Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Epilepsy / December 2004
Complex Partial Seizures - Anxiety
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Massimo Scola - 22 Dec 2004 23:00 GMT Hello everyone
I started having seizures over six years ago, at the age of 23. I was diagnosed with Temporal Lobe Epilepsy, but I'm now not sure whether I have psychogenic seizures.
My neurologists are very surprised when I tell them what I do during the seizures and I was wonder whether any of you are experiencing the same thing.
My fits always happen during the night or in the early morning. I sometimes wake up, sometimes I don't. If I do, I get something like an anxiety attack. I feel very frightend/terror which, though it only lasts for a few seconds.
I get up and, believe it or not, I'm able to pick up my mobile phone number and ring my mother and tell her that "I'm frightended". She would then come over to my place almost immediately to calm me down. It has also happended that I've dragged my partner to the bathroom and showed him all my parfumes. Last week, I had another such seizure early in the morning.. I told my mum that I was calling my GP and that I was talking to "his girl". In fact, I was talking to our new next-door neighbour. I don't know the phone number by heart. I must have picked up the phone number which was written on a piece of paper which we put on our fridge with some magnets. I am never aware what I do during these seizures. I'm always told afterwards what happend.
After such a seizure, I usually feel frightend for several days and I always have a strange taste in my mouth.
Does anyone of you experience such a thing during a seizure? Does this sound like a complex partial seizure? If not, then I guess I have to look into the possibility (or reality!) that all these fits are non-epileptic seizures.
Thanks,
Massimo Switzerland
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G.Ross - 23 Dec 2004 05:39 GMT > Hello everyone > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > anxiety attack. I feel very frightend/terror which, though it only lasts > for a few seconds. *** If we're prone to seizures, they can happen more easily during the night, as our guards are 'down' and we are less alert than during the daytime. If you ever feel like you've been 'grinding your teeth' or biting tongue or cheeks during the night, I can write you and tell you about a mouth guard you can get to prevent those. One is made at a Dentist's (no needles, but it costs about $100. Canadian, I don't know how that translates to Euro currencies). The second version is about $40 and can be purchased at a Sporting good (Soccer or Ski) store and used if you tend to do that. (When I first had Complex Partial (temporal lobe) type szrs. many I had were during the night so my doctor recommended I get my Dentist to fit me for an Occlusal Splint -- what above is called if the Dentist makes it for you.) Anxiety and Fear can be Natural feelings during several of the types of seizures possible. If the neurologists are experienced with seizures, they should Recognize some of those symptoms as part of their treatment and diagnosis. Tell them too about below tastes or any aromas you sense that may not be there -- those are parts of the Aura and give clues to where the seizure might be starting. Many newer pills now are targeted to particular areas of treatment, so the better the Doctor can tell where the seizure focus is (where it starts), better they can select which or any pills they might want to prescribe. /
> I get up and, believe it or not, I'm able to pick up my mobile phone > number and ring my mother and tell her that "I'm frightended". She would [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > magnets. I am never aware what I do during these seizures. I'm always told > afterwards what happend. *** Either a Grand Mal or Complex Partial seizure will produce above type loss of awareness. If you use an Electric Kettle, you might want to make sure you have one that shuts itself off when it boils. Some we can get in North America will boil until you take the cord out, so during a stronger szr. or absence it could boil too long while you're 'away'. The loss of awareness (if you don't pass out) is sometimes called an Absence or Petit Mal seizure if you do any newsgroup searches. The stronger ones, like C.P. and Grand Mal can often end in loss of consciousness.
Do they have "Medic Alert" Bracelets or Necklaces over there? In North America many of us wear a medical tag so if we had a seizure while shopping or away from home, the Dr. can call the phone number, give our register number, get details on our medical conditions and any Medications we're using. Last is handy since they might give us something that could conflict with a Seizure Medication if they didn't realize what we were taking for medical use.
> After such a seizure, I usually feel frightend for several days and I > always have a strange taste in my mouth. **************************** *** What's the taste? That could be part of the Aura (onset) sign of the szr. If your seizures come from Temporal Lobes, the left side is supposed to produce a taste or odour that's Eggy or Acrid, the Right side (what I have) the Taste or Aroma is Lemony or Sour -- *Really strong Lemon Cleaners will give me an Aura and dizzy feeling just by being around me. I think on one of the First Aid charts at Julie's Idaho website, the Aura of each of the main seizure types is listed on the chart. If one of Julie's posts is still up on your reader, her Website is listed at the end of her messages. Click to there, bookmark it or set on Favorites, then look for First Aid for Seizures link and bookmark that too. (It's worth printing if you have others around you who might be able to use it. There's a Second one slightly different but is First Aid in Water for people who do Boating or Swimming and might have a seizure in water.)
> Does anyone of you experience such a thing during a seizure? Does this > sound like a complex partial seizure? If not, then I guess I have to look > into the possibility (or reality!) that all these fits are non-epileptic > seizures. ***** Usually if the complex partial generalizes (spreads) we lose consciousness and can wander off OR pass out on the floor. If the seizures are milder and just a dizzy feeling with the Aura like described above, some of those are called Simple Partial rather than the full C.P. or Grand Mal type seizures. (I don't have experience with Grand Mals, others here do and might have comments on that.) G./
> Thanks, > Massimo > Switzerland Massimo Scola - 23 Dec 2004 16:02 GMT Hi there
> Anxiety and Fear can be Natural feelings during several of the types of > seizures possible. If the neurologists are experienced with seizures, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > seizure focus is (where it starts), better they can select which or any > pills they might want to prescribe. / Well no, that strange metallic taste I have in mouth is after I had a seizure and it can last up to several days. So it's not an aura. An aura is something I get before a fit, right? My auras are, if I can feel them, intense deja-vu before I get the seizure and then I'm "gone" (unconcious)
> *** Either a Grand Mal or Complex Partial seizure will produce above type > loss of awareness. If you use an Electric Kettle, you might want to make [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Mal seizure if you do any newsgroup searches. The stronger ones, like > C.P. and Grand Mal can often end in loss of consciousness. But do CP and Grand Mal seizures make you walk around the house, pick up the phone and talk to someone? I'm sorry if I have to ask these questions, but so far, even my neurologists didn't quite understand why I was doing these things (I believe)
> I think on one of the First Aid charts at Julie's Idaho website, the > Aura of each of the main seizure types is listed on the chart. If one of > Julie's posts is still up on your reader, her Website is listed at the end > of her messages. Click to there, bookmark it or set on Favorites, then > look for First Aid for Seizures link and bookmark that too. That post is no longer on the news server of my ISP. Do you still have that URL?
> ***** Usually if the complex partial generalizes (spreads) we lose > consciousness and can wander off OR pass out on the floor. If the > seizures are milder and just a dizzy feeling with the Aura like described > above, some of those are called Simple Partial rather than the full C.P. > or Grand Mal type seizures. (I don't have experience with Grand Mals, > others here do and might have comments on that.) G./ Wandering off.. you mean, walking around the room/or house?
Again, thanks
Massimo
G.Ross - 23 Dec 2004 20:56 GMT > Hi there >> Anxiety and Fear can be Natural feelings during several of the types [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > I get the seizure > and then I'm "gone" (unconcious) ** An Aura is a Simple Partial seizure and can include a taste or aroma that's not there, a sensation of Deja Vu (if the focus of the szr. happened to be in the Right Temporal Lobe) or Jamais Vu (if it's in the Left T.Lobe -- where your own house might feel like you've wandered into a stranger's house by mistake). Also whether the Taste is Eggy or Sour tells whether it's from the Left or Right Temporal Lobe if that's where the seizures were starting. *Your's above sounded to a Non-Doctor like you might be grinding your teeth? or having absence seizures? and doing that, since *normally the aura of taste or aroma lasts for a Short Period -- under 10 minutes, and not Days like you suggested above. There *Might be others here who have auras that last that long, and They'll post *Now since I said they only last 10 minutes or so, but *I never had one that either didn't move on to the Full CP Seizure OR (when I got closer to full control) would Arise, and pass in less than that time.**
If the taste is lasting several days, you could ask the Dr. if there's a chance you could be biting down so hard you might be damaging Fillings? to produce that taste? or what else it might be. *Normally (many times) the Aura will last from Minutes up to e.g. about 40-80 minutes and either subside or move to a Stronger seizure. Mine were a warning, once I knew what they were, that a stronger szr. might be about to start and I should move somewhere Cool and sit down in case it got so strong that I lost awareness or consciousness. I responded to your "Deja Vu" comment above, since that's what I used to get ahead of a Complex Partial Seizure (older sites call it Temporal Lobe seizures), but the szr. starts in the *Right Temporal Lobe to produce that sensation. When my seizures were not controlled and would Generalize (spread through rest of the brain), was when I'd lose consciousness. I'd often do strange things Between those 2, from the Aura to loss of consciousness -- I've boarded buses I didn't need, thrown a security guard who was trying to hold me down about 6-8 feet from me (he was the same weight I was, and not a weight I'd 'normally' be able to lift easily), and those plus other events I only learned about from Others -- *I wasn't aware during the events or Following that I had done any of those things. /
>> *** Either a Grand Mal or Complex Partial seizure will produce above type >> loss of awareness. If you use an Electric Kettle, you might want to make [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > so far, even my neurologists didn't quite understand why I was doing these > things (I believe) ** I don't know the symptoms of a Grand Mal. *Usually with a CP type once it's gone past the Aura (taste, aroma, deja vu) part, I'd be unlikely to be able to use a phone or talk to anyone in a meaningful way. Perhaps someone else here who's had Grand Mals can respond to that. There is a Frequently asked Questions section under Julie's Idaho Foundation site. Main entrance is at http://www.epilepsyidaho.com . Check also e.g. no.14 item is First Aid for seizures to see if any of the symptoms are listed there. *I can't find the "olde" 2 First Aid Charts that were on that site (Julie are they still there somewhere? ) . IF you find or Julie posts the First Aid for seizures chart (main one plus one for first aid in Water), under the First one, it also had Excellent description of each of the ~5 types of seizures with Symptoms we might show to outsiders, Then what they should do to help us and minimize side effects as we 'come back'. You could also look at http://efa.org the Main US Ep Foundation Site. Some Older sites list our type of szrs under Temporal Lobe Epilepsy or Seizures, the Newer sites combine those types of seizures within "Complex Partial" seizures. So if you look at sites and can't find anything under the latter name, sometimes there's informatin under TLE if it had info. based on older research. In Many cases the fact that some of the research is 'old' doesn't make it less valuable to us, with respect to the information. /
>> I think on one of the First Aid charts at Julie's Idaho website, the >> Aura of each of the main seizure types is listed on the chart. **G* ABOVE was what I can't find there now./
> That post is no longer on the news server of my ISP. Do you still have > that URL? ** I posted 2 sites above **at top**.
>> ***** Usually if the complex partial generalizes (spreads) we lose >> consciousness and can wander off OR pass out on the floor. If the [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Wandering off.. you mean, walking around the room/or house? ** Yes, or in extreme cases you could even go outside etc. without being aware you're doing that. That's why most of us use e.g. Electric Kettles with an Auto-Off setting (some countries sell 2 types- one boils until it's unplugged), microwave ovens or ovens with an Off Timer (for reasons above too, in case someone were to have an absence or full seizure after starting e.g. baking, but be unaware or unconscious at the time when the baking is supposed to be removed or the oven turned off), and other aids that might help for those of us who have a Seizure while doing things around the house. I don't know if those are the only types they sell in **Europe or the British Isles. It seemed to me someone said that the safety type were the only ones they could buy.
**Some types of hot water tanks in N.America can have the Maximum Temperature adjusted downward, OR we have a Showerhead (in Canada/N.America) that adjusts to a temperature setting, then keeps that temperature constant so there's less risk of burns. People who can have Rapid Onset seizures are recommended to use Showers rather than Bathtubs in case they were to lose consciousness while in water. *I never had problems with that, even before I was fully controlled for Complex Partial Szrs. But it depends on the extremes of types of szrs. we have around the group.
If you also have trouble 'remembering things' (like whether you took your morning pills etc.) I have a few tricks I can post to prevent taking too many or too few pills etc. There may be some of those ideas also posted on that Idaho site.
Some of the 'regular posters' might be away on Holidays over Christmas to New Years, so they might add ideas when they're back too. We normally get 12-30 posts a day, depending on the topic or how many people are reading the group. G./
> Again, thanks > Massimo turbinado - 31 Dec 2004 01:58 GMT > But do CP and Grand Mal seizures make you walk around the house, pick up > the phone and talk to someone? I'm sorry if I have to ask these questions, > but > so far, even my neurologists didn't quite understand why I was doing these > things (I believe) I get complex partials and I have woken up several blocks away, or on a bus, or in different rooms of my house. My doctor seems to think that's a "normal" manifestation of CP seizures. I used to get grand mals, but since I've been on medication it's only been CPs. I take 1000 mg of Tegretol per day, and it has not completely eliminated them. I am now being considered for surgery to my right temporal lobe.
Satch - 31 Dec 2004 05:26 GMT > But do CP and Grand Mal seizures make you walk around the house, pick up > the phone and talk to someone? I'm sorry if I have to ask these questions, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > things (I believe) Yes, that can happen with certain types of epilepsy as well. Epilepsy can manifest in multiple kind of ways. The question though is why doesn't your neurologist know these kind of things? If you can find this on the web, in this newsgroup, why can't he/she not find this and why does he say that he does not really understand you? - Thanks.
Marco The Netherlands
tossie - 24 Dec 2004 02:17 GMT Hello,
I have seizures similar to ones you've had and have been having them since I was 7 years old. I am now almost 20 and on average have them once a day. I don't think they are as bad as some of the ones you have described though. I have had some where I've gotten up in the middle of the night and gone around like I was sleep walking. It was a true seizure though. I do think the ones you described look like complex partial seizures. That is the type I have. Feeling frightened about a seizure that ocurred doesn't seem uncommon to me. Especially if you don't have them very frequently. Thinking about it, what you say feels like you are frightened could be the feeling of an aura lasting for a while. I usually have an aura in a seizure. The aura I have also feels a little like a feeling of being nervous. Also, I used to throw-up at times when I would have a seizure, so you might not need to worry too much about having a weird taste in your mouth. I hope things get better for you.
> Hello everyone > [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > Massimo > Switzerland CyberCafe - 24 Dec 2004 17:00 GMT > Hello everyone > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > seizures and I was wonder whether any of you are experiencing the same > thing. My first neurologist, who really didn't specialize in epilepsy but had an "interest" in it, called my symptoms bizaare. That was before the EEG came back positive. Sometimes I think these doctors are more interested in the variation of symptoms we can have. When I was at the doctor this week, a different neurologist, she was interested in the symptoms too.
> My fits always happen during the night or in the early morning. I sometimes > wake up, sometimes I don't. If I do, I get something like an anxiety attack. Anxiety attacks was one of the first symptoms I had years ago. Seizures during sleep, during trying to fall asleep have been pretty common for me.
> I feel very frightend/terror which, though it only lasts for a few seconds. Yup, that's another symptom.
> I get up and, believe it or not, I'm able to pick up my mobile phone number > and ring my mother and tell her that "I'm frightended". She would then come [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > of paper which we put on our fridge with some magnets. I am never aware what > I do during these seizures. I'm always told afterwards what happend. I've heard of that happening. I have almost one year gone from my memory where I could not for the life of me remember things like my daughter's high school graduation. Another problem I have found comes from the people who are trying to help you remember ant they things wrong. For example, a friend of mine talked about the time we almost hit a garbage truck. I was totally confused (thinking I forgot another event) until I recalled it was a pulp (tree logs) truck and not a garbage truck. So don't trust totally what someone else tells you because they can mess the story up. .
> After such a seizure, I usually feel frightend for several days and I always > have a strange taste in my mouth. That feeling frightened goes with temporal lobe seizures it seems. It can come before or after. For myself, if I am experiencing paranoia/fear, that usually means I'm going to have a seizure sooner or later. This last round of seizures, the fear/paranoia hung on for quite a few days after my final seizure. I don't get the strange taste, but everyone is different.
> Does anyone of you experience such a thing during a seizure? Does this sound > like a complex partial seizure? If not, then I guess I have to look into the > possibility (or reality!) that all these fits are non-epileptic seizures. Did they do an EEG and what were the results? They sure sound like complex partial seizures to me (I have the same type).
Barb
> Thanks, > > Massimo > Switzerland > > ;
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