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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / December 2006Ive been to consultant appt (Endocrinology)
I am back from the endo consultant appt !! Got there on time only for the dr to be 2hrs late and got home at 2pm-ish !! He was very good and listened to me !! But he has agreed with me as he thinks that I do need Novorapid with all meals !! But instead of it being done to the amount of carbs I eat at meals its basically going to be so much at each meal and if it doesnt help to go up every 2 days by 4 units an injection !! Long acting insulin is staying Lantus at 46 units but may be changed to "Insulatard" if the new regime doesnt work !! He will keep in touch with how things going via me calling lead DSN and will physically see him in 3mths unless an earlier appointment is needed !! I have offically joined the MDI regime !! > I am back from the endo consultant appt !! > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > I have offically joined the MDI regime !! Contratulations on finally seeing someone who will help you competently manage your diabetes! I wonder if you addressed the steroid issue with him? I understand that you have a number of health problems, but as someone who's recovering from adrenal suppression due to long term low dose steroid use, I've learned that it often promotes and worsens the conditions it's prescribed to help when used long term. Both insulin and steroid drugs inhibits your body's adrenals, promoting inflammation and its various complications, including worsening asthma, arthritis, muscle pain, inability to fight infections, etc... I hope you'll ask your new endo to evaluate your adrenal function; my dysfunction didn't show up on twice a day blood testing, but was very significant in a 24 hour urinary free cortisol test following discontinuation of steroids. Susan He went through everything but having my history in front of him he saw the reasons why steroids are vital to me staying alive! I cant stress that enough but he saw it in black and white! I have adrenal testing frequently anyway and ahve done for yrs! And yet again I will say "I CAN NOT COME OFF STEROID TABS EVER" ok! There are issues why he is looking at Insulatard and him explaining it to me made perfect stuff! And he is very up on it all! Up to date treatments is not always right for everyone! The regime he has started today is: Brekkie - 1000mg metformin s/r 46u Lantus 2u Novorapid Lunch - 10u Novorapid Dinner - 12u Novorapid If bg's are not responding then I up the Novorapid by 4u every 2 days at the meals they are still high at! He doesnt want me to do it per carbs for a reason! And it makes perfect sense to me - hes explained it in terms of everything I suffer with and take! Just because alot of you have a specific treatment or viewpoints for god's sake STOP ramming them down everyones throat! People want advice not lectures! Then again some people are not happy unless they are picking apart someones life! There are a few people here who have really helped me but I am pig sick of everything my team does is criticised by know-it-alls! For pitys sake BACK OFF! > He went through everything but having my history in front of him he saw the > reasons why steroids are vital to me staying alive! [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > > For pitys sake BACK OFF! I'm assuming that the rant at the end of your post was not for me, as I don't believe I criticised your doc nor told you what to take or not to take. Susan No, I think it's for Kurt. ;-) Little bit of humor there. -- Cheri >x-no-archive: yes >> He doesnt want me to do it per carbs for a reason! >> And it makes perfect sense to me - hes explained it in terms of everything I [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >Susan > No, I think it's for Kurt. ;-) Little bit of humor there. LOL. I love your sense of humor, Cheri. I confess to it...whatever it was! Best, Kurt > -- > Cheri [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > > >Susan It was nothing bad Kurt. :-) -- Cheri Kurt wrote in message <1166155839.798308.213690@73g2000cwn.googlegroups.com>... >> No, I think it's for Kurt. ;-) Little bit of humor there. > [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] >> > >> >Susan >> For pitys sake BACK OFF! > >I'm assuming that the rant at the end of your post was not for me, as I >don't believe I criticised your doc nor told you what to take or not to >take. Susan, it looks to me like it *was* for you. >>>For pitys sake BACK OFF! >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Susan, it looks to me like it *was* for you. I think it was mostly for Reisa, who crammed unqualified medical advice down her throat. I suggested she discuss something with her doctor, not knowing that she already had, since she hadn't provided the info, and had posted earlier about steroids being the cause of a lot of her sx. Susan >I think it was mostly for Reisa, who crammed unqualified medical advice >down her throat. I suggested she discuss something with her doctor, not >knowing that she already had, since she hadn't provided the info, and >had posted earlier about steroids being the cause of a lot of her sx. My mistake. Nah, I don't think so at all... -- Cheri dumb_fishie99@yahoo.com wrote in message ... >>> For pitys sake BACK OFF! >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Susan, it looks to me like it *was* for you. > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> I have adrenal testing frequently anyway and ahve done for yrs! >> And yet again I will say "I CAN NOT COME OFF STEROID TABS EVER" ok!> SORRY SUSAN - most of it bar the above was meant for others! Susan sorry the last 3/4 of the psot wasn't for you but for those people guaranteed to come in and criticse yet again. And low and behold what do they do. Sorry Susan but I can not come of steroids for 2 reasons: a) every time I even try to reduce them (now been TOLD not to try) I end up ventilated in ITU! b) as my body no longer produces any steroids I seriously drop my blood pressure when evere I try to reduce them! And like someone else said their are medical grounds (eg...kidney transplant or more) that mean people cant come off steroids. If medical grounds and my life depend on them I have certainly NOT lost brain function but are indeed preserving it in me! A lack of oxygen from respiratory arrest would almost certainly affect my brain functione IF I stop steroids even weaning them down - this has been tried by alot higher Drs than normal with me in hospital at the time but it still led to intensive care and a ventilator so I dont reduce or not take them at all! But what I have lost the ability of being able to put up with idiots. > SORRY SUSAN - most of it bar the above was meant for others! > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > b) as my body no longer produces any steroids I seriously drop my blood > pressure when evere I try to reduce them! This happened to me, too, Donna, the bp drop to 90/53 when severely adrenally suppressed. Now, months later, my adrenals are over producing. Tapering off steroids, especially those used for years, should take months to years, to allow your adrenals to gradually work up to speed again. I've never ended up on a ventilator, and I'm sure it's very scary. I do think over the long term, you might be better off, but if your bg is still high and your use of insulin is very high, your ashtma might not come under control. I really think you need a very complete medical plan for all of this worked out with the best docs you can find. > And like someone else said their are medical grounds (eg...kidney transplant > or more) that mean people cant come off steroids. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > But what I have lost the ability of being able to put up with idiots. It's kind of a requirement around here, but that's what kill files are for. I understand that you have a very complicated medical picture, I do, too, and often my responses to meds and treatment are very different from those of others. Having been adrenally shut down due to steroid use and the effect of higher insulin sensitivity on my adrenals, I know that adrenal recovery takes 12-18 mos (according to my endo and my research) and that tapering SLOWLY is always required. Whatever path you take, I wish you luck and improvement. Susan Gosh Donna, it seemed to me that Susan was only sharing her own experience; not telling you what you should do. This is a discussion group after all, and sometimes the experience of someone else helps us with our own; sometimes others' experiences do not apply, but in either case, the purpose is to share information. I doubt that Susan knew you had already had adrenal function tests. I know that I didn't, and I do try to keep on your posts.  SignatureMichelle, T2 diet & exercise > He went through everything but having my history in front of him he saw > the reasons why steroids are vital to me staying alive! [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > > For pitys sake BACK OFF! > Gosh Donna, it seemed to me that Susan was only sharing her own experience; > not telling you what you should do. This is a discussion group after all, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I doubt that Susan knew you had already had adrenal function tests. I know > that I didn't, and I do try to keep on your posts. One of the problems with steroid use is that it worsens brain function, impulse control, mood and causes agitation, often. We only know Donna this way. Maybe she's this way due to drug effects. I feel very sorry for anyone who feels she must stay on steroids long term, knowing what a vicious cycle they create. Susan > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Susan I guess then you feel that I should yank out my transplanted kidney and go back on dialysis so I will not have to suffer the long term effects of steroids. You wouldn't be the first one to accuse me of lost brain function. My favourite aunt quite often calls me and my cousins "retarded" when she hears of our antics. ;-)) I know that you seriously distrust the medical profession Susan, but some of them actually know what they are doing. Life with prednisone and appropriate measures to adjust to the side effects is vastly preferable to no life at all. ;-) Just pointing out the other side's point of view. Dennis (Type 2, Kidney Transplant 1995) 7.5 mg Prednisone Daily > I guess then you feel that I should yank out my transplanted kidney and > go back on dialysis so I will not have to suffer the long term effects of [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Dennis (Type 2, Kidney Transplant 1995) > 7.5 mg Prednisone Daily Dennis some people just dont get that in some people stopping steroids would kill them! Its a losing battle in here to get that through to them. Thanks! > I guess then you feel that I should yank out my transplanted kidney and > go back on dialysis so I will not have to suffer the long term effects of [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > appropriate measures to adjust to the side effects is vastly preferable > to no life at all. ;-) Just pointing out the other side's point of view. Dennis, no, of course not. I understand the role of anti rejection drugs and yours is an example of their necessity, or the need for some kind of immunosuppressant. I don't know if there are less adrenal damaging IS drugs out there, not ever having investigated it at all. I do seriously distrust the medical profession, since most of my most debilitating conditions have been either directly caused or gone undiagnosed or inappropriately treated (without appropriate monitoring) by highly regarded doctors at prestigious medical centers and elsewhere for decades. Yours is a situation I wasn't thinking of when wording my post. Susan >> I doubt that Susan knew you had already had adrenal function tests. I know >> that I didn't, and I do try to keep on your posts. > >One of the problems with steroid use is that it worsens brain function, >impulse control, mood and causes agitation, often. You know, I read about that while I was looking up stuff about brittle asthma. Interesting but scary. I wouldnt want to go through it. >We only know Donna this way. Maybe she's this way due to drug effects. > >I feel very sorry for anyone who feels she must stay on steroids long >term, knowing what a vicious cycle they create. I hope she is getting the treatment she needs, even if she does feel the need to suddenly pretend that it was all her idea that that her DSN was not doing enough for her. The important thing is that it happened. I have a nurse friend who told me scary stories about what high blood sugar can do to you, mentally, too. I hope it doesn't happen to me. I already experienced how much better things are now that I got my diet under control. but I wouldn't want to have anything as extreme as what she told me about. Maybe DOona will eventually decide that she needs to look into your suggestion (along with her doctor), as long as she can pretend to herself that it's her idea. That would be ok, right? Anyway, one can only hope. > I hope she is getting the treatment she needs, even if she does > feel the need to suddenly pretend that it was all her idea that > that her DSN was not doing enough for her. The important thing > is that it happened. Actually were u there at my appointment ?? No you were not so stop assuming AGAIN !! I told the consultant I had asked friends (actuallly how i been treated here its more like enemies) and had done research and that what I found was recommended for my situation was basal/bolus. I said in opening post ""But he has agreed with me as he thinks that I do need Novorapid with all meals !!"" I said to him that from my research it was recommended I did not say it was my idea but I certainly told him it is what I woukd prefer over mixed Insulin (which was also discussed). FOR ANYONE WAITING TO HAVE AGO AT ME the next bit is for you! The cons looked at the whole me and did not pick or choose what he heard or say like people here do. Becuase of surgery its not recommended I eat a very low carb diets as it affects my bowel function or will do. And also as I am at high risk of heart problems (runs in family) a low carb diet can cause problem so the risk of a low carb diet for too long is high for me! He is trying correctiong doses at meal times as I would need to high a carb ratio also! I can not be treated conventionally and that is obvious if u have my notes in front of you! It was also mentioned to change Metformin s/r to "Rosiglitazone" when it is licensed in the UK to use alongside with Insulin. But then again every step any of my team have taken has been criticised in here so why am I yet again trying to explain it cause no-one actually gives a damn! See, here's the problem. And, this has been said before. You come here & like everyone else here you're interested in learning & interested in what may help you. You seem only to be interested in threads which you begin. That's not an indictment but a description. Yes, you have many times repeated the same several statements over & over - needlessly, since most people read full threads. But, you often have not answered questions, instead making vague comments that things are for a reason. Then, when you become irritated, you lash out at everyone, may explosively, and finally, provide detailed information in a burst, and claim that you've been ill-treated and that people here are more like enemies. If you think that, truly, then, why in the world would you continue to come back here? How can people know you when you provide information only piecemeal, selectively answer questions but few of them instead repeating general statements, ... then accuse people of not knowing you. If your mode of communicating here is not working for you, why not look at that? I assure you that most people who come here are not having this experience. You can verify that yourself if you want to pick any newbie thread in the past 6 months & see how they go. If you want things to continue the way they are here, you have that in your power also. If people didn't care & didn't want to help - if they can - they would simply not reply to your posts. All that said, I'm glad you feel better about things, whether it makes sense to any of us or not. SignatureDonnaB : ^> <*> 06-07-06 Diagnosis T2 hbA1C 8.1, D&E & Metformin 500mg. 09-11-06 hbA1C 5.0 http://www.ajc.com/news/mplayer/panda cub /6371 "As I sat on a sunny bank, on Christmas Day in the morning, I spied three ships come sailing by." - Unknown In alt.support.diabetes on Fri, 15 Dec 2006 08:40:40 -0000 in Msg.# <9LqdnSNTR6YVwh_YnZ2dnUVZ8siknZ2d@bt.com>, "Cloudedbrains" <donna_williamson@btopenworld.com> wrote: > > I hope she is getting the treatment she needs, even if she does > > feel the need to suddenly pretend that it was all her idea that [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > here so why am I yet again trying to explain it cause no-one actually gives > a damn! >> I hope she is getting the treatment she needs, even if she does >> feel the need to suddenly pretend that it was all her idea that [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >Actually were u there at my appointment ?? >No you were not so stop assuming AGAIN !! What assuming did I do? I'm m basing my observation on what I actually observed. Every time you came on here, you emphasized that your medical team knows what they are doing, no matter what. Then all of a sudden you appear and say that you are tired of your DSN ignoring your problem with high bg's, and you're not going to take it any more, and you announce that you're finally going to an endo, and it won't take 3 months to get in after all. There's a real disjunction going on here. Also, my comment was not about anything that happened in your doctor's office. It was about how you handle yourself on here. I'm glad you're finally getting help (I guess you are). That's the important thing. >I told the consultant I had asked friends (actuallly how i been treated here >its more like enemies) and had done research and that what I found was [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >diet can cause problem so the risk of a low carb diet for too long is high >for me! I never heard of that one, but ok... >He is trying correctiong doses at meal times as I would need to high a carb >ratio also! [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >here so why am I yet again trying to explain it cause no-one actually gives >a damn! You know, I take exception to that. In fact people do give a damn, which is why they try so hard to help you, even in the face of all your unanswered questions. Stop taking it for granted! I've seen it over and over again.You come looking for sympathy, and you get it, but you don't want to hear about anything else. My boyfriend thinks you are are actually what they call a "Loki." That's not a troll, but it's somebody who is not entirely sincere. It's really hard to say, but your behavior sure does fit the pattern, yes it does. It could very well be that you have problems, um, with thinking clealy because of steroids and high bg's, in which case it's just difficult for people to deal with helping you. I'm not saying Susan is necessarily right, just pointing out the difficulty with communicating with you - and it is difficult! : FOR ANYONE WAITING TO HAVE AGO AT ME the next bit is for you! : [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] : here so why am I yet again trying to explain it cause no-one actually gives : a damn! I'll assume some of those comments were for me. I've read your history.. I'll BET you've NEVER read mine! You've never read the extensive BULLSHIT I've gone through for over 6yrs trying to obtain good glucose control. I've been on steriods.. I've definately been through the mill. I've learned the hard way on what needs to be done for control... I'm so phuckin' sorry I've tried to help, obviously you believe everything your out of date doctors are doing is correct.. you've never asked for "support" only for "help" the way I've seen it.. anyone (other then Susan) who's tried to help you, you've shot us down like we're ALL idiots.. Well sista.. I've better things to do then to waste any further bandwidth on you. RK - over and out! 2 Back surgeries - 1 double fusion 4 auto-immune diseases that play havok on my glucose daily T1 pumper w/Animas IR1250 >I'll assume some of those comments were for me. I've read your history.. >I'll BET you've NEVER read mine! You've never read the extensive BULLSHIT [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >it.. anyone (other then Susan) who's tried to help you, you've shot us down >like we're ALL idiots.. Amen [Default] On Fri, 15 Dec 2006 09:29:29 -0500, "rk" <p_haha_medium@gmail.com> Giggled into the madness of usenet: >: FOR ANYONE WAITING TO HAVE AGO AT ME the next bit is for you! >: [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] >4 auto-immune diseases that play havok on my glucose daily >T1 pumper w/Animas IR1250 and still forgetting the most important thing, none of your experiences make you an expert on anything or anyone other than yourself. and you are making the same mistake all over again. someone knew is not looking to you as their know it all savior and you are taking personal offense, and not just you, but your several others are doing the same thing as well. snap judgments, personal offense when your advise is not seen as the only correct advise, over inflated egos..and another person has to be made out as the bad guy and harassed into kissing a.s. and the strange thing is you, kurt and tom have been saying you have to protect the newbies from the rest of us because we treat them this way. everyone needs to take a step back and see "why" they are on the attack with this one. don't get so wrapped up in bruised egos that several become a mob of chungs and mus and don't even realize it. SignatureMâck©® Deltec CoZmore Pumper Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.diabetic-talk.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org http://www.pandora.com enter "Jason & Demarco" "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." ...Theodore Roosevelt (o ô) --ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------------- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." ....Bilbo Baggins DISCLAIMER If you find a posting or message from me offensive, inappropriate, or disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore a posting, complain to me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate... . > and the > strange thing is you, kurt and tom have been saying you have to > protect the newbies from the rest of us because we treat them this > way. That's not what we've been saying, so quit trying to start problems. Kurt Ma¢k wrote: > and the > strange thing is you, kurt and tom have been saying you have to > protect the newbies from the rest of us because we treat them this > way. That's not what we've been saying, so quit trying to start problems. Kurt lol is the Mack attack back? i thought he would be done with the trolling for a while. i dont pay him any mind, he posts like an old bitch. Tom "Cloudedbrains" <donna_williamson@btopenworld.com> wrote in message > I said to him that from my research it was recommended I did not say it > was my idea but I certainly told him it is what I woukd prefer over mixed > Insulin (which was also discussed). > > FOR ANYONE WAITING TO HAVE AGO AT ME the next bit is for you! ok.. il have a go atchya. I know doctors are not perfect but the ones you see in person do know you much better than I. all i can say is that i wish you the best of luck. Tom > Maybe DOona will eventually decide that she needs to look > into your suggestion (along with her doctor), as long as > she can pretend to herself that it's her idea. That would be > ok, right? Anyway, one can only hope. I don't care who gets credit for it if she gets better care and gets well, do you? She has already posted that she's learned that steroids can cause a lot of her symptoms. We've seen posts here (and I've seen on other groups) that many folks have found vastly reduced need for steroids to control asthma on low carb. We don't know Donna's whole picture, medically, so it's really up to her to try and get the entire thing looked at and managed in a comprehensive way with her doctor. As to which insulins and treatments are available to her, that may have nothing to do with how up to date her doc is, it may have all to do with what the NHS will pay for/provide. Susan >x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >I don't care who gets credit for it if she gets better care and gets >well, do you? Hmm, well I did say that the important thing is that it looks like she's getting better medical help. The thing is, it looks to me like Donna feels that something is owed to her, by us, and this is what leads to her yelling at us to give her sympathy but not discuss any particulars. We are just supposed to sit by and wait for her next announcement so we can give her more sympathy, when she's in the mood for some more. That's the impression I get, and that's why I told her to stop taking the sympathy for granted. We don't owe her anything. >She has already posted that she's learned that steroids can cause a lot >of her symptoms. We've seen posts here (and I've seen on other groups) [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >nothing to do with how up to date her doc is, it may have all to do with >what the NHS will pay for/provide. well, I don't think I made any comment about her medical treatment, other than to say that it's good that apparently she's getting better treatment now, as far as I know. > Hmm, well I did say that the important thing is that it looks like > she's getting better medical help. The thing is, it looks to me [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > We don't owe her anything. We own one another civility and the benefit of the doubt. In her case, I am aware how much certain endocrine issues affect behavior and tone. > well, I don't think I made any comment about her medical treatment, > other than to say that it's good that apparently she's getting better > treatment now, as far as I know. > > That comment wasn't directed at you. :-) Susan >> We don't owe her anything. > >We own one another civility and the benefit of the doubt. In her case, >I am aware how much certain endocrine issues affect behavior and tone. The thing is, one has to take care not to let it become co-dependent. I liked what BlueBrooke had to say about it. >> well, I don't think I made any comment about her medical treatment, >> other than to say that it's good that apparently she's getting better [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >That comment wasn't directed at you. :-) ah ok :) >>>We don't owe her anything. >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The thing is, one has to take care not to let it become co-dependent. > I liked what BlueBrooke had to say about it. I agreed with everything she had to say, except that I don't think offering the benefit of the doubt is too kind in this case. Susan >x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >I agreed with everything she had to say, except that I don't think >offering the benefit of the doubt is too kind in this case. I think you mean you agreed with everything BlueBrooke had to say? Well, I guess my suspicions of possible Loki-hood could be taken as a swipe, but for the rest I was really trying to be courteous about my confrontation. Reisa's post could really be taken as a swipe, though, but I agree that Donna has shot down everybody who tried to help her. I have really tried to hold my tongue about whether or not she really is a Loki. I also know what it's like to have other people judge you because of blood sugar issues. I think giving her the benefit of the doubt is an individual matter, and some may have more tolerance for longer, than others. We also have the right to discuss it amongst ourselves. I really don't think I am wrong to conlcude that she feels we owe her sympathy, and I have a problem with that. Although it may be voluntarily given even now (by fewer and fewer people) , it is not something that she is owed. It's the choice of the individual to do so or not. So if you still want to do it, it's up to you, totally. For those who don't know already, Loki is the trickster god in Norse mythology. > I think you mean you agreed with everything BlueBrooke had to say? Yes. > Well, I guess my suspicions of possible Loki-hood could be taken as a > swipe, but for the rest I was really trying to be courteous about my > confrontation. Reisa's post could really be taken as a swipe, though, > but I agree that Donna has shot down everybody who tried to help > her. Yes. > I have really tried to hold my tongue about whether or not she > really is a Loki. I also know what it's like to have other people > judge you because of blood sugar issues. I think giving her the > benefit of the doubt is an individual matter, and some may have > more tolerance for longer, than others. We also have the right > to discuss it amongst ourselves. I'm not arguing against anyone's right to their opinions or speech, just arguing in favor of kindness. When I suspect someone is not on the up and up, I just stay silent til I feel sure one way or the other. I've had the experience on this group of being assailed as a troll and spammer for daring to share my views and experiences in the past. Knowing how easy it us to make a mistake, I see no harm in watchful waiting, and much harm in quickly labeling and assailing those who may be innocent, even though annoying as all heck. > I really don't think I am wrong to conlcude that she feels we > owe her sympathy, and I have a problem with that. Although > it may be voluntarily given even now (by fewer and fewer > people) , it is not something that she is owed. It's the choice > of the individual to do so or not. So if you still want to do it, > it's up to you, totally. I have no disagreement with this. > For those who don't know already, Loki is the > trickster god in Norse mythology. Thanks, I didn't, or if I did, I forgitted. :-) Susan > I'm not arguing against anyone's right to their opinions or speech, just > arguing in favor of kindness. When I suspect someone is not on the up [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > waiting, and much harm in quickly labeling and assailing those who may > be innocent, even though annoying as all heck. Ok, I get your point. It's true I am not sure whether or not she is on the up & up, but perhaps, if she is a Loki, it would take a rather crafty and driven mind to come up with all this stuff. I have not stated it definitely, and have said that I am not sure about it. That's a little different than just pointing a finger and yelling "Loki"! At least I didn't tell her that she picked the right name for herself because she truly does have cloudedbrains, Like Alan did, you know....why didn't you complain to him about that? Anyway, point taken. I stand by everything else I said. > At least I didn't tell her that she picked the right name for herself > because she truly does have cloudedbrains, Like Alan did, you > know....why didn't you complain to him about that? Probably because I'd thought it myself? :-/ > Anyway, point taken. I stand by everything else I said. No probs here. Susan >x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Probably because I'd thought it myself? :-/ Susan, I really don't get you. > Susan, I really don't get you. Look, I wasn't being mean, and knowing Alan, he wasn't, either, though I don't recall the instance. I've seen him post patiently, kindly and with generosity of spirit for years. You may not recall that I currently am suffering from elevated cortisol, a steroid hormone. One of the associated features is *brain fog.* One of the side effects of steroid drugs is literally brain shrinkage. I meant that comment quite literally, not unkindly. I think that aside from her multiple serious medical conditions, Donna is likely also experiencing mental effects of those *and* her treatments. I think that perhaps you often presume that you *know* what another's intentions are when you don't. You could just ask, instead of constantly grading others on performance. Just a tip, take it or leave it. Susan >x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >don't recall the instance. I've seen him post patiently, kindly and >with generosity of spirit for years. It was this one: http://tinyurl.com/y9jxcr message # 11. In that post, he also questioned the truth of her claims. Did you notice that? I don't get why you think it's unkind of me to question that she's really sincere, yet you come right out and admit that you agree with Alan that she gave herself an apt name. I thought it was unkind when he said it. >You may not recall that I currently am suffering from elevated cortisol, >a steroid hormone. One of the associated features is *brain fog.* One >of the side effects of steroid drugs is literally brain shrinkage. I >meant that comment quite literally, not unkindly. I think that aside >from her multiple serious medical conditions, Donna is likely also >experiencing mental effects of those *and* her treatments. I'm sorry that you are going through that. I understand that phosphatidyl serine is very good for keeping cortisol down. As for Donna, if that is what is happening to her, I'm sorry for that too. You know, my sister was raped at the age of 4. Just because she now feels she has the right to dump her anger about that on everybody else, and expects them to take it, doesn't mean the rest of us have to take it. Get my drift? In future I will ignore Donna's posts. >I think that perhaps you often presume that you *know* what another's >intentions are when you don't. You could just ask, instead of >constantly grading others on performance. Just a tip, take it or leave it. I don't constantly grade other's performance, and in fact I was just as sucked in by Donna as everyone else was, and just as frustrated at her responses, at her not getting the help she needed. It took me a while to start feeling this way about it. Why are you using such a sweeping generalization? I hate sweeping generalizations. OK, I'm done with this. > I don't get why you think it's unkind of me to question that > she's really sincere, yet you come right out and admit that > you agree with Alan that she gave herself an apt name. > I thought it was unkind when he said it. I don't get why you perseverate over stuff like this. I never said I "agreed with Alan" I said the thought had occurred to me that Donna wasn't thinking completely clearly. I specifically said that I did not recall his post. > I'm sorry that you are going through that. I understand that > phosphatidyl serine is very good for keeping cortisol down. It may be. Right now, I'm using alpha lipoic acid. The insulin sensitization inhibits adrenals. > As for Donna, if that is what is happening to her, I'm sorry for that > too. You know, my sister was raped at the age of 4. Just because > she now feels she has the right to dump her anger about that on > everybody else, and expects them to take it, doesn't mean the > rest of us have to take it. Get my drift? Yeah, you're in a support group, but you don't want to hear other people talk about their problems, unless they do it in a way that doesn't get under your skin. > In future I will ignore Donna's posts. THERE YA GO! Thank you. > I don't constantly grade other's performance, and in fact I was just > as sucked in by Donna as everyone else was, and just as frustrated > at her responses, at her not getting the help she needed. It took me a > while to start feeling this way about it. Why are you using such a > sweeping generalization? I hate sweeping generalizations. Just my observation, not only about your responses to Donna. > OK, I'm done with this. Good. Someone call the Thread Coroner. Susan You know, I totally do. I understand everything she says. :-) -- Cheri dumb_fishie99@yahoo.com wrote in message ... >>x-no-archive: yes >> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Susan, I really don't get you. > You know, I totally do. I understand everything she says. :-) Be very afraid, Cheri. Susan ;-) > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Susan ;-) I'm scared too. ;-) Michelle >>x-no-archive: yes >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I'm scared too. ;-) > Michelle We may have the beginnings of another support group here. :-) Susan LOL I went back to see my therapist last week. Couldn't wait on you all!!! ;o) Love you girls! Billie > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Susan > LOL I went back to see my therapist last week. Couldn't wait on you all!!! > ;o) > > Love you girls! > Billie Backatcha, Billie! Susan : I really don't think I am wrong to conlcude that she feels we : owe her sympathy, and I have a problem with that. Although : it may be voluntarily given even now (by fewer and fewer : people) , it is not something that she is owed. It's the choice : of the individual to do so or not. So if you still want to do it, : it's up to you, totally. Donna has an enormous burden n her plate what with her runaway bgs, the tentative care she was reciving and her asthmatic problems that require her to stay on the high dose of steroid, so she, really didn't have time or mental energy to begin to read other threads. I do want to point out to Donna that when she is switched to rosig???(Avandia,Actos?) the drug her consultant wants her on, tht some peole find thata it puts on weigh (often water weight) and can cause problems with peole who have a tendanc to congestive heart failure issues. With her conserns about heart problems running in her family, as well as her being diabetic, which raises heart problem risk, she should discuss this aspect fully with her docotrs befoer going on the drug and she, herself should watch carefully as well as her doctors for any problems. It is rather like a domino effect with one treatment causing another illness adn tehn the treatment for that causing a third. Wendy On 12/15/06 12:29 PM, in article elv0ic$e12$1@reader2.panix.com, "W. Baker" <wbaker@panix.com> wrote: <snip> > Donna has an enormous burden n her plate what with her runaway bgs, the > tentative care she was reciving and her asthmatic problems that require [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Wendy When I was put on Avandia when it first came out, my then endo emphasized that a small minority (I think it was about 4%) may retain water. I was given a one month script so he could check that I was not one of the 4%. He also said if I noticed any weight gain or fluid retention I was to stop taking it immediately. This happened just after the Rezulin scare and since they are related he was being very cautious. I still take all these years later witholut any problems. When did Avandia come out? I've taken it for so long I can't remember. I hope endos today are being just as cautious. Martha T2 Canada > When I was put on Avandia when it first came out, my then endo emphasized > that a small minority (I think it was about 4%) may retain water. I was [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > I hope endos today are being just as cautious. That's great news for you, Martha, but the years since seem to indicate, as one endocrinologist told me, that Avandia and related drugs not only pack the pounds on a majority of folks, but cause edema and contribute to congestive heart failure. Anecdotally, you're one of the rare ones without bloat. You're lucky your doc took the risk seriously, given the severe underestimate he'd been offered of this side effect. Susan On 12/15/06 5:39 PM, in article 4uh11mF186iv2U1@mid.individual.net, "Susan" <nevermind@nomail.com> wrote: > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Susan Well, I certainly haven't packed on the pounds. That is one of the main things he was looking for. My present endo says the same thing. Martha T2 Camada >x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > >Susan I must be another of those rare ones. I actually lost what bloat and edema I had originally. Haven't had any for months. And I am slowly losing wieght rather than gaining. So why does it act so contradictory in some people? -- Jolanna DM TYPE II Dx May 31, 2006 Lantus Metformin Avandia > I must be another of those rare ones. I actually lost what bloat and > edema I had originally. Haven't had any for months. And I am slowly > losing wieght rather than gaining. So why does it act so contradictory > in some people? Because in addition to bloating and edema, it does sensitize you to insulin, which should reduce bloat, along with lowered carbs, for a net improvement. It may be that the more overweight one is, the more IR, and hence more likelihood of improvement without this effect, at least until later. Susan On 12/15/06 5:39 PM, in article 4uh11mF186iv2U1@mid.individual.net, "Susan" <nevermind@nomail.com> wrote: > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Susan You are forgetting that I said I was prescribed this medication when it first came on the market. It is easy to say what you have said now. There was not much of a track record then. Only the concern that it was similar to Rezulin. If you recall his concern was for edemafluid retention and weight gain. Easy to check for. I got sick to death of having to check my ankles every morning. Martha T2 Canada > You are forgetting that I said I was prescribed this medication when it > first came on the market. It is easy to say what you have said now. There > was not much of a track record then. Only the concern that it was similar to > Rezulin. If you recall his concern was for edema‹fluid retention and weight > gain. Easy to check for. I got sick to death of having to check my ankles > every morning. Actually, I didn't forget that. The reason for the severe underestimate was likely under reporting of adverse events by the manufacturer during trials, a typical occurrence. Susan [Default] On Fri, 15 Dec 2006 09:58:40 -0800, dumb_fishie99@yahoo.com Giggled into the madness of usenet: >>> We don't owe her anything. >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >The thing is, one has to take care not to let it become co-dependent. >I liked what BlueBrooke had to say about it. and we need to take care not to take personal offense at imagined wrongs, and imaginary debts. SignatureMâck©® Deltec CoZmore Pumper Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.diabetic-talk.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org http://www.pandora.com enter "Jason & Demarco" "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." ...Theodore Roosevelt (o ô) --ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------------- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." ....Bilbo Baggins DISCLAIMER If you find a posting or message from me offensive, inappropriate, or disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore a posting, complain to me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate... . [Default] On Fri, 15 Dec 2006 08:35:19 -0800, dumb_fishie99@yahoo.com Giggled into the madness of usenet: >>x-no-archive: yes >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >We don't owe her anything. and by the same token, Donna does not owe anyone here anything either. If anyone feels that she does, they need to check their own motives for being here. SignatureMâck©® Deltec CoZmore Pumper Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.diabetic-talk.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org http://www.pandora.com enter "Jason & Demarco" "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." ...Theodore Roosevelt (o ô) --ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------------- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." ....Bilbo Baggins DISCLAIMER If you find a posting or message from me offensive, inappropriate, or disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore a posting, complain to me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate... . > x-no-archive: > We only know Donna this way. Maybe she's this way due to drug effects. > > I feel very sorry for anyone who feels she must stay on steroids long > term, knowing what a vicious cycle they create. One problems is non of you do know me and no-one has actualy tried to get to know me. Ive spent most of my time in here repeating information I have given countless times before. As I have repeatedly said I have medical grounds NOT to come off steroids and I certainly do not want to end up in Intensive care on a ventilator again because I tried to even reduce them by one tablet! You may be thinking more of anabolic steroids but I can tell you medicinal corticosteroids keep me alive so I certainly dont need ur sympathy but ur understanding that I cant come of them unless you want to bury me! [Default] On Fri, 15 Dec 2006 08:27:33 -0000, "Cloudedbrains" <donna_williamson@btopenworld.com> Giggled into the madness of usenet: >> x-no-archive: >> We only know Donna this way. Maybe she's this way due to drug effects. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >corticosteroids keep me alive so I certainly dont need ur sympathy but ur >understanding that I cant come of them unless you want to bury me! don't ever feel that you need to defend yourself for following proper medical advise regardless of the unqualified opinions expressed on usenet. If anyone had known and then suggested that my foster mother stop taking the steroids she was on they'd be told to f' off and get kill filed. The steroids bumped her BGs, but they extended her life. sometimes there are necessary trade offs. Extend life or get good tight BG control and in the process shorten life. hmm is this not a no brainer for all? SignatureMâck©® Deltec CoZmore Pumper Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.diabetic-talk.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org http://www.pandora.com enter "Jason & Demarco" "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." ...Theodore Roosevelt (o ô) --ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------------- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." ....Bilbo Baggins DISCLAIMER If you find a posting or message from me offensive, inappropriate, or disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore a posting, complain to me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate... . Exactly Mack I just feel like in here I have to even justify breathing as thats what the steroids keep me doing but at least there are a few people who realise that it isnt an option for some people. Its kinda simple for me I take steroids and live and treat the diabetes OR I stop steroids and DIE and then I wont have diabetes no-more (not aimed at you Mack!) > don't ever feel that you need to defend yourself for following proper > medical advise regardless of the unqualified opinions expressed on [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > tight BG control and in the process shorten life. hmm is this not a > no brainer for all? > >> x-no-archive: [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > understanding that I cant come of them unless you want to bury me! > Hey Donna! Good to hear things are going better... I'm going to keep out of your medical issues, because I don't understand. All I can tell you is "consult, consult, consult" and you've tried, tried, tried, and FINALLY had some success. Usenet is an imperfect communication medium. There are several reasons its imperfect: * Usenet does not guarantee message delivery. So, perhaps, one critical message didn't make it to responder "Q". * Usenet is a distributed messaging medium, with thousands of servers distributed across the world. And the servers are all individually administered. It appears, for example, that to solve issues that we were having with my work Usenet server, that last week message expiration was ratched down from 7 days to 24 hours. Not sure, but I tried to read some of the messages in this thread, and my newsreader said they weren't available. Once a message expires, its difficult to get it back. * Usenet does not guarantee message comprehension. So, maybe "Q" got the message, but misunderstood it for whatever reason. * Usenet does not guarantee reading the message. So its very hard to hold a meaningful conversation here. I've come here for advise / questions, and almost invariably if I ask "should I do A, B, or C", I'll get more answers outside A, B, C than inside. And it *IS* frustrating, because you've said 50 times "X", but for whatever reason, "Q" didn't get it. Sort of like trying to communicate at a very loud party. You may have said "X" 50 times as loud as you can, but "Q" didn't hear any of them. Or, maybe he didn't get it. oh well. We try... mt SignatureT2 dx May 2005 with A1c 10.1 1000 mg Metformin 2x day 1000 mg Fish Oil (Omega 3) 2x day 500 mg Niacin 1x day last A1c: 5.0 (Oct 2006) >> x-no-archive: >> We only know Donna this way. Maybe she's this way due to drug effects. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >One problems is non of you do know me and no-one has actualy tried to get to >know me. Gotta call you on this one, Donna. I've been watching your many threads with great interest. Since I am not familiar with your plethora of medical problems, there's not much I can contribute. But what I have seen is just about everyone who has answered your posts trying to "get to know you" despite your efforts to the contrary. >Ive spent most of my time in here repeating information I have given >countless times before. There might be some here who have your medical history totally memorized, but I doubt there are very many who do. I don't think it's asking too much to refresh their memories on important details. Since you are the one asking for support here, is it really right to expect everyone who might answer you to go back and read all your posts first? They are trying to have a conversation with you -- at their peril, it would seem. I can't imagine why anyone here would want to be constantly subjected to your tantrums and outbursts. >As I have repeatedly said I have medical grounds NOT to come off steroids >and I certainly do not want to end up in Intensive care on a ventilator >again because I tried to even reduce them by one tablet! Like I said before, I'm don't have your medical history committed to memory -- but this is the type of statement I most recall from you. There's a lot of drama here, but no facts. It seems you don't want to engage in conversation -- you just want to rant. You should just say so up front. >You may be thinking more of anabolic steroids but I can tell you medicinal >corticosteroids keep me alive so I certainly dont need ur sympathy but ur >understanding that I cant come of them unless you want to bury me! More drama. You haven't been very nice to the people who have been trying to help you. I guess they've noticed it, too, because the list gets smaller and smaller every time you post. I think Susan is being very generous in giving you the benefit of the doubt about your behavior. Perhaps it is the sterioids that make you act this way -- I don't know. I don't know anything about steriods or people who take them. Hell, you've even got me empathizing with Reisa -- and that's saying something. If you just want to make statements, and don't want to engage in conversation, why don't you just start a weblog? Then you can say anything you want and no one will question anything you say. I do hope things get better for you. -- BlueBrooke T2/D&E/June 2005 The things that come to those who wait will be the things left by those who got there first. >Hell, you've even got me empathizing with Reisa -- and that's saying >something. > >If you just want to make statements, and don't want to engage in >conversation, why don't you just start a weblog? Then you can say >anything you want and no one will question anything you say. That's because she wants an audience. >>Hell, you've even got me empathizing with Reisa -- and that's saying >>something. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > That's because she wants an audience. None of us are mind readers and shouldn't presume to know what another person is thinking. I agree that Donna's posting content and style is less than ideal, but if all she wants is some sympathy and a place to vent during a very tough time, is that so wrong, and are we unable to accept and allow it? Any time a poster is asking something you neither can or will offer, why not just hit delete, filter her out and move on, rather than swipe at her? Just MHO. Susan >> That's because she wants an audience. > > None of us are mind readers and shouldn't presume to know what another > person is thinking. even Donna's doctors? > I agree that Donna's posting content and style is less than ideal, but if > all she wants is some sympathy and a place to vent during a very tough > time, is that so wrong, and are we unable to accept and allow it? most of how Donna is expressing herself is a result of past threads. I cant really blame her in any of her posts. > Any time a poster is asking something you neither can or will offer, why > not just hit delete, filter her out and move on, rather than swipe at her? or just make 9 posts in the last 29 hours about her. > Just MHO. she didnt choose any of those choices. >That's because she wants an audience. d/f If Donna bothers you so greatly, why don't you just kill file her? Maybe you're right. Maybe no one owes anyone anything. I'm more inclined to agree with Susan that we at least owe civility to one another. I would even go so far as to say that we at least each other the respect of accepting that for the most part, we're all adults here (and the one youth that I know of is more adult than some adults I know here and off line) and in the end it's up to each of us to make our own decisions. Okay. You think someone is acting in an attention seeking manner. So...don't feed it. Let her be. You don't owe her sympathy if you don't want to give it. And she doesn't owe you obedience. RK realizes that and has had her say and will now likely let the subject be. If what she wrote was a swipe, it is also the last swipe she will likely make on this topic. You've offered your opinion, it's been rejected, you've offered your opinion of that. Now you've had your say and you no longer need to feed what you feel is attention seeking behavior. Perhaps you believe in "tough love". For some folks it works. For other it just pisses them off and causes them to retaliate in kind. Tough love isn't working here. You may as well do your blood pressure and BG a favor and KF the ones bugging you and offer your help to those who are willing to accept it. In any case, please note that I am talking directly to you, not about you as if you weren't here. I respect you enough to do that. >>That's because she wants an audience. > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >sympathy if you don't want to give it. And she doesn't owe you >obedience. This is a straw man argument. I never said nor implied that she owes me obedience. >RK realizes that and has had her say and will now likely >let the subject be. If what she wrote was a swipe, it is also the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >well do your blood pressure and BG a favor and KF the ones bugging you >and offer your help to those who are willing to accept it. Why don't you take your own advice? Thank you! >In any case, please note that I am talking directly to you, not about >you as if you weren't here. I respect you enough to do that. The logic escapes me. >>>That's because she wants an audience. >> [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > >The logic escapes me. ....shrug.... Of course I will. I see no need in arguing or shouting or beating dead horses. Have a good night and a wonderful holiday. >>>That's because she wants an audience. >> [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >>sympathy if you don't want to give it. And she doesn't owe you >>obedience. > This is a straw man argument. I never said nor implied that she owes > me obedience. >>RK realizes that and has had her say and will now likely >>let the subject be. If what she wrote was a swipe, it is also the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >>well do your blood pressure and BG a favor and KF the ones bugging you >>and offer your help to those who are willing to accept it. > Why don't you take your own advice? Thank you! >>In any case, please note that I am talking directly to you, not about >>you as if you weren't here. I respect you enough to do that. > The logic escapes me. A lot of folk are discussing Cloudedbrain's personality, motives, and medical problems, among themselves as though she wasn't here. That can be pretty infuriating even if the people discussing you are right. She's a lot sicker than most here, and that doesn't do any favours for one's clarity of expression, powers of logic, and emotional responses. I'd like to see sick people treated here with a bit more generosity and respect, even if they lash out in ways that would not be justifiable in a calm rational healthy person. >>That's because she wants an audience. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Maybe you're right. Maybe no one owes anyone anything. I didn't say that either. Don't put words in my mouth, that I didn't say. Please, think it through before you reply. >>>That's because she wants an audience. >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >I didn't say that either. Don't put words in my mouth, that I didn't >say. Please, think it through before you reply. Okay. I guess someone forged your name on this post. I apologize. Just to help, so that you can compain to your ISP...it's at the bottom of your post. Good night. >dumb_fishie99@yahoo.com wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >I don't care who gets credit for it if she gets better care and gets >well, do you? Hmm, well I did say that the important thing is that it looks like she's getting better medical help. The thing is, it looks to me like Donna feels that something is owed to her, by us, and this is what leads to her yelling at us to give her sympathy but not discuss any particulars. We are just supposed to sit by and wait for her next announcement so we can give her more sympathy, when she's in the mood for some more. That's the impression I get, and that's why I told her to stop taking the sympathy for granted. We don't owe her anything. > >>Maybe you're right. Maybe no one owes anyone anything. > > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > >dumb_fishie99@yahoo.com wrote: [snip] > We don't owe her anything. I know I shouldn't get into the middle of this, but twisting of logic bugs me no end. "We don't owe her anything" is not the same thing as "no-one owes anyone anything." *sigh* Priscilla, who wonders when words stopped having specific meanings >> >>Maybe you're right. Maybe no one owes anyone anything. >> > [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > >Priscilla, who wonders when words stopped having specific meanings But when Susan expanded the meaning to make her point it was okay? I understand now. No. I really don't.. But that's okay. I'll go back to being quiet now. Enjoy. On Fri, 15 Dec 2006 13:52:11 -0500, Susan <nevermind@nomail.com> wrote: >x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >>>We own one another civility and the benefit of the doubt. In her case, >>>I am aware how much certain endocrine issues affect behavior and tone. > But when Susan expanded the meaning to make her point it was okay? I > understand now. No. I really don't.. But that's okay. I'll go back > to being quiet now. <*Urkel voice on*> Did I do thaaaat? ;-) I think it's time for an appearance by the Thread Coroner. Stealing from my friend Bruce: CERTIFICATE OF THREAD DEATH AND PUBLIC QUARANTINE PUBLIC NOTICE As of 14:00 hours Pacific Standard Time this thread is officially declared dead. Also, due to cause of death, harmful infectious emotions: A full quarantine is declared. Admittance is not recommended. All persons entering will be by their own risk and full responsibility of all consequences. We recommend that you erase the entire contents from your disk. By order of ASD Thread Coroner. Susan > >> >>Maybe you're right. Maybe no one owes anyone anything. > >> > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > But when Susan expanded the meaning to make her point it was okay? I > understand now. No. I really don't.. But that's okay. Welcome to the double-standard world of a.s.d. Happens all the time and you're not alone. :) >I'll go back > to being quiet now. Oh, don't do that. Yours is an important clear voice in this cacophony of noise. Post loud, post often. Best, Kurt > [snip] > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Priscilla, who wonders when words stopped having specific meanings As in the following: "I could care less" when they really mean " I could not care less" "The proof is in the pudding", which is really lazy and meaningless, as opposed to the correct quote, "The proof of the pudding is in the eating". The kids today don't even use words anymore when texting and I.M.'ing ...(sigh) Dennis (Type 2) [Default] On Fri, 15 Dec 2006 09:56:22 -0800, dumb_fishie99@yahoo.com Giggled into the madness of usenet: >>Hell, you've even got me empathizing with Reisa -- and that's saying >>something. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >That's because she wants an audience. everyone, including yourself and including myself wants the same thing. If we didn't we wouldn't post. SignatureMâck©® Deltec CoZmore Pumper Type 1 since 1975 http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org http://www.diabetic-talk.org http://www.insulin-pumpers.org http://www.pandora.com enter "Jason & Demarco" "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." ...Theodore Roosevelt (o ô) --ooO-(_)-Ooo-------------------- "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." ....Bilbo Baggins DISCLAIMER If you find a posting or message from me offensive, inappropriate, or disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore a posting, complain to me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate... . > x-no-archive: yes |
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