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Medical Forum / General / General / May 2004

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KyroDoc - 26 May 2004 01:57 GMT
"Being a skeptical soul, I have always believed that the most reliable way to
determine what people really believe is to observe what they do, not what they
say. If the greatest threat of rubella is not to children, but to the fetus yet
unborn, pregnant women should be protected against rubella by making certain
that their obstetricians won't give them the disease. Yet, in a California
survey reported in the Journal of the American Medical Association, more than
90 percent of the obstetrician-gynecologists refused to be vaccinated. If
doctors themselves are afraid of the vaccine, why on earth should the law
require that you and other parents allow them to administer it to your
kids?"--Dr Robert Mendelsohn MD

Is 90% statistically signifigant?
PF Riley - 26 May 2004 05:57 GMT
>"Being a skeptical soul, I have always believed that the most reliable way to
>determine what people really believe is to observe what they do, not what they
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
>Is 90% statistically signifigant?

No, because this claim that "more than 90 percent" of ob-gyns in
California "refused" to be vaccinated is utter bullshit.

PF
HCN - 26 May 2004 17:48 GMT
,,,Dr Robert Mendelsohn MD

... died in 1988.

Also, stating a "statistic" without saying where the original data come from
is meaningless.
David Rind - 27 May 2004 01:07 GMT
> "Being a skeptical soul, I have always believed that the most reliable way to
> determine what people really believe is to observe what they do, not what they
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Is 90% statistically signifigant?

Actually the question "Is 90% statistically significant?" is
meaningless. I'll post the actual abstract that seems to be
referred to in this quotation and why don't you honestly post
whether you think this information from 1981 is of any relevance
to anything:

JAMA. 1981 Feb 20;245(7):711-3.  Related Articles, Links

Rubella vaccine and susceptible hospital employees. Poor physician
participation.

Orenstein WA, Heseltine PN, LeGagnoux SJ, Portnoy B.

A serosurvey of 2,456 high-risk employees of the Los Angeles
County-University of Southern California Medical Center showed that 345
(14%) were susceptible to rubella. Of 197 seronegative personnel
followed up for participation in a vaccination program, 105 (53.3%) were
vaccinated. However, only one of the 11 known susceptible
obstetrician-gynecologists was vaccinated. Thirty-eight seronegative
employees who were vaccinated with RA 27/3 rubella vaccine were queried
four to six weeks after vaccination and compared with 32 unvaccinated
seropositive control subjects. Although the reaction rate was 50% among
vaccinees and 3% among control subjects, each vaccinee lost only an
average of 0.2 workdays compared with 0.1 workdays for control subjects.
The high rate of susceptibility to rubella among hospital employees
supports the need for screening. Although vaccine reactions are common,
they are generally mild. Means must be found to ensure greater employee
acceptance of vaccine.

PMID: 7463660 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

So to ask this another way, do you believe it is significant that
in 1981 they could only get one out of eleven obstetricians who
had not already been vaccinated to show up for vaccination.

Note that the above quote from Dr. Mendelsohn is a complete
distortion of what the study showed. It did not find that more
than 90& of obstetricians in California refused vaccination. It
dealt only with eleven obstetricians in California who presumably
had already neither been vaccinated nor developed natural immunity
to rubella.

Signature

David Rind
drind@caregroup.harvard.edu

Howard McCollister - 27 May 2004 03:56 GMT
> > "Being a skeptical soul, I have always believed that the most reliable way to
> > determine what people really believe is to observe what they do, not what they
[quoted text clipped - 50 lines]
> had already neither been vaccinated nor developed natural immunity
> to rubella.

An interesting example of the kind of intellectual honesty we can expect
from Kryodoc. But, perhaps we should give him the benefit of a doubt and
assume instead that he just doesn't have the intellect to evaluate medical
literature critically. Whichever, can we extrapolate and extend that example
to all of chiropractic? Well, using his method of statistical evaluation, I
think that's reasonable.

HMc
KyroDoc - 27 May 2004 13:38 GMT
>From: "Howard McCollister"

>An interesting example of the kind of intellectual honesty we can expect
>from Kryodoc

Hey Howard.
You dont have to  be a jerk.

I was hoping someone would elicit some insight into that quote and they did
(Thank you Dr. Rind)  I was being a little sarcastic thats all.
Many of his (Mendelsohns) comments were outrageous and  many were insightful.

...and for the record,  critical medical intellect  has produced halcion and
thalidamide and baycol,  thyroid radiation for kids and and and.....

Oh yes and "critical medical thinking" re-initiated the small pox vaccine
program. That recently killed off a number of Americans did it not? Forgot
about that stroke of genius.

So give me a break.
Griffin - 28 May 2004 03:59 GMT
> ...and for the record,  critical medical intellect  has produced halcion and
> thalidamide and baycol,  thyroid radiation for kids and and and.....

..chiropractic.
Howard McCollister - 28 May 2004 04:57 GMT
> > ...and for the record,  critical medical intellect  has produced halcion and
> > thalidamide and baycol,  thyroid radiation for kids and and and.....
>
> ..chiropractic.

What in the world does intellect of any kind have to do with chiropractic?

HMc
KyroDoc - 28 May 2004 19:49 GMT
>From: "Howard McCollister"

>What in the world does intellect of any kind have to do with chiropractic?

Promoting health from within...utilizing the bodies natural healing resources
through proper nutrition adequeate rest and the elimination of spinal
somato-visceral reflexes( see Irwin Korr) and the reduction of undue
physical/mental/ergonomic stressors

Restoration/Reahabilitive measures  of skeletal biomechanics via  joint
mobilization,
isokinetic/isometric/proprioceptive neuromusculo facilitative technique

Tailoring wellness/health programs to meet the needs of the individual

Oh wait....a more intellectual approach would be to drug every individual into
organ faliure....
...Rx the same drug for the patient regardless of height, weight, age etc...

MUCH more intellectual approach there

BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA
Griffin - 28 May 2004 22:40 GMT
> BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA

Phew...for a second there, I thought you were serious.
 
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