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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Lupus / January 2004Website on Pred/corticosteroids in arthritis
Some stuff about benefits, risks, tapering etc. Nina http://www.orthop.washington.edu/arthritis/medications/corticosteroids/01 Great site! Putting it back on page one for another go & our newbie pred user(s). Hey! I looked up adrenal on there okay & then "adrenaline," but got nothing. I'm curious to know if adrenaline is uhh..spelled wrong or if it's a slang word kinda? Is adrenaline basically the cortisone that our adrenal glands produce? And do people actually produce more cortisone when hyped or something, thereby causing us hardship's the next day just as stress would? Maggie Hi Maggie, AFAIK you spelled adrenaline correctly. AFA the hormone itself goes it is produced by the adrenals and is known for producing the 'fight or flight' reaction in all of us from way back when survival was paramount and was our first priority *along with food, shelter and fire LOL.* Anyhow just from my understanding and JMO, stress produces more of it and thereby stresses the adrenals, then of course creating a 'systemic' reaction making your heartrate increase and bmr go into overdrive where you heat up and/or sweat and feel flushed and with the immune system preparing for a fight/flight ..... our body ends up attacking itself/ourself! Sounds like you have got it right to me. Hugs from Shelagh http://clik.to/lupus Maggie wrote in message: : Great site! Putting it back on page one for another go & our newbie : pred user(s). [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] : : Maggie Actually, the way Prednisone works for me Maggie is that it takes away inflamation, thus relieving pain so I feel better and can do more. I do get a bit hyper on higher doses of Prednisone but not on 10mg. or less. At 5mg. your body begins to produce its own cortisone again anyway. My maintenance dose before I had to my recent burst was 3mg. I could not, however, drop below 3mg. without having a big RA flare. Go figure. The body is a wierd mechanism and each body works differently. My doctors all think I am wierd so that always look for the worst case scenario and usually end up with something else they never expected to happen..... they are getting used to it by now. That don't even cringe when they see me coming. They know I have a good sense of humor and laugh things off so they don't get worried about my reaction.... Nettie > Hi Maggie, > AFAIK you spelled adrenaline correctly. > AFA the hormone itself goes it is produced by the adrenals and is > known for producing the 'fight or flight' reaction in all of us > from way back when survival was paramount and was our first > priority *along with food, shelter and fire LOL.* > Anyhow just from my understanding and JMO, stress produces more > of it and thereby stresses the adrenals, then of course creating > a 'systemic' reaction making your heartrate increase and bmr go > into overdrive where you heat up and/or sweat and feel flushed > and with the immune system preparing for a fight/flight ..... our > body ends up attacking itself/ourself! > Sounds like you have got it right to me. > Hugs from Shelagh > http://clik.to/lupus > > Maggie wrote in message: > : Great site! Putting it back on page one for another go & our > newbie > : pred user(s). > : > : Hey! I looked up adrenal on there okay & then "adrenaline," > but got > : nothing. I'm curious to know if adrenaline is uhh..spelled > wrong or if > : it's a slang word kinda? Is adrenaline basically the > cortisone that > : our adrenal glands produce? And do people actually produce > more > : cortisone when hyped or something, thereby causing us > hardship's the > : next day just as stress would? > : > : Maggie > I was talking about adrenaline not cortisone... got my wires crossed I guess... but that figures at this time of the new year... far too busy lately!! Hugs from Shelagh http://clik.to/lupus "Mercy" wrote in message : Actually, the way Prednisone works for me Maggie is that it takes away : inflamation, thus relieving pain so I feel better and can do more. I do get [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] : about my reaction.... : Nettie Oh gosh, not a big deal..... no problem here!! :>)) Nettie > I was talking about adrenaline not cortisone... got my wires > crossed I guess... but that figures at this time of the new > year... far too busy lately!! > Hugs from Shelagh > http://clik.to/lupus > > "Mercy" wrote in message > : Actually, the way Prednisone works for me Maggie is that it > takes away > : inflamation, thus relieving pain so I feel better and can do > more. I do get > : a bit hyper on higher doses of Prednisone but not on 10mg. or > less. At 5mg. > : your body begins to produce its own cortisone again anyway. My > maintenance > : dose before I had to my recent burst was 3mg. I could not, > however, drop > : below 3mg. without having a big RA flare. Go figure. The body > is a wierd > : mechanism and each body works differently. My doctors all > think I am wierd > : so that always look for the worst case scenario and usually end > up with > : something else they never expected to happen..... they are > getting used to > : it by now. That don't even cringe when they see me coming. > They know I > : have a good sense of humor and laugh things off so they don't > get worried > : about my reaction.... > : Nettie > >Hi Maggie, >AFAIK you spelled adrenaline correctly. >AFA the hormone itself goes it is produced by the adrenals and is >known for producing the 'fight or flight' reaction in all of us >from way back when survival was paramount and was our first >priority *along with food, shelter and fire LOL.* What about... sorry, I'll show myself out, thanks.  SignatureAndy [Chair, N E Lupus Group] See http://www.northeastlupus.org.uk for more! There's a good man. > >Hi Maggie, > >AFAIK you spelled adrenaline correctly. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > What about... sorry, I'll show myself out, thanks. I just know that not making enough adrenaline makes you pretty darn sick. The adrenals produce cortisol, I think, about 7.5 mg. a day. > Hi Maggie, > AFAIK you spelled adrenaline correctly. [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > : > : Maggie Hi Shelagh! From what I read, cortisol is also a hormone. So, is cortisol & adrenaline the same hormone--just given two names? If that's the case, then would it be safe to say that adrenaline gets used out of context? Like by people who like to snowboard off Mt. Everest. They would claim it gets the adrenaline flowing. Okay, it might do that too, (for real!) but they're probably producing more seratonin (or something in the brain that tells them "insane is good") than they are adrenaline, wouldn't you say? Hugs4u2, Maggie Hi Maggie No they aren't the same at all. I got my wires crossed and spoke about adrenaline not cortisol.... sorry to confuse the issues!! Both are produced by the adrenals but are different chemically and have different services to our body ... J explained it all well and gave a website too but re the cliff jumpers and all, yes I do believe a brain chemical is released called an endorphin which relieves physical pain and gives a feeling of euphoria... the same thing that runners get called a 'runner's high' where they just wanna keep on going LOL... don't understand it myself (about running I mean <g>... can't stand jogging; for me a good fastpaced walk does just fine!) Hugs from Shelagh http://clik.to/lupus <JDWAT@webtv.net> wrote in message : Hi Shelagh! : From what I read, cortisol is also a hormone. So, is cortisol & [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] : Hugs4u2, : Maggie Actually I was told it was 7.5 mg at both 8 a.m. and 4 p.m.; and that more heart attacks happen at 6 am due to people getting up stressed over work and their natural cortisol hasn't kicked in yet.. go figure! Hugs from Shelagh http://clik.to/lupus "Wesley" wrote in message : I just know that not making enough adrenaline makes you pretty darn : sick. The adrenals produce cortisol, I think, about 7.5 mg. a day. I failed that cortisol stimulation test that I took last year. I spoke about it here. My adrenals weren't making much, so when my prednisone was stopped for the test, I got really sick, really fast. I think I was taking 5 mg. twice a day at the time. I'm down to 2 mg. twice a day now, and I don't like it. I feel crummy a lot of the time. I would love to go back to 5 mg. twice daily, but it will never happen, because the transplant docs want me off completely if possible, and they rule the roost right now. > Actually I was told it was 7.5 mg at both 8 a.m. and 4 p.m.; and > that more heart attacks happen at 6 am due to people getting up [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > : sick. The adrenals produce cortisol, I think, about 7.5 mg. a > day. Hi Wesley! Will they retest your adrenals before taking you off the pred completely? I'm gonna research the adrenal gland as soon as I can focus a little better. Yesterday did me in. I find it all very weird. I understand what Shelagh (Thank you Shelagh!:)) means now. I'm just weirded out on my own though. : ) I know another test isn't something you want more of, but it's worrisome to think they'd stop the pred without making sure the adrenals are working again. Hugs, Maggie Hi Maggie. What's happening with the MTX? Are you going to inject or still put into a drink? Just curious. Nettie > > Hi Wesley! > > Will they retest your adrenals before taking you off the pred > completely? I'm gonna research the adrenal gland as soon as I can focus > a little better. Yesterday did me in. I find it all very weird. I > understand what Shelagh (Thank you Shelagh!:)) means now. I'm just > weirded out on my own though. : ) > > I know another test isn't something you want more of, but it's worrisome > to think they'd stop the pred without making sure the adrenals are > working again. > > Hugs, > Maggie > > Hi Nettie, I am going to start the shots next week if all goes well. I got myself psyched to actually do it & discovered I had 1/3cc syringes. That's an ouchy³ on a .7cc dose! I thought, well, okay, I can do it in 2 doses later as everyone had suggested (if I need to), but 3 shots on my first day would have to include an anxiety treatment. : ) I don't know if I can just go out & buy syringes though. I couldn't get them until money came anyway, but that's what I'm looking into. Can a person just buy them without a prescription? I bought one syringe years ago for my tackle box, but has things changed now? Oh-ho! EBAY! That's where I'll go check! Hugs, Maggie Hi Maggie, I don't think you can buy them without a prescriptoin, I'm sorry to say. I have some 1cc syringes left over from when I was injecting myself while on dialysis, but I'm not sure if I'm allowed to mail them to you. Probably not. Now if you were addicted to heroin, you could probably get them for free! What a world. > Hi Nettie, > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Hugs, > Maggie I believe it is illegal to give prescription medications to anyone other than the person for whom they were prescribed. --- Bruce Hi Bruce! Yeah, you're right, it is totally illegal. But are syringes only given via prescription? I saw them at eBay for sale, so I guess they just keep them behind the counter at drug stores so that addicts don't steal them? How is your friend? Will she get the needed stem cell transplant? Maggie I am in the US and I used to purchase syringes by the box for my mother in law's daily insulin injections. All I had to do was sign for them-apparently they are available over the counter if one is prepared to give name and address, etc. Don't know if anything has changed in 6 years? Teresa Thanks Teresa! I was gonna go to the drug store today & see what they said. I would imagine, according to the crime statistics, that it has only gotten easier in the past 6 years?? We'll see in a bit though. I'm taking my vial, so I have proof. : ) Is your headache gone now? Hugs, Maggie >I believe it is illegal to give prescription medications to anyone >other than the person for whom they were prescribed. This may be country-dependent - but certainly it's normally strongly advised against. SignatureAndy [Chair, N E Lupus Group] See http://www.northeastlupus.org.uk for more! They were not talking about exchanging prescription meds but rather needles syringes. Nettie > I believe it is illegal to give prescription medications to anyone other > than the person for whom they were prescribed. > --- > Bruce > Just syringes, no drugs. I can't use them anymore. No place to throw them away, and the pharmacy won't take them back. > I believe it is illegal to give prescription medications to anyone other > than the person for whom they were prescribed. > --- > Bruce Hi Wes! LOL! I said the exact same thing to my cousin! She told me to practice shaking & she'd find one of them programs for me to go to. : ) Don't worry, I wouldn't do that. Thanks anyway Wes! It is illegal through & through since they were prescribed to you. Oh boy! If the box got damaged & opened by the post office?! That's 2 crimes in one. LOL! Maggie Well Maggie, you have a vial of MTX so I would think that the pharmacy would sell you syringes.... no you don't need a prescription for syringes but you need a prescription of something that requires syringes and you have it. Good luck. Let me know if you need help. Ask for the diabetic syringes and ask the pharmacy to tell you how much you need for each shot. I take 10mg. and go to 4.0 on the syringe and it is only one shot. The pharmacy should be able to help you out whatever you do. I think you should be able to get syringes that can hold all the MTX in one shot. It is the size of the needle that you should be concerned about. A diabetic needle is very small and thin and does not hurt at all. Best of luck. Nettie Hi Nettie, I am going to start the shots next week if all goes well. I got myself psyched to actually do it & discovered I had 1/3cc syringes. That's an ouchy? on a .7cc dose! I thought, well, okay, I can do it in 2 doses later as everyone had suggested (if I need to), but 3 shots on my first day would have to include an anxiety treatment. : ) I don't know if I can just go out & buy syringes though. I couldn't get them until money came anyway, but that's what I'm looking into. Can a person just buy them without a prescription? I bought one syringe years ago for my tackle box, but has things changed now? Oh-ho! EBAY! That's where I'll go check! Hugs, Maggie Hi ya Maggie, I'm back-I don't where you live but here, in Indiana, anyway, you can buy syringes without a script but you have to"sign" for them and show ID in the pharmacy-the "state" comes in every so often and checks the book, for things like the same person signing too many times for like codeine (there is a codeine cough syrup you can sign for like this too) or needles but if you need the needles for a medical reason you should be able to get a script which would be better. I bought syringes for years for my mom, she had a script but I had to sign for them because I was purchasing them-I found it amusing when they questioned my years of purchasing them-I had worked in that same pharmacy for 9 years! Tanya Hi Tanya! Thanks for the info. I had meant to go to the pharmacy this week, but I couldn't get the ice off the windows to drive that far. Too weak, I guess & the de-icer...I needed more than a gallon! <sigh> So, I called & they told me that I didn't need nuthin' to get syringes. No ID, no script, no signature. Hmmm? I do wonder if it's a state-to-state issue? I'm in KS, btw. Hugs, Maggie Hi Maggie! I'm going to ask my nephrologist to retest me when I see him in two weeks. He has been my all-around doctor, even though he is not my PCP. He ordered the first test. > Hi Wesley! > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Hugs, > Maggie Wesley, I feel bad for you. Sometimes we just cannot go off Prednisone ever. If I drop below 3mg. I go into such a bad flare and it sets so many bad things into motion. I had to go way up to come back down. Perhaps your drs. should start listening to you because you know your body best. 5mg. is a reasonable dose and if that is where you are comfortable, then why not be there? Sounds riduculous on the part of your drs..... I have been on Prednisone since 1997.... there is no turning back for me; I don't think ever in this life time. Perhaps you may need to get assertive. I know I have become very assertive with my drs. and they now listen to me instead of trying to lead me down the wrong paths and then I am only sorry for it later when they say, oh yes, you were right.... think about it. 2mg. is not going to make a huge difference. I'm in your court, especially on this one. Nettie :>)) > I failed that cortisol stimulation test that I took last year. I > spoke about it here. My adrenals weren't making much, so when my > prednisone was stopped for the test, I got really sick, really fast. > I think I was taking 5 mg. twice a day at the time. I'm down to 2 mg. > twice a day now, and I don't like it. I feel crummy a lot of the > time. I would love to go back to 5 mg. twice daily, but it will never > happen, because the transplant docs want me off completely if > possible, and they rule the roost right now. > > "Shelagh" <tiderington@shaw.ca> wrote in message news:<QoiJb.919112$9l5.747042@pd7tw2no>... > > Actually I was told it was 7.5 mg at both 8 a.m. and 4 p.m.; and > > that more heart attacks happen at 6 am due to people getting up > > stressed over work and their natural cortisol hasn't kicked in > > yet.. > > go figure! > > Hugs from Shelagh > > http://clik.to/lupus > > > > "Wesley" wrote in message > > : I just know that not making enough adrenaline makes you pretty > > darn > > : sick. The adrenals produce cortisol, I think, about 7.5 mg. a > > day. Hi Nettie, I have been on prednisone since 1985. It is going to be tough to get off now, especially since I have developed a lupus-like disease and adrenal insufficiency. What I need to do is get my doctors talking to each other. You may know how hard that is. My nephrologist, endocrinologist, and rheumy want me to stay on prednisone, but with this new transplant medication protocol, the transplant surgeons are hot to get me off it altogether. They claim that it messes things up as far as tracking lab work, rejection, etc., and it makes it harder to adjust medications. So you see, they have a point also. I just feel so much better on at least a small dose. > Wesley, I feel bad for you. Sometimes we just cannot go off Prednisone > ever. If I drop below 3mg. I go into such a bad flare and it sets so many [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Nettie :>)) > I have been on prednisone since 1985. It is going to be tough to get > off now, especially since I have developed a lupus-like disease and [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > to adjust medications. So you see, they have a point also. I just > feel so much better on at least a small dose. A very real concern, because it took so long to find you a kidney and you're had a lifetime of surgeries. Each one, as we age, get more difficult to recover from and I sure hope you can stay on some pred to help with the symptoms. Hugs Wes J Hi Wes! Glad to hear you will insist on the adrenal test. It must get frustrating trying to please all those doctors. I have heard that low-dose pred was good for many people. They did some sort of study & found it to be better than the ups & downs of pred doses. Nonetheless, and as complicated as it is for you, you deserve to feel as well as you can. I hope that's how it all turns out for you. Hugs, Maggie Oh yes, I know so well how hard it is to get drs. to communicate with eachother. When I had cancer, the oncologist said wait, while the surgeon said her spleen needs to come out NOW!!! Why wait I said? So the cancer can spread? I said, the rheumatologist said and surgeon said NOW.... so it came out NOW!!! I was at stage 1 and did not need chemo.... I dropped that oncologist and got a different one.... guess why? You are in charge of your life Wesley.... you call the shots with the best informed decisions you can. I think you should decide this for yourself, not the drs. That is my honest opinion. Quality of life is very important on my list.... I would imagine it is on yours too. I am on your side!!! :>)) Nettie > Hi Nettie, > > I have been on prednisone since 1985. It is going to be tough to get > off now, especially since I have developed a lupus-like disease and > adrenal insufficiency. What I need to do is get my doctors talking to > each other. You may know how hard that is. My nephrologist, > endocrinologist, and rheumy want me to stay on prednisone, but with > this new transplant medication protocol, the transplant surgeons are > hot to get me off it altogether. They claim that it messes things up > as far as tracking lab work, rejection, etc., and it makes it harder > to adjust medications. So you see, they have a point also. I just > feel so much better on at least a small dose. > > "Mercy" <pickadillyNOSPAM@charter.net> wrote in message news:<vvd15i26ajm5a@corp.supernews.com>... > > Wesley, I feel bad for you. Sometimes we just cannot go off Prednisone > > ever. If I drop below 3mg. I go into such a bad flare and it sets so many > > bad things into motion. I had to go way up to come back down. Perhaps your > > drs. should start listening to you because you know your body best. 5mg. is > > a reasonable dose and if that is where you are comfortable, then why not be > > there? Sounds riduculous on the part of your drs..... I have been on > > Prednisone since 1997.... there is no turning back for me; I don't think > > ever in this life time. Perhaps you may need to get assertive. I know I > > have become very assertive with my drs. and they now listen to me instead of > > trying to lead me down the wrong paths and then I am only sorry for it later > > when they say, oh yes, you were right.... think about it. 2mg. is not going > > to make a huge difference. I'm in your court, especially on this one. > > > > Nettie :>)) Wes, Why did they reduce you if you failed the test? doesn't failing it mean you aren't making up enough of the difference on your own? I remember you were put on decadron at some point then weren't you? What is it that the transplant team don't like about it at this point in time? I take 5mg. daily and without it I flare immediately. I feel well with it and IMO it just isn't worth weaning down and off just to say 'I'm off pred.'! Hugs from Shelagh http://clik.to/lupus "Wesley" wrote in message : I failed that cortisol stimulation test that I took last year. I : spoke about it here. My adrenals weren't making much, so when my [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] : happen, because the transplant docs want me off completely if : possible, and they rule the roost right now. > Wes, > Why did they reduce you if you failed the test? doesn't failing [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > What is it that the transplant team don't like about it at this > point in time? They have trouble deciding when to reduce the Prograf, and they aren't sure if the Prograf or the Prednisone is keeping rejection at bay. Doesn't really matter to me, just so it stays away. They probably have some more advanced reasons that they don't wish to discuss with me. Some of the transplant stuff is very complicated. I see what you mean now Wes. I didn't know you were taking prograf *and pred. A bit of a situation then with which immunosuppressant is actually working for you? I'm with you though; who cares which it is just as long as you are feeling 'well' and living 'quality'. Continuing good luck to you, you have alot of courage and strength going on! Hugs from Shelagh http://clik.to/lupus "Wesley" wrote in message : They have trouble deciding when to reduce the Prograf, and they aren't : sure if the Prograf or the Prednisone is keeping rejection at bay. : Doesn't really matter to me, just so it stays away. They probably : have some more advanced reasons that they don't wish to discuss with : me. Some of the transplant stuff is very complicated. Thank you Nina. I'll be reading this! Nanny > Some stuff about benefits, risks, tapering etc. > > Nina > > http://www.orthop.washington.edu/arthritis/medications/corticosteroids/01 > Some stuff about benefits, risks, tapering etc. > > Nina > > http://www.orthop.washington.edu/arthritis/medications/corticosteroids/01 Last updated March 8, 2002 Benefits of corticosteroids Types of arthritis Corticosteroids are used to treat several forms of arthritis. Following are examples of some of the rheumatic diseases and conditions that respond to corticosteroid treatment: bursitis dermatomyositis giant cell arteritis gout osteoarthritis polymyalgia rheumatica polymyositis pseudogout rheumatoid arthritis scleroderma systemic lupus erythematosus (lupus) tendinitis vasculitis Administration Doctors often prescribe corticosteroids in pill form, but there are other ways of taking them. For osteoarthritis and bursitis, corticosteroids often are injected directly into the joint or bursa. For other conditions, they are injected into a muscle or vein. Doctors may use "pulse" corticosteroids--a procedure in which a very high dose of the medication is injected into a vein--e.g., when lupus seriously affects the kidneys, nervous system, or brain. Pulse corticosteroid treatment is a serious procedure that involves risks. It should only be used by specialists with appropriate training, preferably in a hospital. Other conditions treated with corticosteroids Skin conditions caused by certain forms of arthritis often are treated with corticosteroid creams applied directly to the spot. Certain eye conditions associated with arthritis are treated with corticosteroid eyedrops. Some allergies can be treated with nasal sprays. Unlike corticosteroid pills, corticosteroid creams, eyedrops, sprays, and injections into joints or bursae are less likely to cause side effects in other parts of the body. This was a lot of help to me Nina. I am pretty new at this, finding help with Lupus. Been going through all kinds of different meds. and trying to find one that will help me out. Thank you so very much for putting this out for some one like me to do some research on. Mo >Some stuff about benefits, risks, tapering etc. > >Nina > >http://www.orthop.washington.edu/arthritis/medications/corticosteroids/01 |
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