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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Diabetes / October 2005

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Tofu and Zucchini Lasagna

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Uncle Enrico - 23 Oct 2005 05:04 GMT
Been mulling over this idea for a low-carb, low-cholesterol lasagna.
Instead of Mozzarella and Ricotta cheese, I'm thinking of a mixture of
firm tofu, parmesan cheese, garlic flakes, splenda and salt. Instead of
lasagna noodles, I'm imagining thin slices of zucchini.  The sauce would
be the usual tomato concoction with maybe ground turkey.  Anybody ever
try such a thing?   Seems to me someone here mentioned a zucchini
lasagna they put together.
Julie Bove - 23 Oct 2005 06:53 GMT
> Been mulling over this idea for a low-carb, low-cholesterol lasagna.
> Instead of Mozzarella and Ricotta cheese, I'm thinking of a mixture of
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> try such a thing?   Seems to me someone here mentioned a zucchini
> lasagna they put together.

Just wondering why you would use the tofu?  And why do you want something
that is low cholesterol?  The cholesterol that you eat doesn't affect your
cholesterol level.  Personally, I try to avoid soy.  I would also avoid
ground turkey since it tends to be rather fatty.  I prefer my lasagna
without meat in it.  But if I were to use meat, I'd use lean ground beef.

When I make lasagna, I use a layer of sautéed zucchini and onions in place
of one layer of noodles.  I also use ricotta cheese mixed with an egg to
make it more firm, and also some added mozzarella, parmesan or whatever kind
of Italian cheese I happen to have.  To this I add plenty of chopped parsley
and spinach.  I've even used cottage cheese in a pinch and that works well
too. For the sauce, I add mushrooms, onions, peppers and carrots to the
tomato sauce.  I don't mind a chunky sauce, but I find that kids are much
more likely to eat this if whipped with an immersion blender after it's
cooked.

I might even consider using two vegetable layers and one of pasta, but
personally I'd still use a little pasta.  I am not overly fond of zucchini.
I can eat some, but not too much of it.

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pinecone - 23 Oct 2005 08:18 GMT
A premium brand of lowfat cottage cheese put through the blender is a
good substitute if you're out of ricotta.

Broiled eggplant or zucchini works great in lasagna (sliced lengthwise
and watched closely, since it cooks quickly).  It browns better if you
spray it with a little cooking spray or oil.
Uncle Enrico - 23 Oct 2005 15:12 GMT
> Just wondering why you would use the tofu?  And why do you want something
> that is low cholesterol?  The cholesterol that you eat doesn't affect your
> cholesterol level.  

Thanks for the info on zucchini slices, Julie. I think it was you who
gave me this idea some time ago.

I used to think Tofu was some New Age BS food until I started
experimenting with it and found it was a great low-fat, high protein
alternative to dairy products. Soy products are on so many
cancer-fighting food lists from reputable sources, I'm inclined to use
them. There are a few soy detractors but they don't have the credentials
to be worthy of serious notice.

I'm not totally sure we know one way or the other about cholesterol in
food, but I believe that vegetable fats are safer than animal fats though.
Evelyn Ruut - 23 Oct 2005 16:07 GMT
>> Just wondering why you would use the tofu?  And why do you want something
>> that is low cholesterol?  The cholesterol that you eat doesn't affect
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> I'm not totally sure we know one way or the other about cholesterol in
> food, but I believe that vegetable fats are safer than animal fats though.

Soy products are excellent unless you literally live on the stuff everyday
all day.

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Best Regards,
Evelyn

(to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')

Julie Bove - 23 Oct 2005 21:25 GMT
> Soy products are excellent unless you literally live on the stuff everyday
> all day.

When I was a vegetarian, I ate a lot of soy, believing it was good for me.
I had veggie burgers, frozen foods from the health food store made with soy
cheese, canned soy beans, Miso soup, stir fries with soy sauce, and roasted
soy nuts.  And for snacks, Tiger's Milk bars.

I developed a thyroid problem when pregnant.  I knew at some point I
probably would have a thyroid problem since it was rampant on both sides of
the family.

When I read more and more about the connection to soy and thyroid problems,
I made an effort to avoid it.  I do use a margarine that contains soy, but I
do not use it very often.  Maybe once a week if that.  Mainly I use olive
oil since Angela can have neither margarine or butter.  It seems that soy is
one food that is next to impossible to avoid unless you really must, like my
daughter with the soy allergy.

Now, I am not on thyroid meds.  The thyroid problem has gone away.  Now of
course I can't prove that soy has anything to do with it or not, but for me,
it seems like something I need to avoid.

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Uncle Enrico - 24 Oct 2005 05:20 GMT
 > When I read more and more about the connection to soy and thyroid
problems,
> I made an effort to avoid it.  

> Now, I am not on thyroid meds.  The thyroid problem has gone away.  Now of
> course I can't prove that soy has anything to do with it or not, but for me,
> it seems like something I need to avoid.

What were your thyroid symptoms?
Julie Bove - 24 Oct 2005 07:23 GMT
>   > When I read more and more about the connection to soy and thyroid
> problems,
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> What were your thyroid symptoms?

When I was pregnant, I was falling asleep all the time and simply could not
stay awake.  I also developed weight problems.  I once lost 12 pounds in a
week, despite being on a strict diet for the gestational diabetes I had.  I
was seeing an Endo. who was monitoring my TSH, T3 and T4.  He was baffled as
to what the problem was because one week I'd be hyperthyroid and the next
I'd be hypothyroid.  He said further testing needed to be done, but they'd
have to wait until after I had the baby because radiation needed to be used.
I was also very anemic.  This too would explain the sleepiness.  Eventually,
I settled into what appeared to by hypothyroid and I was given 100 mcg of
Synthroid.

After I had the baby, I moved to another state.  There was no Endo. in the
city where I lived.  I asked my GP to refer me to someone and she said that
I didn't need an Endo.  I didn't know it at the time, but I was getting
really bad medical care. I had diabetes that went undiagnosed.  At this
time, I was having muscle aches and pains.  My muscles would lock up, making
it hard for me to walk.  My body temperature was wacky.  If I got chilled,
I'd stay chilled for hours!  I would also overheat at the drop of a hat.  I
got to where I could only wear lightweight cotton clothes, but I kept a pile
of blankets nearby in case I started to get chilled.  I was sleeping all the
time.  Angela was a baby then.  I'll fall asleep on the floor.  My muscles
were so tight and achy that I couldn't get up the stairs to bed.  We had to
buy a little crib for the living room.  I had to supplement her diet with
formula because I wasn't producing enough milk.  Now I know this was due to
the thyroid problem.  I also had ringing in my ears.

I  finally found an Endo. and he said everything was fine with my thyroid.
Again, bad medical care.  He was out to have an operation and I saw his son
(another Endo.) and a colleague.  I was distraught about all the pain I was
in and not being able to walk.  They said it was probably Fibromyalgia.
Eventually the Endo. came back and told me that he noticed a connection
between Fibromyalgia and thyroid problems.

The pain continued.  I pushed myself hard and was finally able to walk a few
feet at a time.  I learned all sorts of coping mechanisms so I could drive
myself to the grocery store or drug store and make it down a few aisles
without collapsing on the floor.

My problems continued.  Now I was overheating constantly.  The slightest
activity made  me drip with sweat.  I was exhausted, yet I couldn't sleep
properly.  I felt hyped up all the time.  Emotionally I was a loose cannon.
I'd get angry over the slightest little thing, yet I couldn't figure out
why. I was going into hypos (BG) almost all the time.  I was always in the
bathroom all the time.  I'd eat food and it would rush right through me. I
was eating tons more food than I should have been, trying to keep my BG up.
And I was losing weight faster than I should have been.  Exercise was
difficult.  I'd work out with my weights only to have my muscles turn hard
as rocks. I developed all sorts of skin problems.  I would go into brain
fogs where I couldn't think straight or I'd forget what I was doing.

Found myself another GP who ordered an MRI thinking I might have MS.  She is
the one who discovered that I was running very hyper thyroid!  I took this
information back to my Endo. because the GP refused to lower my dose of
Synthroid.  The Endo. had pooh poohed this until he listened to my heart.
Then he freaked!  Said my heart was beating far too rapidly and I could die
if it wasn't treated.  Told me to stop the Synthroid and also the
Desipramine (anti-depressant) he had given to me in the hopes of stopping
the constant pain I was in.  He gave me another pill to slow down my heart
but I had to quit taking it due to BP so low I'd faint.

I can't remember how many days after I stopped the Synthroid but all of a
sudden I felt good again!  I could sleep at night.  Much less pain.  I
wasn't overheating.  The food wasn't rushing through me.  Was not going hypo
(BG) all the time.  But the Endo. insisted that I start up the Synthroid
again, this time taking only 88 mcg.  Within an hour after taking that first
pill, I felt it.  It felt as though it was slamming into my heart.  I
immediately felt all jittery and hyper like I'd had a whole pot of coffee in
a short period of time.  Sweat poured out of me, and I became shaky from
hypo (BG).  I was on the phone to the Endo. again.  This time he reluctantly
cut me back to 75 mcg.  But told me to not take any for a couple of days to
get it all out of my system.

I did not want to take that pill!  I feared I would begin to feel bad again.
And I did, only this time not right away.  The symptoms came back gradually
and soon I felt as bad as I did before.  I kept telling the Endo. this but
he insisted I was fine and I needed the Synthroid since I was overweight.
In case you don't know this, taking a thyroid pill will not cause you to
lose weight.  This man was either very stupid, very misinformed, or
something.  But I could find no other Endo. anywhere nearby who spoke either
took my insurance or spoke English as a native language.  Meanwhile I was
seeing other specialists who did not speak English as a native language and
got little to no care from them.  I was also diagnosed by a Neurologist as
having neuropathy caused by diabetes.  This was blamed for most of my
symptoms.  Then my GP quit the practice.

We moved to another state.  Found a new GP right away and he was horrified
to see that I was running very hyperthyroid from being given too much
Levoxyl.  At this point I had been switched from Synthroid to Levoxyl.  My
insurance would no longer cover the Synthroid.  He cut my dose back and
hooked me up with an Endo.  I began to feel a little better.  Stopped losing
weight.  Not long after, I began seeing a Dermatologist for my various skin
problems and also a Vascular Surgeon.  Turns out I had bad veins in my legs.
Began to feel better still.

Now I wasn't overheating as often.  But I still was.  And while my pain had
lessened, it was still there.

We moved again to another state.  This time, the Endo. discovered that I was
still running hyperthyroid and cut me back to the lowest possible dose of
Levoxyl.  I felt pretty good for a while, but then felt jittery, hopped up,
overheating, not sleeping well at all, having brain fogs and hypos (BG).  I
brought this up to my GP who assured me that my thyroid was fine.  He showed
me my labs, but they were meaningless since they didn't show the range of
what normal should be.  He also refused to test anything other than my TSH.
So back to the Endo. I went.  I told him I was feeling hyperthyroid so he
tested me and then called me a few days later.  Told me I was indeed
hyperthyroid and no longer needed the meds.  Felt much better after I
stopped them.

Now I will admit that I still have a whole lot wrong with me, medically.  I
am disabled.  A lot of my symptoms overlap each other.  But now my body
temperature is fine.  I don't get cold when others aren't.  I rarely ever
overheat and when I do, I am not dripping with sweat from head to toe like I
used to.  My muscles rarely get tight and when they do, there's usually a
reason.  My ears do not ring.  All of my skin problems have cleared up.  I
do not feel jittery or hypo.  I can stay awake now without dropping off the
sleep the minute I sit down.  I rarely ever have hypos (BG).

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Evelyn Ruut - 23 Oct 2005 14:00 GMT
> Been mulling over this idea for a low-carb, low-cholesterol lasagna.
> Instead of Mozzarella and Ricotta cheese, I'm thinking of a mixture of
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> such a thing?   Seems to me someone here mentioned a zucchini lasagna they
> put together.

I used soft tofu instead of ricotta cheese, years ago.   It worked just fine
and you could barely tell the difference.  Even the kids ate it with no
problem.   I blended the tofu with a couple of eggs, some grated cheese and
parsley, and it even looked just like ricotta filling.   The good part is
that it is almost all protein and quite low fat.

I made lasagna last week using ground turkey cooked into the sauce and that
worked out well also.

When I make lasagna now, I use the Barilla no boil noodles.  They are very
thin and don't mess up my bg's too much.   I use rather a lot of filling
between the layers, make the sauce like a thick "stew" with the ground
turkey, and lots of cheeses.

I have heard of people using layers of eggplant slices, or zucchini slices
instead of noodles also, but when I tried it, it was a bit too mushy for my
taste.   I am sure it could be done though.

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Best Regards,
Evelyn

(to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')

Uncle Enrico - 23 Oct 2005 15:01 GMT
> I used soft tofu instead of ricotta cheese, years ago.   It worked just fine
> and you could barely tell the difference.  Even the kids ate it with no
> problem.   I blended the tofu with a couple of eggs, some grated cheese and
> parsley, and it even looked just like ricotta filling.   The good part is
> that it is almost all protein and quite low fat.

> When I make lasagna now, I use the Barilla no boil noodles.  They are very
> thin and don't mess up my bg's too much.  

Thanks for the tofu report. One of my favorite vegetarian restaurants
uses tofu for cheese and it's great.

I'm curious about no-boil noodles. Are these fresh rather than dried?
Evelyn Ruut - 23 Oct 2005 16:06 GMT
>> I used soft tofu instead of ricotta cheese, years ago.   It worked just
>> fine and you could barely tell the difference.  Even the kids ate it with
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
> I'm curious about no-boil noodles. Are these fresh rather than dried?

No, they are dried thin sheets, and sold in a small box.   For my big
lasagna pan, three of them will cover the bottom of the pan perfectly.
Leave lots of room on all sides, as they expand during baking or standing
(that is why you don't have to pre-cook them).

I have tried all the different brands, and the Barilla ones stand up the
best, are the thinnest, and taste the best too.    You may want to put the
first layer down into an extra "wet" layer of plain sauce first.

I also top it with plain sauce, since I don't want the meat chunks on the
top or the bottom layer, only in the middle layers.    The recipe on the
Barilla box is as authentic as I have found anywhere, in case you need some
guidance with the proportions.

For that top and bottom sauce layer, I usually open a small jar of any kind
of commercial sauce, but the middle layers get my extra meaty "stew" sauce.

I have also found that I prefer the boxed Barilla lasagna sheets to be
superior to the fresh pasta sheets they sell in my local Italian grocery,
since they are thinner and therefore less carby.

Signature

Best Regards,
Evelyn

(to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')

Mimi - 23 Oct 2005 19:42 GMT
I have used the wonton noodle in place of lasagna noodles with great
success. I think it's even better. But I'm not sure how much carb is in them
(made them before I was into carb counting). But they did turn out really
well.

Mimi

>> I used soft tofu instead of ricotta cheese, years ago.   It worked just
>> fine and you could barely tell the difference.  Even the kids ate it with
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
> I'm curious about no-boil noodles. Are these fresh rather than dried?
Uncle Enrico - 23 Oct 2005 21:30 GMT
> I have used the wonton noodle in place of lasagna noodles with great
> success. I think it's even better. But I'm not sure how much carb is in them
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>>
>>I'm curious about no-boil noodles. Are these fresh rather than dried?

Before diabetes, I used to buy Filo dough for Greek style lasagna-like
dishes. Filo dough is a super thin sheet of rolled dough, rather broad
and is found in the frozen food section of most stores. That sort of
thing is off my menu these days. It's like Won Ton but covers much more
territory.
Julie Bove - 24 Oct 2005 02:45 GMT
> Before diabetes, I used to buy Filo dough for Greek style lasagna-like
> dishes. Filo dough is a super thin sheet of rolled dough, rather broad
> and is found in the frozen food section of most stores. That sort of
> thing is off my menu these days. It's like Won Ton but covers much more
> territory.

I too used to use a lot of Filo prior to diabetes.  Now, I use it
occasionally for special desserts.  The carb count is not bad if you eat
only one sheet of it.  Simply grease a custard cup and sort drape the dough
inside, allowing it to fold over on itself and crumble up a bit.  Bake it
until brown and fill with your favorite sugar free pudding or pie filling.
Sliced baked apples with cinnamon work nicely for this.  The end result is a
lower carb tart of sorts.

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