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Medical Forum / General / General / June 2005Did I just have a stroke?
Today when I was eating lunch I had this sharp, split-second spiked pain, going from the upper right hand-side of my neck to my head. It was very quick, I didn't lose consciousness nor had any problems whatsoever, but it was very strange and I never had this before. Would you guys speculate on what this might have been? My first reaction was there was a blood vessel rupturing, could this be possible? Anything else to do or watch out for? THANKS! > Today when I was eating lunch I had this sharp, split-second spiked > pain, going from the upper right hand-side of my neck to my head. It [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > THANKS! I'm not really qualified to advise you. Here is a link to page which will provide you links to many good references. http://www.ninds.nih.gov/disorders/stroke/stroke.htm My guess, and take it at that, is that it was not a stroke and is more likely to be a dental problem. Bill - not a Dr. Hi, thanks for the feedback. Can you let me know what makes you think it was related to a dental problem? Would this be a nerve reaction or something like this? I am not sure if it was a coincidence that it happened while eating, what I wanted to point out was that I wasn't doing any particular high-stress activity or something like this. Also I've been quite sleep deprived and overall tired in the last few months, would this help explain anything? I've gone from a ~8 hour/day sleep a few months ago to ~6-6:30 hours constant now... THANKS!! > Hi, thanks for the feedback. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > THANKS!! Have you discussed this with your doctor? Please provide us with an update after you have talked to a doctor. The doctor can arrange for special tests to determine whether or not you had a heart attack. In some cases, what may have appeared to be a heart attack was not a heart attack.  SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >Have you discussed this with your doctor? Please provide us with an >update after you have talked to a doctor. The doctor can arrange >for special tests to determine whether or not you had a heart attack. >In some cases, what may have appeared to be a heart attack was not >a heart attack. Jason, he questioned a stroke, not a heart attack. Please pay attention. To the original poster: No, you did not have a stroke. A single, brief, shooting pain up the neck with no other ensuing symptoms resembles neither a stroke, nor ruptured artery, nor heart attack. If it has happened only once, I wouldn't worry about it. Probably just a muscle spasm. If it happens again... well, see your doctor. > >Have you discussed this with your doctor? Please provide us with an > >update after you have talked to a doctor. The doctor can arrange [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > once, I wouldn't worry about it. Probably just a muscle spasm. If it > happens again... well, see your doctor. Carey, Are you a doctor? Without any tests, how would you know whether or not this person did or did not have a heart attack. We recently had a patient that had a series of tests to determine why the patient could barely walk due to poor circulation problems in his legs. The test results showed that the patient had had a heart attack. I later talked to the patient and he said that he did not even know that he had had a heart attack. I don't think that you should ever tell someone that it was a muscle spasm instead of a possible heart attack. Such a person should have medical tests to determine whether or not it was a heart attack. Jason SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >Are you a doctor? No. Spending 30 seconds in google would have told you that. >Without any tests, how would you know whether or not >this person did or did not have a heart attack. Without any tests how do I know you haven't suffered a stroke that impaired your reasoning abilities? Well, obviously I don't know and can't know, but I'm beginning to wonder. Now, please note that I never said I did know. Read for comprehension, Jason. >We recently had a patient >that had a series of tests to determine why the patient could barely walk [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >of a possible heart attack. Such a person should have medical tests to >determine whether or not it was a heart attack. Thank you for introducing us to the previously unknown concept of silent MI. Now, good luck convincing his doctor to work him up for MI based on a single, brief occurrence of a shooting pain in the neck with no other s/s. Can you even name the s/s of MI? Ever seen one? Can you name the s/s of stroke? Do you know what s/s and MI mean? If you're going to offer medical advice on the internet, please learn a little about the things you discuss, common medical terminology, and a little basic logic. Oh, and *please* read posts far more carefully before replying. It is not helpful to go around suggesting alarming possibilities to people who give no reason to suggest those possibilities could exist. > >Are you a doctor? > [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > replying. It is not helpful to go around suggesting alarming possibilities > to people who give no reason to suggest those possibilities could exist. Carey, I agree with one portion of your diatribe. The poster did mention that he thought that he may have had a stroke and I mentioned the term "heart attack" instead of "stroke" in my post. I made the mistake of guessing that everyone--including the poster and yourself--knows the difference between a stroke and a heart attack. I don't believe the poster had a stoke but I believe that he might have had a heart attack. I should have made that point more clear in my post. That's why I mentioned the term heart attack instead of stroke. I am sorry if I confused the poster, yourself or anyone else. The truth is that I don't know whether he did or did not have a heart attack. Only medical tests could provide an answer. In most emergency clinics, they test everyone (for legal reasons) that thinks that they might have had a heart attack or stoke. They don't tell people--"go on home--you just had a muscle spasm instead of heart attack or stoke". The reason is simple: If that person died within the next several days--the doctor that sent him or her home would have a million dollar lawsuit. If the same doctor had given him or her a test that proved the person had not had a stroke or heart attack--the doctor could use the test results in his or her defense if there was a lawsuit. The case would probably not even up in court. That is why that I was so shocked when you told the person that it was a muscle spasm. I don't know of any doctor that I have worked with that would tell such a person that it was a muscle spasm instead of a heart attack or stroke unless he was 100 percent sure. Jason SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >I agree with one portion of your diatribe. The poster did mention that he >thought that he may have had a stroke and I mentioned the term "heart >attack" instead of "stroke" in my post. I made the mistake of guessing >that everyone--including the poster and yourself--knows the difference >between a stroke and a heart attack. I know the difference, Jason, but I'm pretty sure you do not. >I don't believe the poster had a >stoke but I believe that he might have had a heart attack. Which demonstrates clearly why you should quit replying to such posts. >In most emergency clinics, they test everyone (for legal reasons) that >thinks that they might have had a heart attack or stoke. They don't tell >people--"go on home--you just had a muscle spasm instead of heart attack >or stoke". Do you actually enjoy demonstrating your ignorance? They most certainly do tell people to go home without working them up for stroke or MI. Jason, I've seen hundreds and hundreds of strokes and MIs over the last 12-13 years, and I've advised many, many people who thought they might be suffering from one whether they actually need to be evaluated or not. I do it almost daily. Yes, I am entirely responsible for the advice I give, and yes, sometimes I tell people they do *not* need to go to a doctor or ER. I and a million other medical providers do that every day. Now get a clue and shut up. >That is why that I was so shocked when you >told the person that it was a muscle spasm. I don't know of any doctor >that I have worked with that would tell such a person that it was a muscle >spasm instead of a heart attack or stroke unless he was 100 percent sure. Once again you demonstrate your ignorance. You were advised by another poster that "no advice is better than wrong advice." Please start listening to good advice until you have a vague idea what you're talking about. > >I agree with one portion of your diatribe. The poster did mention that he > >thought that he may have had a stroke and I mentioned the term "heart [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > poster that "no advice is better than wrong advice." Please start listening > to good advice until you have a vague idea what you're talking about. Carey, You may get away with the way you practice medical care for many years without any lawsuits. I can only tell you the story of one local doctor that was involved in a major lawsuit over this issue. A patient reported to him that he may have had a heart attack or stroke. The doctor conducted a brief exam and sent him home telling him that he was not a victim of a stroke or heart attack. The following week, the patient died of a massive heart attack. The wife of the patient filled a lawsuit. They settled out of court for an undisclosed amount of money. That same thing could happen to you or any other doctor that does not have test results to back them up in any hearing or court case. If you don't have the test results--be prepared to eventually end up with a malpractice lawsuit. Jason SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >You may get away with the way you practice medical care for many years >without any lawsuits. I can only tell you the story of one local doctor [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >in any hearing or court case. If you don't have the test results--be >prepared to eventually end up with a malpractice lawsuit. Yep, another news flash from Jason: It's a litigious world and malpractice insurance companies will settle even ridiculous suits because it's cheaper than litigation. Happens all the time. Nevertheless, I hate to tell you this, Jason, but thousands and thousands of people are sent home without being fully worked up every day. They're sent home because they don't have the signs, symptoms, and other clinical factors that indicate it could, indeed, be a heart attack. If doctors did a full work up on everyone who walked in the door saying they thought maybe they had a heart attack or stroke, medical care and insurance costs would go through the roof, with 99.9% of it a useless waste of time and money. Whatever you think of that, it's all completely moot here. This is not a clinic or hospital. There is no doctor/patient relationship established when someone answers a question here. So realistic answers are allowed, and not everyone needs to be told to get worked up for an MI just because Jason, who has no idea what a heart attack or stroke really looks like, heard about some lawsuit somewhere > >You may get away with the way you practice medical care for many years > >without any lawsuits. I can only tell you the story of one local doctor [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > who has no idea what a heart attack or stroke really looks like, heard > about some lawsuit somewhere I checked the yellow pages of the phone book several days ago looking for the name of a lawyer for my neighbor. I saw several ads. that were paid for by lawyers that specialize in malpractice cases. You may be lucky and never ever have a patient die that thought they may have had a heart attack or stroke. However, if one such patient does die, be prepared to face a malpractice lawyer and the dead person's close relative in court. You will end up with malpractice insurance that costs twice as much to pay during the coming years. You may end up working in a prison hospital since those doctors don't have to pay any money for malpractice insurance. Malpractice lawyers must love people like you. Jason SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >You may be lucky and >never ever have a patient die that thought they may have had a heart >attack or stroke. It isn't luck, Jason. Get back to us when you understand that. > >You may be lucky and > >never ever have a patient die that thought they may have had a heart [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Get back to us when you understand that. Yes, I feel there was luck involved. I have not talked to the older doctor that was the victim of a malpractice lawsuit. To update the other subscribers--the older doctor had a patient that reported to him that he believed that he was the victim of a heart attack or stroke. The older doctor done a brief exam and told him that he had not been a victim of a heart attack or stroke. Several days later, the patient died of a massive heart attack and the wife and her malpractice lawyer sued the doctor.They settled out of court for an undisclosed amount of money. It's my GUESS that the doctor made thousands (or at least hundreds) of guesses related to other people that believed they may have had heart attacks or strokes. He was lucky in those cases but was very unlucky on the day the patient died and he became the victim of a malpractice lawsuit. This same thing could happen to any doctor that fails to have test results to back up any decisions that are made related to whether or not patients that believed they were victims of heart attacks or stokes. SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >It's my GUESS >that the doctor made thousands (or at least hundreds) of guesses related >to other people that believed they may have had heart attacks or strokes. Good job, Jason! Just when you were getting boring beyond redemption you go and say something truly funny. By the way, do you own an interest in a lab business or something? I've honestly never heard anyone -- not even the most outrageously paranoid people who've been here over the years -- suggest that every person on the planet with a muscle ache or pain needs a full cardiac workup. Or is this just a schtick? If it is, I'll give you a 7.5 on the troll-o-meter. > >It's my GUESS > >that the doctor made thousands (or at least hundreds) of guesses related [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Or is this just a schtick? If it is, I'll give you a 7.5 on the > troll-o-meter. You have NEVER seen me mention the term "full cardiac workup". There are many doctors that just arrange for a standard EKG exam on those patients that believe they may have had a heart attack or stoke. Those doctors are very sure (but not certain) that those patients did not have a heart attack or stoke. The clinic staff and doctors refer to these exams as "CYA exams" (cover your a-- exams). The doctors can later use the exams to put the patients minds at ease but mainly used to protect themselves in case there is a lawsuit if the patient later had a heart attack, stroke or died. 90 per cent of doctors practice preventive medicine. SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >You have NEVER seen me mention the term "full cardiac workup". There are >many doctors that just arrange for a standard EKG exam on those patients >that believe they may have had a heart attack or stoke. Do tell us what you think an EKG would reveal about a stroke. >Those doctors are >very sure (but not certain) that those patients did not have a heart >attack or stoke. No they're not. A large percentage of MIs aren't evident on EKG. >The clinic staff and doctors refer to these exams as "CYA >exams" (cover your a-- exams). >The doctors can later use the exams to put the patients minds at ease but >mainly used to protect themselves in case there is a lawsuit if the >patient later had a heart attack, stroke or died. 90 per cent of doctors >practice preventive medicine. 99% of doctors practice good clinical medicine and look at the whole picture. Yes, CYA medicine is much more common these days, but just saying "I think I had a heart attack" won't buy you an EKG with most doctors unless you actually have some of the signs and symptoms or at least a history that warrants it. Basically, you're blowing smoke out your a.s, Jason. > >You have NEVER seen me mention the term "full cardiac workup". There are > >many doctors that just arrange for a standard EKG exam on those patients [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > Basically, you're blowing smoke out your a.s, Jason. Carey, Yes, I know that a EKG exam does not show whether a person did or did not have a heart attack. However, a EKG exam does reveal whether or not a person has heart disease. I don't know the statistics but seem to recall learning that the vast majority of people that have heart attacks also have heart disease. I believe that in a typical court case--that the EKG exam that showed that a person did not have heart disease would cause them to come up with a not guilty judgement in a malpractice case. It would be much better than no tests at all to prove your innocence. I'm on the side of doctors such as yourself and don't want them to be found guilty in malpractice cases unless they really did screw up. Jason SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >Yes, I know that a EKG exam does not show whether a person did or did not >have a heart attack. However, a EKG exam does reveal whether or not a >person has heart disease. Sometimes, but for the majority it does not. Where do you get this crap? >I don't know the statistics but seem to recall >learning that the vast majority of people that have heart attacks also >have heart disease. Ya think? >I believe that in a typical court case--that the EKG >exam that showed that a person did not have heart disease would cause them >to come up with a not guilty judgement in a malpractice case. Malpractice is not a crime. There is no guilty or not guilty. >It would be >much better than no tests at all to prove your innocence. Serial enzymes would be even better. So by your reasoning, shouldn't everyone who "thinks" they had a heart attack get tested? >I'm on the side >of doctors such as yourself and don't want them to be found guilty in >malpractice cases unless they really did screw up. I am not a doctor. I told you that just a day or so ago. > >Yes, I know that a EKG exam does not show whether a person did or did not > >have a heart attack. However, a EKG exam does reveal whether or not a [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > I am not a doctor. I told you that just a day or so ago. Carey, Sorry--I thought that you were a doctor. You should let people know that you are not a doctor in your posts. Two or more people told me that I should do that. Where did I get the info. about EKG exams: Source: H. Winter Griffith, M.D. "Complete Guide to Symtoms, Illness and Surgery". On page 1010 it states: "EKG-Method of diagnosing heart disease by measuring electrical activity of the heart with an electroencephalograph." If you are not a doctor--you probably don't have to worry about malpractice lawsuits. There are several local doctor (mainly surgeons that have patients die on the operating table) are now working at the local prison since they no longer have to pay for malpractice insurance. Jason SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >Sorry--I thought that you were a doctor. If you're not going to bother reading the answers, then please quit asking questions. >You should let people know that you are not a doctor in your posts. How amusing that you would say that right after being suckered into believing a well known usenet kook is a doctor. Do you see the irony in that? Anyone can post here and claim to be a doctor. Just because they say they are doesn't make it so, and even if they are a doctor that doesn't make their advice correct. People who ask medical questions here and take the answers at face value are very foolish. Newsgroups are for *discussion*, not medical advice. Meanwhile, I will decide what needs to be in my posts. >Where did I get the info. about EKG exams: >Source: H. Winter Griffith, M.D. "Complete Guide to Symtoms, Illness and >Surgery". >On page 1010 it states: >"EKG-Method of diagnosing heart disease by measuring electrical activity >of the heart with an electroencephalograph." You see, this is what happens when you go around reading stuff with no background understanding. As I said before, an EKG can diagnose *some* heart diseases, but by no means all, or even most. In particular, a normal EKG does *not* rule out heart attack, as you said it did. >If you are not a doctor--you probably don't have to worry about >malpractice lawsuits. Actually, I do, but why does this malpractice thing fascinate you? Do you really think it's news to anyone here? (Or anywhere else, for that matter.) > >Sorry--I thought that you were a doctor. > [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > really think it's news to anyone here? (Or anywhere else, for that > matter.) You made some great points. I was only trying to help you to avoid being involved in a malpractice lawsuit since I thought that you were a doctor. I now realize that I was wasting my time since you are not a doctor. SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. > Hi, thanks for the feedback. > > Can you let me know what makes you think it was related to a dental > problem? Would this be a nerve reaction or something like this? I was not quite that strong. I said I was "guessing" that it is more likely to be a dental problem than a stroke. First, if you look through the references I provided you,your symptoms do not seem consistent with an everyday stroke. Second, just from personel experience, your symptoms do seem consistent with a dental problem - if you bite on something very hard, or something very hot or cold. It could be something as simple as a cavity. And you were eating at the time. >Also I've been quite sleep deprived and overall tired in the last few > months, would this help explain anything? It would explain why you are tired. Try to get it up to a little over 7 and see how that works for you. Bill > I've gone from a ~8 hour/day > sleep a few months ago to ~6-6:30 hours constant now... > > THANKS!! GO TO THE HOSPITAL ASAP > Today when I was eating lunch I had this sharp, split-second spiked > pain, going from the upper right hand-side of my neck to my head. It [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > THANKS! I don't think my response to you got through, so I'll try once more: I have had a similar pain: a line of very sharp pain for not more than a quarter second, along my right vertical neck-bulge thing(don't know technical term for it). It seems to happen only when I am eating as well, but may have happened at other times too. One day when I was lifting weights I hurt that exact area quite a bit. This was after I experienced those spikes of pain. That is when I realized that my neck has a "grimace" pretty much regardless of what I am doing, especially having to do with heavy-duty work with my arms. Now I try not to grimace at all when doing heavy-duty work or lifting weights. Up to that point I had had a few episodes of the pain in my neck. The bottom line is that I was placing strain on my neck without realizing it, so that may be what you have done as well. I was on the bench-press machine putting out my maximum effort when I suddenly and unexpectedly hurt my neck where I've had the pain before. It hurt most right where the neck connects to the head on the right side, which is apparently where your pain is. James > > Today when I was eating lunch I had this sharp, split-second spiked > > pain, going from the upper right hand-side of my neck to my head. It [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > James James, I realize that other subscribers in this newsgroup will disagree with me but I'll write it anyway. You should see your doctor and explain what happened to you and let him or her make the final decision as to what actions to take. Jason SignatureNEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice. We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people. >James, >I realize that other subscribers in this newsgroup will disagree with me >but I'll write it anyway. You should see your doctor and explain what >happened to you and let him or her make the final decision as to what >actions to take. >Jason Jason, that sounds like a nice idea, but I can't possibly afford to go to the doctor every time I get a muscle strain or nervous tick somewhere. In Dan's case, assuming thats what his name is, its a little more obvious since its not at all clear what the problem is. In my case, I don't think I go more than a couple weeks without some kind of odd pain somewhere. And I'm only in my 20's! I also strained my right calf muscle a bit at the gym and don't plan to go to the doctor over that either. And a right ab muscle. Thats all I can think of right now. James ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ James, Let me deal with this. A pain in a single muscle or joint can also be caused by a VIRUS or other microbe. I was working on a ship where 2 other shipmates came down with the same neck muscle pain that I had developed one night. The fact that 3 people had the same pain and stiffness in the same neck muscle tells me there was a common agent of infection present in a food or beverage that all three had sampled at the same mealtime. I hope this comment brings some anecdotal relief. David H ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Did I just have a stroke? Stroked, stoked, Was it good for you, too ~ ? Refract, or, See your Vector Asap for Reed's Slip Cover ~ ! Gee, String Theory ~ ? |
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