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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / August 2005Newbie saying Hello
Hi all, Thanks for being here! I see you are a pretty active group.....something I've found difficult to find about diabetes groups online or local and searching for info online just makes my head spin with all the medical (over my head) info and no real people to talk to. I am not diabetic but I'm married to a Type1 (diagnosed since 17 and he is now 30)....the user name includes us both so I'm gonna get the ball rolling with hopes to get him involved here and posting and learning. As far as I know, my husband has not sought any medical help since his diagnosis (no insurance and can't afford a good specialist) and is still relying on the info he received at diagnosis and adjusting according to his sugar readings and advice from his dad who is also type1 and they both have always used Novolin R and NPH. (I've noticed some bad talk about those here and would like to know moreabout that) It will be awhile before he can see a specialist and I know that would probably be your first line of advice but in the meantime what can we do, what can he do and what helpful information can I learn in the meantime....it's been a helluva rollercoaster ride for me as I am still clueless......he is still young and healthy enough to take care of the diet and insulin end of it and my function really only involves catching and helping with the hypos and IMO there are way too many of those and over the past couple of years a new feature on the 'roller coaster':...seizures at night and I'm thinking that the NPH is really kicking his butt and therefore kicking mine too! These are incredibly scary and just plain weird. Most hypos involve administration of juice and watching the slow transformation as he begins to gain consciousness and ability to monitor himself without me but with the seizures (they always happen after he has been asleep) it's as if he immediately snaps out of them....instant consciousness and ability to tell me confidently that he is not low and doesn't need any juice.....I usually believe him and just let it go. What the hell is going on here....is it really a Low? How is he instantly recovering without sugar? And there is nothing I can do until he does something different besides pass along useful information and anything I can think of to inspire him to try something different. He is now interested in making some changes, seeing that what he has been doing might be way outdated (and alot of it he is doing from fear of suffering like his dad who stayed too high all the time and his answer to that is trying to find balance but missing and being too low all the time instead....up to now he's been okay with that plan as fallible as it may be)....but I think he is afraid and really doesn't know where to begin, or how NPH works and guidlines for using it. I have questions but I don't know what they are, other than the one's I've asked here......or where to begin so just an intro will suffice for now. Thanks for any advice! Thanks for being here.....I'm grateful! I'll read the archives and see what I can learn from there as well. Blessings, Deanna Welcome Deanna and I know you will love it here. I hope to learn from you and you sound very delightful to have around. I don't know any technical stuff about diabetes only my own experiences which have not been good so far however I am glad you chose us to be with. ASD is the best on the net. > Hi all, > [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > Blessings, > Deanna Wow....I knew this would be a good place.....that was fast! Thank you for your welcome! And I love your name! *wink* I hope to learn from you as well, thank you *blush*....I can teach some things but most of what I know is really second had.....from the experiences of living with a diabetic that hasn't figured out quite how to take care of himself. I have to give respect and trust that since he is still a healthy diabetic, that he knows what he is doing and not cross the lines and impede with too much helpfullness....but I think it's time that we both learned more. so I'm am like a sponge......teach me! :-) > Wow....I knew this would be a good place.....that was fast! > Thank you for your welcome! And I love your name! *wink* [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > me! > :-) He is so fortunate to have you. I admire you wanting to learn as much as you can. My hubby doesn't know the first thing about what I go through and has never tried to learn. However he is very good to me in lots of other ways. I can't complain too much :-) I love your name too. It has a soft pronunciation and I like that. Here is a link the help you get started. It is on ASD's web pages that some of our posters here take very good care of and Jennifer wrote a welcome message to all newcomers that I hear has helped many. For the web site it is... http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/ and for Jennifer's welcome it is under the Newly Diagnosed. If you have any questions no matter how you may think it is unimportant it is never that way with us just ask and someone will always be here to help you along. > Here is a link the help you get started. It is on ASD's web pages that some > of our posters here take very good care of and Jennifer wrote a welcome [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/ and for Jennifer's welcome it is under > the Newly Diagnosed. The advice on that page is really better for Type 2. You might want to check out the Bernstein book. Some people don't like him, but Enrico probably has the web address handy.  SignatureNo Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes "None Given" <nonegiven@invalid.invalid> wrote in message not good to give a newbie even a t1 any reference to the diabetic king quack himself. his methods are still too out of date and only a t1 who's a fool would follow his advice. reisa > "None Given" <nonegiven@invalid.invalid> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > reisa First of all, welcome to the group. Second, get your Dr. pronto. Those seizures don't sound right. Ira T2 since Dec. 2000 if he's a T1 that goes extremely low, yes there will be seizures caused from the low. read the OP msg again, they don't have insurance or much money for doctors. keeping from going too low will prevent the seizures unless something else has developed then yes it's best to get it checked out. RK. | > "None Given" <nonegiven@invalid.invalid> wrote in message | > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] | | Ira T2 since Dec. 2000 >if he's a T1 that goes extremely low, yes there >will be seizures caused from the low. read the [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] >| >| Ira T2 since Dec. 2000 I'm missing something somewhere in the thread. But RK is correct, a type 1 going low enough in a hypo can and will have seizures that can easily be mistaken for epileptic seizures or other problems. The poor man's approach is to do exactly what RK is suggesting above. If the individual is experiencing seizures when the BG is within the normal range then the diabetic needs to be seen by a neurologist as soon as possible. Mâck©® Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.diabetic-talk.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." ...Theodore Roosevelt (o o) --ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------------- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." Jesus never hated anyone. Deanna You shouldn't rely on medical advice from here, or any other discussion board. Even if somebody here, with good intention, gives you advice, he is not a medical professional, doesn't know all circumstances, symptoms, tests, risks and so on. Not to mention, that some will give you advice, that known to be useless or have potential to harm you. You husband need to see the doctor. Do you have something like "General Hospital" in your area? I don't know where you live, but if you live not far from Mexican border you might consider to go there and see the doc, it will, probably, cost less. > Hi all, > [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > Blessings, > Deanna >Deanna >You shouldn't rely on medical advice from here, or any other >discussion board. Hi Deeanna Actually, Palm is right. But you wouldn't do that anyway - you know we are all patients, not doctors. Unfortunately Palm is also an obsessed troll. So ignore the rest. Now, having got that out of the way - welcome to the group:-) I'm type 2, so I won't offer any advice. However, I'm sure you'll get lots of responses from the type 1's - I just thought I'd say g'day. Cheers Alan, T2, Australia. SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. Welcome. I'm not a T1 so really can be of no help with that but wanted to welcome you anyway. SignatureColleen "See, in my line of work you got to keep repeating things over and over and over again for the truth to sink in, to kind of catapult the propaganda." G.W. Bush Greece, N.Y., May 24, 2005 > Hi all, > [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > Blessings, > Deanna Probably, the best thing you can do,is to go to American Diabetes Association website, http://www.diabetes.org/home.jsp type in your zip code in the small window, that says "Got local information" and call to your local chapter of ADA. They might know were you can get free or low cost professional help. > Hi all, > [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > Blessings, > Deanna > Hi all, > [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > and just let it go. What the hell is going on here....is it really a > Low? The only way to know one way or another is to test. > How is he instantly recovering without sugar? It has not been established that he has been low. It could be a problem with his heart, instead. > And there is nothing > I can do until he does something different besides pass along useful [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > I've asked here......or where to begin so just an intro will suffice > for now. Would suggest he inform his primary doctor about his new symptoms. > Thanks for any advice! You are welcome, Deanna:-) > Thanks for being here.....I'm grateful! I'll > read the archives and see what I can learn from there as well. > > Blessings, > Deanna Many blessings to you as well. In Christ's love and service, Andrew -- Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD Board-Certified Cardiologist ** Suggested Reading: (1) http://makeashorterlink.com/?G1D5217EA (2) http://makeashorterlink.com/?W13A4250B (3) http://makeashorterlink.com/?X1C62661A (4) http://makeashorterlink.com/?U1E13130A (5) http://makeashorterlink.com/?K6F72510A (6) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I24E5151A (7) http://makeashorterlink.com/?I22222129 >Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD >Board-Certified Kook Congratulations Deanna You managed to get both of our current resident weirdos responding to your first post:-) Cheers Alan, T2, Australia. SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. deeandjarrod wrote in message <1123367490.398170.251510@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>... >Hi all, > [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] >Blessings, >Deanna R + NPH is an extremely difficult insulin regime. It tends to produce a lot of sky high blood sugars, and a lot of very low blood sugars. The low blood sugars at night often lead to Emergency Room visits and/or convulsions (seizures). The NPH is the really difficult insulin. If people are having seizures at night, it is almost always the NPH at fault. . Many people try to get by on only 2 shots of NPH per day. That means a fairly big shot at bedtime. However, NPH has a peak in activity at 4-6 hours after injection so that bedtime shot sends them low around 3 a.m. When you consider that most folks have the least need for insulin at about 3 a.m., that combination can really cause trouble. If you go too low and have a seizure, a very common result of the low or the seizure is a Somogyi reaction. The ultra-low blood sugar causes a hormone release that in turn "orders" the liver to dump a lot of sugar into the blood. You can go from a 30 blood sugar to a 300 when that happens. http://health.yahoo.com/ency/healthwise/tk3380 Dr. Bernstein's book has some good advice on handling insulins. So do John Walsh's books. My library has books by both authors. One trick for handling NPH is to divide your daily dose into 4 separate shots. Each of the small shots produces less of a low blood sugar episode and thus helps minimize the severity of any lows and the possibility of a seizure. My best results with NPH occurred when I split the daily dose into 4 smaller doses, and shot the bedtime dose after Midnight. One trick is to shoot your daytime NPH shots about 3 hours before each meal. That way, the peak in NPH activity comes at just about the same time as the peak in blood sugar from the meal. Another trick is to shoot your R insulin 30-60 minutes before a meal. R insulin is pretty slow for a "fast" insulin and waiting to eat gives it a chance to start working so that it is peaking when the blood sugar from the meal is peaking. Obviously, if you try to optimize your R and NPH using these techniques, you can't just mix the two in the syringe and get by with only a few shots during the day. It is very inconvenient to do this but much more convenient than going blind or losing your kidneys. Also, a T1 really can't get by with the pre-mix insulins such as 70/30. During his training speeches, our local Endocrinologist stops at this point, makes eye contact with everybody in the room, and repeats, "T1 can't use the pre-mix insulins". Using Humalog or Novolog instead of R insulin will almost always reduce the highs after meals. Using Lantus or Levemir instead of NPH insulin will reduce the number of lows quite drastically, especially the night time lows. Many folks can get by with a single daily shot of Lantus to meet their "slow insulin" quota. Most folks need two daily shots of Levemir to meet their "slow insulin" quota. Obviously, you still must shoot your fast insulin, Humalog or Novolog, just before each meal. However, Humalog, Novolog, Lantus and Levemir cost more than twice as much as the insulins they replace. Most good hospitals have trained diabetic educator nurses (CDE, Certified Diabetic Educators). They are much better than the doctors at advising diabetics about insulin doses because they have much more time available to help. You can take an insulin training course from a CDE, then call her anytime during the day for help if things become confusing. It's usually easier to get into one of those training courses than to get an appointment with a Diabetes Specialist. (In my town, I can't even get an appointment with the two Diabetes Specialists because I am "too healthy". However, I can get accepted into the weekly Insulin Training courses with only a few days wait) Many hospitals offer "scholarships" to their insulin training courses for folks without insurance. The R + NPH regime is straight out of a 1950 textbook. The modern insulin regimes with the modern insulins are much easier to control. Keep coming back. This is a serious subject; Diabetes is a deadly disease. The only dumb question is one you should have asked but didn't. If you can't figure out what our answers mean, ask again. We won't get bored, or mad, or rude. Blessings to you too, Old Al > Hi all, > [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > Blessings, > Deanna Hi Deanna and welcome! Now that OldAl has posted, it's been pretty much covered. The insulin regimen your hub is using was state-of-the-art when his dad was diagnosed. Your hubby will have to see a doc to get prescriptions for new insulins should he decide to give it a try. If you're anywhere near the Canadian border, you don't need prescriptions and the cost is significantly lower than in the US. I pay around $25USD for NovoRapid (Novolog) here in Canada. Some pay as much as $65. Lots of great info here. Keep coming back. These groups (ASD and it's more technical sister, misc.health.diabetes) have made my quality of life much better. Vicki T1, pumper | Hi all, | [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] | Blessings, | Deanna Welcome Deanna, Sorry you had to seek us out... but since you did, this is abt the best place to find info. First totally ignore some of our resident trolls. palm, Uncle Enrico, Dr. Chung to name a few.. I've a box of rox that are smarter then all three put together. ;-) Anyhoo... what Old Al said, those insulins are old care. Very outdated type of treatment. Your husband really needs to get on the newer insulins, but unfortunately they do require prescriptions. One way about this is just having him see his GP and getting a script for what he needs -- then when its affordable get to a endo for proper testing and a bit more guidance. The newer insuilns are Humalog, Novolog, Lantus and the other one OldAl mentioned. I was taking Lantus and Novolog and did pretty good with it, as most do. With Lantus you need to watch how long it actually stays active for the you. (yes, I know its for your hubby) Some find Lantus lasts shorter or longer then 24hrs. I for one used up Lantus by the 19th hour and was left to suppliment with NPH to cover the other 5hrs. Another place to start is to figure out how many carbs hubbys eating and get him to count carbs if he isn't already. Next would be to get him to reduce carbs to get proper carbs and try not to keep carbs at a min. What min? thats up to him.. not even you to decide. It needs to be enough to keep from gaining weight but enough he has plenty of fuel for energy for the day. There are several of us T1's here that eat close to 120-150gm a day and do quite well. I've been eating close to 160gm, not gaining weight, and have a 119mg meter avg for 14days... then again, I've been having several lows this past week too, lol so I might not be the best example.. but either way.. I think you get what needs to be done. Also... exercise is just as important to T1's as it is for anyone... with a brisk walk around the block, I can knock off 60mg easy within a hour. If something comes to mind, feel free to ask, we'll try to share our personal experience the best we can, since personal experience is FAR FAR better then some words on a book that don't share "how" it felt at the time.. Best of Luck... Reisa, T1, pumper Animas IR1250 (novolog) 105bed - 98fbg Hi, I don't know much about diabetic but I 'm glad you here.If you in need of any personal advice stophttp://www.kasamba.com/ViewExpert.asp?conMemID=148744 and I'll be happy to help you with any person advice that you may need. > Hi, I don't know much about diabetic but I 'm glad you here.If you in > need of any personal advice <snip> > and I'll be happy to help you with any person advice that you may need. I get my advice for free, thanks. >Hi, I don't know much about diabetic but I 'm glad you here.If you in >need of any personal advice >stop and I'll be >happy to help you with any person advice that you may need. if you are not diabetic, why would anyone ask you for advice on diabetes? Mâck©® Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.diabetic-talk.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." ...Theodore Roosevelt (o o) --ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------------- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." Jesus never hated anyone. Deanna, I am sorry you are here, but it would be better if your husband were here. I am not a type I so cant offer any information. I am sure you will get help from others. Good luck, it is not an easy journey, but it can be done. Loretta -- In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism. WoW!!!!!!! Thanks everyone for the warm welcome! Great information. You've all given me (us) so much to consider and inspiration to at least get to a general physician for prescriptions and consider trying some new insulins. We're getting the Novolin OTC.....and haven't needed prescriptions. Old Al......you really covered it good! thank you! So is it possible.....that this liver dump thing you are talking about could lead to a rapid rise after a severe low that causes seizure.....hence the confusion as to whether he was even low or not? Up til now I've trusted that he knows what's going on, but now I'm not so sure. Next time he does this, I'm going to check his sugar during and after. If he is conscious and coherent....I do not interfere and only step in on emergency lows and generally monitor indications that he might be dropping. That's always obvious to me so I have never had to check him......but I think its time now for sure. It might be the thing that will get him to the doctor, if we find some weirdness about these seizures that need to be addressed......it's just been too long! He just thinks we can't afford a doctor....but an occassional visit can be done I think. Once again....thanks to ALL.....there's too many to address personally. blessings! deanna |
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