Medical Forum / General / General / April 2006
UT professor criticized over comments about impending pandemic
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GSS - 04 Apr 2006 12:30 GMT Apr. 04, 2006 UT professor criticized over comments about impending pandemic LIZ AUSTIN Associated Press
AUSTIN - A University of Texas biology professor has been targeted by talk radio, bloggers and vitriolic e-mails - including a death threat - after a published report that he advocated death for most of the population as a means of saving the Earth.
But Eric Pianka said Monday his remarks about what he believes is an impending pandemic were taken out of context.
"What we really need to do is start thinking about controlling our population before it's too late," he said. "It's already too late, but we're not even thinking about it. We're just mindlessly rushing ahead breeding our brains out."
The public furor began when The Gazette-Enterprise of Seguin, Texas, reported Sunday on two speeches Pianka made last month to groups of scientists and students about vanishing animal habitats and the explosion of the human population.
The newspaper's Jamie Mobley attended one of those speeches and also interviewed Forrest Mims, an amateur scientist and author who heard Pianka speak early last month before the Texas Academy of Science.
After the newspaper's report appeared, it was circulated widely and posted on "The Drudge Report." It quickly became talk radio fodder.
The Gazette-Enterprise quoted Pianka as saying disease "will control the scourge of humanity. We're looking forward to a huge collapse."
Pianka said he was only trying to warn his audience that disease epidemics have happened before and will happen again if the human population growth isn't contained.
He said he believes the Earth would be better off if the human population were smaller because fewer natural resources would be consumed and humans wouldn't continue to destroy animal habitats. But he said that doesn't mean he wants most humans to die.
But Mims, chairman of the academy's environmental science section, told The Associated Press there was no mistaking Pianka's disdain for humans and desire for their elimination.
"He wishes for it. He hopes for it. He laughs about it. He jokes about it," Mims said. "It's got to happen because we are the scourge of humanity."
David Marsh, president of the Texas Academy of Science, did not return telephone and e-mail messages seeking comment. No recording or transcript of either that speech or another delivered last Friday at St. Edward's University in Austin was available for review by the AP. The Gazette-Enterprise said it reviewed a transcript of the original speech, which was provided on the condition that it not be distributed.
Allan Hook, a St. Edward's biology professor who heard both speeches, said Pianka "wasn't so perhaps adamant in his own personal views of what he thinks might happen" in his second lecture.
But Hook declined to elaborate on what Pianka said in the earlier speech, which Pianka delivered while being honored as the academy's 2006 Distinguished Texas Scientist.
University of Texas officials don't plan to take any action against Pianka, university spokesman Don Hale said.
"Dr. Pianka has First Amendment rights to express his point of view," Hale said. "We have plenty of faculty with a lot of different points of view and they have the right to express that point of view, but they're expressing their personal point of view."
ON THE NET
Prof. Eric Pianka's UT Web site, http://uts.cc.utexas.edu/varanus/eric.html
Texas Academy of Science, http://www.texasacademyofscience.org/
Seguin Gazette-Enterprise, http://www.seguingazette.com/
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donstockbauer@hotmail.com - 04 Apr 2006 12:57 GMT Cybernetic self-organization can cure so many ills.
http://pespmc1.vub.ac.be/SELFORG.html
Self-organization
Self-organization is a process where the organization (constraint, redundancy) of a system spontaneously increases, i.e. without this increase being controlled by the environment or an encompassing or otherwise external system Self-organization is a basically a process of evolution where the effect of the environment is minimal, i.e. where the development of new, complex structures takes place primarily in and through the system itself. As argued in the section on evolutionary theory, self-organization can be understood on the basis of the same variation and natural selection processes as other, environmentally driven processes of evolution. Self-organization is normally triggered by internal variation processes, which are usually called "fluctuations" or "noise". The fact that these processes produce a selective retained ordered configuration has been called the "order from noise" principle by Heinz von Foerster, and the "order through fluctuations" mechanism by Ilya Prigogine. Both are special cases of what I have proposed to call the principle of selective variety.
The increase in organization can be measured more objective as a decrease of statistical entropy (see the Principle of Asymmetric Transitions). This is again equivalent to an increase in redundancy, information or constraint: after the self-organization process there is less ambiguity about which state the system is in. A self-organizing system which also decreases its thermodynamical entropy must necessarily (because of the second law of thermodynamics) export ("dissipate") such entropy to its surroundings, as noted by von Foerster and Prigogine. Prigogine called systems which continuously export entropy in order to maintain their organization dissipative structures.
Self-organization is usually associated with more complex, non-linear phenomena, rather than with the relatively simple processes of structure maintenance of diffusion. All the intricacies (limit cycles, chaos, sensitivity to initial conditions, dissipative structuration, ...) associated with non-linearity can simply be understood through the interplay of positive and negative feedback cycles: some variations tend to reinforce themselves (see Autocatalytic Growth), others tend to reduce themselves. Both types of feedback fuel natural selection: positive feedback because it increases the number of configurations (up to the point where resources become insufficient), negative feedback because it stabilizes configurations. Either of them provides the configuration with a selective advantage over competing configurations. The interaction between them (variations can be reinforced in some directions while being reduced in others) may create intricate and unpredictable patterns (chaos), which can develop very quickly until they reach a stable configuration (attractor).
See also:
* Self-organization and complexity in the natural sciences * Links on Complexity, Self-organization and Artificial Life * F. Heylighen: The Science of Self-Organization and Adaptivity, to be published in the Encyclopedia of Life Support Systems. * F. Heylighen: "Self-Organization, Emergence and the Architecture of Complexity". * Dictionary: PRINCIPLE OF SELF-ORGANIZATION * Dictionary: SELF-ORGANIZATION * Dictionary: SELF-ORGANIZING * Dictionary: SELF-ORGANIZING SYSTEM
Copyright© 1997 Principia Cybernetica - Referencing this page
Author F. Heylighen,
Date Jan 27, 1997
Juan R. - 04 Apr 2006 13:43 GMT GSS ha escrito:
> AUSTIN - A University of Texas biology professor has been targeted by > talk radio, bloggers and vitriolic e-mails - including a death threat [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > But Eric Pianka said Monday his remarks about what he believes is an > impending pandemic were taken out of context. More information on the meeting (including curious incidence with a video camera operator), news, comments, and links to some interesting Pianka webpages (e.g. read his explanation beyond "the four horseman of the apocalypse") available from Canonical Science Today last entry
Dr. Pianka holocaust? No thanks!
[http://canonicalscience.blogspot.com/2006/04/dr-pianka-holocaust-no-thanks.html]
[snip]
--
Juan R.
Center for CANONICAL |SCIENCE)
Jonathan Kirwan - 04 Apr 2006 14:57 GMT Interesting. I only have a few thoughts. (For the other groups, I'm writing from sci.environment.)
One is that Forrest Mims is a sweet man to talk with. I had occasion to call him some years ago and he was generous with his time and didn't make me feel at all uncomfortable. As a person, I liked him a lot.
He's famous for some Radio Shack publications on electronics for hobbyists and he's been involved in amateur science. But Scientific American declined to hire him in 1990 because it found out that he had religious objections to evolution. He also disputes the facts of global warming. So his presence as chair of the Texas Academy of Science's environmental science section says a little something of the situation that the professor may have found himself in when being honored by the academy.
Mims' reported comment, "He wishes for it. He hopes for it. He laughs about it. He jokes about it," is something I wouldn't have expected from him unless he's been embittered more over the years since I spoke with him. He has no business saying what was in the professor's mind when he spoke and that's all he's doing with this comment. He simply doesn't have a right to speak for the mind of someone else. It was just cruel to say it this way.
The other comment I'd have is that we really cannot come to serious grips with our environment without dealing with population.
The growth is exponential and the world's population has more than doubled in my short lifetime. And I expect to live about as long as I already have. My grandfather didn't see a doubling in his entire life (and I've yet to live close to that long.) When we set out to conserve through recycling or improved mileage in our cars or better insulation or just less consuming, it's a small and linearized effect.
Growth rates are now 1.2%/yr; down some from what was truer most of my life (above 1.5%/yr.) I can't say where they will go, but keeping the 1.2%/yr, we have:
p(yr) = 6.5e9*(1.012)^yr
For the US and all of the 25 countries proposed for the EU combined, we have some 0.85e9 people. If all of them cut their consumption in half tomorrow, it would take:
yr = ln [1+.85e9*.5/6.5e9] / ln 1.012 = 5.31 years
Slightly more than 5 years to eat up the savings. Now, these are the higher consuming portion by quite a stretch and the above is a gross simplification.
But the point remains. Unless we get control over exponential growth of population, other improvements in consumption will be swamped out given only modest time.
Jon
Sin ganas - 05 Apr 2006 01:26 GMT ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I think this is why it is being said that 2 billion chinese will never achieve the standard of living which Americans have today, There are not enough resources left to distribute when a population expands to X billions of humans.
Famine, war, and pestilence are the classic controls on overpopulation. Biology savant Robert Webster warns in SMITHSONIAN (Jan2006 issue) that the bird flue type H5N1 is being spread worldwide at this moment by wild ducks. These ducks don't get sick from the new influenza, but they are the carriers of the next big epidemic He states that subjecting all ducks to a "final solution" would only slow the spread of the avian delivery system.
Cheers, David H ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
tgdenning@earthlink.net - 05 Apr 2006 15:12 GMT > Interesting. I only have a few thoughts. (For the other groups, I'm > writing from sci.environment.) [quoted text clipped - 52 lines] > > Jon All very true. But I make one constant and always ignored observation:
Decreasing population is good for *people*, not the environment. As long as we don't make that clear, we will have the "you just hate humanity" attack, or "you care more about birds than people."
At low population levels, every human will have the chance to be wealthy---to have better than USA living standards. And even turning the curve down will have beneficial effects for people long before it reaches some optimum number.
Bringing down the birth rate could achieve 3 billion this century---which means everyone will be 3 times wealthier than if it were the projected 9 billion.
-tg
H2-PV NOW - 05 Apr 2006 23:42 GMT > > Interesting. I only have a few thoughts. (For the other groups, I'm > > writing from sci.environment.) [quoted text clipped - 67 lines] > century---which means everyone will be 3 times wealthier than if it > were the projected 9 billion. Forrest Mims: MOONIE Creationist member of Discovery Institute.
MOONIE Creationist member of Discovery Institute.
http://snipurl.com/ooab Results 1 - 100 of about 51,700 for Forrest Mims Creationist.
http://snipurl.com/ooag Results 1 - 100 of about 33,000 for Forrest Mims Discovery Institute.
http://snipurl.com/ooai Results 1 - 100 of about 273 for Forrest Mims Sun Myung Moon.
Daniel A. Jimenez - 06 Apr 2006 15:32 GMT >Forrest Mims: MOONIE Creationist member of Discovery Institute. > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >http://snipurl.com/ooai >Results 1 - 100 of about 273 for Forrest Mims Sun Myung Moon. Hi.
I know Forrest Mims very well. He is one of the most dedicated and trustworthy scientists I know (and I know a lot of scientists). He is definitely not a Moonie or any other kind of religious nut.
If you object to something he has been quoted as saying in recent news items, please remember that the media have a limited amount of space to do their work, so they often take short segments of long quotes out of context.
 Signature Daniel Jiménez djimenez@cs.utexas.edu "I've so much music in my head" -- Maurice Ravel, shortly before his death. " " -- John Cage
H2-PV NOW - 07 Apr 2006 09:24 GMT > >Forrest Mims: MOONIE Creationist member of Discovery Institute.
> >MOONIE Creationist member of Discovery Institute.
> >http://snipurl.com/ooab > >Results 1 - 100 of about 51,700 for Forrest Mims Creationist.
> >http://snipurl.com/ooag > >Results 1 - 100 of about 33,000 for Forrest Mims Discovery Institute.
> >http://snipurl.com/ooai > >Results 1 - 100 of about 273 for Forrest Mims Sun Myung Moon.
> Hi. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > items, please remember that the media have a limited amount of space to do > their work, so they often take short segments of long quotes out of context. Mims speaks for himself --
http://snipurl.com/otpn Results about 160 for "Meeting Doctor Doom" Mims.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1607906/posts Meeting Doctor Doom (Envirnazi advocates wiping out 90% of humanity) The Citizen Scientist ^ | 3-31-06 | Forrest M. Mims III Posted on 04/02/2006 9:59:32 AM PDT by Crazieman
Meeting Doctor Doom Forrest M. Mims III Copyright 2006 by Forrest M. Mims III.
http://www.sas.org/tcs/weeklyIssues_2006/2006-04-07/feature1p/index.html Meeting Doctor Doom Forrest M. Mims III Copyright 2006 by Forrest M. Mims III.
http://www.discovery.org/scripts/viewDB/index.php?command=view&isFellow=true&id=35 Forrest M. Mims III is an instrument designer, science writer and independent science consultant who has made regular observations of the ozone layer, solar ultraviolet radiation, photosynthetic radiation, column water vapor and aerosol optical thickness since 1989 at his Geronimo Creek Observatory in Texas.
http://snipurl.com/otq2 Results about 883 for "Sun Myung Moon" "Discovery Institute".
http://snipurl.com/otq7 Survival of the Slickest How anti-evolutionists are mutating their message By Chris Mooney Issue Date: 12.2.02 It must take guts to be a "young-Earth" creationist. After all, imagine rejecting virtually all of modern science based on a literal interpretation of Genesis. Imagine opening yourself up to ridicule by insisting that Adam and Eve lived alongside the dinosaurs, Dinotopia-style, and that Noah crammed brontosauruses onto the Ark -- necessary inferences if you think the Bible is true and that God created the earth less than 10,000 years ago. Sure, these views are way outside the scientic mainstream (though polls suggest nearly half of Americans may hold them). But young-Earth creationism is so rigid in its adherence to religious doctrine that there's almost a kind of perverse integrity to it.
http://www.skepticfiles.org/evolut/forestmi.htm What follows are selected excerpts from an open letter by Forrest M. Mims III to Daniel Ji
http://www.horsesass.org/index.php?p=1311 Is the Discovery Institute run by Moonies? ... Hmm. When I was a kid, the Unification Church was considered to be some sort of dangerous, wacky cult; real Christians would actually hire deprogrammers to kidnap their kids out of the clutch of the Moonies and reverse their brainwashing. Nowadays, the billionaire Rev. Moon, with all his money and media (he owns The Washington Times and United Press International) has become an integral part of the Republican power structure.
Now, as a Jew, Ive always had a tough time distinguishing one Christian sect from another; they all seem a little cultish to me. (I mean, transubstantiation thats just plain weird.) So the mainstreaming of Moonism doesnt strike me as all that shocking. But wouldnt you have thought that the right-wing Evangelicals and Catholics who have embraced Rev. Moon as a political ally would have been a little more put off by the fact that, say he claims to be the Messiah? ...
JeffRelf - 05 Apr 2006 03:31 GMT Hi GSS, Speaking of over-breeding and over-consumption,
As crude oil reserves and the like get consumed expotentially, only those who can control their beeding and consumption will survive. Control is the Goal, not increased breeeding and consumption.
CrankHater - 05 Apr 2006 13:50 GMT Jeff...Relf wrote:
> Control is the Goal, not increased breeeding and consumption. says who you worthless f.ck. you should have been sterilised at birth you pathetic worm.
despite your shite being dribbled accross all manner of newsgroups you still have never f.cking posting anything on topic.
you are a c.nt with no friends and no life. f.ck off and die.
T Wake - 05 Apr 2006 19:17 GMT > Hi GSS, Speaking of over-breeding and over-consumption, > > As crude oil reserves and the like get consumed expotentially, > only those who can control their beeding and consumption will survive. > Control is the Goal, not increased breeeding and consumption. Hi Jeff,
Again, it seems you have cross posted this to news://sci.physics by mistake. Given that, of late, you have become obsessive about commenting on how much (or little) on-topic peoples posts are, I am sure this was just a mistake.
Maybe if your newsreader was slightly more standards adherent it would be better.
By the way, before I go on - who defines the "goal" you strive for?
As I have your attention for a brief period of time, can I remind you I am still waiting for an answer to the question about your five spatial dimensions? As I have told you, gravity describes three spatial dimensions. The standard candles you love to refer to, only work in three spatial dimensions.
Is there *any* chance you can show how your five spatial dimensions are modelled (in light of the overwhelming evidence for there being 3)?
Thanks in advance.
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