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Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / November 2007

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how to proceed with failed root canal

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mpearl055@gmail.com - 15 Oct 2007 03:13 GMT
Hi, and a preemptive thanks for taking a look and responding...

Some context:

I had a large cavity at the back of my molar (had been right in front
of the wisdom tooth). I went to a dentist I don't normally go to and
they did the procedure. They then put a crown on it. Six or 12 months
later I went to my regular dentist whose x-rays showed that the crown
was not properly fitted, leaving a gap through which bacteria could
reach the tooth. I went to the original dentist who plucked off the
crown, filled in that space with some material, and sent me on my way.
I had thought it odd that they could do it that way and my thoughts
were confirmed when, an hour after leaving the dentist, the crown
cracked when I was eating lunch. The dentist did it the right way the
2nd time around and had a new crown fitted. He noted some irritation
of the gums and gave me a prescription for that.

A year later, back at my regular dentist, I'm told there's an
infection (10mm + pocket at that tooth). He sends me to an
endodontist. She sees on the x-ray that there are two bits of
instruments left in the canals...one is deep and can't be plucked. The
other is near the top and probably can be retrived (in the
endodontist's estimation). She said it was unclear if the canal with
the instrument at the top was "packed." She also said it could be--
though she saw no indication--a cracked tooth. Anyhow, she gave me two
choices...try another root canal--the endodontist would perform--or
have an implant. The root canal option would at least test whether the
extractable instrument is causing the infection. If we get that out
and it goes away...I'd be ok. I have crappy insurance, so I'm looking
at $800 for the root canal, which might not work. Or, $2500 or so for
the implant and new crown. Perhaps more.

So, if you've stayed with me this long...here are my questions:

1. is it reasonable for me to go back to the dentist who performed the
original root canal and ask them to try again (with no charge)? I know
root canals sometimes fail...but I don't know what the custom is when
they do.

2. are there any other options for how to proceed?
Zzzdentist@dentalminds.com - 15 Oct 2007 07:56 GMT
On Oct 14, 8:13 pm, "mpearl...@gmail.com" <mpearl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> So, if you've stayed with me this long...here are my questions:
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> 2. are there any other options for how to proceed?

Oooh I probably wouldn't go back to the original dentist. You might
see if they are willing to reimburse you some funds (ie. cost of
original root canal) to go towards having the specialist retreat the
tooth.

If the endodontist thinks that there's a good chance that the tooth
can be retreated successfully and that the 10 mm pocket will clear up,
you could try to have it retreated.  You would be looking at possibly
needing a new crown if the old one doesn't hold together after the
retreatment.  Did the endodontist feel that it was worth trying?

One other option is extraction and a convenient bridge.

Zzzdentist
www.dentalminds.com
mpearl055@gmail.com - 15 Oct 2007 16:37 GMT
How common is it for patients in these circumstances to ask--and
actually get--reimbursement of some funds? What would my "argument"
be?

The endodontist said it COULD work by trying to re-do the root canal.
She said it was likely that she could get one of the instrument
remnants out. The unknowns were: was the other instrument causing
infection? is the tooth broken? was the canal packed, as it should
have been. She said the risk was that it doesn't work and then I'm out
an additional $800 for the root canal....

On Oct 15, 2:56 am, Zzzdent...@dentalminds.com wrote:
> On Oct 14, 8:13 pm, "mpearl...@gmail.com" <mpearl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
>
> Zzzdentistwww.dentalminds.com
Amatus Cremona - 15 Oct 2007 18:20 GMT
Separated instruments in canal spaces do not necessary mean anything more
than a less than perfect appearance on the x-ray image.  If the tooth is
failing and separated instruments are found, it is sometimes tried (removal
of the pieces) as a first  line of attack.  However, most failed RCT (in
this modern era) are due to tooth fractures un-related to the RCT itself.

Signature

/

Amatus

/

> How common is it for patients in these circumstances to ask--and
> actually get--reimbursement of some funds? What would my "argument"
[quoted text clipped - 33 lines]
>>
>> Zzzdentistwww.dentalminds.com
Zzzdentist@dentalminds.com - 16 Oct 2007 05:06 GMT
On Oct 15, 9:37 am, "mpearl...@gmail.com" <mpearl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> How common is it for patients in these circumstances to ask--and
> actually get--reimbursement of some funds? What would my "argument"
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> have been. She said the risk was that it doesn't work and then I'm out
> an additional $800 for the root canal....

It really depends on the practitioner whether they will help you out.
If a patient of mine called me up and informed me that they had to see
an endodontist because of a failing root canal that I did, I'd be more
than happy to reimburse them the fee for the RCT towards the
retreatment if the cause was directly related to what I did.  It
doesn't happen very often so I think for the goodwill, it's not worth
keeping money for something I did that ended up not lasting a long
time for the patient.

You could tell the office staff about how much the retreatment is
going to cost you, and that you could have the endodontist forward her
findings to them to verify it if they wish.  They might only offer a
credit, but maybe ask if they could transfer the fee for the failing
root canal to the specialist to offset your costs because of the $800
hardship to you.

Usually if there is no hope or the chances are pretty bad, an
endodontist will tell you outright that an extraction is the best
option.  When they suggest that they could try doing the retreatment,
my impression is that there may still be a chance that it might work.
I don't know your endodontist nor your case details so it's like
asking some guy on the street whether you should go ahead with having
that heart transplant.  ;-)  You really have to decide whether you
want to spend the money and save your natural tooth or look at the
alternatives.

Also, talk with your dentist and ask his opinion.  He knows you, your
tooth, the specialist, and he can talk with the endodontist to find
out more if needed.  He probably can help you decide better than a
bunch of strangers here.  He's there for you, and you paid money to
see him.  Get him involved in helping you decide.

I wish we could get the endodontist on the line at sci.med.dentistry
and get the low down.  Sometimes the endodontist will lay out the
risks and complications facing you, and only after working on the
tooth a bit can they better judge what the outcome will be.  That one
irretrievable, separated instrument portion does worry me.

If you could get some funds back from the original dentist, it may
help your decision especially if say the retreatment then only cost
you $200 or $100 for example, wouldn't it?

Regarding fractures causing most root canal failures in modern times,
I'm not sure would agree with that 100% in my area at least.
Certainly it does happen often, but I find that other common causes
can be due to leaking coronal restorations, endodontic misadventures,
over and under fills, and hidden unobturated canals.

Zzzdentist
www.dentalminds.com
Newbie - 08 Nov 2007 22:21 GMT
>One other option is extraction and a convenient bridge.
>
>Zzzdentist

What if the OP wants an *inconvenient* bridge ?
Zzzdentist@dentalminds.com - 10 Nov 2007 07:33 GMT
> >One other option is extraction and a convenient bridge.
>
> >Zzzdentist
>
> What if the OP wants an *inconvenient* bridge ?

Well if they want that, they can try to go into the dental office
unannounced on Friday afternoon demanding to be seen right away to
have a bridge prepped right that instant.   ;-)

I actually meant *conventional* bridge, but you know how the
mentalmind does sometimes wander.  :-)

Zzzdentist, asleep at the drill and apparently the keyboard
www.dentalminds.com
Newbie@bix.nex - 10 Nov 2007 17:52 GMT
>> >One other option is extraction and a convenient bridge.
>>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>unannounced on Friday afternoon demanding to be seen right away to
>have a bridge prepped right that instant.   ;-)

As long as they got ca$h and are paying up-front....
no problemo mi amigo !
We can fit you in !!!  ;^/]

Personally don't work on Friday afternoon though.

>I actually meant *conventional* bridge, but you know how the
>mentalmind does sometimes wander.  :-)

>Zzzdentist, asleep at the drill and apparently the keyboard

Oh, now I get it.
Zzzzzz....

First thought you were a ZZTop fan. <yukyuk>

Yer a good egg Zz
scott21230@gmail.com - 15 Oct 2007 16:17 GMT
> and it goes away...I'd be ok. I have crappy insurance, so I'm looking
> at $800 for the root canal, which might not work. Or, $2500 or so for
> the implant and new crown. Perhaps more.

On a molar?  It's going to be $2500 just for the implant and more for
the crown.
 
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