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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Hepatitis / November 2004

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Shannan E Hofman Bunting - 12 Nov 2004 22:02 GMT
Hello All.

My mom received the results of her 2nd test today--confirming what we knew
to be true--Hep C.

So I am ready to arm myself for what's ahead & will probably be plaguing you
with lots of questions. First of all, can you help with the abbreviations? I
am really new to this...and I get the gist, but I would like to know
exactly. What do these mean?

Tx
RBV
SVR

Any more I should know?

Couple more questions & I will go quietly (for today):

How likely is she to loose her hair?  It may seem inconsequential to all of
you dealing with some of the stuff I have been reading here--but it matters
to her.

What is the average Viral Load for this--hers is 4,000,000--I don't know
what that means...can you give me an idea?

She sees a GI Specialist on Wednesday & I know he will fill in a lot of the
blanks, but if you could help get us started that would be great.

Shine on...
Shannan
Susie Quill - 12 Nov 2004 22:33 GMT
Tx = Treatment
I believe RBV is ribavarin
SVR = Sustained Viral Response  That is what we are all wanting out of
treatment.  For the virus not to show up anymore after treatment...A test is
taken during treatment, after treatment, and several months after treatment
to monitor results.

I think we all care about hair loss.  I lost a lot of hair, but am finished
with treatment and my beautician told me that I was growing a lot of new
hair.  Never went bald, just thinner.  It isn't the same as actual
chemotherapy.  Was a little scary seeing how much was falling out when I'd
get up in the morning and have a bunch of hair left on the pillow, or have a
lot of strands of hair come out in my hands when washing my hair.  However,
it wasn't clumps of hair as you may be imagining
However, it just went thinner.  I read that using silk pillowslips may
reduce hairloss.  At least it would reduce the amount of friction causing
the hair to be pulled out while sleeping.  Might help.  I couldn't get silk
pillowslips where I'm living and didn't have the energy to try to order them
after reading about it.

Some people have higher amounts of viral load than 4,000,000....some have
less.  It is just a way to quantify  the virus..  However, it doesn't really
tell you how much damage it is causing.  A biopsy is needed for that.
Someone can probably give you a better answer.  Have no idea what an average
would be.
This group is great for responding to questions and giving support.  Don't
hesitate to ask anything.
Susie

> Hello All.
>
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
> Shine on...
> Shannan
Gordo Mondragon - 12 Nov 2004 23:09 GMT
> Hello All.
>
> My mom received the results of her 2nd test today--confirming what we knew
> to be true--Hep C.

I'm assuming she's had it a long time - it's important to know if it's a
new infection or an old one as the treatment and prognosis are different.

I don't have any liver damage so I'm not up on what the different tests
and numbers mean, but there are people here who can help you understand
them if you ask.

Also, where are you located?  Treatment options are different in
different locations (US vs Canada vs UK....)

> So I am ready to arm myself for what's ahead & will probably be plaguing you
> with lots of questions. First of all, can you help with the abbreviations? I
> am really new to this...and I get the gist, but I would like to know
> exactly. What do these mean?
>
> Tx

Newsgroup shorthand for "treatment for Hep C".  Most people who are on
tx are on the combo therapy of interferon and ribavirin, with a duration
of 24 or 48 weeks depending on the genotype of the virus.  Her genotype
is something that you should make sure is known and part of the
conversation with the doctor.  The treatment length for one is not the
same as another.  The interferon is a shot usually once a week and the
pills taken twice a day WITH FOOD than has some fat in it.  This is very
important.  I've used ice cream, whole milk, rolled up slices of
lunchmeats and cheese.  Anything to get some fat with the pills.

The needles are very small, and as someone who hates needles I have to
say that I was OK with injecting myself after the first shot.  You can't
feel it once it gets under the skin so if she's concerned about being
able to do the shots she shouldn't worry.

A lot of the discussion here since I've been here (I'm in week 20 now)
has been on side-effects.  The doctors will say that there are some side
effects - including "mood swings" - but they get easier.  That's sort of
true, and you and your mom might want to ask for people's stories and
advice on what to be prepared for.  Some people have little problem with
it, some get very sick.  And it can change over time so knowing what
your plans are should something come up - she needs more help with
things, etc. - you won't have to figure it out on the spot.  Stress for
me is the killer, and avoiding it will help.

Because people come here with help for their side-effects, you will get
a skewed perception off how common they are.  Hopefully if she's on tx
she will be one of the many with few issues.

I personally would highly recommend discussing the proactive use of an
antidepressant.  I don't have any history of depression, really, so i
didn't think I needed it.  What I know now is that the tx can cause the
chemical symptoms of depression so taking drugs to counteract them can
make a huge difference.  I take Symbyax, a combo of Prozac and Zyprexa.  
The Zyprexa helps me sleep and calms the sometimes busy thinking, and
the Prozac stopped the crying jags.

There's also "riba rage" which some people get.  It varies in intensity,
it can make people really really irritable and easy to anger, and I've
seen it cause otherwise nice people to say really hateful things.   If
you're going to be helping her with this, you might think about what
that could feel like coming from your mother and how you'll deal with
it.  Trust me, it's not usually a case of truth spoken in anger - it's
usually just plain meanness and it's sometimes hard to control.  For
what it's worth, I have consistently gotten the same reaction from the
women that I explain it to - "welcome to my world, now you understand
what it feels like once a month".  Don't know if the women who post here
would agree or not.

Some people find - and are supported by their doctors - that marijuana
is excellent for treating some of the side-effects.  It works on nausea,
loss of appetite, and it's the only thing that works for the rage for
me.  There is a prescription equivalent called Marinol but most people
think the real thing works better.  It can be baked into brownies and
small amounts taken orally.  Something to consider.

Some people get strong fluish symptoms after taking their weekly
interferon shot.  I never had much reaction and I think that most would
agree that whatever reaction she has, it gets better quickly.

> RBV

Not sure.  RBC?  Red Blood Count, I believe.  The ribavirin can (and
probably will) suppress both her red and white cell counts.  If they get
too low then either the riba dose can be changed (that's what they did
for me) or drugs can be used to artificially boost them.  I'm not using
those, just watching to make sure they don't go too low.

> SVR

Sustained Viral Response.  aka killed the sucker.  

The first milestone after starting treatment is the 12-week test.  If
the virus isn't either undetectable or close to it (and no doubt Thomas
will explain the math better than I can) then it means that this
particular treatment is not working and it's usually stopped.  

What you have to remember is that the treatment right now is based on
studies that have been done and the statistical evaluation of those
studies.  It might be that only the first two months of interferon are
really needed, or that the riba is only needed for a short time but the
interferon is needed the full six months or a year, lots of things are
possible.  Hopefully someday there will be tests that allow us to know
better how long we need to take this stuff but for now it's almost all
based on "this worked for a bunch of people so we're going to try it
with you".

There are options if the 12-week test doesn't show what it should, and
there are options if the treatment doesn't end up working.  In that case
it's a decision that includes her current liver health, etc.  Just
remember that you should be told that there are other treatment options
- a different form of the interferon, etc. - if the first one doesn't
seem to be working.  Also as awful as it is to consider, some people
have needed a couple rounds of treatment to kill it off.

After the treatment is complete then there are periodic tests to show
that the virus is still gone.  I'm doing a one-month test and a
six-month, at least that's the plan so far.  

Also know that there is nothing other than this treatment that's been
shown to actually work.  If someone claims that taking herbs will cure
her, they're lying.  

[....]

> How likely is she to loose her hair?  It may seem inconsequential to all of
> you dealing with some of the stuff I have been reading here--but it matters
> to her.

I haven't heard any stories of people's hair falling out like with
cancer chemo.  What it does do is get thinner over time.  My hair was
already cut short and fairly thick so I haven't noticed it on my head.  
I did notice my beard is only about 3/4 density compared to before and I
noticed in the shower my pubic hair seemed to be thinner.  

> What is the average Viral Load for this--hers is 4,000,000--I don't know
> what that means...can you give me an idea?

Mine was 8 million on one test but that was during the initial infection
- I got it recently and started treatment right away.  If she's had it
for a while - is "chronic" - then other people can tell you how her
number compares to theirs.

> She sees a GI Specialist on Wednesday & I know he will fill in a lot of the
> blanks, but if you could help get us started that would be great.

An important use of this group is to get help in figuring out what
questions to ask.  There's a lot to learn in a very short time and it
can be overwhelming.

Also know that because of a mix of personality types and some people
being on treatment, there can be flareups here - and know in spite of
those episodes, the majority of people here mean well and have the
intention of being supportive.  

Gordo
Russ - 13 Nov 2004 01:43 GMT
nice post Gordo, I would like to add the viral load can vary quite a bit
from time to time. I had mine go from 4 million to 1 million (the point when
I started tx last year).

Welcome to the group. All I can say is keep doing what your doing, ask
questions. It takes a bit for all of this to sink in, but for everything you
learn, the less fear will have a grip on you. Knowledge is Power!!

Cya

Signature

Russ

Visit Alaska @ http://www.tannersacre.com

> > Hello All.
> >
[quoted text clipped - 154 lines]
>
> Gordo
Don - 13 Nov 2004 04:31 GMT
>Hello All.
>
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
>Shine on...
>Shannan

Welcome Shannan, and sorry to hear your mom has joined our not so
little club here.  In short time you'll be an expert on the terms we
use to discuss HCV treatment.  

Two important things your Mom and you will want to know about are her
HCV genotype and her stage of liver damage.  The genotype determines
the length of her tx (treatment with interferon 2 and riba) and the
liver condition of her liver is assessed with a procedure called a
biopsy.  The doctor takes a little sample of some liver cells with a
needle to see if her liver has suffered any damage.

I'm glad your mom has got somebody supporting her in this.  It makes
things so much easier.

Best Wishes,

Don
Shannan E Hofman Bunting - 13 Nov 2004 04:48 GMT
Thank you very much for all your kind help & support. I think one of the
worse parts is not knowing SO MUCH. So this is definitely a step in the
right direction.

I believe her condition is chronic, we think she has had it AT LEAST since
1988--when a doctor misread her tests & she was not diagnosed :( And to
answer another Q, we are in the US (Chicago)

I guess we will find out more on Wednesday.

Thanks again--I anticipate that your help & advice will become invaluable to
me, my mom & our family.

Thank you.
Shannan

>>Hello All.
>>
[quoted text clipped - 49 lines]
>
> Don
Michael L. Arends - 13 Nov 2004 13:40 GMT
Smiling Wickedly,  Shannan E Hofman Bunting answered:

> Thank you very much for all your kind help & support. I think one of the
> worse parts is not knowing SO MUCH. So this is definitely a step in the
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Thank you.
> Shannan

Shannan,

Just remember there is really no reason in the world for her to despair
too much.  I was very upset at first finding out I had Hep-c, I think
everyone is that way.  Ultimately, She can be treated and things will
work out. It might not be fun, although it IS very doable.

Listen to the doctors. Don't panic, and come back here often. You're
always welcome.

Michael
JV - 13 Nov 2004 19:36 GMT
For the hair loss. Nioxin really keeps the hair. It comes in 2 types for
reg hair, and for hair that is dyed or treated. It really does help. Its
at any beauty supply. I'm still using it. Good luck with your mom.
Its so nice of you to be getting ahead of what it coming. Knowledge is
power.
                                  Juanita
 
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