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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / March 2006Good nutrition for kidneys
I have seen here discussed what kind of food is good for the eyes to prevent degeneration etc (by Quentin Grady). I was happy that I intake a good quantity of some of the foods recommened by Quentin for the eyes - like Onion & Cilanthro. Is there a similiar list of foodstuff which is good for maintaining the health of the healthy kidneys and also reversing damage in kidneys with mild problems? 2 different Questions, because asking for 2 different people. This post not CC'd by email >I have seen here discussed what kind of >food is good for the eyes to prevent [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >problems? 2 different Questions, because asking >for 2 different people. G'day G'day Just, Someone it likely to know more about this than me as some issues affect some people more than others. Collectively we will discover much more than any of us individually know. Here are few comments. Protein can heal or injure kidneys depending on the condition of the kidneys, the type of protein and the amounts. Normal kidney are remarkable robust. There is some literature to suggest vegetable proteins help heal the kidneys. The reason is that they are higher in arginine. Nuts are generally a good source of arginine, so is bone marrow as found in genuine chicken soup. I can't give you an adequate hypothesis why arginine works ... it could be that it improved circulation. If that is so then it is reasonable to suggest that stopping smoking makes sense. Another thought concerns milk thistle. A long time ago I read a paper that suggested it had some protective function for the kidneys just as it has for the liver. Start Googling folks. Some rather obvious thoughts are that controlling blood glucose is going to help. There is another obvious idea to Google http://scholar.google.com Best wishes,  SignatureQuentin Grady ^ ^ / New Zealand, >#,#< [ / \ /\ "... and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin > G'day G'day Just, > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > that suggested it had some protective function for the kidneys just as > it has for the liver. Start Googling folks. Thank you, Quentin. I thought of also looking at a different angle also. Reducing blood pressure problems, if any, should also help protect kidneys, right? I googled an old post of yours for BP which suggested fish, fish oil & increasing pottasium. I think bananas have a lot of pottasium, so that maybe worth trying. This post not CC'd by email >> G'day G'day Just, >> [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] >I thought of also looking at a different angle also. Reducing blood >pressure problems, if any, should also help protect kidneys, right? G'day G'day Just, My GP is very keen to control blood pressure in diabetics. Some routinely use ACE inhibitors as a preventative. >I googled an old post of yours for BP which suggested >fish, fish oil & increasing pottasium. I think bananas have >a lot of pottasium, so that maybe worth trying. I'm not a fan of bananas. When I had no other complications I could eat about a half banana before my blood glucose went too high. Avocados are a better choice for T2 diabetics. Half an avocado has the same potassium as a whole banana for a mere fraction of the carbs. FWIIW, almost any serving of vegetables will do. That was the point of the DASH diet which dealt specifically with hypertension; replace some refined carbs from grain with some fruit and vegetables to raise potassium and magnesium rather than lower sodium. It worked even with a salt sensitive subpopulation. Best wishes, SignatureQuentin Grady ^ ^ / New Zealand, >#,#< [ / \ /\ "... and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin >I'm not a fan of bananas. When I had no other complications I could >eat about a half banana before my blood glucose went too high. >Avocados are a better choice for T2 diabetics. Half an avocado has >the same potassium as a whole banana for a mere fraction of the carbs. My personal experience backs that up. I gave up bananas within the first month of testing - despite living in the middle of a banana-producing district. The good news is that it is also an avocado-producing district:-) Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. > I googled an old post of yours for BP which suggested > fish, fish oil & increasing pottasium. I think bananas have > a lot of pottasium, so that maybe worth trying. Bananas are also loaded with sugar, which is the last thing your kidneys need. You can get all the potassium you need from a single sprinkle of Morton Salt Substitute which is potassium chloride. No need to load up on sugary foods. --Jenny http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes Diabetes Info http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood Sugar Under Control > Is there a similiar list of foodstuff which is good > for maintaining the health of the healthy kidneys Possibly the best thing you can do to maintain healthy kidneys is not so much what you eat, but what you don't eat. Number one on the list are the painkillers. There's accumulating evidence that the lifetime load of Tylenol varies directly with the health of the kidneys. The more you take, the worse they get. The other NSAIDs (Ibuprofen, Naproxen, etc) also have been associated with kidney problems. Here's a snippet from the Mayo Clinic web site: http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/pain-medications/PN00058 "NSAIDs have anti-clotting effects, so you may notice that you bleed or bruise more easily. Large doses of NSAIDs can also lead to kidney problems and fluid retention, which can worsen congestive heart failure. NSAIDs can cause liver function test abnormalities, as well as ringing in the ears, headache, dizziness and drowsiness. Mouth sores and skin rashes also can occur while taking NSAIDs." > and also reversing damage in kidneys with mild > problems? 2 different Questions, because asking > for 2 different people. High blood sugars are the prime factors that cause early kidney disease. And there is growing evidence that cutting down on your carb intake can reverse early kidney changes. Once the filtering units have been destroyed and the kidney damage is serious, protein does make things worse, but in the early stages, this does not appear to be true. There's a long discussion of this with some cites in Richard K. Bernstein M.D.'s book "Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution" which is worth reading as it explains in detail how high blood sugars destroy the kidney and when you can safely lower carbs with kidney disease. Signature--Jenny http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes Diabetes Info http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood Sugar Under Control > Possibly the best thing you can do to maintain healthy kidneys is not so > much what you eat, but what you don't eat. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > in the ears, headache, dizziness and drowsiness. Mouth sores and skin > rashes also can occur while taking NSAIDs." High sustained doses of acetaminophen (Tylenol) tend to strain and damage the liver, while high sustained doses of ibuprofen (Advil) cause the same problems with kidneys. People with back pains or types of arthritis for example might be taking 8 325 mg pills per day of acetaminophen for long periods of time, which is asking for trouble. Acetominophen is often added to O.T.C. cold and flu remedies, which most people don't seem to be aware of. This was emphasized over and over to us at our transplant centre. People like me who get no relief whatsoever from acetaminophen turn to ibuprofen for muscle and joint pain. Since I already have kidney disease, I have to limit myself to taking just enough to take the edge off the pain for fear of causing further kidney damage. In my case, living with some pain after an injury is better than going back to dialysis. I also have comprehensive blood tests drawn quarterly to watch for any abnormal readings. >> and also reversing damage in kidneys with mild >> problems? 2 different Questions, because asking [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > explains in detail how high blood sugars destroy the kidney and when you > can safely lower carbs with kidney disease. A very sobering thought for everybody should be that the largest group of new patients being admitted to dialysis in the last 10 to 15 years in North America and Western Europe is older, long term diabetics who for many years had at best, marginal control. Years ago, they would not have survived into their sixties to take advantage of dialysis. They often died from cardiac diseases. Aggressive campaigns to diagnose diabetes earlier, combined with the knowledge gained from the DCCT that tighter control yields better health outcomes, as well as the introduction of better medicines, have extended the lifespans of many more diabetics than before. I saw this first hand during my 15 months on dialysis, and confirmed it with the experience encountered by the R.N.'s in the unit. Lowering carbs without increasing protein can help in the the very early stages, and so far studies suggest that higher protein, low carb diets are not a problem if there is no evidence of loss of kidney function. However, certain vegetarian sources of protein may stress damaged kidneys almost as much as meat proteins, so professional advice with a dietitian specializing in renal diets in co-ordination with your medical practitioner is advised. For example, phosphorus and potassium, as well as magnesium can overload already stressed kidneys. Legumes, whole grains, high potassium fruits and tomatoes, mushrooms, dairy products, colas, and even tofu should therefore be taken in portions that only the dietitian can recommend, based on the stage of your particular medical condition. Red meats of course, are high in both proteins and phosphorus. Dennis (Type 2, Kidney Transplant 1995) The kidneys also play a major role in regulating blood pressure. The blood vessels in the kidney tend to constrict and work harder in the presence of higher blood pressures, which is a bad idea if they are already under stress and not working properly. That is why many endocrinologists and others who treat diabetics are aggressively prescribing ACE or ARB inhibitors to prevent or reduce kidney damage in diabetics even if the patient's blood pressure seems to be "okay". Mine actually "forced" my kidney transplant doctors to put me back on an ACE by sending them a formal letter for the record asking that since I suffered from both kidney disease AND diabetes, what possible reasoning were they using? > High sustained doses of acetaminophen (Tylenol) tend to strain and > damage the liver, I read recently (Sorry, I don't have the reference anymore) that that the lifetime load of Tylenol directly affects the functioning of the kidneys, too. Though the liver damage connection is better known. I saw a study on this last year and it depressed the hell out of me because Tylenol is the only painkiller I can take. Since I already have kidney > disease, I have to limit myself to taking just enough to take the edge > off the pain for fear of causing further kidney damage. In my case, > living with some pain after an injury is better than going back to > dialysis. I can well understand that! I suffered permanent hearing damage and tinnitus from a normal dose of an NSAID and now can't take any of them for fear of worsening the tinnitus. Since I have ruptured discs pain is an ongoing issue for me too, but I only take a pill when the pain is intolerable, which fortunately isn't that often. Luckily for me, only one 325 mg of Tylenol works very well for me for nerve pain. I just have my fingers crossed I don't develop arthritis (which both my parents had) because I can't take aspirin either. > The kidneys also play a major role in regulating blood pressure. The > blood vessels in the kidney tend to constrict and work harder in the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > suffered from both kidney disease AND diabetes, what possible reasoning > were they using? Very good advice! Blood pressure control does seem to be extremely important in keeping the kidneys happy. Glad to hear that you were able to get the kidney and that it works. --Jenny http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes Diabetes Info http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood Sugar Under Control I am allergic to all over the counter pain meds except Tylenol...and have Osteoartheritis in my knees. My right knee has become very painful in the last three weeks...can't even sleep. The only medicine I can take are narcotics...Not my favorite type of drug. Tylenol doesn't touch the pain. I can no longer take Ace Inhibitors because of a Serum reaction to it. I think I could probably take one type but my Dr doesn't want to take any chances. ARB Inhibitors give me shortness of breath...which my Dr says can be a sign of an Allergy. It seems just in the past ten years I have become more allergic to meds. I used to take high doses of Ibuprofen(in the 80's) for back pain...I had no problems...Now I get all stuffy and find it difficult to take deep breaths. I have become paranoid about trying new drugs...:) So far my Kidneys are in good working order and I try very hard to keep my numbers down:) jacquie >> High sustained doses of acetaminophen (Tylenol) tend to strain and damage >> the liver, [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood > Sugar Under Control > I am allergic to all over the counter pain meds except Tylenol...and have > Osteoartheritis in my knees. My right knee has become very painful in the > last three weeks...can't even sleep. The only medicine I can take are > narcotics...Not my favorite type of drug. Tylenol doesn't touch the pain. > I can no longer take Ace Inhibitors because of a Serum reaction to it. Sorry to hear about the knee pain! Avoiding NSAIDs for arthritis may actually help you out, long term, since there is evidence that while they cut down pain, they also fight against the rebuilding of the joint tissue. I'm assuming you've tried glucosamine and not found it helpful. If not, it is worth a try. The recent controlled trials for it came out with a mixed result, but so many people with arthritis find it useful, it has to be worth a try. Beyond that, have you tried acupuncture? When pain meds aren't an option or don't work it can sometimes help dramatically. Getting a referral to someone good is important. If you have a local hospital pain clinic, calling them for a referral might help. I've done very well with two different graduates of the New England School of Acupuncture. --Jenny >> http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes Diabetes Info >> >> http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood >> Sugar Under Control Signature--Jenny http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes Diabetes Info http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood Sugar Under Control I didn't notice any difference when using glucosamine ...they put me on it about 6 years ago...I tried it for about a year I didn't notice any change at all. I gave up walking two miles a day because after about a half of a mile the pain was so intense I had to sit down. Bicycle riding even aggravates it. I think our local teaching hospital might have a pain clinic...I'll ask my sister...she works there. I never thought about acupuncture...something to check into..Thanks:) jacquie >> I am allergic to all over the counter pain meds except Tylenol...and have >> Osteoartheritis in my knees. My right knee has become very painful in the [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >>> http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood >>> Sugar Under Control >I didn't notice any difference when using glucosamine ...they put me on it > about 6 years ago...I tried it for about a year I didn't notice any change [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > jacquie Hi Jacquie, Acupuncture didn't help me, but then I do know of others whom it did help. Give it a try, but if you don't see results within a couple of weeks, don't waste too much money on a lost cause. As for Glucosamine, I tried the standard Glucosamine/Chondroitin combination and after a few weeks I did get some help, but I got a lot more help when I started taking the one which contains MSM as well. It is the same combination, but it has "plus MSM" right on the label. That stuff did help me. Good luck. SignatureBest Regards, Evelyn (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox') >>> I am allergic to all over the counter pain meds except Tylenol...and >>> have [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] >>>> http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood >>>> Sugar Under Control Thanks Evelyn. I had my yearly Woman's checkup yesterday and I told my Dr about my right knee keeping me awake at nights. She decided it was time for x-rays(It's been about 12 years) So waiting the results of those...I swear she decided to catch me up at everything yesterday...she decided I needed the Pneumonia shot...and a Tetanus shot...she also forgot my A1C when she ordered my lipids so she sent me to the Lab for that. I got my lipids back but we really didn't have time to discuss them...she wanted to wait for my A1C to come back. My Chol was 179...but my Triglycerides were 229...she said if my A1C was normal she would have to put me on meds to get the Triglycerides numbers down. She keeps on telling me to exercise...the only thing I can do is swim and even here in the desert it is to cold to swim....We live to far away to go to a Gym daily. Somedays it feels like there is no way to win. jacquie >I didn't notice any difference when using glucosamine ...they put me on it > about 6 years ago...I tried it for about a year I didn't notice any change [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > jacquie Hi Jacquie, Acupuncture didn't help me, but then I do know of others whom it did help. Give it a try, but if you don't see results within a couple of weeks, don't waste too much money on a lost cause. As for Glucosamine, I tried the standard Glucosamine/Chondroitin combination and after a few weeks I did get some help, but I got a lot more help when I started taking the one which contains MSM as well. It is the same combination, but it has "plus MSM" right on the label. That stuff did help me. Good luck. SignatureBest Regards, Evelyn (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox') >> jacquie wrote: >>> I am allergic to all over the counter pain meds except Tylenol...and [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] >>>> http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood >>>> Sugar Under Control > She keeps on telling me to exercise...the only thing I can do is swim and > even here in the desert it is to cold to swim....We live to far away to go > to a Gym daily. Somedays it feels like there is no way to win. > jacquie Can you do any kind of armchair exercises? seated aerobics? resistance training? (bands are cheap to buy & easy to use). bj I didn't think of that bj...thanks for the suggestions:) >> She keeps on telling me to exercise...the only thing I can do is swim and >> even here in the desert it is to cold to swim....We live to far away to [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > training? (bands are cheap to buy & easy to use). > bj > > High sustained doses of acetaminophen (Tylenol) tend to strain and > > damage the liver, Says who? A study cited, please - or don't make definitve statements. > I read recently (Sorry, I don't have the reference anymore) that that > the lifetime load of Tylenol directly affects the functioning of the > kidneys, too. Though the liver damage connection is better known. I saw > a study on this last year and it depressed the hell out of me because > Tylenol is the only painkiller I can take. Find the reference or don't make the statement. > Since I already have kidney > > disease, I have to limit myself to taking just enough to take the edge [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I suffered permanent hearing damage and tinnitus from a normal dose of > an NSAID Uniquely STUPID, or UNTRUTHFUL, or BOTH. > and now can't take any of them for fear of worsening the > tinnitus. Since I have ruptured discs pain is an ongoing issue for me > too, but I only take a pill when the pain is intolerable, which > fortunately isn't that often. Luckily for me, only one 325 mg of Tylenol > works very well for me for nerve pain. See a few lines above. > I just have my fingers crossed I > don't develop arthritis (which both my parents had) because I can't take [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Glad to hear that you were able to get the kidney and that it works. Remember folks, Jenny has NO medical qualifications. Remember also that the a.s.d charter states unequivocally that technical advice belongs on m.h.d and recipes and nutrition belong on a.f.d -- a.s.d is for support and encouragement. If Jenny [or others] offer diagnostic or prescriptive advice, ignore them or report to A.M.A for attempting to practise medicine on the net, and without a medical licence. If Jenny [or others] offer support, good, it is to be welcomed. >>> High sustained doses of acetaminophen (Tylenol) tend to strain and >>> damage the liver, > Says who? A study cited, please - or don't make definitve statements. The FDA Letter to State Boards of Pharmacy dated January 22, 2004 clarifies their general position on acetaminophen toxicity specifically on the liver and possibly the kidneys, as well as the toxicity of other NSAIDs. The purpose was to emphasize the need to have consumers warned about the actual toxicity levels and the problem of accidental or unintentional overdosing. http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/analgesics/letter.htm The FDA approved maximum daily dose is 4 grams (4,000 mg), eg. 8 x 500 mg tablets. From what I could read in the following study, most non-intentional overdoses were at 7.5 grams, and often occurred after more than 7 days use. However, some occurred at less than 7 days use. Hepatology Volume 42, Issue 6, Pages 1364-1372 Published Online: 29 Nov 2005 Acetaminophen-induced acute liver failure: Results of a United States multicenter, prospective study (Full Text) http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/fulltext/112161379/HTMLSTART PMID: 16317692 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] This is the first time I have used MEDLINE, so I am not that well versed on how to get the full text of the other abstracts I found searching on: acetaminophen, hepatoxicity. I am more used to seeing the summaries in MEDSCAPE newsletters. I tend to trust MEDSCAPE, but maybe I am naive. Besides, liver toxicity due to acetaminophen overdosing has been well publicized, and I heard the same things from my transplant centre back in the late 1990's. Thanks for keeping me honest though. > Remember folks, Jenny has NO medical qualifications. Remember also that the > a.s.d charter states unequivocally that technical advice belongs on m.h.d [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > a medical licence. If Jenny [or others] offer support, good, it is to be > welcomed. I know that some people have issues with Jenny, but I did not see anything in this thread that hasn't been posted in a.s.d before, but maybe I didn't see it the way you did. Dennis (Type 2, Kidney Transplant 1995) A big thank you, Dennis, and good wishes to you. Alan > >>> High sustained doses of acetaminophen (Tylenol) tend to strain and > >>> damage the liver, [quoted text clipped - 51 lines] > > Dennis (Type 2, Kidney Transplant 1995) >> High sustained doses of acetaminophen (Tylenol) tend to strain and >> damage the liver, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > saw a study on this last year and it depressed the hell out of me > because Tylenol is the only painkiller I can take. What about aspirin as a painkiller? Does it cause any kidney or liver damage? Likewise what about stuff like oxycodone? > What about aspirin as a painkiller? Does it cause any kidney or liver > damage? Likewise what about stuff like oxycodone? I haven't seen anything about aspirin and the organ damage, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't cause problems. The main problem that I'm aware of with aspirin, however, is that it decreases platelets and promotes bleeding. This is good if you have a tendency to clotting (which is why they suggest people take a baby aspirin each day to prevent heart attacks, which are caused by clots.) But if you have a tendency to bleed already (which is often the case if you bruise very easily) too much aspirin might make it easier to burst a blood vessel someplace useful, like your brain. And if your stomach lining is not in good shape the bleeding aspirin causes can lead to serious ulcers and even, very rarely, fatal gastrointestinal bleeding. Oxycodone's biggest problem is that it is addictive and much in demand as a street drug. In our area the pharmacies were having so many break-ins caused by people trying to steal it, that they no longer keep it in stock. If you have a prescription for it, they will mail it to your house. By the time you get to where it is truly appropriate for you to take more than a handful, you should be dealing with a pain problem so severe that other long-time health considerations have to take a back seat to pain relief. --Jenny http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes Diabetes Info http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood Sugar Under Control >> Is there a similiar list of foodstuff which is good >> for maintaining the health of the healthy kidneys [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] >explains in detail how high blood sugars destroy the kidney and when you >can safely lower carbs with kidney disease. I see lots of "can" , I don't see any "does, or will cause" Sleepy ------------------------------------------------------------------ It is easier to make a saint out of a libertine than out of a prig. -George Santayana (1863-1952) ------------------------------------------------------------------ >I have seen here discussed what kind of > food is good for the eyes to prevent [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > problems? 2 different Questions, because asking > for 2 different people. You have received excellent advice from Jenny and Quentin. My 2 cents is simply this: Get enough water. I know it seems simple, but I am not talking about soda, coffee or tea, juice or milk. I am talking about simple WATER. Your kidneys need water and the toxins they remove from your body are suspended in water. There is evidence that the occurrence of kidney stones are greatly reduced in simply consuming enough water. (see the book, "No More Kidney Stones" written by a doctor...don't have it handy, but search for it on Amazon) There is also evidence that if you wait until you feel actual thirst to drink water, you are too late. The sensation of thirst is often lost in older people, and they can become dehydrated without ever feeling thirsty. So if you really want to help your kidneys, drink water, and make it a habit. Do it even if you aren't feeling particularly thirsty. Keep track of how much actual water you are drinking every day, and if it is less than three big glasses full, you may be not getting enough and doing your kidneys a disservice. SignatureBest Regards, Evelyn (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox') >>I have seen here discussed what kind of >> food is good for the eyes to prevent [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] >three big glasses full, you may be not getting enough and doing your kidneys >a disservice. Doesn't the water included in coffee, wine, diet sodas etc count? Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. >>>I have seen here discussed what kind of >>> food is good for the eyes to prevent [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. > d&e, metformin 2x500mg Hi Alan, As long as you are getting enough real water in your diet too. As Dennis commented in another reply in this same thread, the color of ones urine ought to tell the tale. The good thing is that real water doesn't contain any alcohol, caffeine, phosphates (as in soda) or calories or carbohydrates, all of which may appear in the other drinks you mentioned. Many of those are not good for ones kidneys in the quantities you need to keep your urine clear. SignatureBest Regards, Evelyn (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox') > You have received excellent advice from Jenny and Quentin. My 2 cents is > simply this: Get enough water. I know it seems simple, but I am not [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > three big glasses full, you may be not getting enough and doing your kidneys > a disservice. Amen to that!. With adequate hydration, your urine should never be more than a light or pale yellow, not dark like strong tea (green or otherwise). In addition, you reduce the risk of bladder cancers and some infections. Dennis (Type 2, Kidney Transplant 1995) > Is there a similiar list of foodstuff which is good > for maintaining the health of the healthy kidneys > and also reversing damage in kidneys with mild > problems? 2 different Questions, because asking > for 2 different people. I only know one - cranberry. Juice, fruit, whatever. Chak SignatureI would like at least one political party in this country to be willing to say that sex is fun and an important part of being human. --PZ Myers, http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/ > I only know one - cranberry. Juice, fruit, whatever. I don't think cranberry juice is for kidney health. It is usually used to change the pH of the bladder and prevent bladder infections. But there's too much sugar in the juice for this to help people with diabetes. For this reason some people use a pill containing an extract. With my long history of urinary tract problems, I've never found cranberry juice of much help, but that may be because the site of my infections isn't the bladder. I was on a cranberry juice regimen when I was diagnosed in the doctor's office with the 240 mg/dl blood sugar, probably not coincidental. The sourness of the berry masks the very high concentration of sugar in the juice. --Jenny http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes Diabetes Info http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/newlydiagnosed.htm Get Your Blood Sugar Under Control > With my long history of urinary tract problems, Is there any medical problem you don't have? If I claimed testicular cancer, I bet you would claim you've got it. >> With my long history of urinary tract problems, >> > Is there any medical problem you don't have? If I claimed testicular > cancer, > I bet you would claim you've got it. Your comments are awfully mean spirited and un-helpful, whereas Jenny's have always been kind hearted and helpful. This is your second nasty reply in this thread. I think it might be best to killfile you. In fact that's exactly what I am going to do. Plonk. SignatureBest Regards, Evelyn (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox') > Alan Hardy wrote > > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Your comments are awfully mean spirited and un-helpful, whereas Jenny's have > always been kind hearted and helpful. If my comments are as you say, why did you quote them? > This is your second nasty reply in this thread. Not nasty, but accurate - she is NOT a doctor, and the charter DOES say what it says. Pete took notice - he deserves commendation, so why not Jenny? > I think it might be best to killfile you. In fact that's exactly what I am > going to do. Ooh, the killfile threat!! I am heartbroken - NOT. BTW I don't usually post like this. Did you stop to wonder why? >BTW I don't usually post like this. Did you stop to wonder why? I certainly did, Alan. I was actually about to check whether someone was using your name. I was very surprised with the content and tone of your posts - so I was very puzzled. What's up? Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. >>BTW I don't usually post like this. Did you stop to wonder why? > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > What's up? Does that mean he isn't usually so mean? I shall have to resurrect him from my killfile for a bit. Chak SignatureI would like at least one political party in this country to be willing to say that sex is fun and an important part of being human. --PZ Myers, http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/ > Alan S wrote > > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Chak Well, Chak, I don't have the right to dictate to you what you should do, but perhaps you should be a little less hasty in condemning people? Maybe try google archives to find what a poster is really like? > Well, Chak, I don't have the right to dictate to you what you should > do, but perhaps you should be a little less hasty in condemning > people? Maybe try google archives to find what a poster is really > like? If the volume of this group was lower, I would probably do that. If the ratio of trolls and meanies to supporters was lower, I would probably do that. At one time, this group was so troll- and meanie-ridden that I stopped killfiling and started scoring a half-dozen posters high. Then I only read the ones with high scores. I come here for information and support. When I find hostility and anger and meanness, it undoes a lot of the good that the group does me. Since the volume is so high, I find I just do better if I axe the meanies. Occasionally, someone will refer a poster to another poster for good advice, or commend the good advice some poster has given, and then I score that person high for a while. But time is limited - I spend it researching my disease, not other posters. Best, Chak SignatureI would like at least one political party in this country to be willing to say that sex is fun and an important part of being human. --PZ Myers, http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/ > Alan Hardy wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > What's up? TY for asking, m8. No-one else bothered, just jumped for the kf - and boasted about it. First, I got severely physically punished for lying when I was a child, so when I see self-styled experts on Usenet [ ""Usenet"" ffs ] I over-react. Let's remember, please, a family physician takes seven years to train, and a specialist another 5 years on top of that. The "experts" I refer to [note the plural, please] have not seven minutes between the lot of them. I think they probably cause a lot of damage, so I certainly agree with David there. Second, using the dreaded killfile sometimes means you [generic'you'] simply haven't bothered to stop and research the poster, nor to wonder why the so-called mean spirit. Third, and I have absolutely no right to inflict this on others [OTOH it is a support group] my left hand and fingers have knotted into a solid fist of arthritic pain. If Jenny is still bothering to read, she is absolutely right to be concerned about avoiding it if poss. Alan H > Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. > d&e, metformin 2x500mg > -- > Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter. >Third, and I have absolutely no right to inflict this on others [OTOH it is >a support group] my left hand and fingers have knotted into a solid fist of >arthritic pain. If Jenny is still bothering to read, she is absolutely right >to be concerned about avoiding it if poss. > >Alan H Sorry about the arthritis Alan. I wouldn't wish that on anyone. I'd ask just one favour. Tomorrow, when hopefully things look and feel better, re-read what you wrote, and who to, and decide whether it's really a fair comment. I won't enter into a flame war on it. I'll just note that I've yet to find a significant occasion to doubt Jenny or the references she cites. And I'm well aware that she is a patient, not a doctor. I'll leave it there; I sincerely hope your pain goes soon. Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. Jenny <lottadata@hotmail.com> wrote in news:2N6dnXivuq5-SJPZRVn- rA@rcn.net: > The sourness of the berry masks the very high > concentration of sugar in the juice. Only if sugar is added - the berry has 46 calories for 100 grams, which is a bit more than a cup of whole berries. Did you think I meant commercial cranberry juice, like Ocean Spray? That *does* have lots of sugar, but it doesn't come from the berries. Chak SignatureI would like at least one political party in this country to be willing to say that sex is fun and an important part of being human. --PZ Myers, http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/ |
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