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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / October 2008Am I truly from another planet?
Today I had a phone call with my new dietician. She thought that I was nuts for making my own breads and baked good. Even when I explained about Ginsey's peanut allergy. I did not tell her that I have my own grain mill and make my own flours. I thought that might send her over the edge. The last ten bread that I have made in reverse order are: 100% whole wheat honey bread, Polish potato, Scottish Oat and Rye, Dark Pumpernickel, Rosemary and oil cured olive foccaica, Sweet potato brioche, Challah, Country French bread from wild yeast, Sourdough braided Italian, and 100% whole wheat pitas. Want to know what goes into my whole wheat flour? Wheat berries. That's it. I put wheat berries into the mill and turn it on. No weird chemicals, No alien starches, NO NOTHING EXTRA. Wheat berries! Why do I grind my own wheat and other grains? To make sure it is safe for my little girl. As a benefit to this it tastes alot better. Am I a little nuts about it? Maybe, I have sourdough mothers older than my daughter. I am begining to think that most of you people in the U.S. have never had real bread. They have a place you can get it. Your own kitchen. I learned to make bread in France. Know what they can put into what we call French Bread? Flour, Yeast, Water, and Salt. That's it. I have worked in bakeries Genoa, Tokoyo, Paris, San Fransico, and Rome. Good bakeries don't have chemistry sets for making their bread. At least with something as simple as bread, the rule should be if you can't pronounce it don't eat it. It should not last a month on a shelf. I give almost half of the bread that I make away to neighibors and family because it goes stale. Tomorrow I am going to make a Swedish Limpa Rye with Orange Zest and Currants. So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that you have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be enjoyable and should be. If they weren't supposes to be we would all have kibble bowls and water dishes tucked away in a small dining closet.  SignatureMaster Chef Richard Campbell 100% Delightfully Evil for Your Protection I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it. --Dogbert >So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that you >have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be enjoyable >and should be. If they weren't supposes to be we would all have kibble >bowls and water dishes tucked away in a small dining closet. Yes, I am from another world, if not another planet. Right now I am waiting for the dough to rise for some whole-wheat multigrain bread I am making myself. When it has proved I will turn it into frozen balls as prepared pizza bases, reserving two of tonight. The difference is the portion size when I use them; see: http://loraldiabetes.blogspot.com/2006/11/pizza-with-minimal-carbs.html I love my food, and I try to make every meal interesting and delicious. It's amazing what I have learned to like, once I accepted that my life depended on it. Much like nut allergies. Best wishes Richard. Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. -- d&e, metformin 2000 mg Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter. http://loraldiabetes.blogspot.com (Analysis of a Day's Meals) http://loraltravel.blogspot.com (Two Indian Hotels: to Sleep, Perchance...) > So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that you > have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be enjoyable > and should be. If they weren't supposes to be we would all have kibble > bowls and water dishes tucked away in a small dining closet. I enjoy food plenty well. I just don't enjoy how carbs make me feel. I'm a type 2 diabetic, on no meds, and extremely well controlled by diet. I had lunch with my parents, sister, and brother-in-law yesterday in an elegant restaurant near where my parents live. We did a lot of sharing, of the following dishes: An appetizer of lightly (*very* lightly) breaded oysters over an arugula salad A bowl of house-made cream of mushroom soup Chicken satay, with salad An open-faced prime rib sandwich (well, there might have been bread there, but by the time it came round to me for tasting, there was just roast beef and cheese), with little potato pancakes Hoisin glazed tuna over an arugula salad with citrus vinaigrette Scampi over sauteed spinach An angus burger, generously sized, with little potato pancakes A bowl of chocolate ice cream I didn't taste all of it (no potato pancakes for me, and no ice cream), but everything was wonderfully prepared and seasoned Signature"[xxx] has very definite opinions, and does not suffer fools lightly. This, apparently, upsets the fools." ---BB cuts to the pith of a flame-fest > > So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that > > you have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > I didn't taste all of it (no potato pancakes for me, and no ice cream), > but everything was wonderfully prepared and seasoned That sure sounds good, Alice. That's one of the things I like about eating southeast asian family style. Everything's put on the center of the serving area and everyone gets to eat what they want. I've had some eye opening surprises! SignatureNick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families! I've known US vets who served as far back as the Spanish American War. They are all my heroes! Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! ~Semper Fi~ >> So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that you >> have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be enjoyable [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] >I didn't taste all of it (no potato pancakes for me, and no ice cream), >but everything was wonderfully prepared and seasoned Marry me <G> Yes I always reckoned I ate a good diet, and from a dietician's point of view I suppose I did. Dropping the carbs and substituting other things for the starches has made it both more nutritious and several orders of magnitude more tasty. On Oct 27, 10:21 pm, Alice Faber <afa...@panix.com> wrote:> An appetizer of lightly (*very* lightly) breaded oysters over an arugula salad << Wooo .. living life dangerously .. SEPTICAEMIA .. "High case fatality rate especially in patients with iron overload" "Elevated iron stores may ultimately result in diabetes." "Consuming oysters increases the risk of fatal heart disease in diabetics" -------- OYSTERS, IRON OVERLOAD AND VIBRIO VULNIFICUS SEPTICAEMIA ABSTRACT A case of Vibrio vulnificus septicaemia complicated by cutaneous leg ulceration is described. A 74 year old man with haemochromatosis and sideroblastic anaemia developed an acute febrile illness with cutaneous manifestations 24 hours after ingesting raw oysters. The presence of blistering should be considered an important clue to the diagnosis of Vibrio vulnificus septicaemia, and this can facilitate prompt effective antimicrobial therapy. Clinicians should be aware of this infection because of its high case fatality rate, especially in patients with iron overload states. ---------- Diabetics, watch out for that iron Indian Express via NewsEdge Corporation :. If you are a diabetic then intake of iron-rich food may invite heart problems for you. In its latest issue, leading medical journal Diabetes Care has reported that consuming red meat and other foods high in "heme" iron - like chicken liver, clams and oysters -increases the risk of fatal heart disease in diabetics. The researchers from Harvard School of Public Health in the US advise that "patients with Type 2 diabetes should limit consumption of heme iron and red meat". For experts here, the study has come as an eye opener. "It is usually seen that diabetics have a marked tendency towards heart diseases. Diabetics have more endothelium dysfunction, the platelet dysfunction is more, the deposition of cholesterol is more and if a diabetic is taking supplement iron capsules, the iron gets deposited in the muscle of the heart, making it more vulnerable," says Dr Rakesh Yadav, associate professor, cardiology, All India Institute of Medical Sciences (AIIMS). Though a direct co-relation is still to be proven in India, he suggests that diabetics should avoid overdose of iron and supplement iron capsules. Dr Anoop Misra, Director and Head of Department of Diabetes and Metabolic Diseases, Fortis Hospitals, too, advises caution. "This is the first time such a thing has come forward. Vegetarian food including vegetables like spinach which has high iron content should henceforth be avoided by diabetics." The study, in fact, found women more susceptible to heart disease. Those with the highest intake of heme iron had a 50 per cent higher risk of total Coronary Heart Disease (CHD) compared to those with lowest intake. This poses a particular problem for India. Most Indian women are anemic, which is why they are advised to take iron rich food. "Women," Misra points out, "will be at the receiving end, since they often need and take more iron supplements than men." Curiously enough, the study noted that pre-menopausal women may be at a lesser risk, since they lose a significant amount of iron during menstruation. "The positive association between heme iron and red meat intakes and CHD was more evident among postmenopausal women compared with premenopausal women," it said. Doctors feel that there is a need for separate study to be undertaken for Indians. "The food taken by women here and abroad is very different, so we need to have a separate study to check the consequences in Indian context," said a senior cardiologist in Bara Hindu Rao Hospital. But till then, what is the option? Gynaecologists advise that the only foolproof way is to get a haemoglobin check for diabetic women before more iron consumption is prescribed? "In India, women do need iron, but we have to make sure there is no overdose," says Dr Asha Sharma, Head of Dept, Gynaecology, Rockland Hospital. In fact, "before prescribing iron supplements we always get a haemoglobin count done. In case of diabetics, it is prescribed only if the haemoglobin count is very low." How iron affects the heart An excess of iron in the body leads to a condition call hemosiderosis. In this, the iron gets stored in the body and some of it gets deposited in the heart muscles, causing a disfunction and may even lead to heart failure. The condition is called cardiomyopathy. So, more intake of iron can indeed lead to heart problems, says Dr JPS Sawhney, co-chairman department of cardiology, Sir Ganga Ram hospital. Source: The Indian Express Online Media Ltd.. Source: Financial Times Information Limited. Indexing Date: 29/01/2007 Harvested Date: Jan 26 2007 10:15AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Elevated iron stores may ultimately result in diabetes." A prospective study of plasma ferritin level and incident diabetes: the Atherosclerosis Risk in Communities (ARIC) Study. Jehn ML, Guallar E, Clark JM, Couper D, Duncan BB, Ballantyne CM, Hoogeveen RC, Harris ZL, Pankow JS. Department of Epidemiology, Welch Center for Prevention, Epidemiology, and Clinical Research, Bloomberg School of Public Health, Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore, MD 21205, USA. Am J Epidemiol. 2007 May 1;165(9):1047-54. Epub 2007 Feb 6. The authors performed a case-cohort study nested within the Atherosclerosis Risk in Communities (ARIC) Study to determine the association between plasma ferritin level and risk of type 2 diabetes mellitus. Persons with incident cases of type 2 diabetes diagnosed over an average follow-up period of 7.9 years (n = 599) were compared with a random sample of the cohort (n = 690). After adjustment for age, gender, menopausal status, ethnicity, center, smoking, and alcohol intake, the hazard ratio for diabetes, comparing the fifth quintile of ferritin with the first quintile, was 1.74 (95% confidence interval: 1.14, 2.65; p-trend < 0.001). After further adjustment for body mass index and components of the metabolic syndrome, the hazard ratio was 0.81 (95% confidence interval: 0.49, 1.34; p-trend = 0.87). From a causal perspective, there are two alternative interpretations of these findings. Elevated iron stores, reflected in elevated plasma ferritin levels, may induce baseline metabolic abnormalities that ultimately result in diabetes. Alternatively, elevated ferritin may be just one of several metabolic abnormalities related to the underlying process that ultimately results in diabetes, rather than a causal factor for diabetes. Longitudinal studies with repeated measurements of glucose and iron metabolism parameters are needed to establish the role of iron stores and plasma ferritin in diabetes development. PMID: 17284722 Who loves ya. Tom Jesus Was A Vegetarian! http://tinyurl.com/634q5a Man Is A Herbivore! http://tinyurl.com/4rq595 DEAD PEOPLE WALKING http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk > A bowl of house-made cream of mushroom soup > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > This, apparently, upsets the fools." > ---BB cuts to the pith of a flame-fest >Today I had a phone call with my new dietician. She thought that I was >nuts for making my own breads and baked good. Even when I explained about [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >Country French bread from wild yeast, Sourdough braided Italian, and 100% >whole wheat pitas. The apartment next door to mine is for rent if you are looking.... Most people in industrialized nations everywhere get too lazy to cook from scratch. And those who do, rarely cook from the "garden" as it were. I know you don't grow your own wheat but I haven't met anyone in years in this area who grinds their own flour. That's not to say that people in this group don't make the effort. Some because they or their children have serious food allergies, some because we used to cook for a living and still enjoy it, some because they want better quality food and better control. SignatureMåck©® Deltec CoZmore Pumper Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.diabetic-talk.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org http://diabetes.niddk.nih.gov/dm/pubs/type1and2/ http://www.pandora.com enter "Jason & Demarco" http://www.ratbags.com/dechunging/ "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." ...Theodore Roosevelt (o ô) --ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------------- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." ....Bilbo Baggins DISCLAIMER If you find a posting or message from me offensive, inappropriate, or disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore a posting, complain to me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate... . > Today I had a phone call with my new dietician. She thought that I was > nuts for making my own breads and baked good. Even when I explained about [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Country French bread from wild yeast, Sourdough braided Italian, and 100% > whole wheat pitas. My friend makes her own flour. I had considered doing it some years back but having diabetes then, I wasn't eating very much bread. And bread use with husband and daughter was highly variable, but it was rare for us to eat an entire loaf before it went bad. In our house when I was growing up, bread was treated like poison. My brother and I had to buy our lunch most of the time. We were only allowed to bring a sandwich from home once a week at the very most. And not if my mom could help it! I truly hated the lunches at school and would beg to bring my own. Eventually, I just made my own and that was the end of it. We never had bread on the table with meals. On road trips we might have leftover meatloaf sandwiches. But that was about the only time we as a family had sandwiches. Our bread was mostly the really cheap stuff from the cut price grocery store. You would pick up a grease pencil at the front door and mark your own prices on stuff as you went. No shopping carts or bags. Just flatbed carts andopen topped boxes. I believe the bread was 2 or 4 loaves for a dollar. My brother and I got the white bread and my dad got the wheat bread. It was stored in the freezer until we needed it. My dad went through a period of time (he and my mom were perpetual dieters) where he ate Roman Meal bread. He was the only one allowed to eat it as it was expensive. He made hot mustard sandwiches out of it. Nothing on the bread but hot mustard. Blech! We occasionally had pancakes, waffles or French Toast at our house. Usually during the lean times and that was all we could afford to eat. Sometimes had this for dinner. I don't remember having toast very often at breakfast. My mom was big on oatmeal with raisins in it for breakfast. She thought we needed a hot meal, particularly in the winter. We did eat a lot of donuts, just because they were cheap. The store within walking distance would put out grab bags each night and sell them for 99 cents. There would be at least a dozen items in the bag. Usually donuts but sometimes there would be a muffin or two. Invariably, half of this stuff would go in the freezer where it would be pulled out and reheated in the oven at a later date. No microwaves in those days. I never liked those donuts but far worse was an iced donut that had been put in the oven to reheat. Oddly, I learned to make my own donuts and those I actually liked. Not that I made them often, because I didn't. But I never liked the ones from the store or from donut shops. They were always so greasy and sickly sweet. > Want to know what goes into my whole wheat flour? Wheat berries. That's > it. I put wheat berries into the mill and turn it on. No weird chemicals, > No alien starches, NO NOTHING EXTRA. Wheat berries! Why do I grind my own > wheat and other grains? To make sure it is safe for my little girl. As a > benefit to this it tastes alot better. Am I a little nuts about it? Maybe, > I have sourdough mothers older than my daughter. That's good. I used to make sourdough bread at home. That was very good. > I am begining to think that most of you people in the U.S. have never had > real bread. They have a place you can get it. Your own kitchen. I learned > to make bread in France. Know what they can put into what we call French > Bread? Flour, Yeast, Water, and Salt. That's it. I have worked in bakeries > Genoa, Tokoyo, Paris, San Fransico, and Rome. Good bakeries don't have > chemistry sets for making their bread. The problem here is... We have diabetes. Which means for the most part, we can't eat bread. We just can't! Too many carbs in it. I buy about a loaf a week. Most of it gets thrown out. Sometimes I buy the two pack of Silver Hill's Flax bread at Costco, just because it's packaged that way. One loaf always gets thrown out. Sometimes both. I never know when my husband will eat it. Often he doesn't. But he wants it available to him if he wants a sandwich. I have gastroparesis which means I don't digest my food very well and some foods not at all. When I make something for my husband and daughter that I can't eat, like roast beef, I will might make a sandwich for myself. That's about the only time I eat bread. On a rare occasion I might make toast for a snack. I tried eating it for breakfast but it spiked me. Perhaps because I didn't grow up eating a lot of bread, I never developed a fondness for it. It is truly one thing I can easily live without. I just consider it a convenience food for me. A sandwich is something quick for me to fix. But not something I would ever prefer to eat. I would rather have some hummus with vegetables or something made with dried beans. > At least with something as simple as bread, the rule should be if you > can't pronounce it don't eat it. It should not last a month on a shelf. I > give almost half of the bread that I make away to neighibors and family > because it goes stale. When I used to bake, I gave most of it away too. I loved to bake stuff. But I didn't like to eat it so much. Then when I learned that I had diabetes, I really changed my tune. I also used to make chocolates and other candy. I decided nobody needed this stuff and I wasn't going to give it to them! I have had people ask for candy on occasion and I will make it for them then. But no more making this stuff and giving it away as gifts. Instead, I give deliveries of organic produce. > Tomorrow I am going to make a Swedish Limpa Rye with Orange Zest and > Currants. Sounds waaay too rich for my blood. > So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that you > have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be enjoyable > and should be. If they weren't supposes to be we would all have kibble > bowls and water dishes tucked away in a small dining closet. I don't think you'll find too many here who are fatphobic. Many of us eat unrestricted amounts of fat, but we only eat good fats. Like from olives, avocados and nuts. I am foodphobic, mainly because of the food allergies. If I don't know exactly what's in it, it doesn't go into my mouth. I hate being sick, especially if it came about from something I ate. I also avoid HFCS and transfats. I buy very little in the way of processed foods. I have three crockpots and am hoping to get another, larger one for Christmas. With these, there is no reason ever to eat fast food. You simply put the food in there in the morning (can sometimes do prep the night before) and have a good, wholesome meal ready at dinner time. I also avoid the condensed soups so prevalent in crockpot recipes. I have come up with my own substitutes that work with our food allergies. As for the carbphobic... Yeah! And with good reason. It's not that we don't like the taste of carbs. We do. Or I do. But my body doesn't process them like it should. I have type 2 diabetes. I use two different diabetes meds and also two types of insulin. I have severe insulin resistance. I probably have to use a lot more insulin than you do. I am pretty sure my numbers are still higher than yours. I've been on insulin for something like 7 months now and still don't have the dose worked out to where I am in normal range all of the time. There is no way I will ever be able to eat as many carbs as you can, barring some sort of miracle. It wasn't always this way. I can remember people here getting mad at me for the amount of carbs I had to eat. And I say had to because if I didn't, I'd go hypo. In fact I was hypo most of the time. I was hyper thyroid. The food I ate was just rushing right through me. Eventually that got straightened out, but now with the gastroparesis, things get tricky. When I eat something, it might stay in my stomach for too long, causing high BG. For the most part I have been really good to avoid things that are hard to digest. But sometimes I let my taste buds get the better of me. I really love a nice big salad of organic raw veggies. And if I eat too much of that, I can have trouble. So you see... I have no choice when it comes to carbs. What I would prefer to eat is beans and rice, beans and pasta, a bean burrito with a side of beans and rice... And then of course the raw veggies. This is how I used to eat before I got diabetes. I can't do that any more. I just can't. My body won't allow it. If I overdo the carbs, it screams at me with the pain of neuropathy. I eat more carbs than most here do. I seem to have to have a delicate balance. If I eat too few carbs, my BG goes high. So I need some. But I have to make sure not to eat too many. Keep in mind, you are type 1. Most of us here are type 2. We do not have the leeway you do with food. And we never will. Julie, I believe he has said he is type II on a few occasions. I dont think you had to defend yourself. When he runs into trouble and hopefully he wont, he will see for himself. Loretta > Julie, I believe he has said he is type II on a few occasions. I dont > think you had to defend yourself. When he runs into trouble and > hopefully he wont, he will see for himself. No. He is type 1. You are absolutely right, Julie, I had him confused with soeone else, Unfortunately because of senior moments, the type IIers name is gone. lol Loretta >> Today I had a phone call with my new dietician. She thought that I was >> nuts for making my own breads and baked good. Even when I explained about [quoted text clipped - 161 lines] > Keep in mind, you are type 1. Most of us here are type 2. We do not have > the leeway you do with food. And we never will. loved your life story Julie... it reminds me of many things I can remember from childhood as well. Wes >Today I had a phone call with my new dietician. She thought that I was >nuts for making my own breads and baked good. I make / bake everything from scratch... except I don't make my own flours, I don't need to. I think you're nuts for eating too many carbs - not for wanting to eat delicious, healthy foods : ) Nicky. T2 dx 05/04 + underactive thyroid D&E, 100ug thyroxine Last A1c 5.4% BMI 25 > So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that you > have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be enjoyable > and should be. If they weren't supposes to be we would all have kibble > bowls and water dishes tucked away in a small dining closet. I've made my own bread. These days I don't bother, but instead buy the fresh bread made at the store. I don't bother to look at the bread which was delivered there. And I'm now looking at making my own cheese. I got a starter kit and will likely try it out this weekend. SignatureDon't bother with piddly crap like "gun control". Life is 100% fatal. Ban it. > > So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that > > you have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > And I'm now looking at making my own cheese. I got a starter kit and > will likely try it out this weekend. Howard, You might also check on alt,cheese. It's pretty dead right now, but I've seen some good posts there in the past. Good luck and have fun! SignatureNick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families! I've known US vets who served as far back as the Spanish American War. They are all my heroes! Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! ~Semper Fi~ > You might also check on alt,cheese. It's pretty dead right now, but I've > seen some good posts there in the past. Good luck and have fun! Hadn't even THOUGHT of a cheese ng. Figures. Thanks! SignatureDon't bother with piddly crap like "gun control". Life is 100% fatal. Ban it. > At least with something as simple as bread, the rule should be if you > can't pronounce it don't eat it. It should not last a month on a shelf. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > enjoyable and should be. If they weren't supposes to be we would all > have kibble bowls and water dishes tucked away in a small dining closet. I used to make my own bread, but once I began testing my blood glucose, it became very clear that no matter what form they began in, once starch kernels were ground into flours, they became fast sugars and damaged my health and metabolism. I reject your mindless attack on those who eat nutrient dense veggies in place of nutrient impoverished, high calorie starches. I care a great deal about the quality and taste of what we eat. I buy grass fed meat and dairy, fresh veggies, healthy oils and I cook at home all the time, and I'll stack my family's enjoyment of food and the quality of my cooking and flavors against yours or anyone's any day. We're all slim, btw, too. My husband has no health problems but low carbs for his health and weight maintenance. My 21 y.o. daughter doesn't low carb, but makes everything from scratch, using fresh, wholesome meats, fish and veggies. Perhaps you'll be better qualified to discuss other's food choices once your bg is under better control, you know what your meals are doing to your one and two hour bg levels on a reliable basis and you stop pushing starches, which are clearly keeping you reliant on damaging doses of insulin along with running bg numbers known to cause cell and organ damage. I don't know what planet you're from, but you're talking to folks with faulty carbohydrate metabolism about loading up on starch calories. On what planet does that make sense? Susan : Today I had a phone call with my new dietician. She thought that I was : nuts for making my own breads and baked good. Even when I explained about [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] : Country French bread from wild yeast, Sourdough braided Italian, and 100% : whole wheat pitas. : Want to know what goes into my whole wheat flour? Wheat berries. That's : it. I put wheat berries into the mill and turn it on. No weird chemicals, : No alien starches, NO NOTHING EXTRA. Wheat berries! Why do I grind my own : wheat and other grains? To make sure it is safe for my little girl. As a : benefit to this it tastes alot better. Am I a little nuts about it? Maybe, : I have sourdough mothers older than my daughter. : I am begining to think that most of you people in the U.S. have never had : real bread. They have a place you can get it. Your own kitchen. I learned : to make bread in France. Know what they can put into what we call French : Bread? Flour, Yeast, Water, and Salt. That's it. I have worked in bakeries : Genoa, Tokoyo, Paris, San Fransico, and Rome. Good bakeries don't have : chemistry sets for making their bread. : At least with something as simple as bread, the rule should be if you : can't pronounce it don't eat it. It should not last a month on a shelf. I : give almost half of the bread that I make away to neighibors and family : because it goes stale. : Tomorrow I am going to make a Swedish Limpa Rye with Orange Zest and : Currants. : So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that you : have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be enjoyable : and should be. If they weren't supposes to be we would all have kibble : bowls and water dishes tucked away in a small dining closet. : I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long : and I assume they deserve it. --Dogbert I used to bake bread for my family all the time, but the kids have flown and I am diabetic so the breads I used to make and enjo I can no lognger eat. I still make challah for the holiday period and small challah rolls for the rest of the year so i can have one frfor my Friday night dinner adn not have the left overs to tempt me. My husband gets local bakery rye or pumpernickle, which he loves. My meals are low in bread, but very deliious, well seasoned, fresh, etc as I love to cook. I just spend time finding ways to have foods that in ther regular state, would cause me problems with my blood glucose levels. For Thanksgiving I make a pumpkin pie wih Splenda aand a nut crst. I make a top crust only apple pie with the filling also sweetenned with splenda. I accept tht there are limitations to what I can eat and work with that and have maintained a 70 lb weight loss for over 20 years and close to normal bg numbers. I am not on insulin, so I can't shoot more to cover eating greater carbs, but were I on it, I would hesitate to do that as it would cause me to gain weight, as you well know. I resent your attitude towards us as carbophobic. I would not call your daughter peanutophobic, since she can't eat them. Well, wtching my carbsa and keeping them low is something I must do if I wish to live a long life without diabetic complications. Wendy > I resent your attitude towards us as carbophobic. I would not call your > daughter peanutophobic, since she can't eat them. Well, wtching my carbsa > and keeping them low is something I must do if I wish to live a long life > without diabetic complications. Excellent analogy, Wendy, and I share the resentment of the characterization. There are a lot of very fine food connoisseurs and cooks on this group. Based upon what he's posted so far, I'd say most of us are cooking and eating finer food than the "Master Chef" is. :-) Susan > > I resent your attitude towards us as carbophobic. I would not call > > your daughter peanutophobic, since she can't eat them. Well, wtching [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Based upon what he's posted so far, I'd say most of us are cooking and > eating finer food than the "Master Chef" is. :-) Susan, I've seen descriptions and pics of Rich's food on alt.binaries.food, where I've known him for many years. His food looks and sounds wonderful. It may not conform with what many of us can eat or think he should, and you may think most of us are eating 'finer' food, but no problem. We're rid of him here! SignatureNick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families! I've known US vets who served as far back as the Spanish American War. They are all my heroes! Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! ~Semper Fi~ > I've seen descriptions and pics of Rich's food on alt.binaries.food, where > I've known him for many years. His food looks and sounds wonderful. It may > not conform with what many of us can eat or think he should, and you may > think most of us are eating 'finer' food, but no problem. We're rid of him > here! He chose to leave for reasons that aren't at all clear to me, so I guess you could say *he* is rid of *us* here. Cheri > "Nick Cramer" <n_cramerSPAM@pacbell.net> wrote in message > > I've seen descriptions and pics of Rich's food on alt.binaries.food, > > where I've known him for many years. His food looks and sounds [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > He chose to leave for reasons that aren't at all clear to me, so I guess > you could say *he* is rid of *us* here. I'll call him tomorrow or email him tonight. SignatureNick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families! I've known US vets who served as far back as the Spanish American War. They are all my heroes! Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! ~Semper Fi~ >Susan, > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >think most of us are eating 'finer' food, but no problem. We're rid of him >here! I find that rather sad. I never quite understand why someone would leave because others may disagree with their viewpoint. That has happened to me many times on many forums. I stay to discover if they may be right, and if not, to try to persuade them over time to my way of thinking. Sometimes I succeed (have you dropped in on the ADA forum lately?) and sometimes I don't. But I nearly always learn something useful. I have left a few forums, but always only after a significant period of attempting to follow that philosophy. Quitting early benefits neither side of the discussion. Give the master Chef my regards, Nick; I hope he drops in again sometime. With or without the chip on his shoulder (I'm a chipophobe:-). Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. -- d&e, metformin 2000 mg Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter. http://loraldiabetes.blogspot.com (Analysis of a Day's Meals) http://loraltravel.blogspot.com (Two Indian Hotels: to Sleep, Perchance...) > >Susan, > > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > in on the ADA forum lately?) and sometimes I don't. But I > nearly always learn something useful. I don't think it was because of the disagreement. A couple of our posters were downright unfriendly in their tone and some of the others, surprisingly to me, chimed in. I've taken a few lick here. When you got on me about something, a while back, you didn't beat me up. And, as I'm sure you noted, I'm such an ameliorative guy! ;-) > I have left a few forums, but always only after a > significant period of attempting to follow that philosophy. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > again sometime. With or without the chip on his shoulder > (I'm a chipophobe:-). I'll do that, Alan. Rich recognized that your posts were valuable. SignatureNick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families! I've known US vets who served as far back as the Spanish American War. They are all my heroes! Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! ~Semper Fi~ I dont see how it is unfriendly to suggest he make better choices? He goes apeshit about his bread he makes..nobody said "dont make your own bread!"..but said maybe he could master making a bread that doesnt spike him..to see it as a fun challenge. If i come here and post i eat ice cream...and other say cool...what kind is it?...and i say its the kind with HFCS and a ton of carbs and sombody else recoomends a healthier alternative and i get mad about it...well thats silly. KROM "Nick Cramer" <n_cramerSPAM@pacbell.net> wrote . A couple of our posters > were downright unfriendly in their tone and some of the others, > surprisingly to me, chimed in. I didn't see anybody being unfriendly, but then my definition of unfriendly might be different. :-) Cheri >I dont see how it is unfriendly to suggest he make better choices? > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >> were downright unfriendly in their tone and some of the others, >> surprisingly to me, chimed in. Well not everyone is right for these groups so his choice....i wanted to talk cooking with him and formulate recipes for type ones and two but he ran off... KROM >I didn't see anybody being unfriendly, but then my definition of unfriendly >might be different. :-) >Well not everyone is right for these groups so his choice....i wanted to >talk cooking with him and formulate recipes for type ones and two but he ran >off... Yeah, shame... Nicky. T2 dx 05/04 + underactive thyroid D&E, 100ug thyroxine Last A1c 5.4% BMI 25 > I don't think it was because of the disagreement. A couple of our posters > were downright unfriendly in their tone and some of the others, > surprisingly to me, chimed in. You'd have to point out to me where anyone was unfriendly *before* he started being negative. Susan >x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Susan Just for the record, that was from Nick, not me. Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. -- d&e, metformin 2000 mg Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter. http://loraldiabetes.blogspot.com (Analysis of a Day's Meals) http://loraltravel.blogspot.com (Two Indian Hotels: to Sleep, Perchance...) > >> I don't think it was because of the disagreement. A couple of our > >> posters were downright unfriendly in their tone and some of the > >> others, surprisingly to me, chimed in. > > > >You'd have to point out to me where anyone was unfriendly *before* he > >started being negative. > Just for the record, that was from Nick, not me. Alan is quite correct. My NewsReader indents posts to make that obvious to me. SignatureNick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families! I've known US vets who served as far back as the Spanish American War. They are all my heroes! Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! ~Semper Fi~ >>>> I don't think it was because of the disagreement. A couple of our >>>> posters were downright unfriendly in their tone and some of the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Alan is quite correct. My NewsReader indents posts to make that > obvious to me. And strangely my OEQuote Fix prog (which puts replies in different colours, shows the quote to be Alan's, weird. Even has the correct number of indent >>> thingies. > I resent your attitude towards us as carbophobic. I would not call your > daughter peanutophobic, since she can't eat them. Well, wtching my carbsa > and keeping them low is something I must do if I wish to live a long life > without diabetic complications. Well said, Wendy! I love to bake my own bread, but I need to keep my portions of it so small for BG control that it's almost not worth it. When family comes visiting, then I know it won't go to waste, and I bake. PP, T2 > : [ . . . ] > : So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that > : you have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > carbsa and keeping them low is something I must do if I wish to live a > long life without diabetic complications. Wendy, Although Rich has been a T1 for a while, he has just discovered this group. I think for the first time, he's discovering what bad advice he's been getting from 'professionals'. I also think that he, like any of us, is entitled to the occasional rant. SignatureNick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families! I've known US vets who served as far back as the Spanish American War. They are all my heroes! Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! ~Semper Fi~ >>> [ . . . ] > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > he's been getting from 'professionals'. I also think that he, like > any of us, is entitled to the occasional rant. I don't mind rants but Rich is dissing those giving him the benefit of a lot of experience. As Wendy said, no one is calling his daughter a peanutophobic or him a latexophobic. He could give the people who need to lower their carbs the same respect he gives his daughter for having to totally avoid peanuts to stay alive, ditto himself for the latex allergy. Once he gets his weight down he will probably find he doesn't have to use so much insulin or watch everything he eats. He can settle back to the regimen he had as a type 1 prior to all his problems. With his wild bg swings he is not doing himself any favours. > >>> [ . . . ] > > [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > regimen he had as a type 1 prior to all his problems. With his wild bg > swings he is not doing himself any favours. G'day, Ozgirl, While Rich's words belie mine, I don't think he was dissing the group. I think I know him. While he is loving and gentle with his family and he's Ginsey's slave, he is one tough SOB! He's been in some seriously dangerous situations and always conquored them, except for diabetes. I know how maddening that can be. I empathize with with him and appreciate your thoughts. I'd rather have him rant here than bang his head against the wall, screaming and crying. BTDT SignatureNick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families! I've known US vets who served as far back as the Spanish American War. They are all my heroes! Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! ~Semper Fi~ > Although Rich has been a T1 for a while, he has just discovered this group. > I think for the first time, he's discovering what bad advice he's been > getting from 'professionals'. I also think that he, like any of us, is > entitled to the occasional rant. I'm trying to remember the last time any one of us ranted at the group for offering assistance, suggestions, or for reading impossibly scrambled formatting in an attempt to be of service. Sorry, but your friend behaved like a graceless jerk. Susan > I'm trying to remember the last time any one of us ranted at the group for > offering assistance, suggestions, or for reading impossibly scrambled > formatting in an attempt to be of service. > Susan Think Grandpa Chuck. ;-) Cheri >x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >for offering assistance, suggestions, or for reading impossibly >scrambled formatting in an attempt to be of service. T*m >> : [ . . . ] > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > getting from 'professionals'. I also think that he, like any of us, is > entitled to the occasional rant. All the 'professionals' care about are the numbers. I know my endo doesn't give a flying f*** what I eat or if I exercise, as long as my numbers are in line. I could be using a hundred units of insulin a day and the only question she'd ask is how many hypos I had. Rich is an insulin resistant T1. Without insulin resistance he would be using around 55 units of insulin per day, and he's using well over 100 units (based on his reports). Whether or not the insulin resistance will subside once he's completely healed and the excess weight is gone he'll have to wait and see. It's been a tough row for him to hoe, but there's still a lot of work he has to do. If he wants to eat a carby diet that's his choice, but it's a *hell* of a lot easier to control bg and lose weight by cutting the carbs. If he doesn't learn how to count carbs properly he'll be forever at the mercy of his doctors. They'll be setting his doses and telling him how many carbs to eat and he won't have a clue how to adjust *properly* to get the amazing control an insulin pump can give. He's not the one from another planet - we are - and we'll live longer and healthier lives because of it. Eccentric? Me? Damn straight! Vicki Richard, are you insulting us because we are trying to help you. are you 100% evil as you write lol Lorettta > So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that you > have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be enjoyable > and should be. If they weren't supposes to be we would all have kibble > bowls and water dishes tucked away in a small dining closet. That is simply not true. My meals are very enjoyable, and don't include bread at all as a rule...as for kibble, I only feed my dog meat and veggies that I could eat at any time. She enjoys it highly, and there was no worry with the contaminated dog food last year either. I have no problem at all with how you eat, but I think the "phobic" label for others who don't eat that way is a bit over the top. JMO :-) Cheri > So many of you have become so carbophobic, fatphobic, foodphobic; that you > have forgotten that meals with those that you care about can be enjoyable > and should be. If they weren't supposes to be we would all have kibble > bowls and water dishes tucked away in a small dining closet. I do the cooking in our house, and I rarely spend more than half an hour in the preparation of a meal. The exceptions are big stock meals which last for days, such as soups or stews. Rather than a low carber I prefer to call myself a low spiker because I adapt my diet based on BG meter readings, not carb counts. It so happens that doing that has got me into low carb territory, but that's a side effect rather than an intention. My wife isn't diabetic and has rather high standards where food is concerned. Nevertheless we eat exactly the same food, except that she sometimes has cereals for breakfast, which I avoid, and I sometimes add some kind of potato to her evening meal, which I avoid. She's generally pretty pleased with what I serve up. I also note that a number of posters here both practise more severe BG control than I do, and also are more capable cooks many of whose meals sound a lot tastier than anything I prepare. So it's clearly not only quite possible to have enjoyable tasty home cooked food while eating what you regard as a carbophobic diet, but not uncommon here. I don't know where you get your idea that many of us low carbers are eating rather boring Spartan diets. Is it possible that that is a mistaken deduction from criticisms some have made of some of your favourite foods? SignatureChris Malcolm >I am begining to think that most of you people in the U.S. have never had >real bread. They have a place you can get it. Your own kitchen. I learned >to make bread in France. Know what they can put into what we call French >Bread? Flour, Yeast, Water, and Salt. That's it. I have worked in bakeries >Genoa, Tokoyo, Paris, San Fransico, and Rome. Good bakeries don't have >chemistry sets for making their bread. Hey, I used to be famous for my bread. People would queue for my bread. Also I devised a muesli that a friend later put into commercial production. UNFORTUNATELY I didn't know then what I know now, that all those healthy carbs were what was making me feel (and be) ill. |
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