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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate BPH / December 2005

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A Warning Re: Ibuprofen

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El Castor - 18 Dec 2005 20:56 GMT
I recently started a thread in which I reported that Ibuprofen had
been very helpful in getting me through the night without multiple
trips to the bathroom. Unfortunately, I discovered this morning that
the FDA issued a warning last April against long term use of Ibuprofen
-- in part because of a recent study connecting long term use of
NSAIDS with significantly increased risk of cardiovascular disease.

For those who might have been inspired by my story to start popping
ibuprofen, sorry, but it's apparently not a good idea, except for
occasional use. )-8

"The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has issued supplemental
request letters to sponsors of all non-steroidal anti-inflammatory
drugs (NSAID) requesting that they make labeling changes to their
products. These letters include recommended proposed labeling for both
the prescription and over-the-counter (OTC) NSAIDs and a medication
guide for the entire class of prescription products. All sponsors of
marketed prescription Non-Steroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drugs (NSAIDs),
including Celebrex (celecoxib), a COX-2 selective NSAID, have been
asked to revise the labeling (package insert) for their products to
include a boxed warning, highlighting the potential for increased risk
of cardiovascular (CV) events and the well described, serious,
potential life-threatening gastrointestinal (GI) bleeding associated
with their use. The Celebrex labeling will, in addition to the general
labeling that will apply to all NSAIDs, also contain safety data from
long-term treatment trials with celecoxib.

Manufacturers of non-prescription (over-the-counter) NSAIDs are being
asked to revise their labeling to provide more specific information
about the potential CV and GI risks of their individual products and
remind patients of the limited dose and duration of treatment of these
products in accordance with the package instructions."
http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/infopage/COX2/default.htm

Jeff
Pete - 18 Dec 2005 21:20 GMT
For all...I have pasted what I already wrote regarding this in the other
thread, so it wouldn't get lost in the sauce.  Here it is:

Jeff you may be panicking too easily.  The stomach threat has always been
there like I have said, and the CV stuff was all over the TV shortly after
the VIOXX crap (how did you miss it ).  If you are only taking it once a
day (at night, and can get improvement from 400 or 600mgs) and it helps you,
I would think twice.  People have been taking NSAIDS for ages and now all of
a sudden there is the CV alert, which will take them years to prove by any
kind of controlled studies (warnings and suppositions can be cheap, and the
drug companies will always try to bias things in their favor).  But I
certainly respect your cautiousness and concern.  Bottom line is nothing you
take that is man made or synthesized is free of all risks (and that can also
apply to natural stuff too)....Pete

> I recently started a thread in which I reported that Ibuprofen had
> been very helpful in getting me through the night without multiple
[quoted text clipped - 31 lines]
>
> Jeff
Pete - 18 Dec 2005 23:35 GMT
Sorry about the smiley coming out as an attachment (I guess because it was
pasted into my post).  I didn't know OE did that (could be because of the OE
quote fix I use).  Hmmm.  I'll have to check it out...Pete
El Castor - 19 Dec 2005 01:36 GMT
>For all...I have pasted what I already wrote regarding this in the other
>thread, so it wouldn't get lost in the sauce.  Here it is:
>
>Jeff you may be panicking too easily.  The stomach threat has always been
>there like I have said, and the CV stuff was all over the TV shortly after
>the VIOXX crap (how did you miss it ).

Somehow I missed it. )-8

I guess I would feel pretty bad if someone had a stroke because of
something I said. Most of my UseNet posts are political and designed
to induce immediate strokes -- not the kind that sneak up on you a
year later.

Here is a little more on the subject.  It's from a holistic web site
and seems designed to induce immediate panic, so I take it with a
grain of salt, nevertheless ....

"The Food and Drug Administration has recently made the decision to
warn against the long-term use of all painkiller drugs; this study
involving smokers is the first evidence to support that warning.
(Doctors wanted to find out whether NSAIDS could prevent oral cancer
because previous work suggested they helped fend off other types of
cancer.)
Surveying some 900 patients who were smokers and more prone to cancer
and heart problems, researchers discovered that those who took OTC
painkillers for a minimum of six months doubled their chances of dying
from:
   * Stroke
   * Heart attack
   * Other heart-related problems
The risk, however, was highest among ibuprofen users, who were nearly
three times more likely to die of cardiovascular disease than
non-NSAID users."
Seattle Post Intelligencer April 18, 2005"  
http://www.mercola.com/2005/may/4/painkillers.htm

It's hard to know what to think. In perusing the Internet I came on an
article that cited a study which found that ibuprofen reduced the
incidence of breast cancer by up to 50%, and another that showed an
increased risk. (-8

Jeff
 

>If you are only taking it once a
>day (at night, and can get improvement from 400 or 600mgs) and it helps you,
[quoted text clipped - 41 lines]
>>
>> Jeff
Pete - 19 Dec 2005 21:14 GMT
>> For all...I have pasted what I already wrote regarding this in the
>> other thread, so it wouldn't get lost in the sauce.  Here it is:
[quoted text clipped - 37 lines]
> incidence of breast cancer by up to 50%, and another that showed an
> increased risk. (-8

Jeff...That's why they say you should ask your doctor - but that is bullshit
to (no disrespect to our kind and caring, and extremely knowledgeable Dr.
Sancha).  There is no way any one person can even come close to knowing the
*vast* amount of data available on searching the Internet (and not even the
specialist or sub specialist).  Like I said my uro didn't even know what a
PVP was.  Dr. Sancha was very polite in trying to explain that, but I think
every uro on the planet should know what a PVP is, even though he doesn't do
them.  They have been doing them for 7 or 8 years now I believe.

And then (like I always say, and I hate it), if we do read something and ask
our doctors about it we risk them getting pissed, and tossing you out.  We
have every right to study our diseases, and that is published in many
medical publishing's (can't think of the word I want).  But IMO most doctors
(way more than half) will get pissed at you if you sound like you know too
much, or if you give them any kind of indication that you may be questioning
them, no matter how diplomatic you try to be.  I could give you many
examples.

Here is one example (and I hope Dr. Sancha will respond).  Say your doctor
tells you something that you *know* is wrong, or he just may be misinformed
about.  And you have read a documented study or whatever that proves this
(or let's be polite and say it may re-inform him).  How the hell are you
supposed to tell him that without losing him.  He can say a number of things
like "if you don't have faith in my judgments, I suggest you find another
doctor" or "if you are going to doubt me or question my diagnoses you can
find another doctor" (I could keep going and reword it ten more ways).  So
what the hell is the patient supposed to do.  Because as soon as you say
that you read or saw something different (no matter how diplomatic you may
try to be), chances are he is going to going to feel offended.  And if he
dismisses you he will probably say something like "if you are going to
diagnose yourself, etc,etc, why did you come to me".  If it gets to that
point you are probably gone even if you try to apologize.  This is tough
stuff.

I think it is generally okay these days (because of all the friggin TV ads
by the drug companies which are so damn misleading and bias it's ridiculous)
to tell your doctor you saw "such and such" on TV  and "could I try it".  He
may not know what it is and certainly not have any experience with it, if it
is new, and at best he will only know what the sales rep from the drug
company pitched to him when they left the samples off at his office, and I
doubt if many of the doctors even read the package inserts or even know all
the different strengths etc.  That last part pisses me off.  If I read all
the package inserts for a drug I'm taking, I would like to think that the
doc who prescribed it to me at least read it once in his life - even though
the drug may be discontinued - lol .

But getting into details about studies you have done on your disease or
condition can be difficult at best.  And the more you tell them, the more
trouble you get in (like including bad relationships with other doctors when
explaining your history).  And my problem is I am too honest, and want to
tell them everything so they might have a better understanding of my
problem, but most of the time it is going in one ear and out the other
anyway (doc is not writing, and he may look disinterested or yawn, etc -
hell they may even start closing their eyes), so they can quickly get to the
next patient.

I have been to many bad doctors in my life, so if I sound negative, it is
because of what they have done to me.  Dr. Sancha is a good doctor, but
there are many who just treat us like a chart, and don't even know who they
are talking to (ie "next" - as in next patient).

Anyway, we should never stop studying our diseases, maladies, conditions.
But we certainly do have to be careful that what we read comes from a
credible and reputable source.  Sorry for getting carried away again.  I got
to go soak - lol .

Pete

> Jeff
>
[quoted text clipped - 47 lines]
>>>
>>> Jeff
 
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