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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / March 2006Hidden trans fats
This article in WebMD reports on "top 10 trans fat foods." http://www.webmd.com/content/Article/118/113024.htm I have been on the lookout for trans fats for some time now, but this article points out that manufacturers can legally advertise "no (or 0) trans fats" if the product contains less than .5 gram of trans fat per serving. As a result, we could be getting trans fats without knowing it, and it could add up if we included several of these products in our diets. For example, the article claims that "I Can't Believe It's Not Butter" contains hidden trans fats. The second and third pages of this article lists specific items (and brands). Most are obvious, but some are not (at least, they weren't to me). I just checked the packaging on my Fleishmann's spread made with olive oil. I have been trying to incorporate olive oil in my diet, but I really don't like olive oil alone on my toast. So, I have been using this spread (limited amounts). It says "no trans fat," but I now see that it lists partially hydrogenated soybean oil among the ingredients. So, that sounds like I have been getting trans fats, after all. Of course, soybean oil is among the "preferred" oils, but what about the "partially hydrogenated" statement? Can anyone help me here? Am I being concerned over nothing? Or is this another product that I need to avoid? Thanks, MaryL > This article in WebMD reports on "top 10 trans fat foods." > http://www.webmd.com/content/Article/118/113024.htm [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > Thanks, > MaryL "Partially hydrogenated" is the usual way of making trans fats. I think full hydrogenation would take them away again by making them saturated fats. >> This article in WebMD reports on "top 10 trans fat foods." >> http://www.webmd.com/content/Article/118/113024.htm [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > full > hydrogenation would take them away again by making them saturated fats. Here's part of what the article on WebMD says: "For example, the package of I Can't Believe It's Not Butter says 'No Trans Fat,' and the Nutrition Facts label lists the value for trans fats per serving as zero. Read on. In the ingredients list are the words 'partially hydrogenated vegetable oils.' *'Partially hydrogenated' is the clue to hidden trans fats.*" [Added emphasis...**...is mine.] MaryL MaryL, Ever since we've discovered that some products contain partially hydrogenated oils in spite of the 0 trans fat ad blurb, we just read the ingredients. If it's got partially hydrogenated oil (regardless of what kind of oil is used) then it has trans fats. To me if it's got trans fat in any amount then that's not 0. Seems like a license to lie imo. Michelle > MaryL, > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Michelle Yes, it's a definite lie. This type of thing really angers me. Another pet peeve is the practice of using terms that almost none of us recognize instead of listing ingredients *in plain English* (or the language of the country where purchased). MaryL > Yes, it's a definite lie. This type of thing really angers me. Another pet > peeve is the practice of using terms that almost none of us recognize > instead of listing ingredients *in plain English* (or the language of the > country where purchased). Well, to add more "peeves" to the list: I have seen at least one product where the serving size changed when the requirement to list trans-fats took effect. I presume the reason is to get the amount below the magic 0.5 = 0 figure. Another is a product that is mostly sugar, yet sugar is not the first ingredient in the list. How do they get away with that? By having an ingredient list like: something, something, dextrose, sugar, something, high-fructose corn syrup, something, molasses, .....  SignatureWes Groleau "Lewis's case for the existence of God is fallacious." "You mean like circular reasoning?" "He believes in God. Therefore, he's fallacious." >This article in WebMD reports on "top 10 trans fat foods." >http://www.webmd.com/content/Article/118/113024.htm [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >(and brands). Most are obvious, but some are not (at least, they weren't to >me). Thanks for the article! It made some good points, though I take issue with one: they suggest customers ask if an item was prepared with transfats. The problem is, most fast food employees won't know. Also, even if the oil uses isn't partially hydrogenated, it will be after frequent use (such as in a deep fryer). >I just checked the packaging on my Fleishmann's spread made with olive oil. >I have been trying to incorporate olive oil in my diet, but I really don't >like olive oil alone on my toast. Just a thought: have you tried an italian-style olive oil dip? I make mine from extra-virgin olive oil, chopped fresh basil and tarragon, capers, and soy sauce. I use it as a dip for bread. >So, I have been using this spread >(limited amounts). It says "no trans fat," but I now see that it lists >partially hydrogenated soybean oil among the ingredients. So, that sounds >like I have been getting trans fats, after all. Of course, soybean oil is >among the "preferred" oils, but what about the "partially hydrogenated" >statement? >Can anyone help me here? Am I being concerned over nothing? Or is this >another product that I need to avoid? I've seen the same "partially hydrogenated" appear on the ingredient list of cholesterol lowering margarine, so I'd like to know that myself. > Just a thought: have you tried an italian-style olive oil dip? I make > mine from extra-virgin olive oil, chopped fresh basil and tarragon, > capers, and soy sauce. I use it as a dip for bread. No, I have never tried that. Can you recommend some proportions? Thanks, MaryL > I just checked the packaging on my Fleishmann's spread made with olive oil. > I have been trying to incorporate olive oil in my diet, but I really don't [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Can anyone help me here? Am I being concerned over nothing? Or is this > another product that I need to avoid? I like a good crusty Italian bread dipped in olive oil. For toast, I'd use butter. That's if I ate toast and if I weren't allergic to dairy. Currently if I eat toast, I use peanut butter on it. It has to be the natural peanut butter though because most of the commercial peanut butters also contain transfats. SignatureSee my webpage: http://mysite.verizon.net/juliebove/index.htm >> I just checked the packaging on my Fleishmann's spread made with olive > oil. [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > natural peanut butter though because most of the commercial peanut butters > also contain transfats. I also dip bread in olive oil. However, I like a little butter (which actually isn't butter because I have been using the Fleishmann's "made with olive oil" spread) when I have toast with peanut butter and also when I have a sandwich. Incidentally, I use only Ezekiel bread (a flourless bread made with sprouted grains) because any bread made with flour caused spikes -- or did when I last tested; I haven't even tried it for a year. MaryL > This article in WebMD reports on "top 10 trans fat foods." > http://www.webmd.com/content/Article/118/113024.htm [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > Thanks, > MaryL It is impossible to avoid all trans-fatty acids unless you are a vegan, since they occur naturally, in small amounts, in various animal products such as beef, pork, lamb, poultry, seafood, butter and milk. The amount ingested in products labeled as "no trans-fats" or those listed as zero grams or trans-fats per serving is negligible and probable less that the amount ingested from natural sources (unless you are a vegan). Partially hydrogenating vegetable oils slows spoiling and more important, it allows the oil to be heated without breaking down. Oil that breaks down or rancid contains free-radicals, which are likely to be much more detrimental to your health and the minute amount of trans-fats contained in products labeled as zero grams per serving. Sarah >> This article in WebMD reports on "top 10 trans fat foods." >> http://www.webmd.com/content/Article/118/113024.htm [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > > Sarah Very interesting! Thanks for the information. I knew to avoid partially hydrogenated vegetable oils such as Crisco, but the information you provided (and in the article I cited) is all new to me. MaryL This post not CC'd by email On Sun, 26 Feb 2006 13:07:51 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahpa1980nospam@yahoo.com> wrote: >It is impossible to avoid all trans-fatty acids unless you are a vegan, >since they occur naturally, in small amounts, in various animal products >such as beef, pork, lamb, poultry, seafood, butter and milk. G'day G'day Sarah, Thanks for raising several important points not yet addressed by other posters. Let's look at the issues one by one. 1. Do vegans get trans fats in their diets? Well, I can't think of a single example of where they would IF THEY EAT ENTIRELY NATURAL RAW PRODUCTS. The prevailing wisdom is that plants produce only cis-monounsaturated fats, along with some saturated and polyunsaturated fats. That point is simple and as far as I know irrefutable. (I await for the person who found 0.1% cholesterol in a plant to write that they have found a similar exception to the simple rule.) Then there is what hasn't been addressed by the generalisation. 1A. If they are vegans who eat food cooked in partially hydrogenated vegetable oil then they get the same dosing of trans fats that the rest of us do who use such products. 1B. If they are vegans who reuse their vegetable cooking oil then they get the same dosing of trans fats that the rest of us would get if we followed that practice. 1C. If they are vegans who use deodorised vegetable oils then they will get the same dosing of trans fats that the rest of us get if we use deodorised vegetable oils. There is a price when any of us play with our food, vegan or not. 2. Does this make the vegan lifestyle healthier? Let's ignore all the other issues surrounding vegan and non-vegan diets for a moment and concentrate solely on the trans fat issue. I hope that's OK ... avoiding thread drift has its upside. <grin> Let's look at beef, pork, lamb, poultry, seafood, butter and milk. They contain trans fats in small quantities. Some of the trans fat content is elaidic acid which is not desirable. However, when one looks at dairy products we find vaccinic acid. The name comes from the French word for cow. The connection with the word vaccine is that the first vaccine was cow pox used to prevent small pox. Whatever. The key fact here is that vaccinic acid is a precursor for conjugated linoleic acid which is BENEFICIAL. Humans readily carry out the conversion process. In simple terms the price of vegan denial is denying themselves of a beneficial fat. If I were to lead a campaign regarding trans fats and labeling it would be that the specific trans fat content especially elaidic acid and vaccinic acid should be stated. Elaidic acid is comparable in potential for harm to saturated fat in low doses. Even vegans get saturated fats in their diet. It is inescapable. Even if we don't eat any fat at all and eat purified carbohydrate our livers will make palmitic acid which is a saturated fat. Some saturated fat is an inescapable part of our lives. Elaidic acid, IMHO, becomes rapidly worse than saturated fat when the intake levels rise. There isn't a universal agreement on this. I have petitioned the Minister of Agriculture in New Zealand on this matter and basically received the reply that trans fats aren't significantly worse than saturated fats and simply need to be added to the saturated fat content and not the monounsaturated fat content for labeling purposes. Receiving this reply did not mark one of the happier moments of my life. >The amount ingested in products labeled as "no trans-fats" or those listed >as zero grams or trans-fats per serving is negligible and probable less that >the amount ingested from natural sources (unless you are a vegan). Seems reasonable. It would certainly be true of a vegan who dined on takeaways, just as it would be for non-vegan who dined on takeways. >Partially hydrogenating vegetable oils slows spoiling and more important, it >allows the oil to be heated without breaking down. Oil that breaks down or >rancid contains free-radicals, which are likely to be much more detrimental >to your health and the minute amount of trans-fats contained in products >labeled as zero grams per serving. Very sensible comment Sarah. One point that may well have escaped the posters that I have so far seen on this thread is that while the partial hydrogenation methods commonly used produce a mix of the highly beneficial cis form and the undesirable trans form there ARE solutions which mean the consumer can have fats made by partially hydrogenating the polyunsaturated content of some natural oils like soy, corn, sunflower etc without significant trans fat. Those who read my posts will know that the New Zealand has had this for about a decade thanks to the vigorous lobbying of the dairy product producers. Table margarine seemed set to cut into their market share. Their defense was simple. Make it impossible for margarine manufacturers to get into the market by passing legislation that prohibited the sale of spreadable margarine that had more than 0.9% trans fat. Dastardly. That seemed like that. The dairy lobby had won. Not. While the manufacturing processes commonly used in the US churned out margarine with high trans fat content, in NZ, all margarine has less than 0.9% trans fats. Some has a stated content of 0.4% We use a percent system. NZ has a dual labeling system. It includes an amount per serve AND the amount per 100 gram. While many items have the ZERO per serve, they must also have the correct amount in the 100 gram column. The wheeze that the US manufacturers have pulled on an unsuspecting public is not possible here. Before you all decide to move here please consider Australia first. It's bigger. <grin> Just joking. Our situation is not founded on idealism much as I wish it was. In consequence cooking margarine has no restriction on trans fat content. It could be over 10%. Same with vegetable shortening. They don't compete with dairy products so there hasn't been legislation to control their trans fat content. Put simply the fastest way to get your trans fats in New Zealand assuming you wanted some is to buy takeways and it won't matter a hoot whether you order vegan or non-vegan. The cooking fat will get you. Enter the last player in the NZ saga ... McDonalds. Thanks to legislation currently happening in the US, McDonalds have made a worldwide decision to change the oil they use for cooking. It lowers the trans fat content. Sing a few choruses of "Cultural imperialism is our savior." McDees did what our government didn't have the will or spine to do. >Sarah Special thanks Sarah for some thought provoking comments. I hope I have provided simple factual answers to a complex question. SignatureQuentin Grady ^ ^ / New Zealand, >#,#< [ / \ /\ "... and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin >(I await for the person who found 0.1% cholesterol in a plant to write >that they have found a similar exception to the simple rule.) Venus fly-trap? Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. This post not CC'd by email On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 23:12:24 +1100, Alan S <loralweightandcarbs@optusnet.com.au> wrote: >>(I await for the person who found 0.1% cholesterol in a plant to write >>that they have found a similar exception to the simple rule.) > >Venus fly-trap? LOL >Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. >d&e, metformin 2x500mg G'day G'day Alan, I've yet to find a vegan who eats Venus fly-traps. Maybe there is a vegan out there who stays awake wondering if doing so would violated their principles. Please don't experiment with this one. Best wishes, SignatureQuentin Grady ^ ^ / New Zealand, >#,#< [ / \ /\ "... and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin >Elaidic acid, IMHO, becomes rapidly worse than saturated fat when the >intake levels rise. There isn't a universal agreement on this. I [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >labeling purposes. Receiving this reply did not mark one of the >happier moments of my life. I can see why you would not be thrilled by the response! This post not CC'd by email On Tue, 28 Feb 2006 17:11:09 -0700, Chris J. <chris@noadress.com> wrote: >>Elaidic acid, IMHO, becomes rapidly worse than saturated fat when the >>intake levels rise. There isn't a universal agreement on this. I [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >I can see why you would not be thrilled by the response! G'day G'day Chris, They appeared unmoved that countries to which New Zealand exports ARE introducing mandatory listing of TOTAL trans fat content. Products containing cheese, an important NZ exports, will have trans fats, abeit beneficial trans fats. If New Zealand is not proactive in this matter then they will be caught in a reactive situation and be unable to prevent legislation that will be detrimental to our economy. Best wishes, SignatureQuentin Grady ^ ^ / New Zealand, >#,#< [ / \ /\ "... and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin . Products > containing cheese, an important NZ exports, will have trans fats, > abeit beneficial trans fats. What are beneficial trans fats? > . Products > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > What are beneficial trans fats? hmmm...I'd like to know the answer to that too! Dave >> . Products >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Dave I have done experiments with full fat cheeses. I can raise and lower my total cholesterol by large amounts by eating a lot of cheese or by cutting it out entirely. So even though I avoid full fat cheese i am still rather interested to see Quentin's response here. This post not CC'd by email On Wed, 01 Mar 2006 10:01:16 GMT, "Ozgirl" <are_we_there_yet@maccas.com> wrote: >I have done experiments with full fat cheeses. I can raise >and lower my total cholesterol by large amounts by eating a >lot of cheese or by cutting it out entirely. G'day G'day Ozgirl, Saturated fats tend to raise both LDL and HDL, so eating full fat cheese will raise the total cholesterol level. From then on we enter the world of conjecture. Raised cholesterol should lead to raised risk of coronary heart disease. That over looks the de-encryption of polypeptide from the casein protein by the fermentation process used to make the cheese. These substances work as ACE inhibitors that reduce high blood pressure. A 5 point drop in blood pressure corresponds to a 16% reduction in CHD risk. Put simply while there is plenty of evidence that raised cholesterol is associated with high rates of coronary heart disease, the picture isn't simple. There are other factors. Apparently it is hard to find Epidemiology evidence that cheese leads to increased heart attacks. I have often wondered why. Foods are not single substances. Cheese is not simply saturated fat for instance. We know inflammation is the much over looked companion of high cholesterol in causing coronary heart disease. Cheese fats are primarily saturated and mono-unsaturated fats. Other foods thought by many to be healthy because they reduce cholesterol thanks to linoleic acid and are cholesterol free turn out to be unhealthy because they contribute to inflammation. > So even though I avoid full fat cheese i am still rather interested > to see Quentin's response here. Ozgirl, I think your strategy is wise. Some of us have a reasonable grasp of the odds and try to beat them. Every one who comes here is hoping at some level that with knowledge they can do better in the complications stakes. My opinion, for what it is worth, is that a reasonable bet is to go for low fat cheeses like cottage cheese and some feta. Get the benefits of those polypeptides that act like ACE inhibitors. Get the benefits found in the DASH trials of low fat cheese in better weight reduction where isocaloric diets containing low fat cheese unexpectedly resulted in an extra kilogram or two weight loss. Hope this helps, Best wishes, SignatureQuentin Grady ^ ^ / New Zealand, >#,#< [ / \ /\ "... and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin > This post not CC'd by email > On Wed, 01 Mar 2006 10:01:16 GMT, "Ozgirl" [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > low fat cheese unexpectedly resulted in an extra kilogram or two > weight loss. I hedge my bets. I am one who is not quite ready to discount all those years of research on cholesterol. I tend to still do dairy but go for the low fat varietes. Thanks for the information. >> This post not CC'd by email >> On Wed, 01 Mar 2006 10:01:16 GMT, "Ozgirl" [quoted text clipped - 78 lines] >do dairy but go for the low fat varietes. Thanks for the >information. It's been an interesting conversation. I'm off to the fridge for a snack. Lovely Australian Farmers Blue-Vein (it not only tastes delicious - but ensures that others don't encroach on your personal space:-) A snack is about 10gm on a half-cracker. I've often wondered if all those cultures in the blue cheeses are good for me - I've never seen discussion on it; I assume they're similar to yoghurt culture - but I really don't know, I just eat it for the taste. I eat much less cheese than I used to, but it's full fat and full flavour. I keep an eye on the fat in cheese simply for the calories. I do eat feta, ricotta and cottage occasionally, but I cannot handle the reduced fat cheeses that I call "plastic cheese". I see real cheese as a reasonably natural process, but I have my doubts about the processes used in reduced fat and low-fat cheddars and similar. Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. "Alan S" <loralweightandcarbs@optusnet.com.au> wrote in > It's been an interesting conversation. I'm off to the fridge > for a snack. Lovely Australian Farmers Blue-Vein (it not > only tastes delicious - but ensures that others don't > encroach on your personal space:-) A snack is about 10gm on > a half-cracker. Now you have me salivating. One of my favourite snacks (or desserts if I have adult friends - lol) is blue vein, a few dried apricots and some Carr's water bickies. Some wedges of rockmelon tops it off. There are a few things that are very safe in my fridge (i.e. kids won't even touch them ;). They are blue vein cheese, olives, fetta, cottage cheese and powdered parmesan. Oh and dolmades and dried tomatoes. > I eat much less cheese than I used to, but it's full fat and > full flavour. I keep an eye on the fat in cheese simply for > the calories. I do eat feta, ricotta and cottage > occasionally, but I cannot handle the reduced fat cheeses > that I call "plastic cheese". The staples in my fridge are the low fat cheeses, the other ones I buy occasionally. >Now you have me salivating. One of my favourite snacks (or >desserts if I have adult friends - lol) is blue vein, a few >dried apricots and some Carr's water bickies. Hi Aussies For crackers, try Nabisco 98% fat-free High-fibre Premium Crispbread. When you do the sums, per cracker the count is approximately: Energy 120kj, 30cal Protein 1gm Fat Total 0.15gm Sat Fat 0.04gm Carb 5.3gm sugars 0.2gm Fibre 0.9gm Sodium 78mg I eat a half-cracker with something on it as a snack. Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. How big are these crackers? They seem to have a lot of carbs. I have been eating Sunshine Whole wheat crackers. They have 2 net carbs per cracker. I usually eat 2-3 for my snacks. >>Now you have me salivating. One of my favourite snacks (or >>desserts if I have adult friends - lol) is blue vein, a few [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. > d&e, metformin 2x500mg >How big are these crackers? They seem to have a lot of carbs. > >I have been eating Sunshine Whole wheat crackers. They have 2 net carbs per >cracker. I usually eat 2-3 for my snacks. Thin, flat, about 12cmx6cm (5"x2 1/2") so a half-cracker is about 2 1/2" square. http://www.kraft.com.au/nabisco/products_premium.cfm If you do the US sums of subtracting fibre to convert from our numbers, a full cracker is 4.4gm and a half is 2.2. Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. > >Now you have me salivating. One of my favourite snacks (or > >desserts if I have adult friends - lol) is blue vein, a few [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > I eat a half-cracker with something on it as a snack. Half a 4.4 net gr carb cracker? I would eat two ;) A bit of cottage cheese and tomato with cracked pepper, yum :) Actually now I now what I will have for a snack right now. I have Kavli whole grain (rye) Crispy Thin crispbreads here. 3 slices - 8.6 gr net carb. Nice with fresh ground peanut butter, or cottage cheese and gherkin or tomato etc, or cream cheese and smoked salmon with a squeeze of lemon juice, or a bit of mayo and cold sliced hard boiled eggs... add a nice tall glass of iced water. They are nice dipped in hommus too ;) Or dipped in soups... last soup I had was minestrone with a few of thse crispbreads broken into it. > It's been an interesting conversation. I'm off to the fridge > for a snack. Lovely Australian Farmers Blue-Vein (it not > only tastes delicious - but ensures that others don't > encroach on your personal space:-) A snack is about 10gm on > a half-cracker. > I've often wondered if all those cultures in the blue > cheeses are good for me - I've never seen discussion on it; > I assume they're similar to yoghurt culture - but I really > don't know, I just eat it for the taste. I went to check the label on my brie. It says "...may be harmful to the health of pregnant women, children, the elderly, and anyone with a low resistance to infection. People in these groups should not eat this product." So as well as being a tasty treat, it give my immune system something to chew on apart from me. I believe in the "trigger happy" immune hypothesis. If you don't give your heavily armed immune system some real bugs to kill every so often, it gets bored and starts shooting the civilians. SignatureChris Malcolm cam@infirmatics.ed.ac.uk +44 (0)131 651 3445 DoD #205 IPAB, Informatics, JCMB, King's Buildings, Edinburgh, EH9 3JZ, UK [http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/homes/cam/] >> It's been an interesting conversation. I'm off to the fridge >> for a snack. Lovely Australian Farmers Blue-Vein (it not [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >real bugs to kill every so often, it gets bored and starts shooting >the civilians. Interesting. I love blue-vein, bries, camembert, stilton and most cheeses of that type. My liking for them improved as I changed diets, lost weight, gained control. I did all that after the diabetes diagnosis - and after the hypogammaglobulinemia diagnosis. It seems that what little immune system I have must work very efficiently - maybe the cheese is the tune-up it needs:-) Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. This post not CC'd by email On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 23:28:09 +1100, Alan S <loralweightandcarbs@optusnet.com.au> wrote: >It seems that what little immune system I have must work >very efficiently - maybe the cheese is the tune-up it >needs:-) > >Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. >d&e, metformin 2x500mg G'day G'day Chris, As is often is the case things might not be a simple as they appear. In New Zealand, cheese MUST be made from pasteurized milk. Australia is likely to be the same. In some countries it is not. In those countries it is necessary to post the "impaired immune system" warning. Best wishes, SignatureQuentin Grady ^ ^ / New Zealand, >#,#< [ / \ /\ "... and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin >>It seems that what little immune system I have must work >>very efficiently - maybe the cheese is the tune-up it [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >countries it is necessary to post the "impaired immune system" >warning. Thanks for that info:-( I was looking forward to some cheese-tasting in France and Eastern Europe. Darn. Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia. d&e, metformin 2x500mg SignatureEverything in Moderation - Except Laughter. >I believe in the "trigger happy" immune hypothesis. If you don't give your heavily armed immune system some >real bugs to kill every so often, it gets bored and starts shooting the civilians. And then there are those of us whose immune system "pounces" on all other living things via their pollens and dander. Yep, mine is quite healthy. Wore me out--could never get anything done with all its trigger happiness. I had to move to the desert just so it would have fewer targets. But hey, there's been a few indications that those of us with horrible allergies also have less cancer. Michelle Chris Malcolm <cam@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> wrote in news:46o3l3Fc3b2dU2 @individual.net: > So as well as being a tasty treat, it give my immune system something > to chew on apart from me. I believe in the "trigger happy" immune > hypothesis. If you don't give your heavily armed immune system some > real bugs to kill every so often, it gets bored and starts shooting > the civilians. When I was a child, old folks around here used to say you'll eat a peck of dirt before you die, meaning that a little dirt won't hurt you. I 'spect that's the same thing as giving your immune system some clay pigeons. Chak SignatureIn science, 'fact' can only mean 'confirmed to such a degree that it would be perverse to withhold provisional assent.' I suppose that apples might start to rise tomorrow, but the possibility does not merit equal time in physics classrooms. --Stephen Jay Gould This post not CC'd by email On Wed, 01 Mar 2006 06:16:16 GMT, "Ozgirl" <are_we_there_yet@maccas.com> wrote: >> Products containing cheese, an important NZ exports, will have >> trans fats, abeit beneficial trans fats. > >What are beneficial trans fats? G'day G'day Ozgirl, Vaccinic acid found in animal products is readily converted to conjugated linoleic acid which is beneficial for a number of things including weight loss. It possible to improve the levels in goat milk for instance by feeding linseed. Best wishes, SignatureQuentin Grady ^ ^ / New Zealand, >#,#< [ / \ /\ "... and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin > This post not CC'd by email > On Wed, 01 Mar 2006 06:16:16 GMT, "Ozgirl" [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > including weight loss. It possible to improve the levels in goat milk > for instance by feeding linseed. Well thank you, you learn something new every day :) > Vaccinic acid found in animal products is readily converted to >conjugated linoleic acid which is beneficial for a number of things >including weight loss. It possible to improve the levels in goat milk >for instance by feeding linseed. For those googling along at home, it's more often spelled 'vaccEnic acid'. An intro as to why someone would want to eat a trans fat can be found at http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=1 2094634 Banni S, et al "Vaccenic acid feeding increases tissue levels of conjugated linoleic acid and suppresses development of premalignant lesions in rat mammary gland." Nutr Cancer. 2001;41(1-2):91-7. This post not CC'd by email On 7 Mar 2006 13:28:15 -0600, throop@cs.utexas.edu (David R. Throop) wrote: >> Vaccinic acid found in animal products is readily converted to >>conjugated linoleic acid which is beneficial for a number of things [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >conjugated linoleic acid and suppresses development of premalignant >lesions in rat mammary gland." Nutr Cancer. 2001;41(1-2):91-7. G'day G'day David, Thanks for pointing out the typo. It can be annoying for people trying to follow up with a Google search. I am usually pretty reliable with chemical names but I hadn't noticed that one. Thanks. Best wishes, SignatureQuentin Grady ^ ^ / New Zealand, >#,#< [ / \ /\ "... and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin >This post not CC'd by email > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >matter then they will be caught in a reactive situation and be unable >to prevent legislation that will be detrimental to our economy. Not to mention leaving New Zealanders trying to eat a healthier diet without needed information. As an American, I must say I'm disappointed in this. My country was the unchallenged world leader when it comes to bumbling of this nature, yet it appears that, at least on this one issue, NZ might have overtaken us. <G> |
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