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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / November 2005

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Folic Acid Supplements are a Health Hazard, John McDougall, MD: Murray 2005.11.01

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Rich Murray - 01 Nov 2005 08:38 GMT
***********************************************************

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aspartameNM/message/1241
Folic Acid Supplements are a Health Hazard, John McDougall, MD:
Murray 2005.11.01

http://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2005nl/oct/051000folic.htm

The McDougall Newsletter, October 2005, Vol. 4, No. 10

Folic Acid Supplements are a Health Hazard

Stop Folic Acid Pills Now
Limit Your Intake of Fortified Flour Products (in the USA)
Don't Lower Your Homocysteine Levels with Supplements

Taking supplements with as little as 0.8 mg/day of folic acid
has been shown to increase your risk of dying of heart disease and cancer,
according to the results of the first large randomized treatment trial
to carefully examine this issue. 1  [ 0.8 mg = 800 micrograms ]

The Norwegian Vitamin Trial (NORVIT) of 3,749 patients,
who were followed for 3.5 years was designed to show the benefits of
taking supplements - but the results were contrary to expectations.

Folic acid supplementation was found to lower homocysteine levels
by 28%., but to increase relative risks of heart attack, stroke, and death
by 20%, along with a more than a 30% increase in cancer.
Those with the highest baseline homocysteine levels (13 umol/L or greater)
suffered the most harm from taking supplements of folic acid.

Homocysteine Is Only a Risk Factor

Elevated levels of the amino acid homocysteine, found with a blood test,
have been associated with many common diseases, including heart disease,
strokes, venous thrombosis, dementia, and Alzheimer's disease.
The commonly made, but incorrect, assumption is that these diseases are
caused by elevated homocysteine in the body and
the solution is to give medications (vitamin pills) to fix the problem.

However, homocysteine is not the problem.
Elevated homocysteine is only a sign that the body is becoming diseased
and at risk of a tragedy.  We call this type of sign a "risk factor" -
it predicts future risk, but it is not a disease in itself  -
no one dies of an elevated homocysteine level -
most commonly, clogged heart arteries are the actual cause of death
for those people showing this sign.

So what is the real meaning of this risk factor?

Homocysteine levels increase when people eat more meat and
fewer vegetables. These same dietary habits cause other signs
(risk factors) - indicating a higher chance of death and disability - to
rise;
like cholesterol, triglycerides, uric acid, blood sugar, lipoprotein a,
C-reactive protein, blood pressure, and body weight.
Fortunately, correcting the poor diet heals the underlying disease,
and at the same time the risk factors show improvement.

Folic Acid Supplements Overload the Body

Consuming more than 0.2 mg of folic acid daily floods the bloodstream
with this vitamin, overloading the metabolic capacities of the body,
causing imbalances that increase the risk of heart disease and cancer. 2

Folic acid is a synthetic version of the natural vitamin, folate,
found in plant foods.  Folate from food is essential for good health.

Folic acid sold in capsules is a medication at best and a toxin at worst.
When given in doses of 0.8 mg it will lower homocysteine by about 30%
(3 to 4 umol/L). 3  Higher doses then 0.08 mg have no greater benefit
for lowering blood levels of homocysteine.

Folic Acid Mandated for U.S. Cereal Products

January 1998 was the mandatory deadline for the fortification of
grain products with folic acid in the United States.
Folic acid was added to flours used to make bread, rolls, and crackers.
Another hefty source of this supplement comes from enriched
(vitamin-added) "ready-to-eat cereals."

Since 1998, folic acid intake has increased significantly in every segment
of the U.S. population with the average additional intake of 0.22 mg/day.
3,4
Remember, as little is 0.2 mg causes overloads and imbalances
with an increased risk of illness.
A significant segment of the USA population is now consuming
over 1 mg/day of folic acid daily - an amount found by the NORVIT study
to increase the risk of heart disease and cancer.

Doctors Harm Patients with Supplements

Cardiologists are fond of recommending vitamin pills to treat elevated
homocysteine in hopes of preventing further heart disease in their patients.
One of the most commonly prescribed preparations is called Foltx  -
a combination of 2.5 mg of folic Acid, 25 mg of vitamin B6, and
2 mg of vitamin B12.  A recent study showed a similar preparation
reduced the homocysteine levels of patients with a history of stroke
by 2 units (umol/L), but found no difference in risk of future strokes,
heart attacks, or death compared to a control group. 5

Another recent study showing folic acid actually causes the heart arteries
to close should cause doctors to mend their prescribing practices.
After six months of supplementation in 636 heart patients with stents
(stents are wire-mesh supports placed in the coronary arteries during
angioplasty), the Folate After Coronary Intervention Trial found those
patients taking folic acid had significantly more narrowing of the arteries,
more artery closure (restenosis), and more major adverse cardiac events
compared to those taking placebo - the exact opposite of what investigators
had expected to find. 6,7  As expected, the homocysteine blood levels
were reduced by the above treatment.  The authors recommended that the
routine administration of folate treatment not be advocated at the present
time.

Even with all this condemning evidence, you can easily find experts
(many working with vitamin companies) trying to convince the unaware buyer
that high-dose folic acid supplementation - as much as 5 mg/day -
will be good for their heart and blood vessels. 8

Appropriate Response to Homocysteine in Your Blood

The main motivation behind fortification of flours and taking supplemental
vitamins has been to reduce the occurrence of serious birth defects,
especially the occurrence of neural tube defects (NTDs).
The effort seems to be working a little - since the onset of fortification
there has been a 19% decrease in the incidence of NTDs.
Unfortunately, these same widespread recommendations to take folic acid
may be causing more heart disease and cancer.  So, what to do?

All that money and effort now spent on supplementation with the hope
of reducing birth defects, heart disease, and cancer should be directed
towards educational programs to teach people to eat more legumes,
vegetables, and fruits - the plentiful and safe sources of folic acid.
(The name folic comes from the word foliage, which refers to plants.)
When packaged in the plant, folic acid is never harmful and always
beneficial.
Further efforts should be made towards making sure all people have ready
access to plant-foods.

Because of the overwhelming evidence that the vitamin supplements people
are buying are a serious health hazard, I propose these products be labeled
with bold warnings like:
"Taking Vitamin E can raise your risk of dying,"
"Vitamin A (retinol) can damage your bones and cause birth defects,"
"Beta carotene may raise your risk of cancer," and
"Folic acid causes heart disease."

All supplement packages should also tell people that vitamins and other
nutrients are best obtained from healthy vegetable foods.
For more information on the hazards of supplementation,
please read from my newsletter archives the following:

August 2003: Plants, not Pills, for Vitamins and Minerals:
www.nealhendrickson.com/mcdougall/030800puvitaminsandminerals.htm

November 2004: Vitamins Do Not Prevent Cancer and May Increase
Likelihood of Death: How Supplements Can Make You Sicker
www.nealhendrickson.com/mcdougall/2004nl/041100pufavorite5.htm

July 2005: Neither Aspirin Nor Vitamin E Will Save Women
www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2005nl/july/050700fav5.htm

February 2004:  Treating Homocysteine with Vitamins Fails
www.nealhendrickson.com/mcdougall/040200pufavorite5.htm

References:

1)  Bonaa KH. NORVIT: Randomized trial of homocysteine-lowering
with B-vitamins for secondary prevention of cardiovascular disease
after acute myocardial infarction.
Program and Abstracts from the
European Society of Cardiology Congress 2005;
September 3-7, 2005; Stockholm, Sweden. Hot Line II.

2)  Quinlivan EP, Gregory JF 3rd. Effect of food fortification on folic acid
intake in the United States.  Am J Clin Nutr. 2003 Jan; 77(1): 221-5.

3)  Homocysteine Lowering Trailists Collaboration. Dose-dependent
effects of folic acid on blood concentrations of homocysteine:
a meta-analysis of the randomized trials.
Am J Clin Nutr. 2005 Oct; 82(4): 806-812.

4) Choumenkovitch SF, Selhub J, Wilson PW, Rader JI,
Rosenberg IH, Jacques PF.
Folic acid intake from fortification in United States exceeds predictions.
J Nutr. 2002 Sep; 132(9): 2792-8.

5) Toole JF .  Lowering homocysteine in patients with ischemic stroke
to prevent recurrent stroke, myocardial infarction, and death:
the Vitamin Intervention for Stroke Prevention (VISP)
randomized controlled trial.  JAMA. 2004 Feb 4; 291(5): 565-75.

6) Lange H.
Folate After Coronary Intervention Trial" (FACIT).
www.accitalia.it/congress_centre/meeting_int/detail.asp?acr_trial=FACIT
Lange H.
The folate after coronary intervention trial (FACIT).
Scientific presentation at the 52nd Annual Scientific Sessions
of the American College of Cardiology, Chicago, March 30th, 2003.

7)  Schnyder G, Roffi M, Flammer Y, et al.
Effects of homocysteine-lowering therapy on restenosis
after percutaneous coronary intervention for narrowings
in small coronary arteries. Am J Cardiol 2003; 91: 1265-1269.

8) LifeExtension:
www.lef.org/magazine/mag2005/mar2005_report_folic
_01.htm?source=Google&key=folic_acid_supplements&WT.srch=1

You may subscribe to this free McDougall Newsletter at
www.drmcdougall.com

Newsletter archive

2005 John McDougall All Rights Reserved
***********************************************************

Tuesday, November 1, 2005

Any unsuspected source of methanol, which the body always quickly and
largely turns into formaldehyde and then formic acid, must be monitored,
especially for high responsibility occupations, often with night shifts,
such as pilots and nuclear reactor operators.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aspartameNM/message/1237
ubiquitous potent uncontrolled co-factors in nutrition research are
formaldehyde from wood and tobacco smoke and many sources, including
from methanol in dark wines and liquors, in pectins in fruits and
vegetables, and in aspartame: Murray 2005.10.26

As a medical layman, I suggest that evidence mandates immediate exploration
of the role of these ubiquitious, potent formaldehyde sources as co-factors
in epidemiology, research, diagnosis, and treatment in a wide variety of
disorders.

Folic acid, from fruits and vegetables, plays a role by powerfully
protecting against methanol (formaldehyde) toxicity.
Supplements are proven to be very unsafe sources.

Many common drugs, such as aspirin, interfere with folic acid,
as do some mutations in relevant enzymes.

The majority of aspartame reactors are female.

In mutual service, Rich Murray
***********************************************************

Rich Murray, MA Room For All rmforall@comcast.net
505-501-2298 1943 Otowi Road Santa Fe, New Mexico 87505

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aspartameNM/messages
group with 146 members, 1,241 posts in a public, searchable archive
http://RoomForAll.blogspot.com

Dark wines and liquors, as well as aspartame, provide
similar levels of methanol, above 100 mg daily, for
long-term heavy users, 2 L daily, about 6 cans.

Methanol is inevitably largely turned into formaldehyde,
and thence largely into formic acid.
It is the major cause of the dreaded symptoms of "next
morning" hangover.

Fully 11% of aspartame is methanol -- 1,120 mg aspartame
in 2 L diet soda, almost six 12-oz cans, gives 123 mg
methanol (wood alcohol). If 30% of the methanol is turned
into formaldehyde, the amount of formaldehyde, 37 mg,
is 18.5 times the USA EPA limit for daily formaldehyde in
drinking water, 2.0 mg in 2 L average daily drinking water.
***********************************************************

http://www.vrg.org/  The Vegetarian Resource Group   vrg@vrg.org

http://www.vegsource.com  extensive vegan information

http://www.drmcdougall.com    practical, delicious healthy diet guidance

http://www.vegsource.com/articles/kradjian_milk.htm
Robert Kradjian MD Discusses Milk

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aspartameNM/message/971
Joel Fuhrman critique of Atkins diet in "Eat To Live":
Murray 2003.03.01 rmforall

http://www.hyp.ac.uk/cash/index.htm
Consensus Action on Salt and Health

What Rich Murray eats:

Avoid all products with aspartame and MSG.
Substitute stevia (at health food stores).

Gradually reduce alcohol, caffeine (coffee, cocoa, and teas), meat, fish,
eggs, milk, butter, and cheese,  hydrogenated oils, trans fats, white bread,
food additives and colors, sugar, high fructose corn syrup, fluoride, city
water, salt and sodium (  < 1,000 mg daily ).

Enjoy organic rice, potatoes, vegetables, fruits, beans, garlic, tumeric,
with modest use of soy products, walnuts, almonds, flax seeds,
almond butter, sprouted grain breads, flax seed and olive oils, chili sauce,
4-8 1,000 mg fish oil capsules,
and fill your jugs with deionized or distilled water.
***********************************************************
Simm Webb - 01 Nov 2005 14:38 GMT
> ***********************************************************
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aspartameNM/message/1241
> Folic Acid Supplements are a Health Hazard, John McDougall, MD:
> Murray 2005.11.01

If it's from him, then it is definitely a lie.
Wooly - 01 Nov 2005 15:20 GMT
>If it's from him, then it is definitely a lie.

Funny subject line.  My OB/GYN was adamant that I start taking a folic
acid supplement months before I planned to start trying to get
pregnant.  Some silly business about potential neural tube defects in
the fetus and such...

+++++++++++++

Reply to the list as I do not publish an email address to USENET.
This practice has cut my spam by more than 95%.  
Of course, I did have to abandon a perfectly good email account...
BJ in Texas - 01 Nov 2005 16:39 GMT
|| Rich Murray wrote:
||| ***********************************************************
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
||
|| If it's from him, then it is definitely a lie.

Hey, with Rich's track record it has to be kookiness.

Signature

"We reject the condescending notion that freedom will not grow
in the Middle East, or that there is any region of the world
that cannot support democracy." - Colin Powell, U. S. Secretary
of State

Peanutjake - 01 Nov 2005 17:10 GMT
Years ago the FDA prohibited the addition of Folic Acid to vitamin pills.
This was done because the use of Folic Acid hides the presence of Pernicious
Anemia, a very dangerous condition. More recently the FDA added back the
Folic Acid to vitamin pills because lack of Folic Acid causes birth defects
and other problems.

PJ
Cuz - 01 Nov 2005 17:29 GMT
|| Years ago the FDA prohibited the addition of Folic Acid to
|| vitamin pills. This was done because the use of Folic Acid
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
||
|| PJ

Maybe that is Rich's problem, his mom avoided Folic Acid.. :-)

Signature

"The leading cause of death among fashion models is falling
through street grates." -- Dave Barry

Nico Kadel-Garcia - 02 Nov 2005 01:00 GMT
> || Years ago the FDA prohibited the addition of Folic Acid to
> || vitamin pills. This was done because the use of Folic Acid
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> Maybe that is Rich's problem, his mom avoidedhe
ic Acid.. :-)

No, I think she avoided her own species....
Vicki Beausoleil - 02 Nov 2005 02:30 GMT
> > || Years ago the FDA prohibited the addition of Folic Acid to
> > || vitamin pills. This was done because the use of Folic Acid
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
> No, I think she avoided her own species....

He wasn't born - he was congealed.

Vicki
RK - 01 Nov 2005 17:32 GMT
| Years ago the FDA prohibited the addition of Folic Acid to vitamin pills.
| This was done because the use of Folic Acid hides the presence of Pernicious
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
|
| PJ

Oddly my last blood work showed I was seriously lacking Folic Acid
but not Animic.  I do take Folic Acid suppliments... haven't bothered me
any.. don't know if they're helping either just yet.

RK
Quentin Grady - 01 Nov 2005 19:44 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Tue, 01 Nov 2005 08:38:57 -0500, Simm Webb <edvanhuffel@csx.net>
wrote:

>> ***********************************************************
>>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>If it's from him, then it is definitely a lie.

May I make the suggestion that it would better serve the needs of
diabetics if we continue to discuss folic acid in a thread that wasn't
discussing John McDougall. IMHO we need to thrash out fact from
possible fiction created by wrongful interpretation in a less
emotionally charged atmosphere.

G'day G'day Simm et al,

The annoying point is that a few of his interpretations which are
presented as facts are most likely true as of themselves though quite
probably not presenting the complete picture.

For instance it has been found that using high dose folic acid
supplements by itself to lower homocysteine levels does not reduce the
death rate.  Using folic acid by itself has always struck me as dumb
as it is well known the B group vitamins work synergistically. The
more sensible path would seem to have been to use folic acid in lower
doses in conjunction with Vit B6 and Vit B12. What the current
situation is with regard to folic acid, B6 and B12 would need looking
up the latest research. Where our lives depend on making such an
assessment accurately IMHO it is better to rely on mainstream expert
opinion or even our own collective opinion than on someone with known
extreme agendas.

I haven't seen any dramatic warnings relating to folic acid coming
through Medscape.  For this and several other reasons I'm very
skeptical about folic acid supplements raising cancer rates.  One
notable other reason is that some research done long ago showed folic
acid supplements lowered the rate of bowel cancer. What is well known
is that folks with a high vegetable and hence high folate intake tend
to have low cancer rates.

Is this another instance where vitamin supplements even those
regularly prescribed by mainstream medical authorities have gotten it
wrong?  

That is the point we need to thrash out without distraction.

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Rich Murray - 02 Nov 2005 07:43 GMT
***********************************************************
http://www.medpagetoday.com/PrimaryCare/AlternativeMedicine/tb/1674

ESC: Healthy Heart Helpers Get Buffeted at Cardiology Meeting
By Peggy Peck, Managing Editor, MedPage Today
Reviewed by Zalman S. Agus, MD; Emeritus Professor at the University of
Pennsylvania School of Medicine.
September 05, 2005
Also covered by: BBC News, Indianapolis Star, Newsday

MedPage Today Action Points

These studies found no benefit for vitamin B to prevent heart attacks.

Advise interested patients that according to this preliminary study
homocysteine does not appear to be a reliable biomarker for cardiovascular
risk.

Tell patients that while omega-3-fatty acid did not demonstrate a
significant
benefit for patients with implanted cardioverter defibrillators, there was
no
evidence that it is harmful.

These studies were published as an abstract and presented orally as
late-breaking reports at a conference. These data and conclusions should be
considered to be preliminary as they have not yet been reviewed and
published in a peer-reviewed publication.

Review

STOCKHOLM, Sept. 5-High-dose vitamin B may do more harm than good
for heart disease, and homocysteine, billed as a heart disease risk factor,
isn't
one after all, researchers reported here today.

"The homocysteine hypothesis is dead," declared Kaare Bonaa, M.D., of the
University of Tromso in Trondheim, Norway. In terms of heart disease risk,
"homocysteine is an innocent bystander," he said at the European Society of
Cardiology Congress 2005.

And that wasn't the only bad news for believers in simple helpers in heart
disease and prevention. Fish oil capsules did not reduce cardiac events in
patients with implanted cardioverter defibrillators (ICDs), a team of Dutch
researchers reported.

In the vitamin B-homocysteine arena, Dr. Bonaa and colleagues enrolled
3,749 myocardial infarction patients in the Norwegian Vitamin Trial
(NORVIT). Patients were randomized to high dose vitamin B, high dose folic
acid, or placebo for up to three years.

As expected the high doses of vitamin B lowered circulating homocysteine by
30%, but rather than decreasing heart attack risk, "there was a 20% increase
in risk of cardiovascular events," Dr. Bonaa said.

In the past high levels of homocysteine have been associated with heart
disease, but attempts to treat the patients by lowering levels of the
hormone,
especially with folic acid and other B vitamins, have had disappointing
outcomes.

In NORVIT, the participants took doses of 40 mg of Vitamin B-6 or 0.8 mg
of folic acid per day. Dr. Bonaa said that the doses are prescribed at that
level in Europe and represent two tablets of the vitamins that are sold
over-the-counter in the United States. [ 0.8 mg = 800 micrograms ]

He said that the risk of suffering heart attacks or strokes was no different
if
the patient was taking either vitamin or placebo. However, patients taking
both vitamins had about a 20% increased risk of having a heart attack or
stroke (P=0.029).

In addition there was a non-significant trend for an increased risk of
cancer
among those on the high doses of vitamins.

"The results of the NORVIT trial are important because they tell doctors
that
prescribing high doses of B vitamins will not prevent heart disease or
stroke,"
Dr. Bonaa said. "B vitamins should be prescribed only to patients who have
B-vitamin deficiency diseases."

He noted that in the trial measurements of homocysteine were made before
and during treatment and showed that the vitamins dramatically reduced
levels
of homocysteine. However, the lowering effect did not translate into a
clinical
benefit.

Raymond Gibbons M.D., professor of medicine at the Mayo Clinic, who is
president-elect of the American Heart Association, was not surprised by the
negative results for vitamin B. "Taking something with no proven beneficial
effect is a bad idea," he said.

He said that in addition to possible harm that could occur to the person
taking
such substances as vitamins, taking the substances "wastes resources and
most patients can only take so many pills." Moreover, he boasted that in his
career in cardiology, he has "never ordered a homocysteine test."

But others said it is too early to count out either vitamin B or
homocysteine.
For example, Lampros Michalis, M.D., of the University of Ioannina, Greece,
who moderated a press conference where the study was discussed,
said "every time we have tried to find a connection between homocysteine
and lowering it with vitamins we never find anything. But it [homocysteine]
is
so appealing that a natural substance such as a vitamin that can reduce
homocysteine levels that investigators will again try to see if there is a
connection."

In the second study, which was also presented at today's late-breaking
clinical
trials session, researchers with the Study on Omega-3 Fatty acid and
ventricular Arrhythmia (SOFA) reported that omega-3 fatty acids contained
in fish oil capsules reduced arrhythmias by 15% in patients with implanted
cardioverter defibrillators, as measured by the firing of the devices, but
that
reduction was not statistically significant.

Ingeborg Brouwer, Ph.D., project manager at the Wageningen Center for
Food Sciences in The Netherlands, said, "The SOFA trial does not indicate a
strong beneficial effect of n-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids from fish on
life-threatening cardiac arrhythmia."

But she said that patients with a history of myocardial infarction "may
still
benefit from fish oil." Dr. Brouwer said that in investigating subgroups in
the
trial she noticed that patients who had a previous MI appeared to show a
trend toward a protective effect (P=.086). She said that group of patients
might be subjects for another trial.

But even if fish oil didn't help, she said the study confirmed
that it doesn't hurt either.

The researchers enrolled 546 patients and randomized 273 subjects to
receive fish oil while the other 273 received a common cooking oil with no
known cardiac effects, Dr. Brouwer said. After 12 months of monitoring,
30% of the patients taking fish oil had experienced a heart attack or stroke
compared with 33% of those taking the placebo oil.
That difference was not significant (P=0.24).

Related articles:

Fish Oil Supplements May Be Risky to Defibrillator Patients
AHA: Certain Types of Fish More Heart-Healthy Than White Fish
Primary source: European Society of Cardiology Congress 2005

Source reference:

Hot Line II Bonaa K.H. "NORVIT: Randomized trial of homocysteine-lowering
B-vitamins for secondary prevention of cardiovascular disease after acute
myocardial infarction"
Brouwer IA "SOFA: Study on Omega-3 Fatty acid and ventricular arrhythmia"
***********************************************************

Tuesday, November 1, 2005

Any unsuspected source of methanol, which the body always quickly and
largely turns into formaldehyde and then formic acid, must be monitored,
especially for high responsibility occupations, often with night shifts,
such as pilots and nuclear reactor operators.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aspartameNM/message/1237
ubiquitous potent uncontrolled co-factors in nutrition research are
formaldehyde from wood and tobacco smoke and many sources, including
from methanol in dark wines and liquors, in pectins in fruits and
vegetables, and in aspartame: Murray 2005.10.26

As a medical layman, I suggest that evidence mandates immediate exploration
of the role of these ubiquitious, potent formaldehyde sources as co-factors
in epidemiology, research, diagnosis, and treatment in a wide variety of
disorders.

Folic acid, from fruits and vegetables, plays a role by powerfully
protecting against methanol (formaldehyde) toxicity.
Supplements are proven to be very unsafe sources.

Many common drugs, such as aspirin, interfere with folic acid,
as do some mutations in relevant enzymes.

The majority of aspartame reactors are female.

In mutual service, Rich Murray
***********************************************************

Rich Murray, MA Room For All rmforall@comcast.net
505-501-2298 1943 Otowi Road Santa Fe, New Mexico 87505

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aspartameNM/messages
group with 146 members, 1,241 posts in a public, searchable archive
http://RoomForAll.blogspot.com

Dark wines and liquors, as well as aspartame, provide
similar levels of methanol, above 100 mg daily, for
long-term heavy users, 2 L daily, about 6 cans.

Methanol is inevitably largely turned into formaldehyde,
and thence largely into formic acid.
It is the major cause of the dreaded symptoms of "next
morning" hangover.

Fully 11% of aspartame is methanol -- 1,120 mg aspartame
in 2 L diet soda, almost six 12-oz cans, gives 123 mg
methanol (wood alcohol). If 30% of the methanol is turned
into formaldehyde, the amount of formaldehyde, 37 mg,
is 18.5 times the USA EPA limit for daily formaldehyde in
drinking water, 2.0 mg in 2 L average daily drinking water.
***********************************************************

Tidsskr Nor Laegeforen. 2002 Aug 10; 122(18): 1783-7.
Comment in:
Tidsskr Nor Laegeforen. 2002 Aug 10;122(18):1765.
Tidsskr Nor Laegeforen. 2002 Sep 30;122(23):2317.
[An alternative hypothesis explaining the gender differences in risk of
coronary heart disease]
[Article in Norwegian]
Bonaa KH.
Hjertemedisinsk avdeling, St. Olavs Hospital, 7006 Trondheim.
kbonaa@hotmail.com

One of the most interesting aspects of coronary heart disease epidemiology
is the gender difference: in all age groups women have lower risk of
myocardial infarction compared to men.
Epidemiological observations and results of recent controlled clinical
trials suggest that it is not oestrogen that protects women.
In this paper an alternative hypothesis is suggested:
Men are at increased risk of coronary death and myocardial infarction
because they are more prone than women to develop lipid-loaded, unstable
coronary atherosclerotic plaques.
This may be caused by gender differences in plasma levels of high density
lipoprotein cholesterol, which is influenced by the blood testosterone
level.
Publication Types: Review  Review, Tutorial  PMID: 12362689
***********************************************************

> This post not CC'd by email
>
[quoted text clipped - 45 lines]
>
> Best wishes,

***********************************************************
Quentin Grady - 02 Nov 2005 09:39 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Wed, 02 Nov 2005 07:44:22 +1300, Quentin Grady
<quentin@paradise.net.nz> wrote:

>For this and several other reasons I'm very
>skeptical about folic acid supplements raising cancer rates.  One
>notable other reason is that some research done long ago showed folic
>acid supplements lowered the rate of bowel cancer. What is well known
>is that folks with a high vegetable and hence high folate intake tend
>to have low cancer rates.

For a tediously long but relatively easy read on the issues involving
folic acid supplementation and cancer rates you might like the
following.

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/reprint/80/5/1123

The skinny is that folic acid supplementation reduces the rates of
some cancers, some of them quite dramatically.  HOWEVER and it is the
big HOWEVER folic acid supplementation will support some existing
cancers. This isn't exactly big news as folic acid blocking drugs are
sometimes used to fight cancers.

The writer makes the suggestion that a similar situation might have
explained the beta-carotene supplementation debacle with smokers.
Smokers were more likely to have pre-existing cancers and the
beta-carotene supplementation may have helped the cancers grow.
Frankly I don't quite believe that is anything like the whole answer
because the survival rate was higher amongst those smokers who had
higher natural beta-carotene at the begriming of the study.

Best wishes,
Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

Quentin Grady - 02 Nov 2005 06:10 GMT
This post not CC'd by email
On Tue, 01 Nov 2005 08:38:57 -0500, Simm Webb <edvanhuffel@csx.net>
wrote:

>> ***********************************************************
>>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>If it's from him, then it is definitely a lie.

G'day G'day Folks,

 I wish to make a clear distinction between Rich Murray and Dr John
McDougall, MD because IMHO it is important.

Rich Murray pedals anti-aspartame propaganda and is widely regarded
by most everyone as a kook.

Dr John McDougall is a quite different kettle of fish.  He is a
dietary researcher with affiliations to the Seventh Day Adventist
church.  Whether this influences his research perspective is a matter
of conjecture.  He advocates diets that appear to have 80% carbs by
calories.  That aligns him with folks like Pritikin (the father) who
was and Ornish who is also a serious minded researcher.  

If Rich Murray had been the original source of the conclusion that
folic acid supplements were dangerous then I'd happily dismiss the
claim as highly unlikely.

With Dr John McDougall as the original source instant dismissal seems
less advisable.  OK, Dr McDougall has his biases which would
reasonably include promoting eating legumes and other vegetables.
Attacking supplementing with folic acid, with or without Vit B6 and
Vit 12 could be part and parcel of promoting a vegetarian diet.  Put
simply, the attack on folic acid supplementation could be nothing more
than an attempt to dissuade folks from dodging the issue of not eating
"enough" vegetables.  Well it could be.  Doesn't mean it has to be.

Personally I don't think Dr McDougall is quite that shallow ... close
maybe. People sometimes get like that when they become imbued with a
cause. There ARE reasons why it is preferable to get folate from
vegetables where that is possible. For instance high dose folic acid
supplementation doesn't reduce the death rate as expected.  

Why bother to make this post?

Well, IMHO, Rich Murray is hijacking Dr McDougall's name for some
purpose; perhaps to support the anti-aspartame cause, perhaps to give
him credibility he (Rich Murray) doesn't deserve.  Frankly I feel
sorry for Dr McDougall.  I cannot imagine for one moment that Dr
McDougall gave Rich Murray permission to use his name for this
promotion. I mean who could possible be so desperate to want to
associate themselves with someone widely regarded as a kook except
perhaps other aspartame kooks.  

If I am wrong I'll overhaul my imagination. <grin>

Best wishes,

Signature

Quentin Grady       ^  ^  /
New Zealand,       >#,#< [
                   / \ /\    
"... and the blind dog was leading."

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

 
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