Getting ready for micro-dragon war soon.

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déjà vu déjà vu - 21 Feb 2008 22:42 GMT

Getting ready for micro-dragon war soon with biopsy on March 10th.

Type hcv-1b and positive for hbv antibodies age (almost 62) ALT 106 & SGOT
51 (2.8 million virus copies)

All other blood work excellent and Doc says that I shouldn't have extensive
damage (looking only at blood work).

I think that having been infected for quite some time (probably 30+ yrs.)
that I should have stage 3 (at least) fibrosis but biopsy will confirm.

In any case I'm going for the dragon war and hope to inflict millions of
(dragon casualties) if they don't kill me first.

Waiting for the newer treatments in studies doesn't sound like what I should
do with an occasional (liver pain) now and then.

Does pain in the liver mean anything more than a little scar tissue blockage
and does it ever go away after successful treatment?

I feel good now and almost look forward to kicking dragon butt even if it
makes me sick for a year.

This is too soon to speculate, so I"ll shut up now.

Jamffer

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Cactus Jammies - 22 Feb 2008 02:04 GMT

> Getting ready for micro-dragon war soon with biopsy on March 10th.

...

> Waiting for the newer treatments in studies doesn't sound like what I
> should
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> blockage
> and does it ever go away after successful treatment?

...

> Jamffer

Jamffer,
It is a good thing that you are going into treatment. What kind of 'liver
pain' are you talking about? The liver does not have pain nerves in it.
Could it be your gall bladder? Or is your pain in the upper chest area,
which could mean referenced pain from the liver sac. I have never had
'liver pain'.

cactus jammies 1b relapsed after tx in '04-'05

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déjà vu déjà vu - 22 Feb 2008 17:54 GMT

> > Getting ready for micro-dragon war soon with biopsy on March 10th.
> ...
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> cactus jammies 1b relapsed after tx in '04-'05

Liver area tenderness (like slightly sore muscle) but more like heartburn in
lower right ribcage.

It's not noticeable most of the time.

I might pass on the biopsy and maybe get cat scan instead. I live alone and
they wouldn't let me drive away by myself. I guess they worry about me
bleeding to death, alone.

The nurse said that biopsy is recommended but not mandatory.

I'll hear from the Doc in a few days to see what he recommends.

A cat scan would show the whole liver and maybe be better for general
assessment.

Have you heard anything about grapefruit?

Like you, I'm keeping an eye on the latest trials on the horizon.

I have a feeling that in a few years the present standard of care will seem
barbaric and archaic.

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Frogger - 22 Feb 2008 18:56 GMT

> > > Getting ready for micro-dragon war soon with biopsy on March 10th.
> > ...
[quoted text clipped - 40 lines]
> I have a feeling that in a few years the present standard of care will seem
> barbaric and archaic.

Re: Grapefruit, I just read this the other day

Grapefruit Compound May Help Combat Hepatitis C Infection
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/02/080204124110.htm

And ruby red grapefruit season is upon us. Love it love it love it.

cheers,

Frogger

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Cactus Jammies - 23 Feb 2008 00:39 GMT

Jamffer and Frogger,
The article about grapefruit and the possible influence it has on the
progression of HCV is quite interesting. I have been taking a blood
pressure medication that when combined with grapefruit, can cause a drastic
drop in BP. But certainly if there turns out to be a chance that grapefruit
or the flavinoid (Naringenin) from it can assist me defeating the HCV
infection next time I am on TX, then I am confident that there won't be much
of an argument against me dropping the BP meds in favour of the better
chance against HCV.
As to the advisability of a CaT scan vs. a biopsy, I understood that a CaT
scan of the Liver only shows up relative mass and is not used to analyze
fibrosis levels and stages. I had a CaT scan just recently which was
prescribed to have a look at the liver after an ultrasound of the area
turned up some interesting things. The results did not find any abnormal
masses on the liver. I agree that the biopsy is a nusance. The lab would
probably have you laying on your back in an out patients' ward, hooked up to
a BP monitor. I think I was told to just relax and lay there for four hours
after the biopsy, just in case there was going to be any internal bleeding.

I've never had or heard of the type of liver pain you describe, Jamffer.

cactus jammies ~~~~~~~
On Feb 22, 12:57 pm, "déjà vu déjà vu" <jamf...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> "Cactus Jammies" <cactusjamm...@retinal.circus.orb> wrote in message
>
[quoted text clipped - 48 lines]
> seem
> barbaric and archaic.

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tom - 22 Feb 2008 19:43 GMT

> > > Getting ready for micro-dragon war soon with biopsy on March 10th.

<snip>

> I might pass on the biopsy and maybe get cat scan instead. I live alone and
> they wouldn't let me drive away by myself. I guess they worry about me
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> I'll hear from the Doc in a few days to see what he recommends.

I never had a biopsy and took 11 months of the combo tx and have been
undetectable for over 2 years now. Before treatment my Doc wanted me to get
a biopsy but when I questioned him about what actions he would take as a
result of biopsy results the only thing he could come up with was if I
didn't clear the virus after 6 weeks of treatment the decision as to
continue treatment or not might be based on the biopsy results. I was clear
at 6 weeks so it was never an issue. My Doc doesn't recommend I have a
biopsy at this point.

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anonymousone - 23 Feb 2008 07:19 GMT

> > > Getting ready for micro-dragon war soon with biopsy on March 10th.
> > ...
[quoted text clipped - 42 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

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Waterspider - 23 Feb 2008 07:52 GMT

On Feb 22, 9:57 am, "déjà vu déjà vu" <jamf...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> "Cactus Jammies" <cactusjamm...@retinal.circus.orb> wrote in message
>
[quoted text clipped - 50 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

If your going to have treatment, what is the point of the biopsy?

I had a biopsy but based my treatment decison on the results. Just my
opinion,
but why have one when you know you are going to treat.

Exactly; a biopsy is not a pleasant experience and not one that is
particularly beneficial for one's overall wellbeing. But, what Dejavu needs
to know is that the biopsy is the only reliable method of determining liver
damage. Plus, some docs will not prescribe tx without evidence of
substantial damage, and some health insurance companies won't pay for the
drugs without the biopsy evidence.

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Paul - 24 Feb 2008 17:58 GMT

On Fri, 22 Feb 2008 23:52:53 -0800, "Waterspider" <nospam@all.com>, in
message ID <13rvl3og85dg6e7@corp.supernews.com>, in the newsgroup
alt.support.hepatitis-c wrote:

>On Feb 22, 9:57 am, "déjà vu déjà vu" <jamf...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> "Cactus Jammies" <cactusjamm...@retinal.circus.orb> wrote in message
[quoted text clipped - 64 lines]
>substantial damage, and some health insurance companies won't pay for the
>drugs without the biopsy evidence.

If there is no biopsy and the tx fails, you have no baseline to
measure from. If tx fails, people often have a biopsy every few years
to assess the rate of progression. Without an initial biopsy, part of
the equation is missing. However, if tx works OK then the usefulness
of a biopsy is limited. So tx should not be given to people with very
advanced, decompensated cirrhosis, but you would already be aware of
that due to symptoms. In the UK, there has been a movement towards
limiting biopsies for genos 2 and 3 due to the rate of success being
much greater. This would seem to bear out that a biopsy is more
useful for when a tx is going to fail - the obvious problem being, of
course, that no-one has a crystal ball.

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déjà vu déjà vu - 28 Feb 2008 21:31 GMT

On Feb 22, 9:57 am, "déjà vu déjà vu" <jamf...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> "Cactus Jammies" <cactusjamm...@retinal.circus.orb> wrote in message
>
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
>
> I might pass on the biopsy and maybe get cat scan instead. I live alone

and

> they wouldn't let me drive away by myself. I guess they worry about me
> bleeding to death, alone.
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

If your going to have treatment, what is the point of the biopsy?

I had a biopsy but based my treatment decison on the results. Just my
opinion,
but why have one when you know you are going to treat.
******************
Yeah, that's my thoughts also.
Little damage or a lot of damage, I still want to try treatment.
If I was falling out of an airplane without a parachute, would I want to
know my airspeed?
There's no question about, if I have the virus (after antibody and genotype
tests).
With 2.8+ million copies, my liver must be loaded.

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mawtuan - 12 Mar 2008 04:14 GMT

>> Getting ready for micro-dragon war soon with biopsy on March 10th.
> ...
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> cactus jammies 1b relapsed after tx in '04-'05

I've had that pain exactly as described for the past 3-4 years. It started
just prior to tx round #1, subsided just slightly by the week 40 or so, and
then came back full strength for the duration. It never went away again,
and never subsided throughout the 72 weeks of tx round #2. It's still
there, but I've learned to live with it.
Abdominal CT shows nothing in that area. BCLD says he had seen in before
in Hep C. Probably due to enlarged liver stretching the capsule. ???
Thom

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