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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Epilepsy / December 2003Ridding the world of epilepsy
If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. That would mean that this ng would be redundant and no-one would be afraid of being alone and no-one would ever be alarmed, frightened or disgusted about witnessing a seizure. Oh joy! Oh Brave New World!! Mary But epilepsy can start at any time in life when the brain is disturbed by internal or external causes. > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. > That would mean that this ng would be redundant and no-one would be afraid > of being alone and no-one would ever be alarmed, frightened or disgusted > about witnessing a seizure. > Oh joy! > Oh Brave New World!! > Mary > But epilepsy can start at any time in life when the brain is disturbed by > internal or external causes. I know. That's why I said, very carefully, "If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted as developing epilepsy ... Mary > > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > > Mary I had my first seizure when I was 49. You missed !! :-< G./ > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Mary > -- >bject: Re: Ridding the world of epilepsy >From: "gaross" gaross@rogers.com [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >> Mary >> -- first seizure at 10 > I had my first seizure when I was 49. You missed !! :-< G./ I was 54. So nyer nyer :-) Mary First seizure at age19, after birth of first child:) Wendy > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Mary > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Mary Except there are those of us who think that even though someone has epilepsy, that doesn't mean they can't live a fulfilling life. Murdering people because they have a disease is a concept Adolph Hitler made quite popular. Ironic that liberals haven't changed much since then. > > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be > predicted [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Murdering people because they have a disease is a concept Adolph Hitler made > quite popular. Ironic that liberals haven't changed much since then. Plus there's the list on http://efa.org or ?? (Julie or Howdy's sites?) that list 20-30 famous artisans, philosophers, seers, and politicians :-o through history, who had or were Thought to have had Epilepsy... Even several Musicians in recent history (still alive) who have Epilepsy and lead essentially normal lives. They all make valuable contributions to our Culture and our Lives. As do we all here.... G. > Plus there's the list on http://efa.org or ?? (Julie or Howdy's sites?) that > list 20-30 famous artisans, philosophers, seers, and politicians :-o > through history, who had or were Thought to have had Epilepsy... Even > several Musicians in recent history (still alive) who have Epilepsy and lead > essentially normal lives. > They all make valuable contributions to our Culture and our Lives. As do > we all here.... G. YES!!!!!!!!!! Mary > > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be > predicted [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Except there are those of us who think that even though someone has > epilepsy, that doesn't mean they can't live a fulfilling life. At LAST! That's the response I was playing Devil's advocate for ... and I'd add that anyone with any perceived problem has a value. > Murdering people because they have a disease is a concept Adolph Hitler made > quite popular. Ironic that liberals haven't changed much since then. No. Except that more and more we're seeing demands for not waiting to see if people have diseases as adults. Mary > At LAST! > > That's the response I was playing Devil's advocate for ... and I'd add that > anyone with any perceived problem has a value. > > > > Murdering people because they have a disease is a concept Adolph Hitler made > > quite popular. Ironic that liberals haven't changed much since then. > > No. Except that more and more we're seeing demands for not waiting to see if > people have diseases as adults. > > Mary *** When did Epilepsy become a 'Disease'? :-< Is that Quicksand I hear?? G./ > > No. Except that more and more we're seeing demands for not waiting to see > if [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > *** When did Epilepsy become a 'Disease'? :-< Is that Quicksand I > hear?? G./ I didn't say it was. Very many - er, conditions if you prefer - are regarded as undesirable in children and adults. If they could be predicted I reckon that some prospective parents wouldn't want to rear the child because of that. and society seems to be more and more prepared to accept that attitude. Mary "Mary Fisher" <> wrote in message .news.uni-berlin.de... > "gaross" <> wrote in message > > > > > > No. Except that more and more we're seeing demands for not waiting to see if > > > people have diseases as adults. > > > Mary [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > attitude. > Mary ** Agreed. G.R. > > > No. Except that more and more we're seeing demands for not waiting to > see [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > > Mary Intolerance & the desire to have everyone conform to someone's definition of "normal" are also undesirable traits.  SignatureMike K == remove random numbers to email > > > > No. Except that more and more we're seeing demands for not waiting to see if > > > > people have diseases as adults. > > > > Mary [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > == > remove random numbers to email I was only Teasing Mary. She has a history here of Tolerance... It's not that often that some of us find something to tease her about, even including typos or us trying to find a shorter way to express what we mean. I sometimes just use szrs. or something, since calling it a condition etc. is a lot more typing, if you post frequently. (Those 2? posts picked me up more than 42 *new auto-killed spams overnight, and another 23 this morning. I wish the trolls would point their robots at other groups. ) G. / What? You abbreviate big words such as 'antidisestablishmentarianism', not 9 letter words such as 'condition'. You're getting lazy in your old age. > "Mike K" <.uk> wrote in message news:newsrandom-C5EA00.07122204122003@news.news.demon.net... > > > "gaross" <> wrote in message news:0lszb.37676$Y4R1.9065@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com... > > > > > No. Except that more and more we're seeing demands for not waiting > to see if [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > and another 23 this morning. I wish the trolls would point their robots at > other groups. ) G. / Howdy Ian! How about: pnultmicslcmono.? SignatureDave ???? "Noli illigitemi carborundum decendus" http://www.howdydave.com > What? You abbreviate big words such as > 'antidisestablishmentarianism', not 9 letter words such as > 'condition'. You're getting lazy in your old age. That's not in yourdictionary.com. What's it mean? > Howdy Ian! > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > 'antidisestablishmentarianism', not 9 letter words such as > > 'condition'. You're getting lazy in your old age. Howdy Ian! pnultmicslcmono. stands for pnumonoultramicroscopicsylacovomononucliosis (sp?) SignatureDave ???? "Noli illigitemi carborundum decendus" http://www.howdydave.com > That's not in yourdictionary.com. What's it mean? > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > as > > > 'condition'. You're getting lazy in your old age. > Howdy Ian! > > pnultmicslcmono. stands for > pnumonoultramicroscopicsylacovomononucliosis (sp?) You're on your own there Dave....can't help you spell that...much less saying it 3 times fast... Jedi and Son Howdy Mike! IMNSHO: "Normal" is a fallacy! There is "the norm" which is a statistical calculation (we won't get into norm v. mean here.) At best (or worst depending on your point of view) "normal" is a range not an ideal. SignatureDave ???? "Noli illigitemi carborundum decendus" http://www.howdydave.com > Intolerance & the desire to have everyone conform to someone's > definition of "normal" are also undesirable traits. >I didn't say it was. Very many - er, conditions if you prefer - are regarded >as undesirable in children and adults. If they could be predicted I reckon [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> >Mary I agree. Maybe we should also test for heart attacks, cancers and AIDS and abort them as well. Then we'd have an NHS large enough to cope with the reduced number of patients. See? Easy! Tony, are you listening? SignatureMalcolm > I agree. Maybe we should also test for heart attacks, cancers and AIDS > and abort them as well. Then we'd have an NHS large enough to cope with > the reduced number of patients. > > See? Easy! Tony, are you listening? Oh, don't bother Our Glorious Leader, he's frightfully busy organising a very small party for the rugby team. And solving the World's problems. Mary Howdy Mary! As others have pointed out, that wouldn't rid the world of the problem. BUT Once we have eleminated the problem of epilepsy at birth, we could take care of the rest of the problem by putting down everybody else when they reach puberty. That would do wonders for the population explosion too! SignatureDave ???? "Noli illigitemi carborundum decendus" http://www.howdydave.com > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Mary > Howdy Mary! > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > of the rest of the problem by putting down everybody else when they reach > puberty. Now that's an approach I'd never thought of. I've often thought that children should all be born as orphans but your suggestion is worthy of more careful consideration. > That would do wonders for the population explosion too! I hang my head about that, having added my litter to all the others. I didn't want children but lust is a powerful urge. Mary > > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be > predicted [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > > > Mary >ubject: Re: Ridding the world of epilepsy >From: "Mary Fisher" someone.else@zetnet.co.uk [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] >> > >> > Mary I"m afraid to ask what wonderful thing you would suggest doing to someone who has seizures from a head injury sustained from an accident when they are middleaged. Or someone who gets a brain tumor, most people dont have epilepsy or seizures from birth. With some it just turns up when they are 10,20,30,50 etc. > I"m afraid to ask what wonderful thing you would suggest doing to someone who > has seizures from a head injury sustained from an accident when they are > middleaged. Or someone who gets a brain tumor, most people dont have epilepsy > or seizures from birth. With some it just turns up when they are 10,20,30,50 > etc. Don't be afraid. I'd want to give the kind of support I had when I had a tumour. But it sometimes seems that I'm part of a minority. Mary Howdy Nomad! That's easy! If we put everybody down when they reach puberty, nobody would ever get to "middle aged" thus taking care of the problem of middle aged head injuries! SignatureDave ???? "Noli illigitemi carborundum decendus" http://www.howdydave.com > I"m afraid to ask what wonderful thing you would suggest doing to someone who > has seizures from a head injury sustained from an accident when they are > middleaged. Or someone who gets a brain tumor, most people dont have epilepsy > or seizures from birth. With some it just turns up when they are 10,20,30,50 > etc. Dave ©¿©¬ <dave@_nospam_howdydave.com> wrote >Howdy Nomad! > >That's easy! > >If we put everybody down when they reach puberty, nobody would ever get to >"middle aged" thus taking care of the problem of middle aged head injuries! Hang on - who's going to be doing the putting down ???? Or will that be left as a job for late onset (19) idiopathic people like me who fell through the birth filter and were too old for the pubertal cull? Oh good - my chance to be a psychopathic serial killer! Shall we take it in turns Pablo? SignatureMalcolm > >If we put everybody down when they reach puberty, nobody would ever get to > >"middle aged" thus taking care of the problem of middle aged head injuries! [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Oh good - my chance to be a psychopathic serial killer! Shall we take it > in turns Pablo? Perhaps we could start a ng for volunteers. I'll do my grandchhildren ... and their friends ... and the kids up the street ... oh I'm beginning to enjoy this! Mary > Perhaps we could start a ng for volunteers. > > I'll do my grandchhildren ... and their friends ... and the kids up the > street ... oh I'm beginning to enjoy this! > > Mary i've always wanted an excuse to knock off those noisy beggars next door. do you reckon the court will accept my excuse that i was only trying to rid the world of disease? pablo > > Perhaps we could start a ng for volunteers. > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > you reckon the court will accept my excuse that i was only trying to rid the > world of disease? I bet you'd have a lot of support. Mary > pablo I'll do all the lawyers & all the doctors that have ever made some stupid comment to me since I joined the tle club; on the other hand, machine guns would jam before I could kill that many people. > > >If we put everybody down when they reach puberty, nobody would ever get > to [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Mary >I'll do all the lawyers & all the doctors that have ever >made some stupid comment to me since I joined the tle club; >on the other hand, machine guns would jam before I could >kill that many people. I want either the brats I have to teach, or Internet bulk-mailers, please! SignatureMalcolm > >I'll do all the lawyers & all the doctors that have ever > >made some stupid comment to me since I joined the tle club; [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I want either the brats I have to teach, or Internet bulk-mailers, > please! WHAT HAVE I STARTED???? !!!!!!!!!!!! Mary :-)))))) Howdy Mary! It's called a pressure release valve! (or "relief valve" depending on what neck of the woods you're from) SignatureDave ???? "Noli illigitemi carborundum decendus" http://www.howdydave.com > > >I'll do all the lawyers & all the doctors that have ever > > >made some stupid comment to me since I joined the tle club; [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Mary :-)))))) >WHAT HAVE I STARTED???? !!!!!!!!!!!! > >Mary :-)))))) Why, a cure for epilepsy of course, Oh Great One! In humility and adoration, SignatureMalcolm > >WHAT HAVE I STARTED???? !!!!!!!!!!!! > > > >Mary :-)))))) > > Why, a cure for epilepsy of course, Oh Great One! Oh yes, of course, I'd forgotten, thanks. > In humility and adoration, Don't be so adoring in public, folk will think I expect it from everyone. Mary > >Howdy Nomad! > > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Oh good - my chance to be a psychopathic serial killer! Shall we take it > in turns Pablo? sounds like a good position, where do i submit my resume`. i just hope it pays better than my current job. maybe there's a bonus for the amount of culls you perform each month! pablo > That's easy! > > If we put everybody down when they reach puberty, nobody would ever get to > "middle aged" thus taking care of the problem of middle aged head injuries! Oh ... and we wouldn't have adolescents to bug us ... Dave, you're a miracle worker :-))))))) Mary > > I"m afraid to ask what wonderful thing you would suggest doing to someone > who [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > 10,20,30,50 > > etc. > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Mary Why abort a suspect foetus? You could wait for the first seizures to appear, then knock the baby on the head! I started at 19, should have been shot then, I guess. Oh brave new world indeed!! JK > Why abort a suspect foetus? You could wait for the first seizures to appear, > then knock the baby on the head! Yes, I've said that for years - not just about epilepsy of course. > I started at 19, should have been shot then, I guess. There are worse things about 19 year olds ... Mary mine's trauma related so there'd still be a few of us left! pablo > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Mary > mine's trauma related so there'd still be a few of us left! Oh, we could arrange for trauma ... :-) Mary We first have to get rid of these epilepsy causing hams! Here's an interesting article. http://www.bradenton.com/mld/bradentonherald/news/local/3425416.htm > mine's trauma related so there'd still be a few of us left! > pablo [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > > > Mary Mine first started at 26 so I guess I would be one that stuck by too!!! thank God!! and I think as strange as what this sounds...epilepsy has made me stronger and appreciate life more... When I had my first seizure and woke up in emergency..the doctor told me that I most likely had a braing tumor or cancer of the brain as I was too old for epilepsy!!! well she missed too!!! cheers ya..alllllllll > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > -- > Mine first started at 26 so I guess I would be one that stuck by too!!! > thank God!! > and I think as strange as what this sounds...epilepsy has made me stronger > and appreciate life more... Me too. And my cancer. Life is very sweet ... but it seems to be that when someone's thought to be a nuisance the answer is to get rid of it. Mary > and I think as strange as what this sounds...epilepsy has made me stronger > and appreciate life more... I agree totally!!!! I write more letters and try to meet up with friends more. Life's too short and epilepsy suddenly made me feel very fragile. Christine oh what a sad person or being you are. TROLL > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > -- sorry meant to mention that sounds like a Troll posting IMHO the thought of abortion over a child with possible epilepsy is disgusting risky business bring up that sort of topic in a Newsgroup > oh what a sad person or being you are. > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > > > -- Hi Mary - My first seizure followed my brother's death when I was 40. I am not sure I follow your motive here. I have found folks with seizures to be very sensitive and major contributors to the human realm. If I had been God, I would have built seizures into the human dynamic. If seizures make some people nervous, then so be it. There are plenty of other similar cicumstances. Tim >Hi Mary - My first seizure followed my brother's death when I was 40. I am not >sure I follow your motive here. I have found folks with seizures to be very >sensitive and major contributors to the human realm. Pardon me breaking in on a private letter, but you put it on Usenet after all! I've just got to say that I disagree entirely. Epilepsy can turn humans into bitter individuals with a disregard for others, reciprocated social withdrawal and an almost psychopathic outlook on life. >If I had been God, I >would have built seizures into the human dynamic. If seizures make some people >nervous, then so be it. And Temporal Lobe Epileptics are 25 times more likely to commit suicide than the general population. Good job you ain't God then, isn't it? >There are plenty of other similar cicumstances. >Tim SignatureMalcolm (who has just set a record of marking 1300 pages of exams in three days) Did they all pass? > >Hi Mary - My first seizure followed my brother's death when I was 40. I am not > >sure I follow your motive here. I have found folks with seizures to be very [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >There are plenty of other similar cicumstances. > >Tim > Hi Mary - My first seizure followed my brother's death when I was 40. I am not > sure I follow your motive here. I have found folks with seizures to be very > sensitive and major contributors to the human realm. If I had been God, I > would have built seizures into the human dynamic. If seizures make some people > nervous, then so be it. There are plenty of other similar cicumstances. > Tim I've always felt that no-one is 100% seizure free. It might not be recognised or even observed but all those little twitches and tics, odd occasional feelings and the like could be very small seizures. My motive? To play devil's advocate and be so extreme that it would show my disgust at killing anyone at any stage of their life because they're not considered normal by the majority of others. It didn't work 100% but some understood :-) I don't believe that there is such a thing as the perfect human, or even a 'normal' one - those attributes are man-made and meaningless. Even epileptics aren't perfect! Mary . > Even epileptics aren't perfect! speak for your self! pablo > Mary >. >> >> Even epileptics aren't perfect! >speak for your self! >pablo That's easy Pablo. We keep us perfect ones, and shoot the rest. Yet more fun comes our way! SignatureMalcolm I was amused by the brief diversion into the world of labeling. Someone was saying that people with TLE (Temporal Lobe Epilepsy) had higher suicide stats than folks with regular old epilepsy. There was also some reference made to complex partials and simple partials. I suggest that these labels are essentially meaningless and are a device used by neurologists to foster a pretense of knowledge about a most mysterious subject. Someone asked what a 'social stigma' was, in relation to possible suicidal motivations, and I answer as follows: a social stigma is when society finds a reason to label and see you as strange, different, wierd or any other label suitable to cast one out of the normal acceptable range. If the person getting this treatment is not particularly strong or defiant, they are prone towards low feelings and may choose to do themselves in. What a sad loss. These are also the folks most prone to coming up with creative visions about new ways to approach life's difficulties. > I was amused by the brief diversion into the world of labeling. Someone was > saying that people with TLE (Temporal Lobe Epilepsy) had higher suicide stats > than folks with regular old epilepsy. There was also some reference made to > complex partials and simple partials. I suggest that these labels are > essentially meaningless and are a device used by neurologists to foster a > pretense of knowledge about a most mysterious subject. *** If you can find one of Julie's posts or already have the First Aid for Seizures Chart, it lists differences between the two. A simple partial, is also called an Aura on some news sites. It often will not end in loss of awareness or consciousness, but might just be an Aura onset then a clearing... A Complex Partial seizure (used to include older terms for Temporal Lobe Epilepsy), usually starts in one area, then Generalize in a complex fashion to other parts of the brain. It's during this generalizing that most of us who have it might lose awareness and sometimes consciousness. I was only able to judge how close I was getting to Control with the medications I was using, by determining what dose levels stopped my szrs. from Generalizing and leading to a Trip to Emerg. I don't think I replied wrt. Below, because while I had occasional depressions at a few of the Surprise seizures I had, once they were more reasonably controlled, I had less to no periods of depression. Some of the other posters have, however, also had an anti-depressant prescribed as part of their treatments. Those might be more specific to the Detailed area where the seizures are operating, or due to other complications. Just because I had frequent szrs. in my Right Temporal Lobe, I didn't have an equal number of Waves of Depression that matched that frequency. (Those were all well before I went online during 1993-6. A Group like this would have been Useful if I had a computer during that period. That's why I try make up for 'lost time' with newly diagnosed people where I can, when they come here. If I can save them 2-3 years of experimenting with feelings and sensations, as their med. levels change, it was worth my while buying this thing... ) G. / > Someone asked what a 'social stigma' was, in relation to possible suicidal > motivations, and I answer as follows: a social stigma is when society finds a [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > sad loss. These are also the folks most prone to coming up with creative > visions about new ways to approach life's difficulties. . . . so sometimes our seizures result in loss of consciousness and sometimes they don't. Mentioning lobes really doesn't add much because it is so speculative. I would just assume call them black-out seizures and non-black-out seizures. My interest is to associate seizures with life events. Are they random occurrences or do they tend to associate with emotional happenings? I do find that seizures often occur in association with significant life events where the boundaries of my normal experience are being stretched. I consistently experience that the post- seizure period is marked by heightened sensitivity and emotion, and with new perspectives which I have come to label "new eyes." > . . . so sometimes our seizures result in loss of consciousness and sometimes > they don't. Mentioning lobes really doesn't add much because it is so > speculative. I would just assume call them black-out seizures and > non-black-out seizures. *** I have CAT scans, EEGs and CT scans that show the original damage (1979) to Right T. Lobe from the Encephalitis. The seizures didn't start until 1993. The Lobe (of two) only matters wrt. the outward symptoms and aura that can Predict what above tests would find. So if you had feeling of Jamais Vu, Eggy aroma or taste ahead of a seizure, it might more likey occur (and be confirmed) in the *left temporal lobe, not the Right one. If, like mine, your aura was Deja Vu, a taste or odour that was sour or lemony, or where any of those tastes can trigger an aura, it is more likely in the Right Temporal Lobe. FWIW, the T.lobes are called the Seat of the Soul, since they're thought to be where we store 'who we are' in, so people who have Serious damage there, no longer know 'who they are'. If the damage is 'only' as severe as mine was from 1979 through 1986, it affects new learning, and short term memory functions needed for that. I still have that, 17 years further on. When a Screen here disappears and expects me to remember what the instructions were on the previous screen -- if they exceed 2-3 items and I didn't write those Down or can't move back to that screen, the instructions are gone.... Simple things like Reading and remembering what was read were not simple during 1980s or 90s, still aren't when I track a troll like that rr.com? one I just filed the 5th complaint with./ > My interest is to associate seizures with life events. Are they random > occurrences or do they tend to associate with emotional happenings? *** Wouldn't those depend on what was triggering the seizure type? So that while those of us with TLE might find triggers related to emotional based events, or outside occurrences, that might not be the case with many others who only have S.Partial seizures (auras), or the Larger seizure type (you know what it's called --I've forgotten its name at the moment.... see? ) [Grand Mal] Howdy is more into Math stuff than I usually am, what do you mean effectively by 'random'.? Why did I get it but Fred Flintstone up the street never did? or will I have a C.P. seizure Today, more likely than Tomorrow or 3 days from now? That might seem like splitting hairs, but Really it's not wrt. use of that term. Depending on the seizure type, whether I should get into a Car or be the Pilot of your Airplane today, depends whether my seizures were Controlled (they are), or if they might show up as one of the Surprise ones that I had 10-12 times from 1993-7, with little or no *Aura, and frequently without any *Trigger or event which could be 'blamed' as the start point that set off the electric cascade that led to unconsciousness often. / I do find > that seizures often occur in association with significant life events where the > boundaries of my normal experience are being stretched. > I consistently experience that the post- seizure period is marked by heightened > sensitivity and emotion, and with new perspectives which I have come to label > "new eyes." G- I used to have to wait for a 'responsible adult' to come sign me out, since the Doctors wouldn't let me go without that (a 'responsible adult'). Sixty percent of timeittook2daysforthebrainfogtoclearuntilI stopped looking over my shoulder wondering what triggered THAT one and will I have *another one with or without any warning. / > . > > > > Even epileptics aren't perfect! > speak for your self! OK. I'm not perfect. Mary :-))))))) > pablo > > > > Mary Mines trauma related from a mva like quite a few others in this ng. So who should be shot? Me for my head injury & subsequent tle, or the mechanic that installed the roll bars in the vehicle. > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Mary I would tend to believe that epileptics may be more prone to suicide because society places such a stigma on the "disease." I would suggest that people start to look at the positives. As I have stated before to overwhelming criticism here, the post seizure period is a time of what I call "new eyes" during which new perspectives can be experienced. Why this is such a terrible thing to express, even though it is true, continues to puzzle me. > I would tend to believe that epileptics may be more prone to suicide because > society places such a stigma on the "disease." I would suggest that people > start to look at the positives. As I have stated before to overwhelming > criticism here, the post seizure period is a time of what I call "new eyes" > during which new perspectives can be experienced. Why this is such a terrible > thing to express, even though it is true, continues to puzzle me. It does me too. In other ages we'd have been revered as mystics, seers, even saints. Mary It's not all bad. Being labelled as suicidal means that any fault with our phone line is rated as priority. We get it fixed within 24 hrs. > I would tend to believe that epileptics may be more prone to suicide because > society places such a stigma on the "disease." I would suggest that people > start to look at the positives. As I have stated before to overwhelming > criticism here, the post seizure period is a time of what I call "new eyes" > during which new perspectives can be experienced. Why this is such a terrible > thing to express, even though it is true, continues to puzzle me. > It's not all bad. Being labelled as suicidal means that any > fault with our phone line is rated as priority. We get it > fixed within 24 hrs. Because this was top posted I don't know - and can't be bothered finding out - what this was about. But it was worth reading anyway! Mary > > I would tend to believe that epileptics may be more prone > to suicide because [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > thing to express, even though it is true, continues to > puzzle me. >I would tend to believe that epileptics may be more prone to suicide because >society places such a stigma on the "disease." So why the difference in stats: four times more likely in all epilepsies, but twenty-five times more likely with TLE? Explain that by social stigma if you can. SignatureMalcolm > >I would tend to believe that epileptics may be more prone to suicide because > >society places such a stigma on the "disease." > > So why the difference in stats: four times more likely in all > epilepsies, but twenty-five times more likely with TLE? I just told my wife about those stats (I have TLE) and she said: "Don't you dare! These are new carpets!" ;-) Bob > Explain that by social stigma if you can. > > -- > Malcolm > > >I would tend to believe that epileptics may be more prone to suicide because > > >society places such a stigma on the "disease." [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I just told my wife about those stats (I have TLE) and she said: "Don't you > dare! These are new carpets!" ;-) Sensible lady. Wait at least until she has new for old contents insurance. Mary (what's TLE by the way?) > (what's TLE by the way?) I have no idea what TLE by the way is, but TLE is Temporal Lobe Epilepsy (usually Complex Partial & Simple Partial Seizures). Bob > > (what's TLE by the way?) > > I have no idea what TLE by the way is, :-) > but TLE is Temporal Lobe Epilepsy > (usually Complex Partial & Simple Partial Seizures). Oh of course! Thanks. Mary > Bob Howdy Ian! Once we start to exterminate everybody as they enter puberty it will be a mute issue within a generation! SignatureDave ???? "Noli illigitemi carborundum decendus" http://www.howdydave.com > Mines trauma related from a mva like quite a few others in > this ng. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > > > Mary I get the feeling that you idea for abortion was a sarcastic one. The problem is that many people would, in fact, do that if they had a test for ep. Then again, at the rate the genetic manipulation is progressing, we might be able to reprogram the geans to rid the world of both birth and trauma caused ep. by the time such a test is invented. On the other hand, I did like the idea of getting rid of everybody at a certain age. Anybody besides me remember a movie called "Logans Run"? :) The past tempts us, the present confuses us, and the future frightens us...And our lives slip away, moment by moment, lost in that vast, terrible in-between. It is difficult to say what is impossible, for the dream of yesterday is the hope of today and the reality of tomorrow. Robert Goddard(1882-1945) > I get the feeling that you idea for abortion was a sarcastic one. The > problem is that many people would, in fact, do that if they had a test > for ep. I know :-((((((( > On the other hand, I did like the idea of getting rid of everybody at a > certain age. Anybody besides me remember a movie called "Logans Run"? :) No. Tell me about it. > The past tempts us, the present confuses us, and the future frightens > us...And our lives slip away, moment by moment, lost in that vast, > terrible in-between. I'm not tempted not confused not frightened, my life is still slipping away though :-( Mary Hi Mary, I hope you are being sarcastic? Our daughter was a fine, bright young person when she had her first seizure at the age of 12. We had a rough few months until we got her seizures under control with medication. She's now been seizure-free for about 16 months and throughout that whole period she has been a fine, bright young person. We are hoping that towards the end of next year we will be able to try and see whether we can wean her off the drugs - but whether that succeeds or fails, she will still be a fine, bright young person. For sure her seizures are frightening for family, friends, class-mates, passers-by who have had to witness them, but they all seem to have coped pretty well with the experience and their relationship with our daughter appears unaffected. Just in case you are posting this from a "right to life" perspective though, can I say that I totally and unequivocally support a woman's right to choose whether to terminate a pregnancy. Regards, Peter Beach > If/when a pre-birth test is established whereby a person could be predicted > as developing epilepsy the 'foetus' could be aborted. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Mary > I hope you are being sarcastic? That depends on what you mean by 'sarcastic'! > Our daughter was a fine, bright young person when she had her first seizure > at the age of 12. We had a rough few months until we got her seizures under [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > pretty well with the experience and their relationship with our daughter > appears unaffected. I'm very pleased for her. I suspect that as many people who have fits are bright young persons as those who aren't. Life is precious no matter how society views that life. > Just in case you are posting this from a "right to life" I don't know what that means either. > can I say that I totally and unequivocally support a woman's right to choose > whether to terminate a pregnancy. That's your right. I support a child's right not to be killed before it draws breath. But I realise that I'm standing against the stream - not STANDING - not fighting it. 'Terminating a pregnancy' means killing a baby. Why not kill a person as soon as it's obvious that it isn't perfect? I don't intend continuing with this argument but I will say that my original post was triggered by a report that a woman had had a late 'termination' (i.e. when the child would have been viable) because of a very small and easily repairable 'defect'. Which of us is 'perfect'? I'm not. Are you? Mary > Regards, > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > > > Mary Hi Mary, For some reason my news reader went a bit funny and I didn't see the other responses your posting had generated when I responded. I understand a little better where you are coming from now. FWIW I sort of agree and I sort of don't. My wife was 41 or so when our youngest daughter was born (the one who has developed epilepsy). The doctors were very keen that my wife should take a test (anmiosentesis <sp?>) to check for Down's syndrome and other "defects" as she was of an age where the risk of that increases dramatically. We refused to take the test. There were a number of reasons, but principally it was because, even if the test was positive we wouldn't have countenanced an abortion - and therefore best not to know. However we were in a position where if our daughter had had one of those "defects" the tests might have detected, we thought we would have the resources to cope with it. I'm very comfortable with the decision we took. I don't know, however, that I would counsel a teenage mum, perhaps without the father on hand, to proceed in the same way if in similar circumstances. And that is why I wrote that I support a woman's right to choose. Without being able to envisage a plan for all the circumstances of each individual pregnancy and the "right" outcome in each of those cases, I prefer to rely on the judgement of each woman involved - after all if the baby is born, it is the woman who will (in most cases) be the primary care giver and if we are prepared to entrust a newborn baby to her, I think we should also trust her to make the best decision (at least as she sees it) when she learns she is pregnant. I'm pretty set in my ways as far as the abortion argument is concerned. However with the recent "progress" in pre-natal testing I am beginning to wonder about adding a caveat to my belief that pregnancy involves a woman's right to choose. I'm thinking about something along the lines of if a woman wishes to terminate a pregnancy after having had pre-natal tests then the law should lay down what "defects" justify abortion. My list would be pretty damn short. I am sure we will always disagree on the abortion issue - but perhaps we can agree that the notion of "designer children" is absolutely repellant? Best wishes, Peter Beach <snip> > > Just in case you are posting this from a "right to life" > [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > > > > > > Mary
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