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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Herpes / May 2005What is the MAX safe Lysine Dosage??
Hello, I am taking 2000 mg of Lysine per day all because my doctor doesn't think the severity of my genital herpes condition needs Valtrex. I find that the Lysine has been a life saver because without it I would have been in severe pain from the herpes. I am wondering if there are any long term consequences. I called the Vitamin World store and the counter person told me that only 4000 mg or higher have limits on how long you can take them, but yet a source online said that even taking 2000 mg per day should be limited to 6 months then brought down to 1000 mg per day as a maintenance dose for herpes. When calling the pharmacy or talking to my doctor they told me they didn't know. Does anyone know if there is a set limit? I just don't want to be taking this for a long period of time and then find out my liver is about to go because I took too much lysine. Thanks, Tom >Lysine has been a life saver Glad to hear that because It doesn't help at all for many people. In fact, it increases activity for some. That whole lysine/arginine ratio thing seems to be a very inexact science. Lots of people can load up on arginine with no ill effect at all. Everybody's different. >Vitamin World store and the counter person told >me that only 4000 mg or higher have limits on how long you can take them, >but yet a source online said that even taking 2000 mg per day should be >limited to 6 months Yep, there's lots of conflicting info about the stuff. I haven't seen a study on it lately but one reliable source I've read claims that anything less than 3000mg per day won't really do any good for herpes. > I just don't >want to be taking this for a long period of time and then find out my liver >is about to go because I took too much lysine. My understanding is that it's a fairly benign substance but ...who knows. Keep us posted if/when you find some interesting info. M2 Well it does help me in terms of making the outbreaks a little less severe, but not much more than that. I do know that after taking it from times when I wasn't taking it, has brought on the blisters, so maybe that's what you are referring to? I heard that 1000 mg is maintenance and 2000-3000 is for use in prevention. As far as arginine...well lets put it this way...if I have chocolate, coffee and nuts I will almost certainly have an outbreak in about 5 days following it. I noticed that taking lysine has reduced the symptoms but not more than that. Now that the primary is over I still get outbreaks but they are alot less severe, although some of the prodrome pain in the thighs and lower back is pretty painful still. > >Lysine has been a life saver > [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > M2 Just re-read my post and realize it sounded a bit on the negative side. Sorry about that. Sometimes it just doesn't come out the way it's supposed to. Obviously, Lysine works for quite a few people. I went to a seminar a couple of years ago and heard the lady who wrote the book (literally. She was selling the books at the seminar) on Lysine/Arginine ratios and its effect on herpes. She's a nurse and had done quite a bit of research on the subject. Anyhow, the theory on why Lysine works, if I recall correctly, is as follows: 1) HSV needs arginine to replicate 2) Lysine displaces Arginine in the body. 3) The body can make it's own Arginine but can't make Lysine, soooo.... 4) the body hordes lysine whenever it's made available. The more Lysine it hoards, the more arginine it simultaneously displaces 5) Once the body has little or no arginine, HSV can't replicate. ..... at least that's the theory. >after taking it from times when >I wasn't taking it, has brought on the blisters, so maybe that's what you >are referring to? hmm... not sure what you mean. But what I meant was, according to a few people I've talked with, taking Lysine daily over a period of time seemed to increase the frequency of their outbreaks during that time. Then their outbreak frequency would lessen when they stopped taking Lysine. Granted, that's anecdotal from an extremely small sample so take it for what it's worth. >I heard that 1000 mg is maintenance and 2000-3000 is for use in prevention. Sounds like a good consensus. That's what's on a couple of reliable sites. And I've also seen that toxicity levels haven't been scientifically determined. >As far as arginine...well lets put it this way...if I have chocolate, coffee >and nuts I will almost certainly have an outbreak It's a trigger for lots of folks. Wish all triggers had a antidote as simple as Lysine. M2 > Just re-read my post and realize it sounded a bit on the negative > side. Sorry about that. Sometimes it just doesn't come out the way > it's supposed to. Obviously, Lysine works for quite a few people. No problem, I didnt take it in a negative way. > I went to a seminar a couple of years ago and heard the lady who wrote > the book (literally. She was selling the books at the seminar) on [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > 5) Once the body has little or no arginine, HSV can't replicate. > ..... at least that's the theory. That's probably why after taking Lysine the symptoms are more mild from what I still get. If the herpes cannot replicate it doesn't cause move through the nerves and doesn't cause the nerve irritations and pain. Don't get me wrong, even while taking 2000 mg per day I still get symptoms and have outbreaks, but the symptoms are more bearable. Instead of being in all out pain and aching in the thighs, lower back and extreme itching and throbbing sensations, I am feeling a little more comfortable, but I can still feel it happing. I guess I am one of those people that has severe herpes pain, because I have alot of pain almost all the time, like a constant reminder, but with the Lysine its not as bad. Tom > I am taking 2000 mg of Lysine per day all because my doctor doesn't think > the severity of my genital herpes condition needs Valtrex. That's interesting because Lysine is not an antiviral medication used to treat Herpes Simplex Virus. > I find that the > Lysine has been a life saver because without it I would have been in > severe > pain from the herpes. I am wondering if there are any long term > consequences. Too much Lysine is not good for you and can actually cause your body tons of harm. >I called the Vitamin World store and the counter person told > me that only 4000 mg or higher have limits on how long you can take them, > but yet a source online said that even taking 2000 mg per day should be > limited to 6 months then brought down to 1000 mg per day as a maintenance > dose for herpes. Once again.. Lysine is not a herpes antiviral medication. It doesn't reduce asymptomatic shedding. It doesn't cut transmission rates in half. It doesn't reduce the frequency or intensity of flare ups either. >When calling the pharmacy or talking to my doctor they told > me they didn't know. Does anyone know if there is a set limit? I just > don't > want to be taking this for a long period of time and then find out my > liver > is about to go because I took too much lysine. If you want to talk to a herpes expert.. head on over to WebMD and ask Terri Warren about all of this: http://boards.webmd.com/topic.asp?topic_id=90 You might also check out a post that I wrote here: http://www.yoshi2me.com/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=656 It's about Vitamins, Minerals, Amino Acids and the Arginine Theory. Take Care, Angela :) Yoshi writes: >You might also check out a post that I wrote here: >http://www.yoshi2me.com/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=656 >It's about Vitamins, Minerals, Amino Acids and the Arginine Theory. Hi Yosh.... I couldn't get there with the link, even after I registered and logged in. I get the message: "The topic or post you requested does not exist" Is there another way to get there? Like "Jump to...." ... uh ... which group?... and which message?... like that? Thanks, M2 M2, You could see this thread even after you registered? http://www.yoshi2me.com/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=656 Tell you what.. Just go to the folder titled "Herpes Simplex Virus (HSV)" You should be able to find the stickie at the top of the page.. Let me know if you still have trouble seeing it, ok? Angela :)  SignatureHerpes Message Boards www.yoshi2me.com/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/index.php www.health.groups.yahoo.com/group/PickingUpThePieces/ > Yoshi writes: >>You might also check out a post that I wrote here: [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Thanks, > M2 Yosh writes: >You could see this thread even after you registered? >http://www.yoshi2me.com/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=656 Nope. I could *not* either before I registered or after. It would only take me to the "log in" page. >Just go to the folder titled "Herpes Simplex Virus (HSV)" >You should be able to find the stickie at the top of the page.. >Let me know if you still have trouble seeing it, ok? Ok, got there that way. Thanks :-) M2 Yosh writes: >>You should be able to find the stickie at the top of the page.. M2 writes: >Ok, got there that way. Thanks :-) By the way.... what's a stickie?? M2 > By the way.... what's a stickie?? It's those posts that are stuck at the top of the page as a type of service announcement. Angela :) >Yosh writes: >>>You should be able to find the stickie at the top of the page.. >By the way.... what's a stickie?? Hey, this is a family group! ;-) Mike > Hello, > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Thanks, > Tom Tom, I can recommend you or others to use Lysine suplemments only after you've tried all the other suplements etc. I've found that, when used as a last resort, Lysine can be very efective. After several years of trying lots of folk remedies while eating high Arginine containing foods during this time, apparently my body has learned to cope with the herpes virus. Suplementing at one point in time, for the first time, with Lysine, I could have seen a total effectiveness in the ability of my body to fight the virus. In other words, improve your immune system, cleanse your internal organs, blood, skin, etc and then add Lysine to your body. The former part can last several years, until the later part, the use of Lysine suplemments is needed. At such point in time, you will only require small ammounts of Lysine. Another interesting aspect of trying to improve your body's resistance to herpes virus is to try to change the actual triggers occasionally; for example, if you see that certain nuts are triggers, try eating chocolate for a while, then try orange juice, and so on. Use variation in your approaches. Too much of anything is of no good for our bodies. Provided we are not alergic to some of the mentioned foods (you don't seem to be as I reckon), coping with them can be done by increasing gradually. Pay attention to these aspects and you will see results, that before seemed impossible. You will get to a point when you will be able to eat whatever you wish without getting any herpes outbreaks whatsoever (as you've wrote, after 5 days or so, after you ingest high arginine containing foods you will get outbreaks). Indeed, variation is one of the secrets in trying to deal with the virus. There is no magic pill so far, to my knowledge. Nonetheless, our bodies are fantastic machineries that can improve their abilities over time. Pay close attention to what you eat and drink etc, how your skin reacts to it. Perl von Molson Thanks everyone for the info. I know Lysine is not an antiviral and doesn't stop shedding, nor does it stop the frequency of my outbreaks, but I DO notice that it lessens the severity. If I wasn't taking it the nerve pain in the lower back and legs would be almost unbearable. That's where my problem symptoms are. The moderate symptoms are the tingling sensations and the burning and itching, the less problematic symptoms are the blisters which in my case are mild. Nearly all of my pain is on the upper and inner thigh area and near the lower back and groin. I not sure where Angela is getting the information on Lysine being dangerous, because so far I haven't seen any information about that. I would like to know though because if I am taking it I need to know the facts, but it is also true that cleansing the body could be good as Perl stated. Thanks, Tom > > Hello, > > [quoted text clipped - 69 lines] > > Perl von Molson There is a book called "Managing Herpes - How to live and love with a chronic std" written by Charles Ebel and Anna Wald. You can find this and other herpes informational books over on www.yoshi2me.com/herpes-hpv-book.html If you don't have a copy of this book and you want to learn more about herpes - I highly recommend getting a copy for your home library. Here is a little snippet from the book: The consensus in the scientific community is that lysine supplements in particular have no inherent value. Experts also say that if you feel your diet is deficient in some way and you want to take a supplement, the best bet is a broad-spectrum, multivitamin formula that meets the Recommended Daily Allowance (RDA) for the nutrients listed. According to many experts in the field, nutrition is a complex interaction of verious elements, and people are best served by eating a balanced diet that gives them all the essential nutrients from real food. (We do need lysine, and a balanced diet probably contains something on the order of 500 mg a day.) On the other hand, megadoses of any one amino acid or vitamin can easily throw the body's chemical system out of balance. At one time, advocates of lysine also suggested restricting dietary intake of another amino acid, arginine, which is found in lots of common foods, among them chocolate, nuts, corn, and beer. Some people have found that, for them, arginine-rich foods seem to trigger outbreaks. Nutritional research in recent years, however, show that arginine actually enhances immune function and helps people resist some infections. It's been tested on burn patients, for example, and has been shown to lower rates of secondary infection. Angela :) SignatureHerpes Message Boards www.yoshi2me.com/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/index.php www.health.groups.yahoo.com/group/PickingUpThePieces/ > Thanks everyone for the info. I know Lysine is not an antiviral and > doesn't [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > Thanks, > Tom >"Managing Herpes - How to live and love with a >chronic std" written by Charles Ebel and Anna Wald. Got mine at an Indy Event. Everybody that registered received one. I agree, it's an excellent book and a good addition to any library. M2 And VERY hard to argue against! lol Angela :) >>"Managing Herpes - How to live and love with a >>chronic std" written by Charles Ebel and Anna Wald. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > M2 Hi Angela, I actually do have a copy of that book and I found it very informative. As far as the mega doses of Lysine...I wonder what defines a megadose? I don't always eat a balanced diet, but lets say I did and had 500 mg that way and then an additional 2000 mg. So how do I know what am is doing is too much and also for too long? By the way, I really like your web site. I'm going to register. I was looking at it a little while I was at work today, and checking out the success stories about people with herpes. Thank you, Tom > And VERY hard to argue against! lol > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > > > M2 > Hi Angela, Hi Tom! :) > I actually do have a copy of that book and I found it very informative. As > far as the mega doses of Lysine...I wonder what defines a megadose? I > don't > always eat a balanced diet, but lets say I did and had 500 mg that way and > then an additional 2000 mg. So how do I know what am is doing is too much > and also for too long? I would definitely encourage you to discuss all that with your doctor. Your doctor will be able to tell you what a mega dose of Lysine would be.. ya know? > By the way, I really like your web site. I'm going to register. I was > looking at it a little while I was at work today, and checking out the > success stories about people with herpes. Wow ~ thanks Tom. I'm glad you are enjoying the site. Angela :) SignatureHerpes Message Boards www.yoshi2me.com/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/index.php www.health.groups.yahoo.com/group/PickingUpThePieces/ Now maybe you can tell me how to register, because I am having trouble finding a way to do that. Thanks, Tom > > By the way, I really like your web site. I'm going to register. I was > > looking at it a little while I was at work today, and checking out the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Angela :) |
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