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Medical Forum / General / Nutrition / March 2007Latest example of the foolish "saturated fat is bad" mantra.
>From a recent report: Researchers " examined animals infused with unsaturated oils and found that they became insulin resistant without any rise in ceramide..." That is consistent with the molecular-level evidence. But then: "The team also found that infusion of lard oil, a saturated fat, caused the mice to become less responsive to insulin..." Lard is about 40% saturated these days. It is not a "saturated fat" to anyone who possesses basic common sense. Why did they refrain from using fresh coconut oil,which is about 92% saturated fatty acids? If they had, they could make a much stronger case for the claim that "saturated fat" causes insulin resistance. There is no insulin resistance on native peoples who have stayed on their native diets, which are very rich in coconut. The WHO statistics are there for everyone to see, including this ignorant "team" of researchers. Ironically, the title of this report is "Stress-signaling Fat Is A Culprit Behind Insulin Resistance." The problem is that saturated fatty acids do not "signal," but need to be changed by the body into molecules capable of signaling (such as the Mead acid, which is polyunsaturated) if the person is on a fat free diet for a certain period of time. Their claim is a scientific impossibility. However, due to the "loose" nutritional language, they are able to convince themselves of clearly false notions. Source for the quoted passages in the post above: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/03/070307075807.htm Correction: "native peoples" should be "certain native peoples." On Mar 7, 11:11 pm, monty1...@lycos.com wrote: > Researchers " examined animals infused with unsaturated oils and found > that they became insulin resistant without any rise in ceramide..." > > That is consistent with the molecular-level evidence. Can you explain how unsaturated fatty acids cause insulin resistance, at the molecular level? > But then: "The > team also found that infusion of lard oil, a saturated fat, caused the > mice to become less responsive to insulin..." > > Lard is about 40% saturated these days. It is not a "saturated fat" > to anyone who possesses basic common sense. Differences due to use of lard can be attributed to the bit that's different between lard and soy oil. Since lard has over twice as much SFA and a sixth of the PUFA of soy oil, either you say it's the increased SFA to blame, or the decreased PUFA that's to blame. Given that the latter would destroy your world view, you have to choose the former. There is another reason for chooisng the former though: the starting point for synthesis of ceramide is palmitic acid - a saturated fatty acid. > Ironically, the title of this report is "Stress-signaling Fat Is A > Culprit Behind Insulin Resistance." The problem is that saturated > fatty acids do not "signal," Try reading the article. Ceramide is the stress-signalling fat the title refers to. > Their claim is a scientific impossibility. No, just your usual miscomprehension at work. > due to the "loose" nutritional language, they are able to convince > themselves of clearly false notions. You accuse others of "loose nutritional language"? The mind boggles. MattLB I've refuted these MattLB claims many times in the past. One thing I'll mention here is that lard oil is actually much more like olive oil, and so what they have demonstrated is that "monounsaturated fat" is very bad, at least potentially (depending upon factors such as antioxidant protection and cooking techniques), which is the exact opposite of the current nutritional dogma. Have you decided to take me up on my experimental offer, yet, MattLB? Or are you just doing your usual "hit and run," industry shill gig? "In adults, insulin resistance has been associated with dietary polyunsaturated fatty acids..." Source: Diabetologia. 2002 Mar;45(3):349-55. Try doing some actual research once in a while. "We discuss the concept that the two essential (not produced by the body and obtained exclusively through the diet) polyunsaturated fatty acid families-n-6 and n-3-may play a role in the pathogenesis of insulin resistance through inflammatory pathways. Linoleic acid, the major n-6 fatty acid, is metabolized into pro-inflammatory arachidonic acid..." Source: Metabolic Syndrome and Related Disorders. Jun 2004, Vol. 2, No. 2 : 124 -128. Now some argue that loading up your body with fish oil will prevent all the ill effects of arachidonic acid, whereas I avoid all major sources of PUFAs and see only benefits (for over 5 years now), though according to the nutritionists, I should have died a while back, after suffering terrible "deficiency syptoms." If MattLB thinks I am wrong, he can take me up on my offer: One group of health adult rats is fed a diet of "normal calories," with 30% fat from canola oil and fish oil, bought from a supermarket, with only basic multi-vitamin and mineral supplement. The other group is exactly the same, except with 30% coconut oil of my choice (purchased from a retailer). The coconut oil group should die much sooner. If it does not, MattLB pays for all expenses. If they do, then I will pay for all expenses. I am waiting, MattLB, for you to finally put your assets where your oral cavity is located. On Mar 8, 10:30 pm, monty1...@lycos.com wrote: > "We discuss the concept that the two essential (not produced by the > body and obtained exclusively through the diet) polyunsaturated fatty > acid families-n-6 and n-3-may play a role "May play a role" is the key phrase, I think. Not "cause", or even "may cause". It's like blaming adrenaline for causing heart attacks when under stress. > Now some argue that loading up your body with fish oil will prevent > all the ill effects of arachidonic acid, Who in particular? > sources of PUFAs and see only benefits (for over 5 years now), though > according to the nutritionists, I should have died a while back, after > suffering terrible "deficiency syptoms." If MattLB thinks I am wrong, > he can take me up on my offer: That would prove nothing about what you claim (or believe) to have done to yourself. > I am waiting, MattLB, for you to finally put your assets where your > oral cavity is located. You'll be waiting forever. The methodological and scientific flaws have been pointed out to you before, as has the fact that coconut oil is used deliberately in animal experiments to cause atherosclerosis. MattLB On Mar 8, 10:17 pm, monty1...@lycos.com wrote: > "In adults, insulin resistance has been associated with dietary > polyunsaturated fatty acids..." > > Source: Diabetologia. 2002 Mar;45(3):349-55. > > Try doing some actual research once in a while. I asked *you* to explain in molecular detail. Quoting somoene else saying it's "associated" isn't a mechanism. MattLB On Mar 8, 9:40 pm, monty1...@lycos.com wrote: > I've refuted these MattLB claims many times in the past. Which claims? Anything that could be construed as a claim was new. Try quoting what I've said so you can be more specific. > I'll mention here is that lard oil is actually much more like olive > oil, Hardly. Olive oil and soybean oil (which is what they compared to lard) have near identical SFA content. > and so what they have demonstrated is that "monounsaturated fat" > is very bad, No. To do that they would have to show that olive oil (with far more MUFA) was the worst. Since olive oil has the same PUFA as lard and the same SFA as soybean, any differences could be attributed to the increased MUFA. >at least potentially (depending upon factors such as > antioxidant protection and cooking techniques), which is the exact > opposite of the current nutritional dogma. Vague hand-waving to hide the lack of evidence. > Have you decided to take me up on my experimental offer, yet, MattLB? Of course not. > Or are you just doing your usual "hit and run," industry shill gig? Hit you with the facts and watch you run back to your gated website and bitch about me, you mean? MattLB |
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