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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / January 2006

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Fun with inflammatory indices

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Quentin Grady - 21 Jan 2006 23:48 GMT
G'day G'day Folks,

As some of you know, T2 diabetes is closely associated with
inflammation.  Most people by now know that omega-3 polyunsaturated
fats are anti-inflammatory.  Put simply there are three
polyunsaturated fats that seem to be more important than others in
keeping the balance.

To grossly oversimplify:-

EPA omega-3 for heart stability
DHA omega-3 for growing brain function
AA  omega-6 for the brain function

Most Western diets are out of balance with excess AA generated from
vegetable seed oils eg soy, corn, sunflower, safflower etc.  

The lucky ones have gone for fruit and nut oils; olive, avocado and
macadamias with a lacing of fish oils.

(This morning I bought 2 litres of leccino EVOO, the one with the
peppery after taste (hydroxytyrosol) that is one of foods ultimate
anti-inflammatory substances.)

Put simply it is desirable to keep a high EPA:AA ratio.
Read Barry Sears, Omega Rx Zone Diet for a wealth of detail.

                   
Fish              AA          EPA        DHA     Index 1     Index 2
in 100g           mg/100g      mg/100g    mg/100g   EPA/AA  (EPA+DHA)/AA

Herring           37         2680        500       72.4        85.9
Mackerel         120          690       1300        5.8        16.6
Salmon           300          700       2140        2.3         9.5
Tuna             280         1070       2280        3.8        12.0
Cod                3           35         56       11.7        30.3
Trout             30          150        430        5.0        19.3
Carp             190          210         80        1.1         1.5

This is for fun.  If it has any accidental educational value it is to
invite you to look carefully at assumptions.  

When we say fish is a good source of omega-3 fatty acids we need to be
more specific about the fish we are talking about.  It does help to
think of torpedo shaped fish as a rough guide.  

The clear cut winner as an anti-inflammatory fish on both indexes is
herring ... assuming of course that other compounds aren't tipping the
scales one way or the other.

Best wishes,


Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

TigerLily - 22 Jan 2006 01:07 GMT
Quentin, i so often read and save your posts, but
i seldom say thank you to you

so here is a BIG THANK YOU for the information you
make so much easier to understand/read!

kate
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an expensive teacher.

> G'day G'day Folks,
>
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
>
> Fish           AA          EPA        DHA
Index 1     Index 2
> in 100g         mg/100g      mg/100g    mg/100g
EPA/AA  (EPA+DHA)/AA

> Herring           37         2680        500       72.4        85.9
> Mackerel         120          690       1300        5.8        16.6
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Best wishes,
Quentin Grady - 22 Jan 2006 18:50 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 18:07:47 -0700, "TigerLily" <me@privacy.net>
wrote:

>Quentin, i so often read and save your posts, but
>i seldom say thank you to you
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>kate

G'day G'day Kate,

 The truth is I enjoy exploring what is and isn't so.  We are force
fed so much pap these days by folks with vested interests that is
takes time and patience to tease it all out.  Then I like sharing.
Sharing brought about feedback and more questions and more
exploration.

Also it is part of how I learnt to cope with T2 diabetes.  I was
confronted a with a fearsome array of about seven ugly heads from this
one insidious beast.  My solution was to give each of them a whack to
keep them at bay as well at going for the heart of the matter, getting
good blood glucose control.

Thank you for the acknowledgement.  It is one form of support that
really is appreciated.  BTW. I wrote the first chapter of my book
yesterday. There is no telling if I'll have the opportunity to finish
it.

Best wishes,
Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Nev. - 22 Jan 2006 23:10 GMT
> We are force fed so much pap these days by folks with vested
> interests that it takes time and patience to tease it all out.

I think it is not merely pap, but pre-digested pap.

Nev
Alan S - 23 Jan 2006 00:33 GMT
> BTW. I wrote the first chapter of my book
>yesterday. There is no telling if I'll have the opportunity to finish
>it.

Great news! Put me on the list for a first edition.

You'll finish it. It's needed.

Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia.
Signature

Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.

Vicki Beausoleil - 23 Jan 2006 13:43 GMT
> This post not CC'd by email
>  On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 18:07:47 -0700, "TigerLily" <me@privacy.net>
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
> Best wishes,

Quentin, that's wonderful news about the book! Put me down for a minimum
of four copies.

Best of luck in your quest

Vicki
W.M.McKee - 23 Jan 2006 14:18 GMT
>> This post not CC'd by email
>>  On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 18:07:47 -0700, "TigerLily" <me@privacy.net>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
>Vicki

Hi Quentin, we don't seem to exchange many messages, but I do have an
immense amount of respect for you. When your book comes out, I would
be interested in acquiring a copy, or 2, or 3. I am very glad to hear
that you are working on something like that, which could be ofgreat
benefit to a large number of people.

I think you are really super.

Will, T2
Chris J. - 23 Jan 2006 18:28 GMT
>Thank you for the acknowledgement.  It is one form of support that
>really is appreciated.  BTW. I wrote the first chapter of my book
>yesterday. There is no telling if I'll have the opportunity to finish
>it.

This, IMHO, is great news for us all. You can put me down for buying a
copy or three, absolutely!!!!
Quentin Grady - 23 Jan 2006 23:28 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Mon, 23 Jan 2006 11:28:28 -0700, Chris J. <chris@noadress.com>
wrote:

>>Thank you for the acknowledgement.  It is one form of support that
>>really is appreciated.  BTW. I wrote the first chapter of my book
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>This, IMHO, is great news for us all. You can put me down for buying a
>copy or three, absolutely!!!!

G'day G'day Chris,

Email me promptly.

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Chris J. - 24 Jan 2006 01:57 GMT
>This post not CC'd by email
>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
> Email me promptly.

Done!
Quentin Grady - 24 Jan 2006 05:13 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Mon, 23 Jan 2006 18:57:40 -0700, Chris J. <chris@noadress.com>
wrote:

>>G'day G'day Chris,
>>
>> Email me promptly.
>
>Done!

G'day G'day Chris,

It hasn't arrived.  My Bayesian filter is set to a low threshold as
the email address I use in my posts is genuine and I get a tonne of
spam. You may have used some bad words like "accessory" too often
though this doesn't seem likely.  I've scanned to three times my
normal threshold.

Please send via an intermediary.
I'll leave the choice to your intelligence.

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Chris J. - 24 Jan 2006 07:14 GMT
>This post not CC'd by email
>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>though this doesn't seem likely.  I've scanned to three times my
>normal threshold.

>Please send via an intermediary.
>I'll leave the choice to your intelligence.

Let me try sending it again.  I'll keep it exceedingly brief, avoid
any trigger words, and try again.

The subject line I used was: To Quentin

If this does not arrive, let me know and I'll try from a different
domain. However, I sent it from an ISP account so it shouldn't be a
tagged domain.
TigerLily - 24 Jan 2006 01:58 GMT
Quentin, congratulations on the book ! ! !

please put my name down on the list of 'people who
want to buy a copy' when you finally get to print
it, or e-file it, which ever you choose to do

e-books are gaining popularity and i would LOVE to
own a disc of 'Quentin's thoughts' on nutrition

kate
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Join us in the Diabetic-Talk Chatroom on UnderNet
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http://www.diabetic-talk.org/freeveggies.htm
I have no medical qualifications beyond my own
experience.
Choose your advisers carefully, because experience
can be
an expensive teacher.

> This post not CC'd by email
>  On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 18:07:47 -0700, "TigerLily" <me@privacy.net>
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
> Best wishes,
Nicky - 24 Jan 2006 19:30 GMT
> Quentin, congratulations on the book ! ! !
>
> please put my name down on the list of 'people who
> want to buy a copy' when you finally get to print
> it, or e-file it, which ever you choose to do

Me too, please : )

Nicky.

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A1c 10.5/5.4/<6  T2 DX 05/2004
1g Metformin, 100ug Thyroxine
95/73/72Kg

Nev. - 25 Jan 2006 23:29 GMT
> Thank you for the acknowledgement.  It is one form of support that
> really is appreciated.  BTW. I wrote the first chapter of my book
> yesterday. There is no telling if I'll have the opportunity to finish
> it.

I remember a story from a woman who wrote a Cook Book.  When
she went to see a publisher, they said they would only publish it if she
agreed to have it published under the name of a well known author
of Cook Books.

Such is the real world?

Nev.
Quentin Grady - 26 Jan 2006 05:26 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Thu, 26 Jan 2006 09:29:25 +1000, "Nev."
<nenvy@REMOVETOSENDoptusnet.com.au> wrote:

>> Thank you for the acknowledgement.  It is one form of support that
>> really is appreciated.  BTW. I wrote the first chapter of my book
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
>Nev.

G'day G'day Nev,

I think I'm safe.  There is no way any well known author would want
my book associated with them.

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Nev. - 26 Jan 2006 17:15 GMT
>  I think I'm safe.  There is no way any well known author would want
> my book associated with them.

That is probably the advantage/disadvantage when you think for yourself.

Nev.
Michelle - 26 Jan 2006 17:49 GMT
Quentin,

I'm with Nicky--you ought to give the column a shot.  I believe your
degree in chemistry would serve you well because although your articles
(the ones we're so fortunate to read on this newsgroup for free) are
geared toward nutrition, you know way more about the fine points than
any nutritionist would.  The information provided at the start of this
thread is a good example.  A nutritionist should know that fish is
"good" for you, but is she going to know as much about why?  I don't
think so.  And for me, the why is very important information.  In other
words, your chemistry knowledge gives you a pretty unique way to
understand and present the knowledge.

It's all well and good that the gal who writes the nutrition column in
your area is pretty, but in the States some of our most respected
journalists/newsmen/experts are distinguished, mature men.

Just my 2 cents.
Another voice from your fan club.  ;-)
Michelle
Quentin Grady - 27 Jan 2006 08:31 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On 26 Jan 2006 09:49:04 -0800, "Michelle" <bookbug2005@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Quentin,
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>thread is a good example.  A nutritionist should know that fish is
>"good" for you, but is she going to know as much about why?  

G'day G'day Michelle,

 Darn it.  You are probably right.  At the moment for quite personal
reasons I want to get the book completed.  

>I don't think so.  And for me, the why is very important information.  
>In other words, your chemistry knowledge gives you a pretty unique way to
>understand and present the knowledge.

That's a tricky point.  For Xmas I received two popular maths books
and one on punctuation.  The maths books avoided math to the best of
the writers' ability.  There is a saying, something to the effect that
every equation halves the number of readers.   I strongly suspect the
same is true of names of molecules.   You guys and gals have gotten
used to me saying zeaxanthin and know it is not the name of a rock
band.  What of the general populace.  I am trying to handle the
readers desire to know and not to be asked to know.  At the moment it
is debatable whether I've gotten that right.  One strategy I am
following is to deliberately include people who DON'T read here in
amongst the people whose opinion I canvas.

>It's all well and good that the gal who writes the nutrition column in
>your area is pretty, but in the States some of our most respected
>journalists/newsmen/experts are distinguished, mature men.

Agreed.  Tell me.  Do the botoxed beauties who sell soft soap inspire
you or irritate you?

>Just my 2 cents.
>Another voice from your fan club.  ;-)
>Michelle

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Nicky - 27 Jan 2006 17:04 GMT
> Agreed.  Tell me.  Do the botoxed beauties who sell soft soap inspire
> you or irritate you?

If this is a poll - the latter. If they manage to attract my attention in
the first place. Content over icing, every time...

Nicky.

Signature

A1c 10.5/5.4/<6  T2 DX 05/2004
1g Metformin, 100ug Thyroxine
95/73/72Kg

Michelle - 27 Jan 2006 19:36 GMT
>That's a tricky point.  For Xmas I received two popular maths books
>and one on punctuation.  The maths books avoided math to the best of
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>following is to deliberately include people who DON'T read here in
>amongst the people whose opinion I canvas.

Hi Quentin,

I do understand your dilemma.  My mother and I began working on
cookbook geared toward healthy eating--started before I became aware of
my sugar problems, but basically diabetic friendly nonetheless.  While
she handles the cooking part of the book, with my background as a lab
tech we decided it would be helpful to add simple healthy eating blurbs
throughout, addressing issues such as cholesterol, glycemic index, etc.
No matter what I write, I'm afraid I'm talking over people's heads.
I've learned that so much of the knowledge I take for granted seems to
be rather specialized.  I know very intelligent people who have no
concept that they have some control over their personal health.  So I
keep rewriting, trying to bring it down so that anyone can understand
it, but there's only so much you can do.  Then I remember that anyone
who is interested in healthy eating has already made a committment
toward better health and may be a little more willing to learn than the
general populace.  I don't want to do these people a disservice by
being too simple.  It is a balancing act.  Anyway, I would hope that
anyone who would be interested in your book is looking to expand
his/her understanding at least a bit.

Btw, I wasn't saying you should do a column "instead" of your book.
;-)  Actually, if you can complete your book it would be a good
reference for any column job, even if you didn't get it published right
away.  It shows dedication to the subject.

And the botoxed beauties do NOT inspire me.  I don't have a grudge
against the young and beautiful, but I do have a problem with fake.
I'm 42 years old, starting to get some gray in my reddish hair, and
damn proud of it.  I want to look good for my age, but I certainly
don't pine to be 18 and stupid again.

Michelle
Quentin Grady - 28 Jan 2006 05:04 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On 27 Jan 2006 11:36:25 -0800, "Michelle" <bookbug2005@gmail.com>
wrote:

>>That's a tricky point.  For Xmas I received two popular maths books
>>and one on punctuation.  The maths books avoided math to the best of
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>anyone who would be interested in your book is looking to expand
>his/her understanding at least a bit.

It appears to be writing itself.  My daily life generates sufficient
lead ins for what I want to say.

>Btw, I wasn't saying you should do a column "instead" of your book.
>;-)  Actually, if you can complete your book it would be a good
>reference for any column job, even if you didn't get it published right
>away.  It shows dedication to the subject.

Smart thinking.

>And the botoxed beauties do NOT inspire me.  I don't have a grudge
>against the young and beautiful, but I do have a problem with fake.
>I'm 42 years old, starting to get some gray in my reddish hair, and
>damn proud of it.  I want to look good for my age, but I certainly
>don't pine to be 18 and stupid again.

I can't imagine that you were ever stupid, though I may have been a
disguise you adopted to fit in.  I can't have been easy to be a girl
geek ... all the laboratory training.

>Michelle

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Michelle - 28 Jan 2006 19:48 GMT
>It appears to be writing itself.  My daily life generates sufficient
>lead ins for what I want to say.

Hi Quentin,
Glad to hear the creative juices are flowing.  :-)

>I can't imagine that you were ever stupid, though I may have been a
>disguise you adopted to fit in.  I can't have been easy to be a girl
>geek ... all the laboratory training.

Perhaps "stupid" is too harsh to apply to any young person.  Maybe
"inexperienced" is more fair.  However, I can look back and realize
that although I had an excellent grasp of textbook subjects, people
seldom behaved as well as I expected them to.  And I wasn't "smart
enough" to adopt the "stupid" disguise.  Talk about truly geeky.  LOL!
Working in the various labs was a big eye-opener.  But for a long time
I still had a tendency to dismiss bad behavior as "they were having a
bad day" etc.  It finally dawned on me that some people were having
"bad lives" and I was going to have to be more assertive.

Also in regard to the botox beauty selling whatever..., I do not
understand the western world's focus on youth.  Yes, youth is probably
when the most surface beauty occurs in any individual's life, however,
that's the basic of what youth has to offer.  Very few youths write
novels, build bridges, have the depth to navigate life's pitfalls
smoothly, etc.  Some eastern cultures tend to revere their oldsters.
Personally, I think each phase of life has something to offer and no
one needs to be left out.

Michelle
Quentin Grady - 30 Jan 2006 06:45 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On 28 Jan 2006 11:48:11 -0800, "Michelle" <bookbug2005@gmail.com>
wrote:

> But for a long time I still had a tendency to dismiss bad behavior
> as "they were having a bad day" etc.  It finally dawned on me that
> some people were having"bad lives" and I was going to have to be
> more assertive.

G'day G'day Michelle,

I've had a few incidents recently with people unconnected with asd
for whom the phrase, "Never truer words said" comes to mind.

Best wishes,
Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Michelle - 30 Jan 2006 19:43 GMT
>> But for a long time I still had a tendency to dismiss bad behavior
>> as "they were having a bad day" etc.  It finally dawned on me that
>>some people were having"bad lives" and I was going to have to be
>> more assertive.

>G'day G'day Michelle,

>I've had a few incidents recently with people unconnected with asd
>for whom the phrase, "Never truer words said" comes to mind.

Sorry to hear that Quentin.  And it seems that just one person having a
"bad life" can make life so difficult--whether it's a work setting,
other group setting, or personal relationship.  Although hopefully with
maturity, people can learn to banish toxic personal relationships.
Unfortunately, this isn't usually possible in a work setting.

Michelle
Chris J. - 28 Jan 2006 02:02 GMT
>Agreed.  Tell me.  Do the botoxed beauties who sell soft soap inspire
>you or irritate you?

I find them to be, in many cases, detrimental to the product. Anytime
I see an add that does not focus on the product, or has things that
distract from the product, my first thought is always "What are they
trying to pull"?  After all, IMHO, the only real reason to distract
from the product is if it's a lousy product, and the more "window
dressing", the more likely that seems.
Quentin Grady - 28 Jan 2006 05:07 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 19:02:04 -0700, Chris J. <chris@noadress.com>
wrote:

>>Agreed.  Tell me.  Do the botoxed beauties who sell soft soap inspire
>>you or irritate you?
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>from the product is if it's a lousy product, and the more "window
>dressing", the more likely that seems.

G'day G'day Chris,

Sharp thinking. I adopt a similar dictum.  I goes something like this,
"You get to take home the product not the sales person."  

In my mind the seller disappears and I look at what I am left with.

Best wishes,
Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Chris J. - 28 Jan 2006 21:01 GMT
>This post not CC'd by email
>
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>Sharp thinking. I adopt a similar dictum.  I goes something like this,
>"You get to take home the product not the sales person."  

I take it a bit too far, as I have a visceral dislike of sales
pitches. If I'm getting a sales pitch, I become irritated, and leave,
even if I was otherwise planning on buying the item. I've missed out
on a few nice things this way.

>In my mind the seller disappears and I look at what I am left with.

That's the only rational way.
Quentin Grady - 30 Jan 2006 06:47 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Sat, 28 Jan 2006 14:01:15 -0700, Chris J. <chris@noadress.com>
wrote:

>>In my mind the seller disappears and I look at what I am left with.
>
>That's the only rational way.

G'day G'day Chris J,

Then I go back and count the number of little "tells" the salesperson
exhibited as a guide to the likelihood of after sales services
actually materializing.  The essential concept is make it a two step
process.

Best wishes,
Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Julie Bove - 22 Jan 2006 01:51 GMT
<snip>

> The clear cut winner as an anti-inflammatory fish on both indexes is
> herring ... assuming of course that other compounds aren't tipping the
> scales one way or the other.

Tipping the scales!  Hehehehe.  Too funny!

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Quentin Grady - 22 Jan 2006 18:41 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Sun, 22 Jan 2006 01:51:43 GMT, "Julie Bove"
<julienospambove@verizon.net> wrote:

><snip>
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>Tipping the scales!  Hehehehe.  Too funny!

G'day G'day Julie,

I thought so to.  One of the delights of internet is one can laugh at
one's own jokes and no one thinks it impolite.

For me the take home message is about the same as always.  

A.  Don't make the typical complex equivalent error eg "coffee is
caffeine ... fish is EPA and DHA"   Coffee has about a dozen active
ingredients and only one or two of the attributes of coffee are
explained by the caffeine content.   Fish IMHO is similar.  

Fish is a good source of choline; dimethylaminoethanol, DMAE and
pyroglutamate.  IIRC correctly, DMAE and pyroglutamate are
anti-inflammatory.

B.  The healthiest people in the world frequently eat fish eg the
Shetland Islanders, the Okinawans, people of Crete. They don't bother
with fish oil capsules.  I know from the personal testimony of a bloke
from the Shetland Islands who has a few relatives over 100 that they
eat the fish hearts in vinegar as an entree and they eat plenty of
shellfish.  

C.  We aren't the healthiest people in the world.  Some of what we do
is remedial in its nature.  If you are considering taking fish oil
capsules then it make sense to consider it as part of a medication
regime.

It took a bit of scratching around with Google to find what I'd
written in the past on the subject.

Here are the general principles for dealing with metabolic syndrome.

1. Avoid refined carbs

2. Eat foods in as natural a state as possible.

3. Use non-starchy vegetables as your primary source of carbs.

4. Keep the amounts of carb dense foods low or moderate depending on
health.  

5. Avoid soft drinks and fruit juices.  

6. Avoid vegetable oils.  
  Replace them with fruit oils eg olive, avocado.

7. Avoid hydrogenated oils like the plague. The news on this got
worse. It was thought that below a couple of percent of calories was
OK. Some recent research suggests there is no safe limit for the
common contaminant of hydrogenated oils elaidic acid, a trans fatty
acid.

8. Eat fish preferably salmon, mackerel, sardines etc.
They really are good for brain function.  As the details of choline,
pyroglutamate, EPA, DHA, DMAE etc become clearer ... the answer is a
short fish.

9. Have protein at all meals.  

Best wishes and glad you enjoyed the joke,

Best wishes,
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Vicki Beausoleil - 22 Jan 2006 10:54 GMT
> G'day G'day Folks,
>
[quoted text clipped - 49 lines]
>
>  

Canned mackerel is incredibly inexpensive here. One large can makes a
meal for the two of us at less than a dollar per person. I also prefer
mackerel to salmon because the bones are easier to pick out. Yes, I know
the bones are a good source of calcium, but the texture of a canned
salmon bone makes me gag.

Scrambled eggs and mackerel are yummy for breakfast.

Although your thread is aimed at T2s, there's no reason to believe the
same doesn't apply to T1s. Chronic inflammation is a bad thing even if
you're not diabetic.

Vicki
Ozgirl - 22 Jan 2006 12:18 GMT
> Canned mackerel is incredibly inexpensive here. One large can makes a
> meal for the two of us at less than a dollar per person. I also prefer
> mackerel to salmon because the bones are easier to pick out. Yes, I
> know the bones are a good source of calcium, but the
texture of a
> canned salmon bone makes me gag.

My mother made delicious salmon rissoles (patties, cakes or
whatever anyone else wants to call them). I was in my 20's
before I discovered she had always used mackerel.

My first ex husband ate canned herrings in tomato sauce with
every "salad". I have never touched them, tomato sauce and
fish in a can don't go together in my opinion.
Nev. - 22 Jan 2006 20:00 GMT
I like salmon rissoles cooked with tomato sauce as an ingredient.

But I have heard that using sauce is an insult to the cook or chef.

Nev.

> My first ex husband ate canned herrings in tomato sauce with
> every "salad". I have never touched them, tomato sauce and
> fish in a can don't go together in my opinion.
Quentin Grady - 22 Jan 2006 21:56 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Mon, 23 Jan 2006 06:00:16 +1000, "Nev."
<nenvy@REMOVETOSENDoptusnet.com.au> wrote:

>I like salmon rissoles cooked with tomato sauce as an ingredient.
>
>But I have heard that using sauce is an insult to the cook or chef.
>
>Nev.

G'day G'day Nev,

So is NOT belching after a meal in some cultures.  Tomato sauce is
one of the world's best sauces of lycopene. In these days of
multi-cultural diversity is easy enough to find a culturally enshrined
custom that ensures health.  In New Zealand most cooks would be
entirely happy if you if call out, "This looks delicious" as you add a
splat of tomato sauce.  

Even if it wasn't, who'd know?

Tell them you're thinking of visiting New Zealand if the cook frowns.

Best wishes,
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Nev. - 22 Jan 2006 22:59 GMT
>  Tomato sauce is one of the world's best sauces of lycopene.

One of the frustrations I have found living on the better side of the
Tasman is that every so often I go into the diabetic shop and find
a delicious sauce/condiment that is low in carbohydrate and sugar,
but when I go back to buy it again they no longer stock it.  It
usually turned out that these delicious condiments were made with
splenda in the land of the long white cloud.

Nev.
Quentin Grady - 23 Jan 2006 18:07 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Mon, 23 Jan 2006 08:59:51 +1000, "Nev."
<nenvy@REMOVETOSENDoptusnet.com.au> wrote:

>>  Tomato sauce is one of the world's best sauces of lycopene.
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
>Nev.

G'day G'day Nev,

CER, closer economic relations?  

Is the loss of sauces with splenda permanent?  

I haven't been to the shops that sell them here for a while.  Believe
it or not the closest one is a specialty chocolate shop.  Another is
an outfit that sells weightloss plans.  

The supermarkets are bastards in their own little way.  We see low
sugar or diabetic jams etc prominently displayed for while. Then the
labels change to red, which is their secret code they aren't going to
restock the items.  Or they "display" them at foot level in a dark
corner. As they have said to me on occasions, "Only you and the other
guy bought them."  Am I on secret video or what?

Best wishes,

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Nev. - 24 Jan 2006 00:30 GMT
>  CER, closer economic relations?
>
> Is the loss of sauces with splenda permanent?

Yes, it seems to be.
I tended to blame this on the shop run by the official diabetic assoc,
rather than blaming you Kiwis.  I sometimes doubt their business
sense because they once stocked a range of sugar free jellies that
the supermarkets stocked, but the diabetic shop stocked a smaller
range at a higher price.

> I haven't been to the shops that sell them here for a while.

Maybe not enough people are buying them.

> The supermarkets are bastards in their own little way.

Aren't they just?

> We see low sugar or diabetic jams etc prominently displayed for while.
> Then the labels change to red, which is their secret code they aren't
> going to restock the items.

However, low sugar jams are one item the supermarkets still stock well
here.  The diabetic shop once had a strawberry jam that had a low 1%
sugar, but 59% carb.

Some time back I went to the manager of one chain store and complained
when they had stopped stocking a low cholesterol milk, and was told that
other people had complained.  The manager told me it was a head office
decision and he was trying to get it changed back again. He did get that
low cholesterol milk restored to the shelves, however, not long after that I
changed to skim milk because that was lower in sugar and carbs, and
maybe fat.

That store manager has been replaced by a younger one whom I went to
the other day and asked why the opposition had a much better variety of
sugar free soft drinks.  He told me would ask the soft drink rep why, but
the basic reason is that his store is not allocating enough shelf space to
carry a better variety.  It is interesting to note that the best selling
sugar
free drink, which they run out of each day, in the other store is one that
the first store does not appear to stock at all on their limited allocated
shelf space.

Years ago there was a Swiss Miss chocolate drink powder on the
shelves and I used to buy the low sugar and low carb variety until
Swiss Miss disappeared of the supermarket shelves.  Swiss Miss
has recently appeared on the shelves again, but naturally the low
sugar, low carb variety hasn't come back again.

Until recently we used to have our own nationally produced low
sugar, low carb chocolate powder drink on the supermarket
shelves, but the manufacturer has now replaced it with a high
sugar, high carb one.  I guess not enough people bought a low sugar,
low carb product. So I cannot blame the supermarkets for this one.

A fair few years ago I went into a health food shop and saw carob
blocks labelled "sugar free" so I went home and rang the health
dept, and the person who answered the phone told me he was a
diabetic and he would go and see the health shop people. I visited
the health shop a few days later and saw the "sugar free" on the
tags crossed out and replaced by "no added sugar".  The claim
had been made by the health shop people, not by the manufacturers.

When I was first diagnosed with diabetes, the endo recommended
a brand of tomato sauce, marked "low joule" which I think was
lower in sugar and carbs.  This eventually disappeared off the super
market shelves, but eventually came back on.

Thanks for all the info you search for and post.

Nev.
Quentin Grady - 22 Jan 2006 18:26 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Sun, 22 Jan 2006 05:54:00 -0500, Vicki Beausoleil
<VBeausoleil@netscape.net> wrote:

>Canned mackerel is incredibly inexpensive here. One large can makes a
>meal for the two of us at less than a dollar per person. I also prefer
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>Scrambled eggs and mackerel are yummy for breakfast.

G'day G'day Vicki,

Delighted to see someone else enjoys mackerel.  Frankly I can't see
why people get excited about tuna. Our supermarkets have rows of
tinned tuna, in oil, spring water and brine. Then tuna comes in cans
designed to disguise the taste or lack there of, of tuna; green pepper
corns, lemon grass, you name it.  

On the bottom shelves there are two brands of mackerel. It comes in
larger sized cans which are cheaper than the miniature tuna cans.

>Although your thread is aimed at T2s, there's no reason to believe the
>same doesn't apply to T1s. Chronic inflammation is a bad thing even if
>you're not diabetic.

Yes, I hadn't intended to be unkind to T1s and leave them out.  I do
approach issues concerning T1s with considerable caution. I'm not one
and so don't depend on getting the facts right for them.  That said, I
have noticed the suffering that is associated with arthritis and I'm
mindful of the recent article suggesting T1 diabetics have a ten-fold
greater risk of coronary heart disease than non-diabetics though they
can halve that with "tight" control.  Even the main stream medical
field is now acknowledging the importance of inflammation with their
recommendation to get CRP below 2 parts per million thanks to the
discovery that statins are anti-inflammatory and the business
opportunity this opens up.

In some respects we inherit the same needs.

1.  Get inflammation down.

2.  Get our LDL nice and fluffy.

3.  Avoid or reduce insulin resistance.

Omega-3 from fish oils tackle 1. and 2. simultaneously.  

2. might need some explanation. It is common knowledge that taking
about 5 grams of fish oil daily significantly reduces triglycerides.
Low HDL, high triglycerides is associated with small dense nasty LDL
with twice the killing risk of the big fluffy stuff.

>Vicki

Best wishes,
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New Zealand,       >#,#< [
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"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Julie Bove - 22 Jan 2006 19:51 GMT
> G'day G'day Vicki,
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> designed to disguise the taste or lack there of, of tuna; green pepper
> corns, lemon grass, you name it.

<snip>

I can't say that I'm excited about tuna, but it's the one fish I can eat on
occasion.  The flavor is not objectionable to me.  I only eat the plain
kind.  Not the flavored.  I used to think that I didn't like fish because I
hadn't been served any as a young child aside from canned tuna or salmon.  I
always hated the taste of salmon!  Then we moved to WA where fish is
popular.  Every Friday we had fish sticks at school.  They were always
served with mashed potatoes.  I found that I could manage to eat them by
covering them with the mashed potatoes.  Can't do that now though.  Too many
carbs.

I've tried other types of fish over the years.  I haven't liked any of it no
matter how it was prepared.  People have made fish for me using their
special recipe and were convinced I would love it!  I couldn't get beyond
the first bite.  Something about the smell, the taste and the texture just
turns my stomach.

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Jefferson - 23 Jan 2006 01:40 GMT
>>G'day G'day Vicki,
>>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> the first bite.  Something about the smell, the taste and the texture just
> turns my stomach.

You omitted an important part of Quentin's reply to Vicki.  That is that
fish oil is very good for reducing triglycerides.  When someone has
fatty liver such as you have mentioned in another post, you are missing
an important tool for lowering insulin resistance as well as treating
fatty liver disease (Nonalcoholic fatty liver disease - NAFLD.)  The
TG/HDL ratio is considered an indicator of insulin resistance.  I don't
of any other alternative except meds like statin or fibrates for
lowering triglycerides especially if one can not exercise to reduce weight.

Frank
Quentin Grady - 23 Jan 2006 18:53 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Sun, 22 Jan 2006 20:40:41 -0500, Jefferson
<croom1935@netscape.net> wrote:

>You omitted an important part of Quentin's reply to Vicki.  That is that
>fish oil is very good for reducing triglycerides.  When someone has
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
>Frank

G'day G'day Frank,

FWIIW, I take five fish oil capsule daily. I'm not fussy about brand
though I do check they are molecular filtered and prefer those that
are non-reflux though I don't experience problems.

Best wishes,
Signature

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Ricavito - 22 Jan 2006 20:44 GMT
> This post not CC'd by email
>  On Sun, 22 Jan 2006 05:54:00 -0500, Vicki Beausoleil
[quoted text clipped - 60 lines]
>
> http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Well, I'm with you guys on the mackerel, but in defense of tuna, it is
wonderful in its fresh state.  There are so many wonderful tuna
varieties--blue fin, yellow fin, skipjack, albacore--but here in the US
at least, they are commonly ruined by overcooking.  And it's expensive.
For me though, although I eat them on occasion, I am bothered by the
fact that all the catch methods are really problematic, even the so
called "dolphin safe" catch methods.  Tuna harvesters often have a lot
of side catch such as sea turtles, sea birds, etc. that are harmed when
the tuna is taken.  There's really no safe harvesting methods commonly
in place right now.

Salmon tastes great but from what I've learned here, there's not so
much value in the farm raised salmon that is cheap and widely available
in the western US.  And Alaskan wild salmon (line caught) is fairly
expensive.

So I'm with you guys on the mackrel.  I love the taste, especially
spanish mackarel prepared the Japanese way, but it is not cheap.
However, *canned* mackrel is cheap and plentifuly in the US.  Mackerel
are terrific spawners and they mature quickly, and furthermore I think
are usually caught by line and hook method, so it's an ecologically
safe bet to eat them IMHO.  My MIL has a great receipe for mackrel
cakes made with potato, and I think I will try and develop a BG
friendly version.

Thanks for the reminder!

ricaVito
Quentin Grady - 22 Jan 2006 22:19 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On 22 Jan 2006 12:44:15 -0800, "Ricavito"
<newsgroupreader@frontiernet.net> wrote:

>Well, I'm with you guys on the mackerel, but in defense of tuna, it is
>wonderful in its fresh state.  There are so many wonderful tuna
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>the tuna is taken.  There's really no safe harvesting methods commonly
>in place right now.

G'day G'day Ricavito,

My admiration for you as a person grows with every post of yours I
read.  I really appreciate you taking the time to put together your
posts and hope you will continue to do so.

BTW, I have some highly intelligent friends who ask me some
uncomfortably probing questions such, "If everyone who isn't allergic
to or food intolerant of fish, takes up your suggestion to eat more
fish, how will the stocks be sustained?"

>Salmon tastes great but from what I've learned here, there's not so
>much value in the farm raised salmon that is cheap and widely available
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>are usually caught by line and hook method, so it's an ecologically
>safe bet to eat them IMHO.  

Bottom trawling is much more devastating than the fishing industry
would like the general public to know.  Bottom trawling here, wipes
out the habitat for octopus and deep sea squid. The whales returning
from Antarctica starve.  It is hard to think that by eating certain
fish one is starving whales to death.  

Equally hard to take on board that some grouper are thirty years old.

Mackerel and herrings are likely candidates for more sustainable
oceans.

>My MIL has a great receipe for mackrel
>cakes made with potato, and I think I will try and develop a BG
>friendly version.

Well, fauxtato is a likely starting point.  Cauliflower has a safety
factor of five compared to potato.  Five cups of cauliflower has the
same carb content as one cup of potato.  The factor for pumpkin is
about three.  

>Thanks for the reminder!

That's all it takes for most thinking people.

>ricaVito

Best wishes,
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Ricavito - 22 Jan 2006 23:38 GMT
> This post not CC'd by email
>  On 22 Jan 2006 12:44:15 -0800, "Ricavito"
[quoted text clipped - 68 lines]
>
> http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Quentin, you are a kind man.  And a thought provoking one too!  I will
let you know how the califlower/pumpkin/mackerel cakes turn out :-)
Alan S - 23 Jan 2006 00:45 GMT
>> This post not CC'd by email
>>  On 22 Jan 2006 12:44:15 -0800, "Ricavito"
[quoted text clipped - 71 lines]
>Quentin, you are a kind man.  And a thought provoking one too!  I will
>let you know how the califlower/pumpkin/mackerel cakes turn out :-)

A minor clarification. When Quentin or other antipodeans
talk about pumpkin, you would probably be talking about a
form of squash.

http://tinyurl.com/8d3kv
http://tinyurl.com/9gj7o

Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia.
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Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.

Ricavito - 23 Jan 2006 01:52 GMT
> >> This post not CC'd by email
> >>  On 22 Jan 2006 12:44:15 -0800, "Ricavito"
[quoted text clipped - 82 lines]
> --
> Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.

Thanks Alan, I actually did know that because I follow the food threads
pretty closely
;-)      But actually, I was thinking that a bit of American "pumpkin"
puree might actually be tasty in the fish cakes, although probably
better with salmon than mackerel.  Not sure how it measures up on the
carb/glycemic scale however.  Certainly, califlower is an inspired
idea.  BTW, do you eat American "pumpkin" in the Antipodes?  

ricaVito
Alan S - 23 Jan 2006 04:42 GMT
>Thanks Alan, I actually did know that because I follow the food threads
>pretty closely
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
>ricaVito

Not that I'm aware - I've only ever seen them in movies
about Hallowe'en.

Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia.
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Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.

Chris J. - 23 Jan 2006 18:25 GMT
>A minor clarification. When Quentin or other antipodeans
>talk about pumpkin, you would probably be talking about a
>form of squash.

Ahhhh! Thanks for the clarification! I did not know that...

OK, so, is this all part of the Antipodean conspiracy? :-)
Ozgirl - 23 Jan 2006 20:30 GMT
>>A minor clarification. When Quentin or other antipodeans
>>talk about pumpkin, you would probably be talking about a
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> OK, so, is this all part of the Antipodean conspiracy? :-)

Our squash generally look like tiny little pumpkins, about
an 1 1/2 inches diameter, usually yellow or green and look
like a zucchini inside, low carb. Our pumpkins are orange
and dense, not watery looking on the inside and have a
greenish grey skin.
Nev. - 24 Jan 2006 00:41 GMT
Our pumpkins are orange
> and dense, not watery looking on the inside and have a
> greenish grey skin.

Actually I like Japanese pumpkins best.

Nev.
Alan S - 24 Jan 2006 02:09 GMT
>Our pumpkins are orange
>> and dense, not watery looking on the inside and have a
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>Nev.

I've wondered about the name. They're "Jap" pumpkins, but
I'm not sure they're Japanese.

Cheers, Alan, T2, Australia.
Signature

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Quentin Grady - 23 Jan 2006 18:59 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On 22 Jan 2006 15:38:12 -0800, "Ricavito"
<newsgroupreader@frontiernet.net> wrote:

>Quentin, you are a kind man.

G'day G'day Ricavito,

It sometimes provides dilemmas.  On the one hand there is dealing with
a disease that doesn't go away.  On the other care of the environment.

> And a thought provoking one too!  I will
>let you know how the califlower/pumpkin/mackerel cakes turn out :-)

I'd be delighted to hear. The Indians have recipes which involve a mix
of vegetables eg spinach and parsnip cooked in separate pots then
assembled in a fry pan to finish with a dash of garam masala for
fragrance.  I might explore that as the mackerel is pre-cooked.

Best wishes,

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Ricavito - 24 Jan 2006 03:02 GMT
> This post not CC'd by email
>  On 22 Jan 2006 15:38:12 -0800, "Ricavito"
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
>
> http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Well, yes that dilemma is one's world conscience wrestling with one's
survival pragmatism :-)

But in mentioning your kindness, I was talking about your interactions
and expressions of appreciation for others.  It is a pleasure to
converse with someone such as yourself who seems always to find the joy
in life.

Well, I'm working on the recipe--in my own way.  Usually, I "try out"
recipes by suggesting them to my husband since he is the cook in the
family. So I've planted the seed :-)
John38 - 23 Jan 2006 02:35 GMT
[snip]

>  So I'm with you guys on the mackrel.  I love the taste, especially
>  spanish mackarel prepared the Japanese way, but it is not cheap.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>  cakes made with potato, and I think I will try and develop a BG
>  friendly version.

Try stuffing mackerel with chopped fresh chilis & grated fresh ginger &
lemon, cook at searing heat under the grill or a BBQ, serve with lentils
or a bit of rice.

Signature

John38 - t1 (LADA) since 2003 : DAFNE (glargine/aspart)

Quentin Grady - 23 Jan 2006 18:23 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Mon, 23 Jan 2006 02:35:19 GMT, John38 <dev-null@reiteration.net>
wrote:

>On 22 Jan 2006 12:44:15 -0800, Ricavito
>
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>lemon, cook at searing heat under the grill or a BBQ, serve with lentils
>or a bit of rice.

G'day G'day John38,

 The ginger, chili, lemon combo sounds great.  I tracked down the
ingredients that go into Orcona's Sharkbite.  They tell me it's
diabetic unfriendly since it contains sugar. However the yellow/orange
colour comes from a mix of yellow and orange bell peppers with a few
red Thai chilis thrown in. It is fabulous with grilled flounder.

Lentils look like a good choice for T2s. I wonder if any have adopted
the Japanese solution of having 50:50 rice:pearl barley to replace
rice.

Best wishes,

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                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Nicky - 24 Jan 2006 19:25 GMT
> Lentils look like a good choice for T2s. I wonder if any have adopted
> the Japanese solution of having 50:50 rice:pearl barley to replace
> rice.

Wild rice looks a good option too. I had a little serve for lunch yesterday
with no ill effects, and I'm planning on some rice-and-tuna for supper later
in the week!

Dana Carpender had a good-looking wild rice and cauli recipe on her
newsletter from hold the toast this week.

Nicky.

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Quentin Grady - 25 Jan 2006 05:02 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 19:25:30 -0000, "Nicky"
<ukc802466929@btconnect.com> wrote:

>Wild rice looks a good option too. I had a little serve for lunch yesterday
>with no ill effects, and I'm planning on some rice-and-tuna for supper later
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
>Nicky.

G'day G'day Nicky,

Wild rice might work for another reason ... its dear.
We have therefore learnt to associate it with elegance and small
portions.  Oh, there is another reason.  Somewhere I read of the
benefits of red and black rice.  Most anthocyanins come from fruit but
there are blue potatoes and black rice.

Best wishes,
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                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

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Ricavito - 24 Jan 2006 22:52 GMT
> On 22 Jan 2006 12:44:15 -0800, Ricavito
>
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> --
> John38 - t1 (LADA) since 2003 : DAFNE (glargine/aspart)

Thanks John, that sounds tasty.  I love ginger grated on fresh mackerel
Michelle - 22 Jan 2006 20:15 GMT
Hi Quentin,

Thanks for the in-depth info on the Omega 3s and 6s.

Actually, we are pretty big fish eaters at my house--for westerners.
Salmon and tuna once per week, and some form of white fish.  The white
fish, although not rich in omega 3's like the salmon and tuna, doesn't
seem to have any downside the way red meat does.  The problem we have
in maintaining this more fish-laden diet is finding wild salmon; the
farm raised is full of PCB's--at least that which is sold in the U.S.
Maybe it's different in your neck of the woods?  Also, we learned to
stay away from the albacore tuna because of the mercury.  Instead we
use "chunk light" which supposedly comes from a smaller species of
tuna.  Since it's not at the top of the food chain, it doesn't absorb
as much mercury, in theory.  It's a rather large conundrum that two of
the foods that should be best for people has become so polluted.

Michelle
Quentin Grady - 22 Jan 2006 22:24 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On 22 Jan 2006 12:15:49 -0800, "Michelle" <bookbug2005@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Hi Quentin,
>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>farm raised is full of PCB's--at least that which is sold in the U.S.
>Maybe it's different in your neck of the woods?

G'day G'day Michelle,

Absolutely.  In Canterbury they have salmon farms fed from glacial
melt.  Much of their product is sold to the Japanese who are most
demanding in their food standards.

> Also, we learned to
>stay away from the albacore tuna because of the mercury.  Instead we
>use "chunk light" which supposedly comes from a smaller species of
>tuna.  Since it's not at the top of the food chain, it doesn't absorb
>as much mercury, in theory.  It's a rather large conundrum that two of
>the foods that should be best for people has become so polluted.

Karma perhaps, except it never quite seems to go full circle and get
those responsible for the pollution.

Water quality is highly political in NZ as collecting seafood is
covered by indigenous rights.

>Michelle

Best wishes,
Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
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Michelle - 23 Jan 2006 02:04 GMT
Hello Quentin,

>Absolutely.  In Canterbury they have salmon farms fed from glacial
>melt.  Much of their product is sold to the Japanese who are most
>demanding in their food standards.

Glad to hear that salmon is farmed properly somewhere.  :-)  Aha, now
if they'd just send some of it this way.

>Karma perhaps, except it never quite seems to go full circle and get
>those responsible for the pollution.

Boy, isn't that the truth?  Of course, we currently have an
administration that finds the bottom line is more important than
protecting the environment.  Incredibly short-sighted.  But when you're
born with a silver spoon in your mouth, I guess you don't expect that
you or your descendents will ever have to worry about squirming in the
muck.

Michelle
Quentin Grady - 23 Jan 2006 18:48 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On 22 Jan 2006 18:04:39 -0800, "Michelle" <bookbug2005@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Hello Quentin,
>
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
>Michelle

G'day G'day Michelle,

While democracy is the best option it does leave us with some awful
decision making. People are such short term thinkers.

I have some interesting conversations with people from time to time
about being happy with what one has.  I'm lucky enough to have much
good fortune in my life and am enjoying it to the fullest.

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Michelle - 23 Jan 2006 19:28 GMT
Quentin said:
>While democracy is the best option it does leave us with some awful
>decision making. People are such short term thinkers.

>I have some interesting conversations with people from time to time
>about being happy with what one has.  I'm lucky enough to have much
>good fortune in my life and am enjoying it to the fullest.

Hi Quentin,

Totally agree with you--Democracy isn't perfect, but it's the best
system we've got.  :-)  Here, the scales (not the fishy ones) tend to
teeter back and forth between the liberals and conservatives over a
period of years.  Guess it keeps either group from doing too much harm.
;-)  And if you take the loooong view, we could all live in a time
where we had to worry about dying from scarlet fever and whether or not
we had enough food to survive the winter.  We're lucky to be able to
complain about the more esoteric aspects of our lives.

And by the way, congrats on starting your book!  Now that you've
announced it, we'll all pester you on its progress and keep you
motivated.  ;-)

Michelle
Quentin Grady - 23 Jan 2006 23:27 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On 23 Jan 2006 11:28:43 -0800, "Michelle" <bookbug2005@gmail.com>
wrote:

>And by the way, congrats on starting your book!  Now that you've
>announced it, we'll all pester you on its progress and keep you
>motivated.  ;-)
>
>Michelle

G'day G'day Michelle,

It won't be easy.  I have also to complete teacher's guides for a
project.  It pays the bills but doesn't grab the passion in quite the
same way.  

To be honest I'd probably be happier with a newspaper column answering
questions from readers on nutrition.

Best wishes,
Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Nicky - 24 Jan 2006 19:29 GMT
> To be honest I'd probably be happier with a newspaper column answering
> questions from readers on nutrition.

Have you approached any editors with the idea? You can get exactly the right
names and know which newspaper or magazine are most likely to buy it by
looking up your local version of the Writers and Artists Handbook in the
library.

Nicky.

Signature

A1c 10.5/5.4/<6  T2 DX 05/2004
1g Metformin, 100ug Thyroxine
95/73/72Kg

Quentin Grady - 25 Jan 2006 05:04 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 19:29:20 -0000, "Nicky"
<ukc802466929@btconnect.com> wrote:

>> To be honest I'd probably be happier with a newspaper column answering
>> questions from readers on nutrition.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
>Nicky.

G'day G'day Nicky,

Thanks.  I don't have a degree in nutrition. It is chemistry.
I'm not a pretty face.  They like slim young things that think
wrinkles are something to be found in unironed sheets.

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Nicky - 25 Jan 2006 13:15 GMT
> Thanks.  I don't have a degree in nutrition. It is chemistry.
> I'm not a pretty face.  They like slim young things that think
> wrinkles are something to be found in unironed sheets.

Chicken! Readers generally prefer some maturity in an advisor, and editors
are well aware of that. Quality is judged by itself, you don't need formal
qualifications to write a column. Send off some examples from your website,
and let them judge for themselves.

If you want to play outside your own patch, here's the details for SAGA
magazine in the UK - a lovely market, the demographics are intelligent,
educated 50+, they print both short and long pieces.

Chris McLaughin                 (contributing editor, Health)
The Saga Building
Middleburg Square
Folkestone
Kent CT20 1AZ
UK

General email is editor@saga.co.uk

Website is www.saga.co.uk/magazine

I would suggest that you approach them with a short covering letter
proposing a series of articles on nutrition, with your existing pieces
included as an example of your work.

Nicky.

Signature

A1c 10.5/5.4/<6  T2 DX 05/2004
1g Metformin, 100ug Thyroxine
95/73/72Kg

Quentin Grady - 25 Jan 2006 21:19 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 13:15:24 -0000, "Nicky"
<ukc802466929@btconnect.com> wrote:

>> Thanks.  I don't have a degree in nutrition. It is chemistry.
>> I'm not a pretty face.  They like slim young things that think
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
>
>Nicky.

G'day G'day Nicky,

I'm just being touchy because I've seen who has the column in the
local newspaper.  It is sponsored by a local pharmacy and the lass who
writes it looks like she belongs in the beautician counter.

Best wishes,
Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Nicky - 26 Jan 2006 20:50 GMT
> I'm just being touchy because I've seen who has the column in the
> local newspaper.  It is sponsored by a local pharmacy and the lass who
> writes it looks like she belongs in the beautician counter.

Hmmm... You sure she's not using a piccie from 30 years ago? : )

Nicky.

Signature

A1c 10.5/5.4/<6  T2 DX 05/2004
1g Metformin, 100ug Thyroxine
95/73/72Kg

Andrea2 - 22 Jan 2006 22:04 GMT
>G'day G'day Folks,
>
[quoted text clipped - 47 lines]
>
>Best wishes,

I am presently taking a supplement that contains DHA-396mg, EPA-488mg,
DPA-76mg, Other omega3-40mg. In your research, have you found any
benefits of DPA?

I also eat a lot of fish like, salmon, herring and mackerel. I have
even come to like the pickled herring my boyfriend loves. It makes a
tasty snack but does contain carbs that must be counted.

Andrea2
Type 2
Quentin Grady - 23 Jan 2006 18:29 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Sun, 22 Jan 2006 14:04:00 -0800, Andrea2
<andrea6192001nospam@yahoo.com> wrote:

>I am presently taking a supplement that contains DHA-396mg, EPA-488mg,
>DPA-76mg, Other omega3-40mg. In your research, have you found any
>benefits of DPA?

G'day G'day Andrea2,

Only that a combination with all three is closer to what is found in
mammals.  DPA is one of the intermediates between EPA and DHA and it
is thought that we fill the gap ourselves.  Not sure if this is so.

>I also eat a lot of fish like, salmon, herring and mackerel. I have
>even come to like the pickled herring my boyfriend loves. It makes a
>tasty snack but does contain carbs that must be counted.
>
>Andrea2

Good for you.  Herring scored highly in being low in arachidonic acid
and high in the EPA and DHA which out to be good new for anyone with
an obvious inflammatory disease, which might mean anyone who reads
asd.

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Chris J. - 23 Jan 2006 05:42 GMT
>G'day G'day Folks,

       
>Fish              AA          EPA        DHA     Index 1     Index 2
>in 100g           mg/100g      mg/100g    mg/100g   EPA/AA  (EPA+DHA)/AA
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>Trout             30          150        430        5.0        19.3
>Carp             190          210         80        1.1         1.5

Quentin, could I ask how you got this information? I haven't seen it
broken down that way in the USDA search, which is what I normally use.

Thanks!
Quentin Grady - 23 Jan 2006 18:44 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Sun, 22 Jan 2006 22:42:51 -0700, Chris J. <chris@noadress.com>
wrote:

>>G'day G'day Folks,
>
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
>Thanks!

G'day G'day Chris J,

I was searching http://scholar.google.com using the search string
"iodine content" "cod liver oil" when I came across,

http://www.agrar.hu-berlin.de/nutztier/tz/SeitenRechts/lehre&forschung/module/Fo
od_quality.pdf


http://tinyurl.com/cjwft

They provided the table.  I then transferred it to Excel format which
is boring to do but the boredom passes. A simple cut and paste dumps
it all in one column. Then I used the spreadsheet to calculate the
ratios.  

Anyone any better ideas for performing such transfers into Excel
quickly?    

Then their is the dull business of replacing the tabs with spaces to
present the material for posting.  BTW, if the table doesn't look
right, then it is probable that aren't using the internet standard of
a fixed-spacing font such as Courier.

If you'd like the Excel version please email.

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Chris J. - 24 Jan 2006 06:30 GMT
>I was searching http://scholar.google.com using the search string
>"iodine content" "cod liver oil" when I came across,
>
>http://www.agrar.hu-berlin.de/nutztier/tz/SeitenRechts/lehre&forschung/module/Fo
od_quality.pdf

>
>http://tinyurl.com/cjwft

Thanks, I enjoyed the article, and highly recommend it. To anyone
reading this, it's main focus is on the importance of nutrition in
meat animals, BUT, it's got all kinds of statistics and nutritional
data, including some by world region.  

>They provided the table.  I then transferred it to Excel format which
>is boring to do but the boredom passes. A simple cut and paste dumps
>it all in one column. Then I used the spreadsheet to calculate the
>ratios.  

>Anyone any better ideas for performing such transfers into Excel
>quickly?    

I do some corporate consulting, so I'll ask around.

>Then their is the dull business of replacing the tabs with spaces to
>present the material for posting.  BTW, if the table doesn't look
>right, then it is probable that aren't using the internet standard of
>a fixed-spacing font such as Courier.

BTW, do you have a macro-capable word processor, such as Word? That
might make it easy to replace tabs automaticly. Or, just use any that
has a find-replace function, and replace all tabs with spaces.

>If you'd like the Excel version please email.

Please do send it! (I've sent an e-mail).
Thanks!!!
 
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