So, I went ahead and had the Prolieve TUMT procedure yesterday. I thought I
would post my experience and status after 24 hours.
I was given a Rx for one Celevrex 400 mg to be taken the night before. Since
this is a pretty strong NSAID this should have clued me in that pain was in
my future. I didn't know if it was during or after the procedure that this
would come into play.
I was also given an Rx for one Ditropan XL 10mg to be taken the night before.
This was supposed to relax the bladder and prevent spasms. See later about
how well this didn't work.
I was also given an Rx for 10 Macrobid(Nitrofurantin) which is a porweful
antibiotic that targets urinary tract infections. I would normally have
gotten Cipro or Levaquin but I am highly allergic to both and have had
devastating reactions in the past.
I was also instructed to take two Fleet enemas the night before. (Why the
night before and not the morning of??)
I was given an R for one Ativan (lorazepam) to be taken one hour before the
procedure to allow me to relax. It seemed to have the reverse effect. I was
more alert and agitated withing 30 minutes of downing this drug.
I arrived at the doctor's office at 7:45 AM and was told to empty my bladder.
I was ushered into an examining room and told to strip from the waist down.
The nurse did not leave the room for my striptease which seemed a little
unusual. I have learned that modesty is not particularly helpful when
visiting urologists or proctologists so I am pretty much "over it!".
The nurse had be lie down on my back and draped a cover over my abdominal
area. She pulled my penis through a slit in the drape and while holding it
in a death grip with one hand, buried the tip of a syringe (no needle) in my
meatus with the other hand. She proceeded to force the contents of the
syringe (anesthetic gel) into my penus. OUCH!! My yelp was ignored and she
continued on her quest. My penis responded with a moderate erection. I
guess he just wanted to show that erectile capability still existed. The
nurse seemed unimpressed by my display and promptly finished then placed a
medical device that only be described as a spring clothes pin just behind my
glans. OUCH OUCH!! She asked this time if it was uncomfortble and I assured
her it was. She adjusted the pressure somehow and it deep seem to get better.
By this time, the tumescence was gone (I hoped this would not be my last hard
on!) She then left me to wait while the anesthetic took effect and also for
the urologist to arrive.
My urologist, a locally (Orlando, FL) respected young surgeon, arrived about
ten minutes later and began the procedure. I was asked to roll onto my left
side and pull my knees up to my chest. He then did a quick DRE probably to
lube things up and then thrust a probe into my rectum. OUCH! Once the
larger part of the probe passed through the sphincter and was seated, it went
from hurt to discomfort. I returned to the supine position and the probe was
adjusted. I had been concerned about the rectal probe but it turned out to
be the least troublesome part of the whole procedure.
Next, a catheter was thrust into my penis. OUCH OUCH OUCH! Especially when
he got to the prostate. I tried some deep breathing and got past this stage.
Next he told me to expect some pressure as the two balloons on the catheter
were inflated. The first, inside the bladder, was to secure the catheter.
It gave me an intense need to urinate. Next he inflated the balloon in the
prostate. This balloon is used to dilate the prostatic urethra. OUCH OUCH.
It created a strange feeling in my entire groin and an intense need to
defecate. I tried to relax. HAH!
At this point, I was ready to start the procedure where the prostate would be
cooked for 45 minutes. The uro checked the readings on what appeared to be a
laptop computer, asked me how I was doing and then left the room. I was
shocked. I expected someone to at least stay in the room with me. I was
hoping that they would be a scream away if I needed them.
A warm then hot feeling moved through my groin. My meatus began to burn
(reminiscent of an acute urinary infection). I turned on my music (New Age
soothing strains of cello, flute and piano) and tried to mentally go
somewhere else. It was no use.
A few minutes later, the nurse came back and asked how I was doing. I told
her about the burning (that's expected) I also told her that I felt like I
had a very full bladder and needed to urinate but couldn't. This was
becoming pain, not discomfort. She told me that my bladder was in spasm and
I needed to try to relax. A knuckle sandwich to her left jaw would have made
me feel a lot better but she was in control so I passed. I asked her how
much longer I had to go and she could not tell me. It seems the monitor
showed how far into the procedure you were but not the remanining time.
Apparently she had failed subtraction when she was getting her license. I
asked where the doctor was? She said she would get him.
About five minutes later (time was moveing at the speed of the last minutes
of the NBA playoffs) the doctor returned and announced that everything was
going as planned. My numbers were good. He apparently was good at math and
was able to tell me that I hade 39 minutes left. I immediately consulted my
watch and planned the end of the event. I told him about the pain and he
said that he could give me pills to reduce the spasms. Because I have had so
many bad reactions to medications, I declined (I must have been crazy!)
Left alone again, the spasms got worse. I tried an old technique learned
during my wife's LaMaze classes to concentrate on a focus point and
temporarily leave my body. There exactly two hundred and twelve tiny holes
in the speaker on the ceiling of my doctor's examination room. I know, I
counted them three times just to be sure. The pain got worse and I started
yelling for someone. The doctor came in somewhat surprised that I was
unhappy. I begged for the pills. He left for a few monments and returned
with a tiny pill that I placed under my tongue. My mouth was so dry at this
point that it would not dissolve. I ask for some water but was told that was
not a good idea. I worked up some saliva to try to get this pill working.
The doctor also confirmed that I was doing well (at least according to the
Prolieve machine) and had just over 20 minutes to go. Oh boy, I'm past the
half way point.
The pill may have worked or it may have been the distraction because the pain
subsided to a managable discomfort. For w while. The pill was gone now and
I was starting to have unmanageable discomfort. The nurse returned and I
asked for another pill. She was unsure if I could have a second. I told her
I could. The doctor returned and said that I only had 8 minutes to go and he
didn't think I would benefit from a secong pill. I assured him that I would.
He gave it to me and I worked it around under my tongue until it too was gone.
I counted the seconds and consulted my watch regularly.
Just when I deciced it should all be over, the sound coming from the machine
changed. A nurse (not the original one) can it and started typing into the
keyboard. I made a comment about being glad that was all over and she
informed that I was far from done. I told her this is impossible as I was
timing it. She refused to tell me anymore but left. The original nurse
returned and informed me that the procedure was over however there was a five
minute cool-down. At this point I lost it. I had managed the 45 minutes and
now all my reserve was gone. The pain from the spasms was getting worse. I
tried to sit up a bit and my whole groin area clenched. It almost sent me
flying off the table. The nurse was not the least sympathetic and told me to
lie still or there would be problems. I told her I was having pain and she
told me I wasn't. I reassured her that the spasms were getting worse and she
assured me that without the heat, there can be no spasms. I either convinced
her or the cool-down time was over because she started to dissemble the
apparatus. I felt the prostate balloon relax and it felt wonderful. Next the
bladder balloon was deflated without relieving the pain. Next she asked me
to lift my kness and in a very masochistic manner yanked out the rectal probe
OUCH OUCH! Next my bladder started feeling really full. She informed me
that she was filling my bladder with water. OUCH! Like there wasn't already
enough going on in there. Finally, without warning, she pulled out the
catheter OUCH OUCH OUCH. It was worse coming out than going in. I felt a
rush and a very warm sensation and got my revenge. I pissed all over the
nurse, the equipment and the bed on which I was laying. I could have stopped
but chose not to. It felt so damn good to just let it go.
The nurse told me I was done and gave me some drapes to dry myself. I was
told to dress and return to the consultation area. I did so and she was
still cleaning up as I left the room. I stopped at the rest room and had a
wonderful pee.
That's my story. None of the drugs seemed to do what they were intended to
do. The manufacturer (Boston Scientific) is full of sh.t when they advertise
mild discomfort. There is pain, not unbearable, but pain just the same. It
is the duration of the discomfort/pain that is the hardest to deal with.
I went home without a catheter. This is a big plus and the only positive for
the procedure. I was forcing liquids and urinating about every half hour.
My wife and I went out for a nice lunch then I reported back for a bladder
scan. After emptying my bladder, my residual was 30 cc. My penis burns when
I urinate and I have a little pink tinge. I also have a few droplets of
blood after my stream ends. I have a burning/irritated feeling deep in my
rectum that could actually be the prostate. Otherwise, I am doing fine. It
will take several weeks to see if the procedure resolved my problems.
I am tempted to say that it was all worth it since I am doing so well today.
However, I promised myself yesterday that I would remember the pain and opt
out of any further procedures that do not involve anesthesia. I return to
the uro in one month (barring any problems) and I plan to inform him that he
undersold this procedure.
The manufacturer claims that many men bring a book to read during the
procedure. Unless it is self-hypnosis, there is no way I could have read,
My eyes were pinched shut much of the time. My relaxing music was no help.
I may change my mind later. But if I had known what I was getting into, I
would have opted out. I went to the uro in the first place for the
Greenlight PVP and he talked me down to TUMT. He claimed it was easier on
the patient not to have to endure a general anesthetic. I disagree. Being
awake was no benefit. I recently underwent a colonoscopy and traditional
hemorrhoidectomy, both under general anesthesia, without incident.
I will post any new developments for those considering Prolieve or any TUMT
procedure.
>I am scheduled for a Prolieve TUMT procedure next week and would appreciate
>hearing from anyone who has undergone this process. It differs from other
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>for anxiety. One pill is not about to calm me enough. Any other options. I
>am considering skipping the Ativan and consulting with Dr. Smirnoff instead.

Signature
Ron M
Gene F. Rhodes - 14 Jul 2005 00:33 GMT
If some doctor tries to talk me into a TUMT after reading this,
I'll tell him to take his TUMT and suppositate it :-)
Gene
> So, I went ahead and had the Prolieve TUMT procedure yesterday. I thought I
> would post my experience and status after 24 hours.
[quoted text clipped - 187 lines]
> --
> Ron M
Rich256 - 14 Jul 2005 02:41 GMT
> If some doctor tries to talk me into a TUMT after reading this,
> I'll tell him to take his TUMT and suppositate it :-)
> Gene
There may be one thing about TUMT that is better. No general or spinal
anesthesia. That can be a "killer". That I expect is the reason PVP is
done in a hospital whereas TUMT is usually in the Doctors office.
Ron M - 14 Jul 2005 14:29 GMT
I agree wholeheartedly. The three good things about the procedure are no
hospital/clinic, no general/spinal anesthesia and no catheter. If it
improves my condition and gets me off Flomax then I may rescind my objections.
At the moment things are fine and the pain is fading in my memory. Mother
Nature helps us in this way or there would be few two-child families.
I just want men to know that the advertising was misleading, at least in my
case. Clinical trials did report that 5% of men reported "Moderate or Severe
Intraprocedural Discomfort" (a.k.a. PAIN!) Others may be lucky and have no
problem. To the unlucky 5% there is 100% PAIN. Knowledge is power.
>> If some doctor tries to talk me into a TUMT after reading this,
>> I'll tell him to take his TUMT and suppositate it :-)
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>anesthesia. That can be a "killer". That I expect is the reason PVP is
>done in a hospital whereas TUMT is usually in the Doctors office.

Signature
Ron M.
Rich256 - 14 Jul 2005 16:43 GMT
A few acquaintances died from anesthesia. One a young boy having a tooth
removed. A low probability but it does happen. You get to pick the doctor
doing the procedure but usually not the anestheist. Someone died near here
a while ago when the anestheist fell asleep during the operation!!
I had Targis TUMT in March. The doctor suggested I try it before PVP. I
had switched to this doctor because my previous one did not do PVP/. One at
his group told me that PVP was about the same as TURP!! After hearing about
the problems from friends who had TURP and having followed the threads about
PVP, on this group that statement really turned me off. I realize now why
they do not do PVP. The hospital they use has not pruchased the PVP
equipment.
I had all intentions of asking for PVP. The doctor had done 30 PVP and said
they were all successful but suggested I try TUMT first as PVP can always be
done. So I went along with his suggestion.
My experiences were somewhat similar as yours but not as severe. I did make
a comment to my wife about "The little house of Horrors". A female
technician did most of the procedure. Said that she had done 500 of them.
Fortunately the night before she called and told me in great detail what I
might expect along the way and explained that there would be pain.
Fortunately some of them such as spasms did not happen.
I forget what the medications were but I did take one Fleet enema two hours
before the procedure. That I think was so the doctore could use probe in
the rectum. That was the most uncomfortable part of the procedure for me.
It was used to inject a pain killer into the prostate. The insertion and
removal of the catheters and devices of course where short piercing pains
but less than pulling a tooth.
They had me wear a catheter for five days, over a weekend. It was somewhat
uncomfortable but one really nice part was that I had a full nights sleep
every night.
Prior to the procedure I was on Flomax (and had dizzy spells from it) and
still getting up every hour at night. Now I go anywhere from two to four
hours and have even slept an entire night. I would say that two to three is
avearge but not really bad as I have other things that seem to wake me. I
am 75 years old so this might do me for life!! I am relatively healthy so
wanted to do something now. My 97 year old father in law really needs
something but because of his age they don't want to even try Flomax. He
already gets dizzy spells. A URO did suggest that he might consider TUMT.
Bottom line is don't belive the "Done in the confort of the Doctors office"
or that some patients read during the procedure. I go in for a flow test in
a couple weeks. Then will decide if it was really successful. If things
could stay the way they are I am satisified.
> I agree wholeheartedly. The three good things about the procedure are no
> hospital/clinic, no general/spinal anesthesia and no catheter. If it
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> >anesthesia. That can be a "killer". That I expect is the reason PVP is
> >done in a hospital whereas TUMT is usually in the Doctors office.
Al - 14 Jul 2005 04:10 GMT
In my opinion, it is inexcusable to not have a trained operator in
attendance every second that the machine is on. There is no machine
ever made that can't break or malfunction.
The uro checked the readings on what appeared to be a
> laptop computer, asked me how I was doing and then left the room. I was
> shocked. I expected someone to at least stay in the room with me. I was
> hoping that they would be a scream away if I needed them.
Chockman - 15 Jul 2005 03:09 GMT
Ron M...
I am appalled that you would be left alone during this Prolieve
procedure. When I had my Prostatron TUMT July 2, 04, the URO, the
nurse, the technician and an URO resident were present during the entire
procedure once the procedure had begun. I certainly had discomfort but
nothing like you describe. Had I experienced what you experienced in
being left alone with the machine operating, I would have been more than
a little perturbed!!! Unfortunately, my TUMT only accomplished half of
the job and I ended up with a PVP 2/23/05.
> So, I went ahead and had the Prolieve TUMT procedure yesterday. I thought I
> would post my experience and status after 24 hours.
[quoted text clipped - 184 lines]
>>for anxiety. One pill is not about to calm me enough. Any other options. I
>>am considering skipping the Ativan and consulting with Dr. Smirnoff instead.
48 hours post Prolieve TUMT
Two days later and I am doing extremely well. Since most postings reflect
bad outcomes, I felt I had to add my status.
I have a good stream and no blood upon urinating. I can go a fairly long
time between voids but when I finally have to go, it is with great urgrncy.
This is mentioned in the literature and is expected during the first few
days/weeks.
I couldn't resist the "big test" and even though I did not have the uro's go
ahead to resume sex, I was able to raise and maintain a full erection.
Apparently the TUMT has not affected this most important manly function. I
also had a normal ejaculation with real semen although it was tinged yellow
and very viscous. After being on Flomax for year, I had a reduction in the
ejaculate and that continues. At least it is not completely dry. I was very
worried about retrograde ejaculation although I had been told that it does
not diminish pleasure.
I do have one remaining effect that persists. My rectum continues to
burn/hurt during defecation and at other times. At the moment I am writing
this off to irritation caused by the rectal probe/temperature gauge used
during the TUMT. If it does not improve within a few days, I will be heading
back to the uro or proctologist.
Would I do this again or suggest it to others? NOT YET.
I have to see what the long term gains are when I stop the Flomax (not for at
least four weeks).
If you are considering Prolieve TUMT I would advise you that there is PAIN
not just DISCOMFORT. In my case it varied from quite bearable to somewhat
unbearable (yes, there were tears toward the end). If the outcome is good
and lasting then maybe it is worth one hour of suffering. I will admit that
after walking out of the office, I felt fine which would not have been the
case if general or spinal anesthesia had been involved.
My only hope is that doctors would be more honest with their patients up
front about the DISCOMFORT! Also, they could offer additional analgesia
before and during the procedure. Even a little more compassion would go a
long way.
>I am scheduled for a Prolieve TUMT procedure next week and would appreciate
>hearing from anyone who has undergone this process. It differs from other
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>for anxiety. One pill is not about to calm me enough. Any other options. I
>am considering skipping the Ativan and consulting with Dr. Smirnoff instead.

Signature
Ron M.
So, I am just shy of two months since "enduring" the Prolieve TUMT and I am
declaring it a complete FAILURE!
My stream is worse than before I started and I am up two to three times a
night. My Uro suggested that I am drinking too many fluids and should cut
way back to perhaps three glasses a day (He claimed this is his consumption).
I calculated I was consuming about 100 oz of liquid (mostly water) per day so
I gradually cut back especially afer dinner. I ended up with really strong
urine and constipation. I am back up to 70-80 oz per day.
I had an episode at about five weeks were I was retaining urine. On one
visit the scanner measured 570cc in my bladder after voiding. I was taught
to self-catheterize (OUCH at first but now I think every guy should learn to
do this). When they catheterized me in the office (OUCH! OUCH! OUCH!) ,
they got 575cc and a lot of blood. I was supposed to do it myself four times
a day. The first and second time I got only 40cc and more blood so I cut it
to once a night. I think I had some sort of blockage and the initial
catheterization broke through it. After the third time there was no blood,
very little residual urine and only mild discomfort when passing through the
prostate.
I have stopped my FLOMAX because of the undesireable side effects. My sinus
headaches have stopped, my eyesight has improved, my "fuzziness" is gone and
the backache is also. My BPH symptoms are unmitigated.
At my last visit I was encouraged to "keep the faith" and I would see
improvement. I tried to broach the subject of Greenlight PVP but my uro was
unwilling to discuss it. When I return in November, I plan to request my
records so I can seek a more supportive physician. I am lucky to be in an
area where several practices perform PVP.