spoke with WebMD reporter Salynn Boyles
about the PCPT study.
"It certainly does not seem prudent at this point to tell tens of
thousands of men that they should take this drug," Scardino tells WebMD.
Other doctors may have other opinions. Some men with risk factors for
prostate cancer may wish to ask their doctors about taking Proscar to
prevent prostate cancer.

Should I Stop Taking Proscar for Relief of Urinary Symptoms?

"Probably not," Scardino writes in the New England Journal of Medicine.
Just be sure to get regular digital rectal exams and PSA tests.

What About Propecia?

Propecia is another brand name for finasteride, the main ingredient in
Proscar. It's used to prevent male pattern baldness. The PCPT study
looked at a 5 mg dose of finasteride. Propecia is a 1 mg dose. It's not
known whether the lower dose has the same effects.

SOURCES: WebMD Health, "Drug Prevents Prostate Cancer." The New England
Journal of Medicine, July 17, 2003. National Institutes of Health, news
release and fact sheet on PCPT, June 24, 2003.

knowledge is power - growing old is mandatory - growing wise is optional    
"Many more men die with prostate cancer than of it. Growing old is
invariably fatal. Prostate cancer is only sometimes so."
http://community.webtv.net/PALMER_ENT/doc

Pete, as you requested, I followed up your e-mail to Karen concerning
Beta Sitosterol. I just posed it as a new question, rather than
mention you, and get her all pissed off. (-8

My Question:
"I note that you recommend against the use of  Beta Sitosterol in
connection with prostate health as it is known to "encourage the
growth of prostate cancer cells". This concerns me since I take Saw
Palmetto. It is my understanding that the active ingredient in Saw
Palmetto is Beta Sitosterol. Do you also recommend against the use of
Saw Palmetto? Can you cite any studies which show a connection between
Beta Sitosterol and the growth of prostate cancer cells?"

Her Reply:
"This is the second question I've had on this. The component in
Cinnamon is in a different chemical make up than that in Saw Palmetto.
Remember, we're not extracting one chemical. You must look at the herb
as a whole. Cinnamon is not recommended for people with Prostate
cancer. Saw Palmetto is often recommended for prostate problems, so
evidently the chemical, though it is present in both herbs, does not
present an issue with Saw Palmetto."

You will note that nowhere in my question did I refer to "cinnamon". I
guess you can draw your own conclusions about the value that I would
place on her advice. (-8

BTW, I visited a urologist today.  I haven't seen one since I had a
biopsy about four years ago, so it was about time. He had no problem
with me taking Beta Sitosterol and Saw Palmetto, so I'll probably
continue. I explained the relief I'd experienced with Ibuprofen, and
he wasn't surprised. The mechanism, in my case, is not so much an
enlarged prostate (89cc), but rather an age related hormone imbalance
that causes younger men to produce less urine while asleep, or in my
case, more urine. NSAIDs counteract this effect. He recommended two
aspirin at bed time, and if that didn't work, either go to three, or
switch back to Ibuprofen, and taper off the dose until I get to the
minimum dose that's effective.

Jeff