 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / May 2007Pomegranate for Dentistry: from "Sham vs. Wham: The Health Insider"
Today's feature from "Sham vs. Wham: The Health Insider" is a story about Pomegranate being used in an unusual dental clinical trial. This lowly plant keeps coming on strong. Read more at http://shamvswham.blogspot.com/, a website featuring daily health and nutrition news and views. Only if you promise to stay here and discuss it after I read it.  Signature/ Amatus / > Today's feature from "Sham vs. Wham: The Health Insider" is a story > about Pomegranate being used in an unusual dental clinical trial. This > lowly plant keeps coming on strong. Read more at > http://shamvswham.blogspot.com/, > a website featuring daily health and nutrition news and views. You know most spammers are 'hit and run'. >Only if you promise to stay here and discuss it after I read it. > You know most spammers are 'hit and run'. > > >Only if you promise to stay here and discuss it after I read it. I'd be delighted to discuss this with you anytime you'd like. I read your discussion quite often, having family in the dentistry business. I'm more of a scientist and businessman myself. By the way, there wasn't a spam element in the post, and I don't appreciate that comment, Mr. or Ms. "Newbie." Thanks, D. We get a fair number of posters hitting the newsgroup looking to either sell stuff or lure people to a web-site which either charges for downloads, or sells stuff less obviously. therefore we are rather skeptical at times. Tell us a bit about your group and the study, please. Also, re-post the link Signature/ Amatus / >> You know most spammers are 'hit and run'. >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > D. Amatus, I post reviews of clinical trials, that fall into the "Sham" (bad, unproven results) or "Wham" (good, proven results). In this discussion about Pomegranate, the authors of this trial (dentists from Brazil) used a Pomegranate based product with patients in a controlled clinical study comparing it with chlorhexidine. Pomegranate turns out to be as effective as the nasty chemical we all have learned to hate. No side effects such as teeth staining or loss of sensation in the mouth. Just another "win" for Pomegranate. You asked for the link. When you read the site at http://shamvswham.blogspot.com/, please remember that the original research or the abstracts of most items I discuss are linked to the headline of that day's post, so you can find more reading on the same topic. regards, D. > We get a fair number of posters hitting the newsgroup looking to either sell > stuff or lure people to a web-site which either charges for downloads, or [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > > D. Amatus, Here's a link for heallthcare professionals that I just found which has a number of links to full-text articles about the research done on Pomegranate. On my first pass, I did not see the Pomegranate for Plaque trial, but there are so many others there of interest from a general interest category (that fruit is amazing). I'm posting this to the article as a PS in the comments section. Anyone is welcome to post commentary on Sham vs. Wham, D. Here's the link: http://www.pomwonderful.com/the_science.html > We get a fair number of posters hitting the newsgroup looking to either sell > stuff or lure people to a web-site which either charges for downloads, or [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > > D. [cut] > > > I'd be delighted to discuss this with you anytime you'd like. I read > > > your discussion quite often, ...Then you should be quite familiar with the names ofthose who participate in the discussions of this newsgroup and about what it is they offer. However... And yet you fail to back up your claim: <snip> Lo and behold, today's WHAM is about a little known benefit of Pomegranate -- besides tasting great and being good for you, it also helps to fight dental plaque </snip> You are a fraud sir. >Amatus, > [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] >> >> > D. Newbie, you are a coward and a bully. One exists on every newsgroup. In this case, you couch your insults and inaccurate assessments into little venomous barbs that expire in six days. What a joke. Have the guts to put messages into the ether that stay behind you. Perhaps you are afraid of a trail of these kinds of insulting insinuations? The only claims I've made for pomegranate are those resulting from its recent clinical trial, which certainly does support the use of pomegranate in the dental arena. But, wow -- you caught me. I make ten cents everytime someone buys a pomegranate. D. > And yet you fail to back up your claim: > [quoted text clipped - 49 lines] > > >> > D. My my, aren't you getting a bit testy ? You fail to provide a link to the "recent clinical trial" that supports your claim of: <snip> Pomegranate -- besides tasting great and being good for you, it also helps to fight dental plaque. In fact, it is so good at this job that in the clinical trials linked to the headline of today's post, it was equivalent to the nasty chemical chlorhexidine, which is most commonly used in ingredients for plaque removal. </snip> Suspect that you don't post a link because it's to another retailer, or pseudo-science altie site. If you knew the first thing about plaque removal you would know that it is the physical disruption of the mass that matters most. This is best achieved by proper brushing and flossing tecnics. Chlorhexidine kills bacteria but does not remove plaque. You conveniently forgot to reveal: <snip> Dave Jensen Sedona, Arizona, US For 25 years, I have been a consultant (CTI Executive Search), author (Street Savvy Science), and business owner (ProActive BioProducts) </snip> Your so called "non-paid link" for Arctic Root® goes directly to ProActive BioProducts. No surprise there. Then since you cannot win the argument on merit and facts, you resort to the lame tactic of personal attack. So typical. >Newbie, you are a coward and a bully. One exists on every newsgroup. >In this case, you couch your insults and inaccurate assessments into [quoted text clipped - 62 lines] >> >> >> > D. Newbie, you are without a doubt the biggest troll I've seen in awhile. All articles on the site http://shamvswham.blogspot.com/ link to the clinical trials or more detail on the subject. As mentioned, if you had bothered to read it, the link to full details is the headline. Just as in every day's discussion on the site, the first line in the post, the headline, links to the science. Or, an abstract. In this case, it is to the American Botanical Council's report on the research. Chlorhexidine is an unhealthy product, and many people are glad to see that there will be a natural alternative. While scraping their teeth works in the office, chlorhexidine works outside of the office to kill the associated bacteria. And now Pomegranate can be seen as a viable alternative. End of subject for me. D. > My my, aren't you getting a bit testy ? > [quoted text clipped - 96 lines] > > >> >> > D. >Just as in every day's discussion on the site, the first line in the >post, the headline, links to the science. Or, an abstract. In this >case, it is to the American Botanical Council's report on the >research. Right, it links to Whole Foods Market, a retail site. Hence your post is commercial spam. Newbie, what you are looking at is called in Internet language a "Frame." Whole Foods is a sponsor company of American Botanical Council, the research firm and non-profit. There is no way that "consumers" of information, you or me, could get access to the website of ABC and download full text or abstracts. So, I linked to the free ABC information that is available through the "Frame" at Whole Foods, who pays for our access. You could also get the same detail directly from the ABC, if you wanted to pay for access, and it wouldn't have the Whole Foods frame around it. I don't like my last few posts, because I am starting to imitate you and your testy tone. So, to Dartos or anyone else, just take a peek at the first post, which was a polite, short pointer to a research study on a dental subject that likely wouldn't be reported upon in your usual journals. If that isn't of interest, don't read further. D. > >Just as in every day's discussion on the site, the first line in the > >post, the headline, links to the science. Or, an abstract. In this [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Hence your post is commercial spam. I will not read any further into the web-site. First impressions are often best. Signature/ Amatus / > Newbie, what you are looking at is called in Internet language a > "Frame." Whole Foods is a sponsor company of American Botanical [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] >> >> Hence your post is commercial spam. > I will not read any further into the web-site. > > First impressions are often best. Haven't read the site but agree. Judge a book by its cover. If it's endorsed by the ADA and a fortune 500 company like exposing people to mercury I tend to believe its okay, otherwise probably not worth looking into. > Whole Foods is a sponsor company of American Botanical >Council, the research firm and non-profit. Yeah sure. Have to take issue with a company who lists the first person as a "Wizard". That sounds really professional. No, really is that intended to make the reader think that somehow Mariann is *magical* ? What a rube you are little dave. <snip> Mariann Garner-Wizard Shari Henson Brenda Milot, ELS Heather S Oliff, PhD Marissa Oppel, MS Cathleen Rapp, ND Densie Webb, PhD Executive Editor Mark Blumenthal Managing Editor Lori Glenn Consulting Editors Dennis Awang, PhD, Steven Foster, Roberta Lee, MD Funding/Administration Wayne Silverman, PhD Production George Solis </snip> >I don't like my last few posts, because I am starting to imitate you >and your testy tone. You are the one who started the name calling and personal attacks. Methinks you are suffering from what the psychiatrists call *projection*. Well, when someone new drops in, posts a self-serving, likely financially motivated post, it is SPAM and Newbie called you on it. Rightfully so. I made a small investment in a dental invention relating to treating broken jaws, but I have not littered the internet with posts with links to a website that might make me money. We are in this newsgroup to discuss dentistry, not sell stuff. I say you are full of it old boy (and you don't know the definition of troll). The real D, Dartos > Newbie, you are without a doubt the biggest troll I've seen in awhile. > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > D. >Well, when someone new drops in, posts a self-serving, likely >financially motivated post, it is SPAM and Newbie called you [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >I say you are full of it old boy (and you don't know the definition >of troll). Was going to point this out but little dave seems impervious to facts and rational argument. Thanks Big D ! >The real D, >Dartos [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >> >> D. Hey SPAMMER, go home ! Newbie is a true gentleman who is welcome in my home any time. I cannot say the same thing about any spammer. Signature/ Amatus / > Newbie, you are a coward and a bully. One exists on every newsgroup. > In this case, you couch your insults and inaccurate assessments into [quoted text clipped - 67 lines] >> >> >> > D. >> You know most spammers are 'hit and run'. >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >D. Then what do you call this ? <quote> But there was a time in my life when I was totally and completely hooked on that caffeine buzz to get my day started. Luckily, that bad habit has fallen away, mostly due to a product called Arctic Root® that I take each morning. </quote> There is a link to ArcticRoot selling page. You may think your post isn't spam but I disagree. How much kick back do you get mr. businessman ? Hey Newbie . . . Good handle, by the way. Very appropriate. If you don't like it, don't visit it. I have thousands of readers a week, in a blog that started only a few weeks ago. Something must be right. Many of them are repeat readers. Each "Sham" or "Wham" gets a non-paid link. But I don't need to explain myself to a newbie, D. > You may think your post isn't spam but I disagree. > How much kick back do you get mr. businessman ? > Hey Newbie . . . Good handle, by the way. Very appropriate. > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > You may think your post isn't spam but I disagree. > > How much kick back do you get mr. businessman ? uh oh >> Hey Newbie . . . Good handle, by the way. Very appropriate. >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >uh oh Yeah and get this from his blog: <clip> About Me Dave Jensen Sedona, Arizona, US For 25 years, I have been a consultant (CTI Executive Search), author (Street Savvy Science), and business owner (ProActive BioProducts) </clip> One guess where his clever little 'non-paid link' for Arctic Root® leads. Ummmm, Dave, My buddy Newbie [ who is almost as old as me :-) ], has said it very well. You are selling a product through the link you provided. Therefore, you are a SPAMER! Signature/ Amatus / > >>> Hey Newbie . . . Good handle, by the way. Very appropriate. [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > One guess where his clever little 'non-paid link' for Arctic Root® leads. You should know that personal testimonials and anecdotal reports do not constitute scientific evidence; that is if you really are a pharma rep. >Each "Sham" or "Wham" gets a >non-paid link. Sure, when your blog refers people that buy the product you don't get anything. Pure unadulterated altruism ? Sure, mr. businessman. Don't let the handle throw you, whoops it already did ! >Hey Newbie . . . Good handle, by the way. Very appropriate. > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >> You may think your post isn't spam but I disagree. >> How much kick back do you get mr. businessman ? > You should know that personal testimonials and > anecdotal reports do not constitute scientific evidence; > that is if you really are a pharma rep. Exactly, the ADA only makes recommendations based on hard science as evidenced by its extensive clinical tries on amalgam, root canals and implants. Making anecodtal claims of safety or effectiveness would be unthinkable for an ADA trained dentist. In fact the ADA and dental boards even go so far as to put dentists who question their scientific facts out of business to help protect the public and would never think of blatantly advertising, holding patents or benifitting in any way from the products and procedures it endorses publicily, that's also true of its medically and scientifically trained members who post on this newsgroup.. > >Each "Sham" or "Wham" gets a > >non-paid link. > > Sure, when your blog refers people that buy the > product you don't get anything. > Pure unadulterated altruism ? Sure, mr. businessman. U tell em. Real Dentists wouldn't advocate procedures that make money for them as safe or effective while slanting the "real" facts. Done any root canals, placed any mercury, or done any $2000 implants lately by the way? >In fact the ADA and dental >boards >even go so far as to put dentists who question their scientific facts >out >of business A bold claim. Care to back it up Simpleton ? Oh wait it's CubicAirconia. Nevermind, PLONK. > >In fact the ADA and dental > >boards [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Nevermind, PLONK. Usual Juvenille, behavior, ask a question and then run away. But to answer your dammingly enlightening and insightful question any "simpleton" would agree that the ADA supports investigating dentists who do not follow its "scientifically" determined policies. Are you saying it shouldn't? The point is that the ADA's "science" is well, how do I say this in simple way..pure GAARbagge. (of course if U sit garbage long enough it eventually loses its smell) > You know most spammers are 'hit and run'. > > >Only if you promise to stay here and discuss it after I read it.- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - You sir, were enormously helpful to me when I had my teeth pulled and had an alveoectomy (sp?) done. I needed some questions answered and you were Johnny on the Spot...I just wanted to thank you very, very much! >> You know most spammers are 'hit and run'. >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >you were Johnny on the Spot...I just wanted to thank you very, very >much! You are welcomed but are you thanking me or Amatus ? Both ? |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2008 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.