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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / August 2005chemo and diabetes.
I have not really given this a lot of thought, but it just came to me. My mother had diabetes. she had hodgkins disease and was on chemo. She developed the diabetes after that. In l994, I had breast cancer. I went through twelve rounds of chemo therapy. I was officially diagnosed in l999. At first, I thought it was genetic and did until just a few minutes ago when this theory came into my head. Is it possible that chemotherapy, while killing bad cancer cells, also kills good cells, caused my pancrease not to produce insulin. I never asked the doctor this and will at my next appointment, Just want to hear your opinions. I am thinking that both my mother and I developed diabetes after having chemo therapy. My mother died in 1995 from complications of diabetes and cancer. Thanks Loretta -- In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism. >I have not really given this a lot of thought, but it just came to me. > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >Thanks >Loretta I'm not sure about chemo Loretta, but many of the people on my CLL list have prednisone as an adjunct to the chemo treatment and that can definitely be a factor in type 2. Did you have prednisone as part of your treatment? Cheers Alan, T2, Australia.  SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. Alan, I am happy to say that I didnt have prednisone. It was bad enough having cancer, but having a moon face, would have really depressed me. I have been and always will be vain even though I am overweight :-) Loretta -- In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism. > I have not really given this a lot of thought, but it just came to me. > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > Thanks > Loretta Loretta aren't you Type 2? If so your pancreas is probably still working away all the time. It's just that your body has become insulin resistant. (I think that's what they told me.) SignatureGrandpa Chuck -ô¿ô- ~ The following information is given with the utmost respect for the armed forces and civilians who have died in the current war in Iraq. According to http://icasualties.org/oif/ The number of Americans killed in Iraq as of August 6, 2005 is 1832. Each star represents one person killed. ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** 500 ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** 1,000 ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** 1,500 ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ******************************** 1,832 United Kingdom = 93 ************************************************** ****************************************** Other = 101 ************************************************** ************************************************** * Iraqi civilian deaths are between 24,000 and 100,000 by all estimates. Chuck, I am type II. Are you saying my pancreas is putting out all the insulin that is necessary? Loretta -- In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism. Loretta Eisenberg wrote in message <20752-42F6BFFD-345@storefull-3233.bay.webtv.net>... Chuck, I am type II. Are you saying my pancreas is putting out all the insulin that is necessary? Loretta You still may be putting out more insulin than a non-diabetic. However, a more pertinent question is "Can you make enough insulin to cover a non-diabetic's meal?" (Or pass a Glucose Tolerance Test, or produce a FbG less than 126) If you can't, you are deficient in insulin and therefore "diabetic". Non-diabetics have up to 4 times as much insulin capacity as they need to get through the day. If you have the T2 genes, you are likely to get stuck in the Type 2 Diabetes Progression which entails a progressive but slow loss of insulin capacity. The day your loss of insulin capacity is enough to let your sugars go too high, you are "diabetic". The statistically average T2 has lost 50% of their original insulin capacity at the time of diagnosis. The 50% loss applied to their original 4 times overcapacity means they (statistically) have about 2 times as much insulin capacity as a non-diabetic. However, since the overwhelming majority are also highly Insulin Resistant, that "2 times as much as a non-diabetic" is not enough to control their sugars. That's why the diet and exercise therapy works so well for so many. They're still making twice as much insulin as a non-diabetic but losing some abdominal fat and raising their exercise level knocks their Insulin Resistance down and they can get by. "Get by", not "gobble carbs" like the non-diabetics can. A vigorous diet and exercise program with some metformin and/or Actos/Avandia added tends to protect the beta cells. On the other hand, gobble carbs, and let everything go, and the beta cells continue to die at a high rate** and you end up on insulin, usually more than twice as much as we T1 use. (** "high rate": There is a repair mechanism for T2 beta cells. They regenerate. However the effect of T2 genes mean that they typically die faster than they regenerate, i.e. at a high rate. That repair mechanism is thought to be reason why some participants experienced an increase in insulin capacity in the HOPE trial. The Avandia knocked their Insulin Resistance down low enough so that the repair mechanism was able to make some headway against the death mechanism) Regards Old Al Old Al, you are so knowledgeable, thanks so much Loretta -- In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism. Thank you Al. You explained it much better than I could. I just knew someone would step in and clarify it. > Loretta Eisenberg wrote in message > <20752-42F6BFFD-345@storefull-3233.bay.webtv.net>... [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > Regards > Old Al SignatureGrandpa Chuck -ô¿ô- ~ The following information is given with the utmost respect for the armed forces and civilians who have died in the current war in Iraq. According to http://icasualties.org/oif/ The number of Americans killed in Iraq as of August 6, 2005 is 1833. Each star represents one person killed. ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** 500 ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** 1,000 ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** 1,500 ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ********************************* 1,833 United Kingdom = 93 ************************************************** ****************************************** Other = 101 ************************************************** ************************************************** * Iraqi civilian deaths are between 24,000 and 100,000 by all estimates. > Chuck, I am type II. Are you saying my pancreas is putting out all the > insulin that is necessary? Loretta, So sorry to hear that you and your mother had to deal with such a difficult diagnosis and of your mother's death! Without testing it is impossible to know if your type 2 diabetes was caused by damage to beta cells or problems with cell glucose receptors. A fasting C-peptide test could answer that question for you. I assumed for years that my problem was failing beta cells, but testing showed it was faulty receptors (or mitochondria, or something else at the cellular level) as my pancreas is pouring out tons of insulin. My cells just can't use it. It could be that exposure to the powerful, toxic, drugs used chemo might have either 1) caused the problem or 2)pushed a borderline, genetic condition into full-fledged diabetes. Unfortunately, this is the kind of question that probably has not been studied. I have read that chemo for breast cancer can cause permanent cognitive problems and that it has only been recently that this was discovered. OTOH, there is a genetic form of type 2 diabetes common among Ashkenazi Jews which does not result in overt obesity. In fact, a medical book from the 1920s which I found in an antique store noted that adult diabetes was very frequently found among Jewish people (and advised a low carb diet as the only treatment available.) So it is hard to know. My mom had chemo for a different kind of cancer without developing any blood sugar problem (I get my diabetes from the other side of the family.) OTOH, it does seem to have begun her cognitive slide. Signature--Jenny http://www.geocities.com/lottadata4u/ Diabetes info http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/ Low Carb info Jenny, I am having problems with memory and I do attribute that to the chemo. Thanks . I hope your mother is okay. Loretta -- In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism. > Chuck, I am type II. Are you saying my pancreas is putting out all the > insulin that is necessary? [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and > terrorism. That one I am not qualified to answer. However, when I had my diabetes education classes they said that most T2 diabetics still have a functioning pancreas that is releasing insulin when it is called for, but due to insulin resistance it is not being absorbed by the cells in a normal manner. That is the reason we need the meds we take. Or if we are lucky we can get the control we need through exercise and tight carb control. I believe what some are calling T1.5 or T3 diabetics are people who have the insulin resistance of a T2 along with a failed weakened pancreas. SignatureGrandpa Chuck -ô¿ô- ~ The following information is given with the utmost respect for the armed forces and civilians who have died in the current war in Iraq. According to http://icasualties.org/oif/ The number of Americans killed in Iraq as of August 6, 2005 is 1833. Each star represents one person killed. ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** 500 ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** 1,000 ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** 1,500 ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ********************************* 1,833 United Kingdom = 93 ************************************************** ****************************************** Other = 101 ************************************************** ************************************************** * Iraqi civilian deaths are between 24,000 and 100,000 by all estimates. > I have not really given this a lot of thought, but it just came to me. > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Is it possible that chemotherapy, while killing bad cancer cells, also > kills good cells, caused my pancrease not to produce insulin. Chemotherapy kills off dividing cells. Your beta islet cells would not have been dividing cells unless perhaps under the stress of metabolic syndrome (MetS) when there may be more apoptosis. > I never asked the doctor this and will at my next appointment, Just > want to hear your opinions. > I am thinking that both my mother and I developed diabetes after having > chemo therapy. Type 2 diabetes is not associated with complete loss of beta islet cells as you are proposing as a consequence of chemotherapy. > My mother died in 1995 from complications of diabetes and cancer. My condolences to you for your loss. > Thanks You are welcome, Loretta :-) In Christ's love and service, Andrew -- Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD Board-Certified Cardiologist ** Suggested Reading: (1) http://makeashorterlink.com/?G1D5217EA (2) http://makeashorterlink.com/?W13A4250B (3) http://makeashorterlink.com/?X1C62661A (4) http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A (5) http://makeashorterlink.com/?K6F72510A (6) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I24E5151A (7) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I22222129 Hello, I have a son who was diagnosed when he was eleven with type I diabetes. I was RH- which I was told was an auto-immune disorder and caused my immune system to attack the fetus, I almost miscarried at 6 months, and when my son was diagnosed I was told it developed because of an auto immune disorder. I also read that wheat and milk can be linked, and I have celiac and lactose intolerance. I'm just trying to find out if any other mothers of type I diabetics have rh- blood, are celiac, or intolerant to lactose. I know nothing about medicine. I read about the mother who donated part of her pancreas to her daughter, and want to learn more about how to go about that, but can't seem to get any info from out family doctor. Thanks, have a great day > Hello, > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > other mothers of type I diabetics have rh- blood, are celiac, or > intolerant to lactose. Yes, Yes, Yes. , Some mothers are Rh-. That doesn't cause diabetes. If you got something call Rhogam while you were pregant, there should be no complications. You can read more about Rh blood types here: http://anthro.palomar.edu/blood/Rh_system.htm or do a web search for Rh-. Lactose intolerance means that you don't make enough of the enzyme that breaks down lactose to digest milk products. So when you consume milk products, you gas, diarrhea and other problems. None of these have anything to do with diabetes or your immune system. Celiec disease is linked to other autoimmune diseases. http://digestive.niddk.nih.gov/ddiseases/pubs/celiac/#9 > I know nothing about medicine. There are many good resources on the internet. The New York Times has a good science section on Tuesdays. You can read Scientific American, which has good articles on science. And you can go to your local library and bookstores. > I read about the > mother who donated part of her pancreas to her daughter, and want to > learn more about how to go about that, but can't seem to get any info > from out family doctor. If your son has diabetes, he should probably be followed by a pediatric endocrinologist. If there is not one nearby, you should be able to find on at major referral hospitals. Your family doctor and the pediatric endocriniologist should be able to work together to get excellent care for your son. > Thanks, have a great You too. Jeff > Hello, > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > learn more about how to go about that, but can't seem to get any info > from out family doctor. It seems you are wondering if there is a connection between your autoimmune problems and your 11 year old son developing type 1 diabetes, which you have correctly surmised is an autoimmune disease. The susceptibility toward having autoimmune diseases is inherited with incomplete penetrance (meaning it is not always expressed even when inherited) through alleles linked to HLA antigen so there is a connection. > Thanks, have a great day You are welcome, Jessie. In Christ's love and service, Andrew -- Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD Board-Certified Cardiologist ** Suggested Reading: (1) http://makeashorterlink.com/?G1D5217EA (2) http://makeashorterlink.com/?W13A4250B (3) http://makeashorterlink.com/?X1C62661A (4) http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A (5) http://makeashorterlink.com/?K6F72510A (6) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I24E5151A (7) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I22222129 > > Hello, > > > > I have a son who was diagnosed when he was eleven with type I diabetes. > > I was RH- which I was told was an auto-immune disorder and caused my > > immune system to attack the fetus, I almost miscarried at 6 months, and This is not auto-immune but allo-immune. > > when my son was diagnosed I was told it developed because of an auto > > immune disorder. This is not an auto-immune disorder. This is the mother developing antibodies against red cell antigens RH pos on the baby. I also read that wheat and milk can be linked, and I > > have celiac and lactose intolerance. I'm just trying to find out if any > > other mothers of type I diabetics have rh- blood, are celiac, or [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > autoimmune problems and your 11 year old son developing type 1 diabetes, > which you have correctly surmised is an autoimmune disease. When it comes down to auto-immune disease that is true. Immunology is inherited to some extent. Hemolytic disease of the newborn is not auto-immune. > The susceptibility toward having autoimmune diseases is inherited with > incomplete penetrance (meaning it is not always expressed even when [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > (6) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I24E5151A > (7) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I22222129 When I was pregnant with my daugher, they told me I was O negative and had to take blood tests every month for the rh factor. Only thing is that no one said to test my husband because he was also negative and there was no problem. I took all those blood tests for naught. lol Loretta -- In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism. jessie wrote in message <1123492561.111714.315410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>... >Hello, > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Thanks, have a great day My little contribution: My aunt had RH babies. We were never told that it was an "auto-immune" disorder. She had RH- blood, her husband had RH+ blood. The babies were RH+ and my aunt's body reacted to all that "foreign protein". None of her "blue-babies" developed diabetes. (They didn't have any of the good technology back then, the baby would die soon after birth unless they gave it massive blood transfusions) IOW, you had an RH problem because of your choice of a father for your son. Lactose intolerance is the normal, majority condition of adult human beings. There is a fraction of the race, often with a genetic heritage from Northern Europe, who developed the ability to retain their ability to digest lactose after reaching adulthood. It so happens that the US was settled with a lot of people with Northern Europe genes so we see lactose intolerance as something strange. Celiac , OTOH, is evidence of a possible genetic tendency to overreact to allergens. That's a rough description of T1, the body somehow overreacting and deciding that its own beta cells are foreign protein. AFAIK, we T1 keep the anti-beta cell antibody mechanism going throughout life. That suggests that if you gave your son some of your beta cells, the antibodies would just go after them. Note that the docs are a bit uncertain on this topic though. Not to nag, but most of the T1 children I am personally aware of are using some really Godawful old-fashioned insulin regimes. Keep on looking at the beta cell tricks** but I hope you have also looked into the efficacy of your son's insulin regime. I use a modern, intensive DAFNE regime with Humalog and Ultralente and can keep my HbA1c down below 6. I expect to do better next year when I switch to Humalog and Levemir. (**the beta cell trick I am interested in: There are folks talking about growing human beta cells in test tubes, then implanting them. They think they won't last very long in T1 or eliminate shots so non-T1 folks think it's a waste. However, I know that if you give me 10-20% of my original beta cell quota, I could keep my PITA insulin shot routine and improve my control to non-diabetic levels. If I had to have simple surgery every year or so to replace the cells, it could easily be a cost-effective process) Regards Old Al > jessie wrote in message > <1123492561.111714.315410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>... [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > they > gave it massive blood transfusions) Rh babies are not an autoimmune disease. Rather, the mother's body is reacting to a foreign protein. There is no effect on the mother. And no autoimmune problems for the child. > IOW, you had an RH problem because of your choice of a father for your > son. Unknown. From the post, it is not possible to determine if there was an Rh problem. A potential problem exists only if the mother doesn't get Rhogam and has at least one previous baby who is Rh+. This is not an autoimmune disorder. > Lactose intolerance is the normal, majority condition of adult human > beings. There is a fraction of the race, often with a genetic heritage [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > settled with a lot of people with Northern Europe genes so we see lactose > intolerance as something strange. There are also some people in Asia who are usually lactose tolerant. But, most people in the world are lactose intolerant. This is not an autoimmune problem. > Celiac , OTOH, is evidence of a possible genetic tendency to overreact to > allergens. That's a rough description of T1, the body somehow > overreacting and deciding that its own beta cells are foreign protein. Celiac disease is an autoimmune disorder. > AFAIK, we T1 keep the anti-beta cell antibody mechanism going throughout > life. That suggests that if you gave your son some of your beta cells, [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > Regards > Old Al Jeff She said she HAD an RH baby That means 1) the father was Rh+ 2) She was Rh- 3) She had a prior exposure to Rh+ SO, you HAD enough information You seem to have a recurring problem with genetics - This is a simple Mendelian situation. I see where you are incapable of understanding not non-mendalian characteristics (like T2 diabetes). Heaven help you if you get one of those really weird non-mendalians like calico coloring in cats. And, it IS an Autoimmune disease the fetus is part of the body at first, and the infant's blood is part of its body after birth, SO, it is n immune reaction to part of one's own body - "AUTO" "IMMUNE" >>jessie wrote in message >><1123492561.111714.315410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>... [quoted text clipped - 90 lines] >>Regards >> Old Al Signature"...in addition to being foreign territory the past is, as history, a hall of mirrors that reflect the needs of souls observing from the present" Glen Cook > Jeff > She said she HAD an RH baby [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > 2) She was Rh- > 3) She had a prior exposure to Rh+ Yet, from the medical history given, this might have been her first child and she could have had problems for some other reason. > SO, you HAD enough information You seem to have a recurring problem with > genetics - This is a simple Mendelian situation. I see where you are > incapable of understanding not non-mendalian characteristics (like T2 > diabetes). Personal attack noted. It is a shame that you don't try to educate people instead of attack them. I disagree. While what you say is most likely true (I would be quite surprised if it weren't), she didn't say whether this was not her first pregancy nor did she provide adequate details to be sure this is the case. > Heaven help you if you get one of those really weird > non-mendalians like calico coloring in cats. > > And, it IS an Autoimmune disease the fetus is part of the body at first, > and the infant's blood is part of its body after birth, SO, it is n immune > reaction to part of one's own body - "AUTO" "IMMUNE" No, it is not an autoimmune disorder. The body is attacking a foreign protein. This usually occurs because the baby and mother's blood mix at birth and some of the Rh+ antigen gets into the mother's bloodstream. This usually does not occur during pregancy, but only during (or after) birth. (http://www.texashste.com/html/path_im.htm) Also, I would like to point out that it is the mother's body that is making the antibodies, not the infant, even though it is the infant's blood that the antibodies react against. Furthermore, it is not linked to autoimmune disorders like diabetes or lupus. Jeff PS. I am really sorry that you need to behave this way. You and I have a disagreement over a particular medical topic. Big deal. That doesn't mean you need to attack me at every chance. Just for the record, I will not behave this way against you. >>>jessie wrote in message >>><1123492561.111714.315410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>... [quoted text clipped - 95 lines] >>>Regards >>> Old Al > > Jeff > > She said she HAD an RH baby [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Personal attack noted. It seems to be simply an observation though understandably you find the observation to be personal. > It is a shame that you don't try to educate people > instead of attack them. What Ted enumerated would be for your education, dear Jeff: http://makeashorterlink.com/?G1974229B Truth is simple: http://makeashorterlink.com/?P2264129A The way to the truth is straight and narrow: http://makeashorterlink.com/?A2642108A You will remain in my prayers, dear Jeff whom I love, in Christ's holy name. May you reject your pride and accept Him as your personal Lord and Savior, someday, so that you too will have eternal life and the fascinating riches of His everlasting kingdom. Here's how: http://makeashorterlink.com/?I22222129 Please note that God truly made this special link describing that He is the great "I am" and that His message is as simple as the number 2 which is a number between 1 to 9 and reminds us of His 2 commandments, the 2 arms of the cross, the 2nd part of the Trinity, the 2 finger sign of the Prince of Peace [who remains *V*ictorious over death and satan], and the 2PD-OMER Approach. Let it not ever be written that Christ did not make His presence known here on Usenet :-) Also, note that Exodus 16:16 continues to remind us that 16 oz plus 16 oz makes 2 pounds, which is "a certain measure of weight," which is what "omer" literally means in Hebrew. Enter the 2PD-OMER Approach, which can "cure" metabolic syndrome (MetS) thereby bringing this thread back on topic for these NGs :-) http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/press.asp You may hear me speak about the 2PD-OMER Approach in person and meet others who have been using this WOE here: http://www.TheHealthFair.com You may also choose to have me speak to your group or organization about the 2PD-OMER Approach in person for the usual and customary speaker's fee of US$30,000.00 made as a tax-deductible contribution to TheWellnessFoundation.com (it remains my choice to not profit personally from the 2PD-OMER Approach): http://www.TheWellnessFoundation.com In Christ's love and service, Andrew -- Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD Board-Certified Cardiologist ** Suggested Reading: (1) http://makeashorterlink.com/?G1D5217EA (2) http://makeashorterlink.com/?W13A4250B (3) http://makeashorterlink.com/?X1C62661A (4) http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A (5) http://makeashorterlink.com/?K6F72510A (6) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I24E5151A (7) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I22222129 >>Jeff >>She said she HAD an RH baby [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > surprised if it weren't), she didn't say whether this was not her first > pregancy nor did she provide adequate details to be sure this is the case. "most likely" Yes, I can postulate a situation where it is not the case. First, I would have to give her an injection of Rh+ blood, Since she is Rh-, she would become sensitized, and not have a viable reaction. Why?? is that a likely occurance? Not in a million years. THEN, she would need an Rh+ baby without an Rh+ father. Possible, mutation??? What are the odds of that happening ??? Why don't you simply postulate that she is an alien from outer space> The odds are better. As to your explanation of why it is technically not an autoimmune disorder. I'll accept you on that. I bow to your superior knowledge of medical jargon. RhoGam came on the market over 40 years ago, so it is odd she didn't get tested and inoculated at each birth, but it happens. > > Heaven help you if you get one of those really weird > [quoted text clipped - 125 lines] >>>>Regards >>>>Old Al Signature"...in addition to being foreign territory the past is, as history, a hall of mirrors that reflect the needs of souls observing from the present" Glen Cook > RhoGam came on the market over 40 years ago, so it is odd she didn't get > tested and inoculated at each birth, but it happens. My niece aborted a rapist's baby, they didn't test her for anything or give her a shot. Later, she married and they wanted a baby, she miscarried and was told it was because of the Rh thing, she got a shot that time. SignatureNo Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes > > RhoGam came on the market over 40 years ago, so it is odd she didn't get > > tested and inoculated at each birth, but it happens. > > My niece aborted a rapist's baby, they didn't test her for anything or give > her a shot. Later, she married and they wanted a baby, she miscarried and > was told it was because of the Rh thing, she got a shot that time. Sorry to correct a few things about that story. Any prenatal testing includes a type and RH along with an antibody screen to check for Rh antibodies. The shot is given when the mother does not have an antibody to RH. It prevents antibodies from forming and thus prevent hemolytic disease of the newborn in the future babies. Once an antibody is detected and formed against Rh then the mother has to be monitored by measuring the strength of the antibody called a titer along with checking the amniotic fluid for abnormalities. The shot does nothing for those mothers who already have an antibody and it is therefore not given. It can not prevent something that is already there. It is common practice for all threatened abortions regardless of term to do a type and Rh. If the mother is Rh negative she is always given the shot AFTER testing to confirm that she is Rh negative and she does not have an antibody. Depending on the length of pregnancy, in addition they will always check for baby cells in the mother in all threatened miscarriage or full term deliveries. The shot is dependent of the amount of baby cells present so more than one shot might be required. The test quantifies the amount of baby blood found. When a pregnant women has an accident (trauma) then they always check for baby cells in the mother by drawing blood regardless of the mothers or babies Rh type. This indicates that the baby is bleeding into the mother or out through vaginal bleeding. These are all procedures mandated by medical practice guidelines and by laboratory testing guidelines. None given, that is a tragic story. The rh comes in on the second child and in my mothers case it was the third child. We are all negatives. I am glad that your niece was able to move on with her life. I hope they caught the bastard and threw away the key. Loretta -- In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism. >I hope they caught the bastard and threw away the key. > >Loretta after making him a gelding. Mâck©® Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.diabetic-talk.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." ...Theodore Roosevelt (o o) --ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------------- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." Jesus never hated anyone. >>I hope they caught the bastard and threw away the key. >> >>Loretta > > after making him a gelding. If we're not into arts & crafts, can't we just buy 'em a gelding and give it to 'em? :) Wild Monkshood > Mâck©® > Type 1 since 1975 [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Jesus never hated anyone. > Jeff > She said she HAD an RH baby [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > SO, you HAD enough information You seem to have a recurring problem > with genetics This observation with Jeff has been made before especially when Jeff is arguing in favor of the theory of evolution. > - This is a simple Mendelian situation. His problem with genetics is probably not a simple Mendelian situation. > I see where you > are incapable of understanding not non-mendalian characteristics (like > T2 diabetes). Heaven help you if you get one of those really weird > non-mendalians like calico coloring in cats. Heaven does not help him when he tries to convince people that the theory of evolution should be promoted to law/postulate. > And, it IS an Autoimmune disease the fetus is part of the body at > first, and the infant's blood is part of its body after birth, SO, it is > n immune reaction to part of one's own body - "AUTO" "IMMUNE" Actually, in an Rh negative woman, Rh antigen is not normally part of herself so her reaction would not be considered autoimmune. In Christ's love and service, Andrew -- Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD Board-Certified Cardiologist ** Suggested Reading: (1) http://makeashorterlink.com/?G1D5217EA (2) http://makeashorterlink.com/?W13A4250B (3) http://makeashorterlink.com/?X1C62661A (4) http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A (5) http://makeashorterlink.com/?K6F72510A (6) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I24E5151A (7) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I22222129 Jessie, my mother was Rh negative and I was rh negative, My daughter does not have diabetes. My mother and I both had type 2. I didnt know that they were doing pancreatic transplants, That is wonderful. Loretta -- In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism. |
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