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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / August 2007tried the cider vinager test today..
Starting bg was 96...took 2 tablespoons cider vinager with splenda and lemon concentrate with water to make a semi lemonade. Well tasted awful but i choked it down and tested every 30 mins... Results were bass akwards then i expected i went up! I didnt liver dump and i didnt eat anything prior to the test...my number went up to 106 and hovered there till i gave up and ate a sandwich done with the experiment for now..lol. I will try to see if it reduces my numbers right after a meal next. KROM > Starting bg was 96...took 2 tablespoons cider vinager with splenda and > lemon concentrate with water to make a semi lemonade. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > KROM Hmm, I have never tried it without eating right after. Maybe I'll try that. Because meters are not so exact, the difference between 106 and 96 is not so much. KC Well i didnt want food eaten to factor in..and still not be so far removed from eating that it is a liver dump.. It very well might effect food in the stomach or some mechenism my test failed to hit upon. KROM >> Starting bg was 96...took 2 tablespoons cider vinager with splenda and >> lemon concentrate with water to make a semi lemonade. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > KC > Well i didnt want food eaten to factor in..and still not be so far removed > from eating that it is a liver dump.. [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Yeah, I have noticed that my meter has a standard deviation of about 30 mg/dL, but my nurse practitioner said that they allow for a deviation of about 60 between different brands! KROM, would you mind explaining the term "liver dump"? I've been in this game for 15 years and have never heard that term. Thanks. -Andal > > Well i didnt want food eaten to factor in..and still not be so far removed > > from eating that it is a liver dump.. [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > this game for 15 years and have never heard that term. Thanks. > -Andal While waiting for KROM, when your blood sugar gets too low, your liver will release some - often too much. What he said..lol. I first learned of this when i wake up on a empty stomach and went and did some yard work to get it done in the cool of the morning. When i finished and sat down i felt horrible and checked my blood and it was like 260...fasting with meds im usually under 100. So it was a scary ordeal..especially once my bodies natural production fired up and flooed me with insulin and crashed me to 34. Felt like crap for two days after and learned it was a liver dump from here and my endo. Now if i work hard and creep up i will eat anyways a thing like almonds so when my insulin kicks in i dont plummet so hard and i stabalise rest of the day. KROM > While waiting for KROM, when your blood sugar gets too low, your > liver will release some - often too much. > What he said..lol. > I first learned of this when i wake up on a empty stomach and went and did [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > While waiting for KROM, when your blood sugar gets too low, your > > liver will release some - often too much. Thanks, KROM and Robert. Glycogen dump, right? So it's the cause of a rebound. I just never heard that term liver dump before. Is there a way to tell how much insulin your body produces by itself? I know if I were 270, I would have to take 2 or 2.5 units of novolog, but I wouldn't crash unless I had had a drink or something...It's just not something I experience that my high blood sugars ever go down by themselves. >> What he said..lol. >> I first learned of this when i wake up on a empty stomach and went and [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >> here >> and my endo. May have not been a liver dump, Ive done this if I get dehydrated. BG reads really high then after I drink a couple of glasses of water it plummets. It hasnt done this for a while now as I am more careful about letting it. I was well hydrated as i carry a big squeez bottle of water when im in the yard. KROM >>> What he said..lol. >>> I first learned of this when i wake up on a empty stomach and went and [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > plummets. It hasnt done this for a while now as I am more careful about > letting it. Everyones different and If you are a type two your pancreas can turn on and off at its whim. So some days i can eat almost anything and never break 90 and others i look at a carb i jump..and i take the same meds same time everyday. KROM > Is there a way to tell how much insulin your body produces by itself? > I know if I were 270, I would have to take 2 or 2.5 units of novolog, > but I wouldn't crash unless I had had a drink or something...It's just > not something I experience that my high blood sugars ever go down by > themselves. > Starting bg was 96...took 2 tablespoons cider vinager with splenda and > lemon concentrate with water to make a semi lemonade. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > KROM Thats the slow painful way to drink vinegar, Just fill up a shot glass and let it go. You may never even taste it. Jimmie > Thats the slow painful way to drink vinegar, Just fill up a shot glass and > let it go. You may never even taste it. > > Jimmie I'd suggest drinking wine and then (gulp some air?) letting it turn to vinegar in your stomach... ;) Sean >I will try to see if it reduces my numbers right after a meal next. Well yeah, that's the point of it - AFAIK, it doesn't have any effect on hepatic production. I don't know exactly what it does do, but I have a vague feeling it does something with GLP-1 - so you'd have to eat to see an effect. Nicky. T2 dx 05/04 + underactive thyroid D&E, 100ug thyroxine Last A1c 5.6% BMI 25 I just tried to take it without eating because my blood sugar was high at 170. So, instead of taking some insulin I took some vinegar. I was 166 an hour later. I will creep up even without eating, so 166 wasn't bad but it definitely wasn't as good as the results I get when I take it with eating. KC Will do..in fact i semi tried it tonight...i ate some breaded fish sticks wife bought with a spritz of vinager and tartar sauce that was lowish in carbs. My pre meal bg number was 86 and one hour later 120 and one hour after that i was 89. So maybe it had a effect to help block carb absortion in the gut? Intersting and tasty test tho..lol KROM >>I will try to see if it reduces my numbers right after a meal next. > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > D&E, 100ug thyroxine > Last A1c 5.6% BMI 25 > So maybe it had a effect to help block carb absortion in the gut? That's what I am thinking now that I too tried to take vinegar without food and got no effect. KC "Starting bg was 96...took 2 tablespoons cider vinager with splenda and lemon concentrate with water to make a semi lemonade." The fillers used in splenda to make its bulk similar to sugar are pure carbs. I never had a bg raise from splenda at all and i eat alot of it in my coffee and sodas. Now the baking mix is half sugar a 50/50 blend so gotta be careful with that. KROM > "Starting bg was 96...took 2 tablespoons cider vinager with splenda and > lemon > concentrate with water to make a semi lemonade." > > The fillers used in splenda to make its bulk similar to sugar are pure > carbs. "I never had a bg raise from splenda at all and i eat alot of it in my coffee and sodas. Now the baking mix is half sugar a 50/50 blend so gotta be careful with that." Look at the packets used in coffie and see what contents are listed first. When it is used in foods it does not have the fillers. Big users of it can get pure splenda. The bulk baking form has fillers similar to the packets, not sugar. The amounts of fillers is small but pure carbs none the less. Your bg milage can vary. > Starting bg was 96...took 2 tablespoons cider vinager with splenda and > lemon concentrate with water to make a semi lemonade. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > I will try to see if it reduces my numbers right after a meal next. Hi krom, here is a short and free article : Diabetes Care. 2004 Jan;27(1):281-2. Vinegar improves insulin sensitivity to a high-carbohydrate meal in subjects with insulin resistance or type 2 diabetes. PMID: 14694010 These data indicate that vinegar can significantly improve postprandial insulin sensitivity in insulin-resistant subjects. Acetic acid has been shown to suppress disaccharidase activity (3) and to raise glucose-6-phosphate concentrations in skeletal muscle (4); thus, vinegar may possess physiological effects similar to acarbose or metformin. Further investigations to examine the efficacy of vinegar as an antidiabetic therapy are warranted. Vinegar also reduces the expression of genes involved in gluconeogenesis and lipogenesis, which is in part regulated by 5'-AMP-activated protein kinase (AMPK) an enzyme which senses the energy status of the cell. hth Gys Ahh ty so indeed on a empty stomach or low carb meal it will have little effect. So as a safe guard on the days i eat more carbs then normal i will try the vinager shot after the meal or use it on the meal itself where applicable such as the fish sticks i ate. KROM >> Starting bg was 96...took 2 tablespoons cider vinager with splenda and >> lemon concentrate with water to make a semi lemonade. [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > hth > Gys > Ahh ty so indeed on a empty stomach or low carb meal it will have little > effect. > So as a safe guard on the days i eat more carbs then normal i will try the > vinager shot after the meal or use it on the meal itself where applicable > such as the fish sticks i ate. I incorporate vinegar into a meal. For example lunch for me is almost always a very large plate of salad (with some protein) from a variety of raw vegetables, with a vinaigrette dressing (home made, no salt but garlic and onion marinated in it). My evening meal usually has a side salad accompanying it. So it's a protein, often fish or chicken, with cooked vegetables and a bowl of salad with the vinaigrette. I like salads..so this is a good way to add it into my meals as you do..i just norm eat a dressing made with yogurt but i can adapt to add the vinager too. KROM >> Ahh ty so indeed on a empty stomach or low carb meal it will have little >> effect. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > accompanying it. So it's a protein, often fish or chicken, with cooked > vegetables and a bowl of salad with the vinaigrette. >Ahh ty so indeed on a empty stomach or low carb meal it will have little >effect. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >KROM Much easier and tastier to include your "vinegar shot" as part of the meal - in the salad dressing, in a stew or stir-fry etc. Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 1500mg, ezetrol 10mg Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter. -- http://loraltraveloz.blogspot.com/ latest: Mossman Gorge in the Daintree Rainforest http://loraldiabetes.blogspot.com/ latest: Self-Testing and Type 2 Management Tonight im going to make lo-mein with dreamfields speggeti noodles and chicken breast marinated in hoisin and rice vinegar ..seasame oil..splenda and white pepper. The finsish dish will have veggies and hot peppers for a zing. Should be good..same recipee i norm use but splenda in place of reg honey or sugar to sweeten. KROM >>Ahh ty so indeed on a empty stomach or low carb meal it will have little >>effect. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > http://loraldiabetes.blogspot.com/ > latest: Self-Testing and Type 2 Management The lo mein was excellent! Better then take out for sure! To be extra extra sure dreamfiels doesnt raise me i tested 20 mins after eating and 40 and 60 and 90 then went back to normal rest of the day. my highest reading was the first one 20 mins after eating a very filling portion and it was 120..it fell from that point on..so thank you splenda for bringing me chinese back! I love sweet and sour sauces and always made then with sugar and honey and corn starch. Now i just cook the sauce down till thick and add it to the chicken and veggies and noodles at the end..works great! KROM > Tonight im going to make lo-mein with dreamfields speggeti noodles and > chicken breast marinated in hoisin and rice vinegar ..seasame oil..splenda [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > KROM >To be extra extra sure dreamfiels doesnt raise me i tested 20 mins after >eating and 40 and 60 and 90 then went back to normal rest of the day. Not enough tests, Krom - Dreamfields can strike hard, late - around 3-5 hours pp. BTW, anyone seen the rice they were supposed to be working on? Nicky. (Dreamfields fan) T2 dx 05/04 + underactive thyroid D&E, 100ug thyroxine Last A1c 5.6% BMI 25 Nicky wrote in message ... >BTW, anyone seen the rice they were supposed to be working on? > >Nicky. (Dreamfields fan) >T2 dx 05/04 + underactive thyroid >D&E, 100ug thyroxine >Last A1c 5.6% BMI 25 No, and I've noticed that most of the Dreamfields pasta has disappeared from the shelves where I live. It's not good to me, so I don't buy it, but I have noticed it's mostly gone. Cheri >No, and I've noticed that most of the Dreamfields pasta has >disappeared from the shelves where I live. It's not good to me, so I >don't buy it, but I have noticed it's mostly gone. Rats. I will be seriously irritated when it goes - although there are currently 5 flowers on my spaghetti squash : ) Nicky. T2 dx 05/04 + underactive thyroid D&E, 100ug thyroxine Last A1c 5.6% BMI 25 I tested all the rest of the day in my usual times and never saw a late rise and never have from dream fields..i was just curious to see if maybe i had a early early peek and nope its fine. I tested thru out the day till 12 hours out and highest readign that day was 120 right after eating it and 90 rest of the day. I am one of the lucky ones who can eat it fine. KROM >>To be extra extra sure dreamfiels doesnt raise me i tested 20 mins after >>eating and 40 and 60 and 90 then went back to normal rest of the day. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > D&E, 100ug thyroxine > Last A1c 5.6% BMI 25 |
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