 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / January 2006Sue's campaign of misinformation
It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going here. She has repeatedly mis-stated things that she says Dr. Boyd say's and when called on it tries to cover it up with some other non-sense. She is deliberatley stating mistruths, out and out lies, and inuendo. Sue let this be a warning to you. You are being watched carefully right now, cross the line and I'll be there to call you on it. Do we understand one another? We're onto you Sue. > It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going here. She > has repeatedly mis-stated things that she says Dr. Boyd say's and when [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > line and I'll be there to call you on it. Do we understand one another? > We're onto you Sue. When someone calls something "nonsense," that indicates the person has a poor understanding of the situation and converasation material. So no Tim, I do not think we undertsand one another if you do not understand my posts, but such is life. I guess I just have to put up with you following me around, checking up on my every single word, misunderstanding me, attacking me, and then announcing to the usnet a complete mischaracterization of me, and of the conversation that transpired. Sigh, -Sue >> It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going here. >> She [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > When someone calls something "nonsense," that indicates the person has > a poor understanding of the situation and converasation material. It is non-sense and you know it is. > >> It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going here. > >> She [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > It is non-sense and you know it is. Tip: "Nonsense" is not a hyphenated word. Why do you believe it is nonsense? I assume that you have little understanding of human physiology. That is all I can conclude from your odd behavior and misinterpetation of my posts. -Sue >> >> It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going here. >> >> She [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > understanding of human physiology. That is all I can conclude from > your odd behavior and misinterpetation of my posts. Who cares whats hyphenated Sue, typical of someone like you. Let's see I can find errors in all your posts if i wnat to. You assume wrong Sue and I happen to know a lot more about this and about Boyd's position than you will ever know. > >> >> It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going here. > >> >> She [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Who cares whats hyphenated Sue, typical of someone like you. "Let's see I can find errors in all your posts if i wnat to." Reply. I think you have already made this your mission. Isn't that what you were tryging to make clear in your original threating post on this thread? ... That you are watching me very closely... "You assume wrong Sue and I happen to know a lot more about this and about Boyd's position than you will ever know." Reply. That's great. It sure would be nice to hear something of substance then, rather than what I have seen so far... habitual flame-throwing. Why not try to hold a conversation and share some knowledege? -Sue >> >> >> It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going >> >> >> here. [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > what you were tryging to make clear in your original threating post on > this thread? ... That you are watching me very closely... I'm watching is correct. > "You assume wrong Sue and I happen to know a lot more about this and > about [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > flame-throwing. Why not try to hold a conversation and share some > knowledege? You don't even know what flame-throwing is Sue. You have a lot to learn. [snip Timmy's bullying] > I'm watching is correct. Who cares, if you are watching? [snip more bullying] > You don't even know what flame-throwing is Sue. You have a lot to learn. YOU, Timmy have a lot to learn. "JanD" <JanD@insightbb.com> wrote in message news:M_mqf.667211$xam3.196753@attbi_s21... cut and reported > > >> It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going here. > > >> She [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > -Sue The TMJ Association can help you. > > >> It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going here. > > >> She [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > -Sue p. 374-375 The "frequency discussion" I remember that passage.  Signature/ Amatus / > >> > >> It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > p. 374-375 >> It appears to me that Sue has a little campaign of her own going here. >> She [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >> line and I'll be there to call you on it. Do we understand one another? >> We're onto you Sue. clip > So no Tim, I do not think we undertsand one another if you do not > understand my posts, but such is life. What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: "Theory Only: I would venture to guess that the onset of pain associated with TMJ disorder is due to "parafunctional overuse" of the muscles that control mandibular function as Boyd describes. (As I understand, this includes bruxism and grinding due to poor parasympathetic tone, thus affecting muscle relaxation... an essential component in normal chewing function)." >What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >parasympathetic tone, thus affecting muscle relaxation... an essential >component in normal chewing function)." The Sympathetic and Parasympathetic nervous systems control involutary smooth musculature. Skeletal muscles are innervated by, you guessed it motor nerves. Sue's 'theory' not only nonsense, it's complete and utter bullsh*t. -- Whamatus Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com >>What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: >> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Sue's 'theory' not only nonsense, it's complete and utter bullsh*t. Thank you W_B. If you do a search for " poor parasympathetic tone" (show's what she doesn't know just in that choice of wording alone) you will find some reference to heart related research.. can you say BINGO.... >>>What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: >>> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >what she doesn't know just in that choice of wording alone) you will find >some reference to heart related research.. can you say BINGO.... Sue's very limited knowledge of Anatomy, Physiology, and Neuroscience are glaringly evident in her asinine statements. Throw in a few 'scientific' words and violá --> instant expert sounding statments. However these statments only fool the undeducated fools and minions that are today's 'alternative' followers. Anyone with a good solid science background in study of the human will quickly recognize Sue's arrogance/ignorance for what it is; absolute horse sh*t. ...and oh yeah, Bingo! -- Whamatus Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com > >>>What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: > >>> [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > Take out the G'RBAGE > wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Just saw this post. Now that was harsh. I was not trying to convince anyone or to get anyone to follow me Amatus. I preceded my post with "theory only." I was hoping for some intelligent discussion that could help to enlighten me. I was in no way intending to be perceived as an expert in this subject. My post was intended to be neither arrogant nor completely ignorant. I am merely interested in this subject and interested in learning more from the experts. I was likely wrong in my assumption that the "chewing reflex" is related to the ANS. I would like to know what causes this however, as this is an automatic reflex. The ANS runs parallel to the CNS. Since the ANS was brought up in regard to parafunction, I thought perhaps there was some ANS component related to the "chewing reflex," that is labeled but not defined by Guyton (in my physiology textbook). This is described as "The presence of a bolus of food in the mouth causes the reflex inhibition of the muscles of mastication, which allows the lower jaw to drop. The drop in turn initiates a stretch reflex of the jaw muscles and leads to rebound contraction." ("Textbook of Medical Physiology" by A.C. Guyton) I am sorry if this bears no relation to parasympathetic function. As far as parafunction. Night-time bruxism has been associated with obstructive sleep apnea, something commonly found in heart failure patients (as is Central Sleep Apnea). This often remains undiaogosed until HF symptoms appear. I would like to learn more about parafunction. I would like to know whether this is under complete voluntary control or if a dysregulated ANS may have some effect on these "habits" of grinding (for lack of a better term). It sesm that this dones in response to stress, and thus is related to ANS activity, at least indirectly. In the same token, I would like to know whether bruxism affects ANS regulation (as the abstract that I laid out on the other thread alluded that mastication has some effect on HR variability which is under ANS control). This is of interest to me, because as I pointed out, the progression of heart failure is driven by a dysregulated ANS; namely overactivity of the adrenergic sympathetic system, accompanied by reduced parasympathetic drive. Yes Amatus, I am referring to smooth muscle and cardiac muscle control here. And yes, we commonly refer to this as sympathetic and parasympathetic "tone." I do not profess to be an expert. I am not fearful of being shot-down when I may have a concept wrong. I would like to discuss this with someone that is willing to impart their knowledge in a respectful and non-judgemental exchange. -Sue >."Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1135215067.165356.286080@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com... >Night-time bruxism has been associated with >obstructive sleep apnea, something commonly found in heart failure >patients (as is Central Sleep Apnea). This often remains undiaogosed >until HF symptoms appear. I find the correlation between apnea and heart problems suspect as far as cause and effect go...most patients with apnea are obese, many morbidly obese. Is the heart disease a function of the apnea or is the apnea just another symptom or consequence of being obese? I think it is the latter. T > >."Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message > news:1135215067.165356.286080@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com... [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > T Tony, This may be entirely true. This makes intuitive sense. Of interest as well; we also find central sleep apnea (and mixed apnea) in heart failure. My theory (unsubstantiated of course) is that central sleep apnea may precipitate after the onset of HF, as a result of chronic activation of the adrenergic sympathetic system. In fact I often wonder if OSA can turn into CSA once heart failure is developed. This is only an intuitive leap as well, however. We are uncovering a lot in this area of sleep apnea in HF patients. We have implanted a hemodynamic monitor in HF patients (that measures right ventricular pressure, as well as many other parameters). We have submitted PMA (premarket approval) for this but have not received FDA clearance yet. An interesting finding that we happened to notiice is that we were able to identify disordered breathing at night based upon the pressure measurements. These patients (previously undiagnosed) have then gone on to be diagnosed with sleep apnea via traditional sleep study. Thsi helped gretaly in thier HF management as OSA and CSA symptoms mimic many of HF's symptoms. (lack of energy, tired. etc.) Once on CPAP, these pts did much better! I find the technology fascinating. Thanks Tony for your kind response. :-) I must run off now. I still have X-mas shopping to do! (just a couple more items) Later, -Sue And what will the 'savior' do with this knoweldge she hopes to gain here? Whamatus_B wrote: > On Wed, 21 Dec 2005 14:30:01 -0800, "Tim Dixon" > <timgdixon-no-spam@cox.net> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > Take out the G'RBAGE > wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Just saw this post. Now that was harsh. I was not trying to convince anyone or to get anyone to follow me Amatus. I preceded my post with "theory only." I was hoping for some intelligent discussion that could help to enlighten me. I was in no way intending to be perceived as an expert in this subject. My post was intended to be neither arrogant nor completely ignorant. I am merely interested in this subject and interested in learning more from the experts. I was likely wrong in my assumption that the "chewing reflex" is related to the ANS. I would like to know what causes this however, as this is an automatic reflex. The ANS runs parallel to the CNS. Since the ANS was brought up in regard to parafunction, I thought perhaps there was some ANS component related to the "chewing reflex," that is labeled but not defined by Guyton (in my physiology textbook). This is described as "The presence of a bolus of food in the mouth causes the reflex inhibition of the muscles of mastication, which allows the lower jaw to drop. The drop in turn initiates a stretch reflex of the jaw muscles and leads to rebound contraction." ("Textbook of Medical Physiology" by A.C. Guyton) I am sorry if this bears no relation to parasympathetic function. As far as parafunction. Night-time bruxism has been associated with obstructive sleep apnea, something commonly found in heart failure patients (as is Central Sleep Apnea). This often remains undiaogosed until HF symptoms appear. I would like to learn more about parafunction. I would like to know whether this is under complete voluntary control or if a dysregulated ANS may have some effect on these "habits" of grinding (for lack of a better term). It sesm that this dones in response to stress, and thus is related to ANS activity, at least indirectly. In the same token, I would like to know whether bruxism affects ANS regulation (as the abstract that I laid out on the other thread alluded that mastication has some effect on HR variability which is under ANS control). This is of interest to me, because as I pointed out, the progression of heart failure is driven by a dysregulated ANS; namely overactivity of the adrenergic sympathetic system, accompanied by reduced parasympathetic drive. Yes Amatus, I am referring to smooth muscle and cardiac muscle control here. And yes, we commonly refer to this as sympathetic and parasympathetic "tone." I do not profess to be an expert. I am not fearful of being shot-down when I may have a concept wrong. I would like to discuss this with someone that is willing to impart their knowledge in a respectful and non-judgemental exchange. -Sue > > >>>What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: > > >>> [quoted text clipped - 94 lines] > > -Sue Typo correction/clarification. Meant to say that the ANS operates in parrallel to the SNS (sensory-somatic portion of the CNS). "Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1135293067.666773.971020@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com... no one cares sue > "Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message > news:1135293067.666773.971020@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com... > > no one cares sue YOU don't speak for everyone. "JanD" <JanD@insightbb.com> wrote in message news:aPwHqf.668678$xm3.241778@attbi_s21... ignore >>What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >The Sympathetic and Parasympathetic nervous systems control >involutary smooth musculature. ...and organ/endocrine functions. Collectively the sympathetic and parasympathetic are called the Autonomic Nervous System. (just for clarity) >Skeletal muscles are innervated by, you guessed it motor nerves. > >Sue's 'theory' not only nonsense, it's complete and utter bullsh*t. -- Whamatus Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com > >What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: > > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > Take out the G'RBAGE > wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Whamatus - Thank you! Now we are getting some discussion. Yes. This is what I understood as well. I understood the masticatory muscles to be controle dby motor nerves. That was why the discussion on DT was so interesting. The dentists on Dentaltown brought up automonic function and its potential role in the parafunction associated with TMJ disorders. As I mentioned, my theory is theory only, as I prefaced in the post. I present theory, fully expecting to be challenged on that theory. Thank you for your input. It helps me learn. What causes involuntary bruxing and grinding at night? In your opinion, what role does the autonomic nervous system play in this parafunction, if any? Thank you, Sue PS How would you describe the "chewing reflex?" What causes this reflex? What causes reflex inhibition of the muscles that control chewing..allowing for the jaw to drop? Thanks. Dear Regs, Please scroll down to examine a masterful dissection. Assuredly not boring, and maybe mildly entertaining. At least for 32 seconds or so... >> >What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: >> > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >> >> Whamatus OK regs, I'm gonna bite. Pay attention and you just may learn something. >Whamatus - Thank you! Don't thank me yet. >Now we are getting some discussion. No, not really; simply correcting your erroneous ass-umptions. > Yes. This is what I understood as well. Ass-umes facts not in evidence. There is *no* evidence that you even passingly understand the subject matter. Your education of human neuroanatomy is severely deficient. >I understood the masticatory muscles to be >controle dby motor nerves. All skeletal muscles are innervated by motor neurons. There are also sensory afferent neurons present in skeletal muscle. >That was why the discussion on DT was so >interesting. Some find watching grass grow, or paint dry *interesting*. Based on their ad-rag, I consider it a MMS publication. (That's mutual masturbation society for you folks in Rio Linda) In the common slang vernacular, a circle jerk. >The dentists on Dentaltown brought up automonic function and its >potential role in the parafunction associated with TMJ disorders. That's about as interesting as watching a snail crawl. >As I mentioned, my theory is theory only, as I prefaced in the post. I >present theory, fully expecting to be challenged on that theory. Thank >you for your input. It helps me learn. You must first have a basis, on solid scientific ground, *before* you postulate a 'theory'. You have none of the pre-requisites to even form a valid scientific premise. >What causes involuntary bruxing and grinding at night? No one yet knows the answer to that question. If anyone did, we could treat the disorder. > In your >opinion, what role does the autonomic nervous system play in this >parafunction, if any? Zero, zip, nada... etc. The Autonomic Nervous System functions of the human mouth are largely limited to salivary flow control, gag reflex, and partially swallowing. Some may include the 'sucking reflex' of a nursing baby. >Thank you, >Sue >PS How would you describe the "chewing reflex?" What causes this >reflex? What causes reflex inhibition of the muscles that control >chewing..allowing for the jaw to drop? Thanks. There is no such thing as a 'chewing reflex'. Hence your next two questions are irrelevant. The only <'reflex'> that I'm aware of during the chewing cycle is when there is a foreign object impinged upon by erupted teeth. i.e. bone fragments, shot, or other hard objects. It is debatable if this is truly an *opening* <'reflex'> at all, or a learned behavior. BTW once the bolus is swallowed the Autonomic peristalsis takes over. Now for the coup de grâce. Sue, you are a very lonely person, and a textbook example of the 'savior syndrome'. Your so called 'knowledge' is severely limited; therefore you augment your attempts at spurring relevant discussions by interjecting words that you have gleaned from the internet, SMD and, (gasp) DT. You rarely even post an original thought. Your pitiful cries for attention fall upon deaf ears; and this disturbs you immensely Attempts to discourage you from your newsgroup behavior only serve to encourage your neurosis. And only acts to increase your need for attention, and hence more posting. If you really seek knowledge about dentistry, go to f*ckin' Dental School already ! I don't feel sorry for you, because only *you* can change yourself and/or your situation. You ain't gonna find sympathy or agreement here sister, unless you are fluent in the language and concepts. On a final note, do not expect me to respond any further; have wasted enough of my precious time on you. Seek your need for acceptance from within, not from the outside. If you need a friend that badly, ...buy a dog. -- Whamatus Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Man W_B it doesn't get any better than that. Gotta love that coup de grâce. > Dear Regs, > Please scroll down to examine a masterful dissection. [quoted text clipped - 141 lines] > Take out the G'RBAGE > wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com > Man W_B it doesn't get any better than that. Gotta love that coup de > grâce. As predicted. Liars do love other liars. >> Dear Regs, >> Please scroll down to examine a masterful dissection. [quoted text clipped - 141 lines] >> Take out the G'RBAGE >> wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com "JanD" <JanD@insightbb.com> wrote in message news:lznqf.667271$xme3.64591@attbi_s21... cut and reported > Dear Regs, Translation: *GANG* MEMBER LIARS that LIE FOR EACH OTHER stick together, LOVE BELITTLING. > Please scroll down to examine a masterful dissection. Umm, NOT! W_B's FOUL mouth USUAL GARBAGE, BELITTLING, LIES AS USUAL. [snipped] >>> >What is to understand Sue when you make statements like this: >>> > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >>> >>> Whamatus >>Whamatus - Thank you! >>Now we are getting some discussion. > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >>The dentists on Dentaltown brought up automonic function and its >>potential role in the parafunction associated with TMJ disorders. >>As I mentioned, my theory is theory only, as I prefaced in the post. I >>present theory, fully expecting to be challenged on that theory. Thank >>you for your input. It helps me learn. >>What causes involuntary bruxing and grinding at night? >> In your >>opinion, what role does the autonomic nervous system play in this [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >>reflex? What causes reflex inhibition of the muscles that control >>chewing..allowing for the jaw to drop? Thanks. > -- > Whamatus > G'RBAGE > wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com "JanD" <JanD@insightbb.com> wrote in message news:Nunqf.425a3254$084.62390@attbi_s22... cut and reported how long do you think it will take with all of us reporting Jan to her ISP before they get tired of having to hear about her and cut her off? Not long I hope. Thats what happened at AOL by the way. > "JanD" <JanD@insightbb.com> wrote in message > news:Nunqf.425a3254$084.62390@attbi_s22... [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > before they get tired of having to hear about her and cut her off? Not long > I hope. Thats what happened at AOL by the way. You are now proven to be a liar, Timmy "Jan" <jdrew63929@aol.com> wrote in message news:1135216684.0203050.234110@g44g2000cwa.googslegroups.com... cut and reported > "Jan" <jdrew63929@aol.com> wrote in message > news:1135216684.0203050.234110@g44g2000cwa.googslegroups.com... > > cut and reported Poor Timmy. What did you say? how long do you think it will take with all of us reporting Jan to her ISP before they get tired of having to hear about her and cut her off? Not long I hope. Thats what happened at AOL by the way. Now, would you care to apologize? Or be proven as a L I A R? Which is it, Tim? Newsgroups: sci.med.dentistry From: "Jan" <jdrew63...@aol.com> - Find messages by this author Date: 21 Dec 2005 17:58:04 -0800 Local: Wed, Dec 21 2005 8:58 pm Subject: Re: Sue's campaign of misinformation Reply | Reply to Author | Forward | Print | Individual Message | Show original | Remove | Report Abuse Tim Dixon wrote: > cut and reported > how long do you think it will take with all of us reporting Jan to her ISP > before they get tired of having to hear about her and cut her off? Not long > I hope. Thats what happened at AOL by the way. You are now proven to be a liar, Timmy jdrew63929@aol.com "Jan" <jdrew63929@aol.com> wrote in message news:1135219722.s898576.145420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... cut and reported > Dear Regs, > Please scroll down to examine a masterful dissection. [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] > >The dentists on Dentaltown brought up automonic function and its > >potential role in the parafunction associated with TMJ disorders. Whamatus writes: "There is no such thing as a 'chewing reflex'." Reply. According to the late Dr. Arthur C. Guyton there is. Unfortunately he was killed in a car accident April, 2003. He wrote the textbook on human physiology. Known in the medical world as the guru on human physiology. "The only <'reflex'> that I'm aware of ..." Reply. Check it out with other experts if you are unsure. "BTW once the bolus is swallowed the Autonomic peristalsis takes over." Reply. Yes. Thank you. Q. What causes involuntary bruxing and grinding at night? Amatus: No one yet knows the answer to that question. If anyone did, we could treat the disorder. Q. In your opinion, what role does the autonomic nervous system play in this parafunction, if any? Whamatus: Zero, zip, nada... etc. The Autonomic Nervous System functions of the human mouth are largely limited to salivary flow control, gag reflex, and partially swallowing. Some may include the 'sucking reflex' of a nursing baby. Reply. If no one yet knows what causes involuntary bruxing and grinding, then how does one arrive at the forgone conclusion that the ANS has zero, zip, nada involvement in this? Others have speculated otherwise. -Sue > > Dear Regs, > > Please scroll down to examine a masterful dissection. [quoted text clipped - 95 lines] > > -Sue This is interesting. "Chewing to a large extent, a reflex...." I wonder what Whamatus was taught in dental school? He claims there is no "chewing reflex." Everyone uses their own semantics I guess. -Sue http://arbl.cvmbs.colostate.edu/hbooks/pathphys/digestion/pregastric/mastication.html Chewing is, to a large extent, a reflex, although you can voluntarily masticate as well. To study this phenomenon, watch a cow ruminating or look around and watch someone chewing gum. The presence of food (or gum) in the mouth causes a reflex inhibition of the muscles of the lower jaw. Those muscles relax and the lower jaw drops, causing a stretch reflex which causes muscle contraction and closure of the mouth. During mastication, the tongue and, to a lesser extent, the lips and cheeks acts to keep food between the grinding surfaces of the teeth. This can be demonstrated by trying to chew your next meal while holding your tongue still. Incidentally, chewing is hard work and expends a lot of energy. >Reply. If no one yet knows what causes involuntary bruxing and >grinding, then how does one arrive at the forgone conclusion that the >ANS has zero, zip, nada involvement in this? Others have speculated >otherwise. > >-Sue You do know what STFU means right ? within, not from the outside. If you need a friend that badly, ...buy a dog. -- Whamatus Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com > >Reply. If no one yet knows what causes involuntary bruxing and > >grinding, then how does one arrive at the forgone conclusion that the [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > Take out the G'RBAGE > wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com You do know what STFU means right ? within, not from the outside. Reply. Very good Whamatus! You mean STFU about ANS (internal) versus STFU about CNS sensory-somatic (external). :-) :-) (It's only dicsussing potential theory, as we do not know the exact cause!) Sue > > Dear Regs, > > Please scroll down to examine a masterful dissection. [quoted text clipped - 95 lines] > > -Sue Typo noted. Wherever I happened to say Amatus, it should read Whamatus. -Sue >Typo noted. Wherever I happened to say Amatus, it should read >Whamatus. > >-Sue Stop dissin' my sista ! -- Whamatus Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com > > >The dentists on Dentaltown brought up automonic function and its > > >potential role in the parafunction associated with TMJ disorders. I can see how the ANS could be involved in causing nighttime bruxism, but the effect might be more via glandular involvement (adrenal medulla rather than smooth muscle), or via the enteric nervous system (the third division of the ANS)? > Q. What causes involuntary bruxing and grinding at night? > Amatus: No one yet knows the answer to that question. If anyone did, > we could treat the disorder. I was under the impression that involuntary bruxing and grinding at night is oftentimes caused by stress. I've been wondering for a while - if this is the case, should dentists offer preventative advice in this area with regards to relaxation techniques (similar to dispensing smoking cessation information)? > > > >The dentists on Dentaltown brought up automonic function and its > > > >potential role in the parafunction associated with TMJ disorders. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > area with regards to relaxation techniques (similar to dispensing > smoking cessation information)? "bruxing and grinding at night is oftentimes caused by stress." Reply. This is my understanding as well. As such, and if this is the case, the ANS is involved in this syndorme (IMO), even though the trigeminal nerve (fifth cranial) is sensory/motor. "should dentists offer preventative advice in this area with regards to relaxation techniques (similar to dispensing smoking cessation information)? Reply. Relaxation methods and meditation have been found to be helpful. (As per the dentists located on DT , anyway). Your idea makes perfect sense to me. Gotta run. Hubby is havin colonoscopy today... yuck.. and so close to the holidays. He has been putting this off! Now I think he was just trying use up our flexible spending account money before the end of the year. Take care Amber. :-) Sue PS I have an original and unsubstantiated thought. I wonder if the "chewing reflex" is controlled by mechanorecpetors? ... analogy thought process ... like the baroreceptors that act in response ot acute blood pressure changes. go away If you like what the DT dentists say, why are you here? I know if I liked DT, that's where I would be. Dartos > Reply. Relaxation methods and meditation have been found to be helpful. > (As per the dentists located on DT , anyway). Your idea makes perfect > sense to me. > If you like what the DT dentists say, why are you here? > I know if I liked DT, that's where I would be. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> (As per the dentists located on DT , anyway). Your idea makes perfect >> sense to me. See what I mean about the chessy platitudes. You could suggest that a primary clencher bang their foot three times with a hammer before going to bed to help their nocturnal parafunction and she would say "your idea makes perfect sense to me". IME, it's hard enough to get a patient to realize that they are clenching in the first place. Trying to say that they are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going to sit very well with them (even if it's true). Not that I never mention stress and relaxation. I just don't bombard them with the notion that they can fix all of their problems by screwing their head on straight. Dartos >>If you like what the DT dentists say, why are you here? >>I know if I liked DT, that's where I would be. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > bed to help their nocturnal parafunction and she would say "your idea makes > perfect sense to me". All Sue wants to do is glean something from here to take somewhere else so she can say this is what the dentists at SMD say, just like she does here with "As per the dentists located on DT , anyway", and so on and so forth. That way she fulfills her role as "savior" to the dental patient world. Just like she attemtped to do with that assinine statement she tried to attribute to Dr. Boyd, then covered it up with I prefaced with Theory.. hogwash, she know's just what she is doing and its sick really. I have never seen a stronger argument for the existance of "savior syndrome" than I have with her. > IME, it's hard enough to get a patient to realize that they > are clenching in the first place. Trying to say that they [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] >> to bed to help their nocturnal parafunction and she would say "your idea >> makes perfect sense to me". There are some obvious problems with that girl. Signature/ Amatus / > All Sue wants to do is glean something from here to take somewhere else so > she can say this is what the dentists at SMD say, just like she does here [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] >>> to bed to help their nocturnal parafunction and she would say "your idea >>> makes perfect sense to me". Can you say CLS > There are some obvious problems with that girl. > [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] >>>> to bed to help their nocturnal parafunction and she would say "your >>>> idea makes perfect sense to me". > IME, it's hard enough to get a patient to realize that they > are clenching in the first place. Trying to say that they [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Dartos Dartos, No one has suggested that you tell a patient that s/he is "neurotic." Personally I do not think that people that clench or grind their teeth are necessarily neurotic, but I do think that relaxation and meditation can be helpful. In fact I think these can be helpful for anyone, especially for those that lead stressful lives. Bill George, our former CEO meditated for 20 minutes every day. He was anything but neurotic. -Sue >> IME, it's hard enough to get a patient to realize that they >> are clenching in the first place. Trying to say that they [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > Bill George, our former CEO meditated for 20 minutes every day. He was > anything but neurotic. "I do think that relaxation and meditation can be helpful" Helpful for what? Oh and we're impressed by your name dropping. > > IME, it's hard enough to get a patient to realize that they > > are clenching in the first place. Trying to say that they [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > -Sue Classic TMJism >> > IME, it's hard enough to get a patient to realize that they >> > are clenching in the first place. Trying to say that they [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Classic TMJism It sure is. The writing is all over the wall. There is emerging a common thread and theme to all these johnny come lately types and its starting to stink like some old stuff from long ago. I wonder if Bill George was a primary clencher, grinder, bruxer, TMD'r, TMJ'r TMJD'r MPD'r, CMS'r, or what; and how the meditation helped him. (Prediction: Sue will state he wasn't any of those and that she is just pointing out how wonderfully relaxed he was). Or are we suppose to be impressed by name dropping. This place is beginning to stink and I don't like it. I predict the Great War of 96' may return yet. > >> > IME, it's hard enough to get a patient to realize that they > >> > are clenching in the first place. Trying to say that they [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > This place is beginning to stink and I don't like it. I predict the Great > War of 96' may return yet. I predict the same. Trying to say that they > are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going > to sit very well with them (even if it's true). > > Not that I never mention stress and relaxation. I just don't > bombard them with the notion that they can fix all of their > problems by screwing their head on straight. I wouldn't equate stress to being "neurotic" or "not having your head on straight" :-). I was thinking more along the lines of a patient information leaflet outlining the possible causes of clenching/grinding (incl. stress) and methods for reducing stress (like relaxation CDs, exercise etc.) > Trying to say that they >> are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > (incl. stress) and methods for reducing stress (like relaxation CDs, > exercise etc.) Thats the problem with ALL of YOU. "possible causes of clenching/grinding" I am convinced that because of people like you, sue and many other 'savior' types that frequent here you are responsible for a huge amount of the misinformation, lies and other inuendo that floats all around the net. I'll tell you what, print it up and start handing it out, but get the sam houston out of here with your cockamamy ideas. > Trying to say that they > > are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > (incl. stress) and methods for reducing stress (like relaxation CDs, > exercise etc.) Where have you been for the past thirty years? > Trying to say that they > > are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > (incl. stress) and methods for reducing stress (like relaxation CDs, > exercise etc.) Letsconnect, I am beginning to understand why many dentists have their hygienists do the talking for them...... lol. A patient may be more receptive to an information leaflet than a dentist that automatically assumes the patient is neurotic. -Sue > > Trying to say that they > > > are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > -Sue Hogwash >> Trying to say that they >> > are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > -Sue Oh really, and what dentist around here stated they "automatically assumes the patient is neurotic"? Oh I know you're going to tell us thats what they say over at DT right. A leaflet that says what? More of the same old misinformation and lies and inuendo you are your cohorts spread to every dental related newsgroup/message board/forum you can find. Let's see a show of hands fellas how many of you would pass out some "leaflet" to your patients, or given out by your DH, that claims what these kooks are claiming. > >> Trying to say that they > >> > are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > "leaflet" to your patients, or given out by your DH, that claims what these > kooks are claiming. Better yet, why doesn't the TMJ Association doesn't want anyone to read "The TMJ Iatroepidemic"??? If you can answer that question, then you're on your way to enlightenment. >> >> Trying to say that they >> >> > are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] > "The TMJ Iatroepidemic"??? If you can answer that question, then you're > on your way to enlightenment. Thats simple. It's called "Hope Against Hope". > >> >> Trying to say that they > >> >> > are stressed out, neurotic, and wound too tight isn't going [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > > Thats simple. It's called "Hope Against Hope". "They" have no use for that sort of thing. ... they *are* the savior syndrome ... and I can spot their style at a glance. So TMJASSociation .... there's no room for you here so get lost. > "They" have no use for that sort of thing. ... they *are* the savior > syndrome ... and I can spot their style at a glance. > > So TMJASSociation .... there's no room for you here so get lost. SabraTW: There's things goin' on here that I don't get (as usual....). I _do_ get that it is really not a good idea for Sue or anyone else to take what has been said here and paraphrase out of context into another forum, especially when those others could lift a finger and come on over here and ask their questions. There are copywright issues, libel issues, personal responsibility issues and others at play when this happens. ButttttttTTTTTTTtttttttttTTTTTTTTTTTttttttttttt.... For those of us who don't have much of a clue as to what is going on here, can you explain in easy words that a mediocre dentist can understand? (Maybe it's just me that is as thick as the board the iBook is sitting on...) Thanks PS: this is not an obligation, just a request. Merci SP SignatureTake out the TRAASH to reply > > "They" have no use for that sort of thing. ... they *are* the savior > > syndrome ... and I can spot their style at a glance. [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > -- > Take out the TRAASH to reply SP, I know you did not ask me, but I am speaking on this too if you will listen, please. I was not trying to quote Boyd. I prefaced my post with a huge "THEORY ONLY." I put quotes around "parafunctional overuse" to indicate that this was my own colloquialism for what is happening when a person bruxes... but I then followed that with "(as Boyd describes)." Tim called me on it. I saw my mistake, explained and corrected myself. Yet Tim made up his own mind as to my intentions. Now he and Webby seem to think I am from the TMJ Association or something. It is ridiculous! Yet. I also incorrectly described the "chewing reflex" as a response to ANS activation...namely the parasympathic causes relfex inhibition of the of teh muscles of mastication. BIG mistake. Dumb assumption on my part. But I was NOT stating as fact. I was only stating as THEORY (in attempt to discuss and learn). Anway, that set off Whamatus. I have since reviewed my physiology and understand the 5th cranial nerve (trigeminal) is both sensory/motor. However stimulation of the hypothalmus, amygdala and even the cerebral cortex in areas near taste sense can cause chewing. So I am confused about the potential role of ANS in TMJ syndrome, as well as night time bruxing. Is there a potential role? I can direct you to the thread. Thanks, -Sue "Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1135367749.753772.903320@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... NO ONE CARES WHAT YOU THINK. YOU ARE A THIEF OF OTHERS WORDS AND EVERYBODY HERE KNOWS IT. DON'T YOU GET IT SUE, NO ONE LIKES YOU AND NO ONE WANTS YOU HERE. > "Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message > news:1135367749.753772.903320@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... > > NO ONE CARES WHAT YOU THINK. YOU ARE A THIEF OF OTHERS WORDS AND EVERYBODY > HERE KNOWS IT. DON'T YOU GET IT SUE, NO ONE LIKES YOU AND NO ONE WANTS YOU > HERE. They need to prepare another speech for Congress. >> "Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message >> news:1135367749.753772.903320@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > They need to prepare another speech for Congress. *.* "Tim Dixon" <timgdixon-no-spam@cox.net> wrote. cut] > "The Webby" <tmjiatroepidemic@san.rr.com> wrote in message [cut] [cut >>> "Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message >>> news:1135367749.753772.903320@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... "The Webby" <tmjiatroepidemic@san.rr.com> wrote [cut] [cut] >> "Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message >> news:1135367749.753772.903320@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... I have to agree with my good friend Tim. Joel, tell her to go back where she came from Amatus Cremona .. > "Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message > news:1135367749.753772.903320@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... > > NO ONE CARES WHAT YOU THINK. YOU ARE A THIEF OF OTHERS WORDS AND > EVERYBODY HERE KNOWS IT. DON'T YOU GET IT SUE, NO ONE LIKES YOU AND NO > ONE WANTS YOU HERE. I'm starting to wonder about the appearances and disappearances... to quote my good friend Amatus "Joel, tell her to go back where she came from" >I have to agree with my good friend Tim. > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >> EVERYBODY HERE KNOWS IT. DON'T YOU GET IT SUE, NO ONE LIKES YOU AND NO >> ONE WANTS YOU HERE. Did you notice the absence of certain individuals during the time Joel was missing (getting his new low cost clinic set-up) ? And, the appearance of some individuals when he returned ? Amatus Cremona .. > I'm starting to wonder about the appearances and disappearances... to > quote my good friend Amatus "Joel, tell her to go back where she came [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >>> EVERYBODY HERE KNOWS IT. DON'T YOU GET IT SUE, NO ONE LIKES YOU AND NO >>> ONE WANTS YOU HERE. I sure did and I think many others have taken notice as well. > Did you notice the absence of certain individuals during the time Joel was > missing (getting his new low cost clinic set-up) ? And, the appearance of [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >>>> EVERYBODY HERE KNOWS IT. DON'T YOU GET IT SUE, NO ONE LIKES YOU AND NO >>>> ONE WANTS YOU HERE. > Did you notice the absence of certain individuals during the time Joel was > missing (getting his new low cost clinic set-up) ? And, the appearance of > some individuals when he returned ? ... And there is no way to cross reference posters to see if different names represent the same person? SP SignatureTake out the TRAASH to reply >> Did you notice the absence of certain individuals during the time Joel >> was [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > names represent the same person? > SP Depends on how they get their posting published on the net. One poster here used to boast about how many old computers he had in his dwelling which were all hooked up to the internet via cheap or free posting sites. Each machine would create a different IP Address. Would not be hard to create multiple on-line log-ons each with a different IP address. > One poster here > used to boast about how many old computers he had in his dwelling which were > all hooked up to the internet via cheap or free posting sites. Holy.**&&?%$#.... I remember that... and how he would get computers for free from some recycling outfit. Then that _one person_, if he was once a practicing dentist, would perhaps be breaking an oath to first do no harm. In misleading people on the SMD and DT sites, he would be doing just that. ... Um... it seems that we are talking about a person who lives in a city where.... um.... the Flyers play Hockey..... SP SignatureTake out the TRAASH to reply > I have to agree with my good friend Tim. > > Joel, tell her to go back where she came from What all of this has to do with her line of work is beyond me. >> I have to agree with my good friend Tim. >> >> Joel, tell her to go back where she came from > > What all of this has to do with her line of work is beyond me. Oh don't you know, she's very interested... "Tim Dixon" <timgdixon-no-spam@cox.net> wrote [cut] > "The Webby" <tmjiatroepidemic@san.rr.com> wrote in message [cut] [cut] Speaking of which, since I have her kill-filed I don't know. Did she ever tell us if those articles she authored were published anywhere, or if they were simply drafts to justify funding within the corporation ? Amatus Cremona .. >> I have to agree with my good friend Tim. >> >> Joel, tell her to go back where she came from > > What all of this has to do with her line of work is beyond me. No she never did.. she posted some cites that are meaningless because she provided no proof of their existance either way. > Speaking of which, since I have her kill-filed I don't know. Did she ever > tell us if those articles she authored were published anywhere, or if they [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >> >> What all of this has to do with her line of work is beyond me. "Amatus Cremona" <Arcus@Martele..com> wrote [cut] > Amatus Cremona > .. > "The Webby" <tmjiatroepidemic@san.rr.com> wrote in message [cut] [cut] > I have to agree with my good friend Tim. > > Joel, tell her to go back where she came from Is there no automated way to be alerted to the multiple presences of individuals? Thanks S SignatureTake out the TRAASH to reply > I have to agree with my good friend Tim. > > Joel, tell her to go back where she came from Who is Joel in all-a this stuff? SP SignatureTake out the TRAASH to reply [cut] > "Sue" <chrlie699@yahoo.com> wrote in message > news:1135367749.753772.903320@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... "JanDrewTheJewHater" <JanD@insightbb.com> wrote in message news:fbZqf.4292002$084.224689@attbi_s22... Oh here comes the Jew hater again, ignore the old hag chester molestor [cut] > Now he and Webby seem to think I am from the TMJ Association > or something. It is ridiculous! You're correct. It is absolutely ridiculous. They only go to Congress. They wouldn't dare go to smd. Webby [cut] > So I am confused about the potential role of ANS in TMJ syndrome, as > well as night time bruxing. Is there a potential role? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Thanks, > -Sue TMJ Syndrome? Please describe this particular syndrome. > [cut] >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > TMJ Syndrome? Please describe this particular syndrome. Yes please do Sue. > Yet. I also incorrectly described the "chewing reflex" as a response to > ANS activation...namely the parasympathic causes relfex inhibition of [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > hypothalmus, amygdala and even the cerebral cortex in areas near taste > sense can cause chewing. Sue: Firstly, SabraTW said she was putting The Book back up in the other group for downloading for those who wanted it over the Holidays. I didn't check, as I already have read it. If you _did_ take it down and read it, you'd know that Sabra, Tim, Dartos and Carebelli have been around these here UseNet parts since UseNet was THE way to communicate over the 'Net. We're talkin' S.L.O.W connections over modems on rinky-dink computers, even before hard disks were the norm. This means that these dude(ette)s have experience with people on line and thence into real life. If people like them get their backs up at what you are doing here, I have to take notice of that in a serious way. To be sure, some of 'em are quicker to get hot under the collar than others, but if, together, they find fault with your stuff, maybe it isn't smoke. I say MAYBE, as I'm not convinced you are here to serve other interests. I _would_ say that your health sciences background is not really an asset much, as we are not by and large neuropharmacological practitioners. We treat surgically rather than medically for the most part. If you could get some basic training before posting again, that would help. Cheers SP SignatureTake out the TRAASH to reply Great post Stove. >> Yet. I also incorrectly described the "chewing reflex" as a response to >> ANS activation...namely the parasympathic causes relfex inhibition of [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > Cheers > SP > Great post Stove. Thanks for confirming *where* that puts you. It IS also called LIES. > Poor Timmy, got a auto reply. One that he got some time ago. oh really Return-Path: <a...@insightbb.com> Received: from fed1rmgxi07.cox.net ([12.1.241.201]) by fed1rmmtai07.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.05.02 201-2131-123-102-20050715) with ESMTP id <20051221223219.XQGR3056.fed1rmmtai07.cox....@fed1rmgxi07.cox.net> for <timgdixonnos...@cox.net>; Wed, 21 Dec 2005 17:32:19 -0500 Received: from abuse-att.net ([12.1.241.201]) by fed1rmgxi07.cox.net (InterMail vG.1.00.00.00 201-2136-104-20040331) with ESMTP id <20051221222952.QXMJ19145.fed1rmgxi07.cox....@abuse-att.net> for <timgdixonnos...@cox.net>; Wed, 21 Dec 2005 17:29:52 -0500 Received: (qmail 13410 invoked by uid 204); 21 Dec 2005 17:33:18 -0500 Received: from a...@insightbb.com by mailwallout.sgi.int by uid 201 with qmail-scanner-1.16 ( Clear:. Processed in 1.042357 secs); 21 Dec 2005 22:33:18 -0000 Received: from mamabear.sgi.int (127.0.0.1) by mailwallout.sgi.int with AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP; 21 Dec 2005 17:33:17 -0500 Received: (qmail 13900 invoked by uid 1197); 21 Dec 2005 17:33:17 -0500 Date: 21 Dec 2005 17:33:17 -0500 Message-ID: <20051221223317.7456.qmail@mamabear.sgi.int> X-Orig-OID: 121605-152811-20007 X-OID: 122105-173317-12327-114 To: timgdixonnos...@cox.net (by way of Abuse <a...@insightbb.com>) (by way of abuse <a...@insightbb.com>) From: a...@insightbb.com Subject: Re: Fw: What the *Webby* Busy Body Bitch Does [122105-173317-12327-114] Thank you for contacting the Insight Internet Investigations and Security Services Team. The IIISS team has investigated the abuse that you reported and has taken the appropriate action. Please continue to let us know when such instances occur. If you have any other questions or concerns, please E-mail us at: a...@insightbb.com Thank you for contacting the Insight IISS team. (DISHONEST Timmy goes the all the trouble to change the dates, DUMBER than a box of rocks didn't change the subject title) JanD" <J...@insightbb.com> wrote in message >> news:IUmqf.667203$xm3.454350@attbi_s21... >>> Poor Timmy, got a auto reply. One that he got some time ago. >> oh really > Yes, oh really, dumber than a box of rocks, Timmy > Subject: Re: Fw: What the *Webby* Busy Body Bitch Does >> [122105-173317-12327-114] Tim Dixon" <timgdixon-no-s...@cox.net> wrote in message (THAT'S BOTH MISINFORMATION AND A LIE!) how long do you think it will take with all of us reporting Jan to her ISP before they get tired of having to hear about her and cut her off? Not long I hope. Thats what happened at AOL by the way. > cut and reported Poor Timmy. What did you say? how long do you think it will take with all of us reporting Jan to her ISP before they get tired of having to hear about her and cut her off? Not long I hope. Thats what happened at AOL by the way. (THAT'S BOTH MISINFORMATION AND LIE NUMBER TWO!) ALL THAT WISH TO KEEP RIGHT ON SIDING WITH TIM DIXON ARE GUILTY OF CONDONING BOTH POSTING MISINFORMATION AND LYING. >>> Yet. I also incorrectly described the "chewing reflex" as a response to >>> ANS activation...namely the parasympathic causes relfex inhibition of [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] >> Cheers >> SP "JanD" <JanD@insightbb.com> wrote in message news:O0%qf.67131m6$xm3.363514@attbi_s21... ignore the old hag chester, the lonely old hag, who doesn't have a friend in the world, not even her husband of 40 years |
Enable EMail Alerts
Start New Thread
Reply to this Message