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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Epilepsy / December 2004Being sz free isn't the only requirement for a licence
Hi folks, it's me come to have a whinge again, Yep, I've been free of seizures for yonks, and took over control of my medication as my new GP turned out to be an a.shole who you may recall didn't know the difference between epilepsy and ECT. I dumped him and organised my own gradual withdrawal from meds. So I'm safe, happy and one of the people lucky enough to have a licence. Even a lorry rental firm was happy when I needed to move - "If the DVLA thinks you're OK to drive, then so do we. It's no problem." My licence has come up for three yearly renewal, and I thought it would just be a case of ploughing through the paperwork again. Not so. Buried deep in the small print is the following section to sign: "I agree to follow the advice of my doctors concerning any treatment for epilepsy, attend appointments as necessary..." 2500 UKP fine for false declarations, and an extra 1000UKP for failing to provide info. 5000+ or six months prison for not following instructions. What this means is that in order to get my licence I have legally to agree to go back on the medication and yessir, nosir to my idiotic GP. The least compliant group of patients is people with schizophrenia, but even they don't have to sign an agreement that they'll stick to a brain- numbing drug regime. So I now have three choices - I go back to the brain fog, I stop driving even though I've been sz free for ages, or I lie and risk prison again (that's risk again, not prison again!). Yours unhappily,  SignatureMalcolm (who thinks being forced to take unnecessary drugs in order to get a licence is an infringement of personal liberties) > Hi folks, it's me come to have a whinge again, Hello and greetings and welcome back! > Yep, I've been free of seizures for yonks, and took over control of my > medication as my new GP turned out to be an a.shole who you may recall [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > declarations, and an extra 1000UKP for failing to provide info. 5000+ or > six months prison for not following instructions. I don't remember seeing that ... > What this means is that in order to get my licence I have legally to > agree to go back on the medication and yessir, nosir to my idiotic GP. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > brain fog, I stop driving even though I've been sz free for ages, or I > lie and risk prison again (that's risk again, not prison again!). Or you change your GP. > Yours unhappily, Yes it is, do consider changing ... Unhappy now, Mary > Hi folks, it's me come to have a whinge again, > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > declarations, and an extra 1000UKP for failing to provide info. 5000+ or > six months prison for not following instructions. *** So you follow advice of your doctors, just not the one you fired. When you get a new G.P. or ask about a referral you'll have a new Neuro if you decide you need one or have any setbacks, like Mary said? > What this means is that in order to get my licence I have legally to > agree to go back on the medication and yessir, nosir to my idiotic GP. ** How hard is it to find a New GP and sign a release to get your Med. records transferred ? That's all that's involved in Canada. My Neuro renews my repeats for the pills *I use, but it's my G.P. who fills in any Insurance, Motor Vehicle etc. forms since he's 'my doctor', and gets Communications and info. about me Txed from my Neuro to him. /G. *** Look-- prison ain't so bad, just ask Martha !! :-> I didn't read anything in what you wrote above about your being a felon, etc. You just said you hadn't had a seizure for ?? so you're outside the window where any suspension would apply? I think it's last 6 mos. in Canada, down from 1 year 'clean', so if you had a Recent one then your shoudn't drive. But if you haven't or are Controlled (with or without meds.) then you're off. (If you had asked me, I would have suggested staying on whatever you took while you changed doctors and removed whatever it was with the *2nd Doctor, but that's only because of reactions with some pills like Tegretol to Prompt Stopping of them. If the Dr. agreed you could try come off, they would give you a step by step sequence to remove them. My Night Tegretol (2 tablets) took about 4-6 weeks, as we replaced it with another pill. But that was specific to above pill and its nature. It wouldn't necessarily apply to you, as you've gotten off your meds. without incident? ) / > The least compliant group of patients is people with schizophrenia, but > even they don't have to sign an agreement that they'll stick to a brain- [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Yours unhappily, *** Quit it, it's just the weekend getting to you? Here I'll show you where we hide the Chocolate. "One of these makes you smaller and the other makes you tall, and these ones with the 'M' have special pain relievers.. Funny that, I just thought that meant they were Your's ... G./ :-> > -- > Malcolm (who thinks being forced to take unnecessary drugs in order to get a > licence is an infringement of personal liberties) *** Only if they're truly unnecessary. In my case, the reverse applies and I wouldn't consider driving without making sure I was in full control. That has to do with the liberties of others ahead of me on the roadway. / >"M" <webmaster@need.to.remain.anon> wrote in message >> What this means is that in order to get my licence I have legally to >> agree to go back on the medication and yessir, nosir to my idiotic GP. >** How hard is it to find a New GP and sign a release to get your Med. >records transferred ? That's all that's involved in Canada. Not so easy in England. Most GPs no longer act as individual doctors, but as practices which cover a defined catchment area. Within the practices, patients are assigned to a particular doctor, who has overall responsibility on paper for that patient, although if I visit the practice, I might end up seeing any of a number of doctors within the trust. Private GPs cost a lot of money and are not very frequently found (none round here). Therefore I have no option but to register with this practice unless I move house into a different catchment area. > My Neuro >renews my repeats for the pills *I use, but it's my G.P. who fills in any >Insurance, Motor Vehicle etc. forms since he's 'my doctor', and gets >Communications and info. about me Txed from my Neuro to him. /G. > >*** Look-- prison ain't so bad, just ask Martha !! :-> I'm sure that having just escaped after 20 years working in a boarding school it would be a step backwards. And I gather that steps backwards in UK prisons are uncomfortable ones :) >I didn't read >anything in what you wrote above about your being a felon, etc. You just >said you hadn't had a seizure for ?? so you're outside the window where any >suspension would apply? I think it's last 6 mos. in Canada, down from 1 >year 'clean', so if you had a Recent one then your shoudn't drive. But if >you haven't or are Controlled (with or without meds.) then you're off. That's what I would have thought, but the fact that I have to agree to compulsory medical treatment when everything is running smoothly is now a UK prerequisite for a permanent licence, and I am not prepared to sign that part of the form. > (If you had asked me, I would have suggested staying on whatever you took >while you changed doctors and removed whatever it was with the *2nd Doctor, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >that was specific to above pill and its nature. It wouldn't necessarily >apply to you, as you've gotten off your meds. without incident? ) / No probs whatsoever. I came off sensibly and increasingly slowly and am so much happier without them. >> The least compliant group of patients is people with schizophrenia, but >> even they don't have to sign an agreement that they'll stick to a brain- [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >makes you tall, and these ones with the 'M' have special pain relievers.. >Funny that, I just thought that meant they were Your's ... G./ :-> Yours is already a possessive and does not require an apostrophe :\ >> -- >> Malcolm (who thinks being forced to take unnecessary drugs in order to get [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >I wouldn't consider driving without making sure I was in full control. >That has to do with the liberties of others ahead of me on the roadway. 29 years of legal/illegal motorbiking/driving and not a seizure to show for it. I think I'm in control. SignatureMalcolm > X-No-Archive: yes >>"M" <webmaster@need.to.remain.anon> wrote in message [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > practice, I might end up seeing any of a number of doctors within the > trust. Oh Malcolm, you can change to another practice easily. It doesn't have to be in your catchment area ... > I gather that steps backwards > in UK prisons are uncomfortable ones :) LOL >> (If you had asked me, I would have suggested staying on whatever you >> took [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > Yours is already a possessive and does not require an apostrophe :\ You're feeling more positive already! >>> -- >>> Malcolm (who thinks being forced to take unnecessary drugs in order to [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > 29 years of legal/illegal motorbiking/driving and not a seizure to show > for it. I think I'm in control. You know, Malcolm, this is how you were talking when I first saw you in this group. You became much happier, apparently, and in control and positive and now you've slipped back into the doldrums. I don't like it, for the sake of a few words ... You CAN change your GP. You have to want to and not find reason for not doing so. Hugs, Mary >Oh Malcolm, you can change to another practice easily. It doesn't have to be >in your catchment area ... I have tried 3 in other areas. They ask for my postcode, consult a chart and then say no. SignatureMalcolm Howdy M! Sounds like it may be time to talk to a barrister! What has a higher penalty: application fraud or driving without a license? SignatureDave ???? http://www.howdydave.com > X-No-Archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I have tried 3 in other areas. They ask for my postcode, consult a chart > and then say no. Dave ©¿©¬ <dave@_nospam_howdydave.com> wrote >Howdy M! > >Sounds like it may be time to talk to a barrister! > >What has a higher penalty: application fraud or driving without a license? Probably driving without a licence. They's definitely bang me up for that as I've already been to court for it once. But with licence fraud I think previous convictions would also be taken into account as well, so maybe non-compliance is the least expensive option - say "yes, no, whatever you want" to the ECT man and ignore him completely - I think he'd be unlikely to complain back to the DVLA. Probably the least offensive offence would be lying about my address in order to register with a different GP. But then when form filling time came along, I guess there'd be confusion, so maybe that wouldn't work. No racing today so I've had a lie-in, and Wow, this morning's coffee is strong enough to remove my fillings! Which reminds me, NHS dentists are fun to find as well, and I've been unsuccessful there (I'm beginning to see why illegal immigrants don't register with anything (my local council pestered me endlessly and finally threatened me with 1000UKP fine if I didn't fill in the electoral roll forms!)) But if I had tooth problems, at least it would be legal to drive with toothache or an abscess :-& ...(having fun trying to find the best emoticon for toothache... . :-& :-# :-@ :-$ :-+ :-Z :-X SignatureMalcolm > (my local > council pestered me endlessly and finally threatened me with 1000UKP > fine if I didn't fill in the electoral roll forms!)) WHAT??? I've never heard of that ... Mary >> (my local >> council pestered me endlessly and finally threatened me with 1000UKP [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> >Mary Yes, you have to be on the electoral roll. They kept on sending me the forms and I kept on binning them because I get so much junk mail here anyway and I had better things to do and I know that in this constituency my vote means pig all anyway. Eventually I had a letter in bright red ink, from a council prosecutions dept informing me that if I didn't fill in the enclosed form, or confirm the details of all people of voting age residing at my address over the 'phone, I would be taken to court and fined 1000UKP. So now you've heard of it, courtesy of Adur District Council. SignatureMalcolm >>> (my local >>> council pestered me endlessly and finally threatened me with 1000UKP [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > anyway and I had better things to do and I know that in this > constituency my vote means pig all anyway. Being on the register doesn't mean you hve to vote. Mary >> Yes, you have to be on the electoral roll. They kept on sending me the >> forms and I kept on binning them because I get so much junk mail here [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> >Mary I know that, but you still have to be on the electoral roll... or when the government introduce compulsory ID cards they won't know who you are :) But then, it's the law, and the law is a total a.s, so what would we expect? PS: Dontcha just love the hunting people who are going to appeal against the government's ruling in the High Court, and then say they they'll disobey the act if it become law anyway? I think there's a non sequitur in there somewhere. Ho hum. Back to writing exams....... SignatureMalcolm http://www.zared.com/Regional/Europe/United_Kingdom/England/West_Sussex/Adur/ >>Oh Malcolm, you can change to another practice easily. It doesn't have to >>be >>in your catchment area ... > > I have tried 3 in other areas. They ask for my postcode, consult a chart > and then say no. But it's your right ... <puzzled> Mary >>>Oh Malcolm, you can change to another practice easily. It doesn't have to >>>be [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >But it's your right ... So's NHS dentistry, but if a practice says its full they'll turn you away if you're not in their catchment area. Maybe your area is organised differently to mine on the regional trust system. Try it and see. Maybe I should go back to the super practice up in Surrey and re- register there (except I only got in because the dividing line ran along the centre of the road and I was able to claim I lived in Peaslake rather than Ewhurst). SignatureMalcolm It sounds stupid to me that you are forced to take meds again when you really do not need (7 years seizure free!). In The Netherlands we have a catchment area as well. If you are not happy with one doctor, then you are not happy with the other doctor. Maybe talk to your local epilepsy foundation. They may be able to help you out here but please do not sign something when your GP does not really back you up. SignatureThanks. Marco The Netherlands Hi Malcolm, glad to hear that you're doing so well. I had a similar problem several years ago when I tried to claim long-term disability from my group insurance. If you're not following the treatment prescribed by your physician, you're screwed. :( At the time I was adamantly opposed to taking AEDs so I just did without the money. I don't know how your medical system works over there - are you allowed to shop around for MDs or do you have to go to your assigned one? I hope you can find a decent solution to your dilemma... Keep drug- and seizure-free! cheers, Hilary > Hi folks, it's me come to have a whinge again, > [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > Malcolm (who thinks being forced to take unnecessary drugs in order to get a > licence is an infringement of personal liberties) Hi Malcolm, Are you able to go to your regular doctor stating how long you have been drug and seizure free and get a written clearance from him stating that you no longer need the drugs? Darryl. > Hi folks, it's me come to have a whinge again, > [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > Yours unhappily, Hi If you agree to take whatever meds the doctors advises and meet him when he wants you to fine. Simply put the meds in the bin, your doctor will not be standing beside you when you are supposed to take them we he? Maybe I've missed something and it's not quite as easy as I think. Kenny > Hi > If you agree to take whatever meds the doctors advises and meet him when he > wants you to fine. > Simply put the meds in the bin, your doctor will not be standing beside you ********************************************************** > when > you are supposed to take them we he? > Maybe I've missed something and it's not quite as easy as I think. > > Kenny Yup - Splash? / If you weren't controlled and stopped, the Doctor is out of the loop, well except for the Last One, who has to sign the Release at the Hospital before they wheel you out. They can tell from your Blood Levels if you were taking the Prescription the Doctor had written for you or not. I don't understand the supposed stigma so many people put on taking a level of medications that can give 100% control? BTW, AOL is becoming an Unstable ISP wrt. volumes of troll mails following posts here. If you have another access route you might be better off using it. I almost just discarded above, but thought someone might think your option was serious, if they already had full control and stable med. levels. G./ >I don't understand the supposed >stigma so many people put on taking a level of medications that can give >100% control? Not a stigma, but side-effects. SignatureMalcolm > X-No-Archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Not a stigma, but side-effects. > Malcolm G.- That's not what the earlier poster said, unless it was in mails that expired here already. His post contained this which I replied about, and it was on a thread that started about driving and being in full control --> Hi If you agree to take whatever meds the doctors advises and meet him when he wants you to fine. Simply put the meds in the bin, your doctor will not be standing beside you ************************ when you are supposed to take them we he? Maybe I've missed something and it's not quite as easy as I think. Kenny >> X-No-Archive: yes >> [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >Maybe I've missed something and it's not quite as easy as I think. >Kenny Your machine is obviously on a different Internet to mine. I started the thread because I don't like the mind-fogging meds, I'm stable without them and yet I have to agree to follow my doctor's every command to take them in order to get a licence, even after about 7 year sz free. End of whinge. I'm off back to ASA, sorry Mary. SignatureMalcolm "M" <webmaster@need.to.remain.anon> wrote in message > End of whinge. I'm off back to ASA, sorry Mary. I look forward to another time - but not for the same reason. Mary Hi All If he is not having seizures anymore why would he be in hospital? But he knows I hope that if there he is likely to have them again without the Meds. then he should not be driving anyway oder? Kenny > Hi All > If he is not having seizures anymore why would he be in hospital? > But he knows I hope that if there he is likely to have them again without the > Meds. > then he should not be driving anyway oder? > Kenny I don't remember if they said. On another thread, but related, many months ago -- I had been told that if I wasn't compliant or uncontrolled and chose to drive, that any Liability Insurance I had through my auto insurer would be void. Since many liability settlements might be in range of $100,000 to $400,000? to replace income of a Breadwinner killed in an accident by someone not controlled, it could be potentially an expensive experiment so long as the person involved wasn't controlled. Secondly, if they appeared on CBC, or CNN as the cause of a major accident, that wouldn't be a positive advertisement for the rest of us, and might result in the wait times, before we'd be clear to drive, being Increased rather than reduced. G./ If his doctor still thinks he is taking medication, then it is likely that someone is looking at his blood levels and at that point, they find no sign of it (good catch Gaross). I did not think about that. But still, I would refuse to take some pills with all these side effects, when I do not need it. SignatureThanks. Marco The Netherlands Though it is not the best way to do it, I was about to say the same thing: just throw them in the bin. Fact is, if you sign the agreement, then you agree with the contents of it. If you are seizure free, then there is no logical reason why you need to go back to the meds again except for a bureacratic shitty rule. SignatureThanks. Marco The Netherlands > If you are seizure free, then there is no logical reason why you need to > go > back to the meds again except for a bureacratic shitty rule. Marco, if you leave a bit of the previous post in we'll know what you're talking about. None of your comments today makes any sense to me because there's no context. Mary > None of your comments today makes any sense to me because there's no > context. It usually doesn't; with or without context :-) Pardon me, it won't happen again. SignatureThanks. Marco The Netherlands >> None of your comments today makes any sense to me because there's no >> context. > > It usually doesn't; with or without context :-) LOL! I'm sure it would. > Pardon me, it won't happen > again. Forgiven :-)))))))))))))) Mary Can't you get a one time appointment with another doctor for a second opinion? Just go in, tell the doc that you have been seizure free and med free for 7 years (or whatever) and get a clean bill of health! SignatureDave ???? http://www.howdydave.com > Though it is not the best way to do it, I was about to say the same thing: > just throw them in the bin. Fact is, if you sign the agreement, then you > agree with the contents of it. > > If you are seizure free, then there is no logical reason why you need to go > back to the meds again except for a bureacratic shitty rule. |
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