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Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / September 2005

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Getting Bummed Out...

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dr shad j lewis (via google) - 12 Sep 2005 23:59 GMT
For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
patient, "I hate the dentist."

It sometimes makes me think that I've chosen the wrong profession.
dr shad j lewis (via google) - 13 Sep 2005 00:22 GMT
My thoughts are more in order about this.  Correct me if I'm wrong in
any way.

The other week, I had a patient in my office and he was from Africa -
some 3rd world country.  He had a tooth ache, and the tooth needed to
come out.

After I removed the tooth, he thanked me and I asked him if it hurt at
all (as I was doing through the procedure).  He said, Yes, but it was
berable.  He continued, any amount of tolerable pain was worth it to
rid me of weeks to months of pain.  We don't have dentists where I'm
from, and this tooth would have continued to cause me grief.

It got me thinking.  When people tell me, "I hate the dentist" I really
take offense to that.  I spent years in school, thousands of dollars to
help people in a way I enjoy helping them.

It really makes one feel unappreciated.

Which takes me to the point, that some people here just don't know how
good they have it.
Mark & Steven Bornfeld - 13 Sep 2005 00:27 GMT
> My thoughts are more in order about this.  Correct me if I'm wrong in
> any way.
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
> Which takes me to the point, that some people here just don't know how
> good they have it.

    That's a given.  Probably you have it good too.  Difference is, you
probably know it.

Steve

Signature

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

LadyLollipop - 13 Sep 2005 01:44 GMT
> My thoughts are more in order about this.  Correct me if I'm wrong in
> any way.
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
> Which takes me to the point, that some people here just don't know how
> good they have it.

>> I'd call that a wake up call... now the only problem is how to get her
>> to eat tomatoes before she wakes up
>
> It could be some of those new fangled Faradic tomatoes you know...
>
> http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg15621102.200.html

It could be that the dentists here could care less if anyone suffers with:

Trigeminal neuralgia

http://www.tna-support.org/newlook/definition.htm

Trigeminal neuralgia (TN) is not fatal, but it is universally considered to
be the most painful affliction known to medical practice.

Their response is jokes and

yawn.
Peter Bowditch - 13 Sep 2005 12:09 GMT
>Trigeminal neuralgia (TN) is not fatal, but it is universally considered to
>be the most painful affliction known to medical practice.

Bullshit!

Some evidence please, and not from some anti-dentist whacko.
Signature

Peter Bowditch aa #2243
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au
Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

W_B - 13 Sep 2005 22:37 GMT
>>Trigeminal neuralgia (TN) is not fatal, but it is universally considered to
>>be the most painful affliction known to medical practice.
>
>Bullshit!
>
>Some evidence please, and not from some anti-dentist whacko.

Tic Dolereau

Rx: Tegretol
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
LadyLollipop - 14 Sep 2005 00:19 GMT
>>Trigeminal neuralgia (TN) is not fatal, but it is universally considered
>>to
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Some evidence please, and not from some anti-dentist whacko.

This wasn't from what you call an *anti-dentist-wacko*

Take your Bullshit! and apologize!

http://www.tna-support.org/newlook/definition.htm

I will be waiting.
LadyLollipop - 14 Sep 2005 00:46 GMT
>>Trigeminal neuralgia (TN) is not fatal, but it is universally considered
>>to
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Some evidence please,

Do a search, evidence is PLENTIFUL

http://www.google Trigeminal neuralgia

     Web  Results 1 - 10 of about 539,000 for Trigeminal neuralgia
[definition]. (0.19 seconds)
Stormin Mormon - 16 Sep 2005 00:36 GMT
Yep, we sure have a bunch of ingrates in the US. I've heard a bunch of cases
of pure ingrattitude from the New Orleans area. I sure try to do my part, by
being grateful (and saying so) to folks.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 Do good work.
 It's longer in the short run
 but shorter in the long run.
.
.

My thoughts are more in order about this.  Correct me if I'm wrong in
any way.

The other week, I had a patient in my office and he was from Africa -
some 3rd world country.  He had a tooth ache, and the tooth needed to
come out.

After I removed the tooth, he thanked me and I asked him if it hurt at
all (as I was doing through the procedure).  He said, Yes, but it was
berable.  He continued, any amount of tolerable pain was worth it to
rid me of weeks to months of pain.  We don't have dentists where I'm
from, and this tooth would have continued to cause me grief.

It got me thinking.  When people tell me, "I hate the dentist" I really
take offense to that.  I spent years in school, thousands of dollars to
help people in a way I enjoy helping them.

It really makes one feel unappreciated.

Which takes me to the point, that some people here just don't know how
good they have it.
s.c.madden@comcast.net - 16 Sep 2005 01:09 GMT
You said:
Some here just do not know how good they have it.

So true Shad.  We are spoiled and we do not even realize it.

Don't get dicsouraged. Pts are just scared.

If you have many patients who are fearful of the dentist, maybe you
could invest in some of the painless sorts of  procedures that are
offerred now... and promote your office as one of those Comfort types
of offices...Conscious Sedation types...

Use the injectionless anesthetic .. Oragix or whatever it is called...

Or get some of those books by Mac Lee... to put in your waiting room.

Actually maybe you need a really sweet assistant or hygienist ... a
calm and mature-type who comes across very  reassuring...

Don't take this wrong, but sometimes people are put at ease by a calm
woman

...then you can do your stuff...

I hope these suggestions make sense ...

Dentists PLEASE help me out here.

Thanks,
Sue
letsconnect - 16 Sep 2005 02:01 GMT
s.c.mad...@comcast.net wrote:

> Don't get dicsouraged. Pts are just scared.
>
> If you have many patients who are fearful of the dentist, maybe you
> could invest in some of the painless sorts of  procedures that are
> offerred now... and promote your office as one of those Comfort types
> of offices...Conscious Sedation types...

I find it weird that painless would be equated to conscious sedation
(and, by implication, DOCS)... just another hype. Not saying that it
doesn't work for some, but IMHO it's being overpromoted as it is. But:
it entirely depends on your market. Works for some folks.

> Use the injectionless anesthetic .. Oragix or whatever it is called...

Only good for soft tissues. Can work for root planing&scaling. No use
for much else, as far as I'm aware.

> Or get some of those books by Mac Lee... to put in your waiting room.

I'm not saying the book isn't good, but you can bet your life that it
won't do much to alleviate anxiety unless you're talking about someone
who's mildly anxious about a specific procedure. In which case a more
personable option would be to explain the procedure, rather than have
your patient sit down with a book. But I understand that the system in
the US is such that dentists rush around between patients and don't
actually get the chance to do that. So a book might be better than
nothing.

> Actually maybe you need a really sweet assistant or hygienist ... a
> calm and mature-type who comes across very  reassuring...

Might work for some of the guys :-P

Dunno, maybe I'm just not in tune with what's going on...
s.c.madden@comcast.net - 16 Sep 2005 03:13 GMT
Letsconnect,

I am the one who is out of tune.  I was just trying to think of some
stuff (any stuff).  You deal with patient anxieties on your website.
What would you suggest for Shad as the dentist.

What can he do to help patients feel less anxious?

Thanks,
Sue
Flap - 16 Sep 2005 07:46 GMT
Letsconnect,

I am the one who is out of tune.  I was just trying to think of some
stuff (any stuff).  You deal with patient anxieties on your website.
What would you suggest for Shad as the dentist.

What can he do to help patients feel less anxious?

Thanks,
Sue

Flap's Reply:

Breath Mints?  :oD~~~~~~~~~

Flap

http://flapsblog.com
s.c.madden@comcast.net - 16 Sep 2005 15:29 GMT
Falp (I mean Flap),

Now that is really b-a-a-a-a-h-h-
b-a-a-a-a-a-d.... but funny :-)

Once you haev spent a few nights sleeping
with sheep, somehow the ridiculous seems to makes sense after awhile.

-Sue
letsconnect - 18 Sep 2005 20:49 GMT
If my memory serves me correctly, Suzanne Boswell summed up the lowest
common denominator in two words: "Loosen up". After that... depends.

> I am the one who is out of tune.  I was just trying to think of some
> stuff (any stuff).  You deal with patient anxieties on your website.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Thanks,
> Sue
W_B - 19 Sep 2005 20:12 GMT
>If my memory serves me correctly, Suzanne Boswell summed up the lowest
>common denominator in two words: "Loosen up". After that... depends.

Incontinent ?
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
Vaughn - 19 Sep 2005 21:29 GMT
>>If my memory serves me correctly, Suzanne Boswell summed up the lowest
>>common denominator in two words: "Loosen up". After that... depends.
>
> Incontinent ?

    I was wondering also, "depends" or "Depends"?  Is this thread still about
bumms?

Vaughn
W_B - 19 Sep 2005 21:45 GMT
>>>If my memory serves me correctly, Suzanne Boswell summed up the lowest
>>>common denominator in two words: "Loosen up". After that... depends.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
>Vaughn

Um. well, that Depends <g>
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
Amatus Cremona - 19 Sep 2005 22:24 GMT
>     I was wondering also, "depends" or "Depends"?  Is this thread still
> about bumms?

Reminds me of the survey question they asked Joel at the clothing store.
They asked if he was wearing briefs or boxers.  His response was  "well,
depends".

Sorry Joel (I could not resist)

Signature

/

Amatus

/

>
>>>If my memory serves me correctly, Suzanne Boswell summed up the lowest
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> Vaughn
Mark & Steven Bornfeld - 13 Sep 2005 00:26 GMT
> For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
> patient, "I hate the dentist."
>
> It sometimes makes me think that I've chosen the wrong profession.

    You must be joking!
    When I was young and single, I only noticed when young attractive women
would say "Nothing personal, but..."
    I used to check my breath a lot.

Steve

Signature

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

W_B - 13 Sep 2005 18:50 GMT
>> For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
>> patient, "I hate the dentist."
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
>Steve

Used to say that if I had a dollar for every time I heard that, I wouldn't have to work.
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
Mark & Steven Bornfeld - 13 Sep 2005 19:03 GMT
> Used to say that if I had a dollar for every time I heard that, I wouldn't have to work.

    You too?  I thought I heard it because I look like Woody Allen.

Steve
> --
>
> W_B
> Take out the G'RBAGE
> wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com

Signature

Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

Stovepipe - 14 Sep 2005 13:55 GMT
> > Used to say that if I had a dollar for every time I heard that, I
> > wouldn't have to work.
>
>       You too?  I thought I heard it because I look like Woody Allen.
>
> Steve

OH THAT POOR MAN!!!!

(Woody, I mean....)       ;-)

SP

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Jorge Bonilla - 13 Sep 2005 01:12 GMT
> For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
> patient, "I hate the dentist."
>
> It sometimes makes me think that I've chosen the wrong profession.

Put up a small sign that says "People who hate dentists will be charged
extra". That should be the end of the problem.
Jorge Bonilla DMD
Stovepipe - 14 Sep 2005 13:55 GMT
> > For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
> > patient, "I hate the dentist."
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> extra". That should be the end of the problem.
> Jorge Bonilla DMD

Excellent idea!

SP
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carabelli - 13 Sep 2005 01:30 GMT
> For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
> patient, "I hate the dentist."
>
> It sometimes makes me think that I've chosen the wrong profession.

Most of the time it means "I'm scared of the dentist"

And that is because of what someone has told them, or they had a crummy,
uncaring dentist.  Then they avoid visits until there's a problem that could
have been treated comfortably if they had come in sooner.

carabelli
Vaughn - 13 Sep 2005 01:41 GMT
> Most of the time it means "I'm scared of the dentist"
>
> And that is because of what someone has told them, or they had a crummy,
> uncaring dentist.  Then they avoid visits until there's a problem that could
> have been treated comfortably if they had come in sooner.

    Well, I have never run into a proctoligist that I would classify as
"crummy" or "uncaring", and they certainly don't scare me, but still...

Vaughn
Vaughn - 13 Sep 2005 01:43 GMT
>     Well, I have never run into a proctoligist that I would classify as
> "crummy" or "uncaring", and they certainly don't scare me, but still...

    Omigosh!  I just took another look at the title of this thread.

> Vaughn
W_B - 13 Sep 2005 19:09 GMT
>>     Well, I have never run into a proctoligist that I would classify as
>> "crummy" or "uncaring", and they certainly don't scare me, but still...
>
>     Omigosh!  I just took another look at the title of this thread.
>>
>> Vaughn

Seems to me you were just staying 'on topic'.
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
W_B - 13 Sep 2005 19:10 GMT
>> Most of the time it means "I'm scared of the dentist"
>>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
>Vaughn

Thought that you had to *back* into a proctologist...
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
Flap - 13 Sep 2005 01:58 GMT
For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
patient, "I hate the dentist."

It sometimes makes me think that I've chosen the wrong profession.

Flap's Reply:

Cheer up Shad.

They don't really hate YOU.

Damn, I even hate to go to the dentist and mine is an
attractive/personable/reassuring (and very good operator, BTW) woman.

Flap

http://flapsblog.com
carabelli - 13 Sep 2005 04:15 GMT
"Flap" <fullosseousflap@gmail.com> wrote .,.............\
> Damn, I even hate to go to the dentist and mine is an
> attractive/personable/reassuring (and very good operator, BTW) woman.
>
> Flap

So I guess she charges too much?

carabelli
Flap - 13 Sep 2005 05:02 GMT
"Flap" <fullosseousf...@gmail.com> wrote .,.............\
> Damn, I even hate to go to the dentist and mine is an
> attractive/personable/reassuring (and very good operator, BTW) woman.

> Flap

So I guess she charges too much?

carabelli

Flap's Reply:

Nah!

It is the whole set-up...... dentists just creep me out.

Flap

http://flapsblog.com
W_B - 13 Sep 2005 18:48 GMT
>For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
>patient, "I hate the dentist."
>
>It sometimes makes me think that I've chosen the wrong profession.

Make a simple adjustment, when you hear that...
raise the fee.
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
Steven Fawks - 13 Sep 2005 21:12 GMT
> For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
> patient, "I hate the dentist."
>
> It sometimes makes me think that I've chosen the wrong profession.

One of the toughest things about this job is dealing with
the negativity associated with dentistry by the general
public.

Like Dan says, many times that statement is made instead of:

"I'm afraid"  "The last dentist *hurt* me"  "You are going
to be gentle, aren't you?"  "I don't tolerate dental treatment
very well"

Several ways to respond:

"I'll do my best to keep you as comfortable as possible"
"Have you had bad experiences with dental treatment in the past?"
"I haven't found a way to make dental treatment *fun*, but
I will be as gentle as possible"
"If you really *enjoyed* dental treatment, I'd have to refer you to a
psychiatrist (ha, ha)"
"Hmmmmm...I've never heard anyone say that before (ha,ha)"

Talking about it may uncover a need for some type of sedation or
other concern relating to anesthesia.  I'd rather a patient be up
front about their fears and anxieties than to hide them.  One of
the most unpleasant experiences that I've had recently was trying to
start a root canal on a lady who completely fooled me about having
any concerns regarding treatment and then just fell apart at the seams
before I got within 3 feet of the pulp!  After added anesthesia and
turning on the nitrous, I was able to finish.  If I would have known
that she was uptight and hadn't even been able to sleep the night before
treatment, I would not have entered into the appointment casually.
She had arrived smiling and bubbly.  I didn't see it coming at all.

Work on being as gentle and painless as possible while being kind and
understanding.  You will get more "thank you"s and even an occasional
hug.  That helps out weigh some of the negative stuff we have to deal
with.  Being able to forget things quickly also helps (gets easier as
you get older for some reason <G>).

JME,
Fawks
W_B - 13 Sep 2005 23:00 GMT
>Being able to forget things quickly also helps (gets easier as
>you get older for some reason <G>).
>
>JME,
>Fawks

Was gonna respond, just can't remember what I was going to say now.
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
Stovepipe - 14 Sep 2005 13:55 GMT
> >Being able to forget things quickly also helps (gets easier as
> >you get older for some reason <G>).
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> Take out the G'RBAGE
> wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com

Oh, come on... you're only seventy-four....

SP
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W_B - 14 Sep 2005 16:35 GMT
>> On Tue, 13 Sep 2005 20:12:06 GMT, Steven Fawks <tuthjockey@earthlink.net>
>wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
>SP

Will you still need me
Will you still feed me...
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
Stovepipe - 14 Sep 2005 17:03 GMT
> >> On Tue, 13 Sep 2005 20:12:06 GMT, Steven Fawks <tuthjockey@earthlink.net>
> >wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
> Take out the G'RBAGE
> wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com

Hmmm ... You should've had your answer to  that ten year'n ago...

SP
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Tim Dixon - 14 Sep 2005 17:11 GMT
>>> On Tue, 13 Sep 2005 20:12:06 GMT, Steven Fawks
>>> <tuthjockey@earthlink.net>
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> Will you still need me
> Will you still feed me...when i'm 64

Thats 64, not 74
Stovepipe - 14 Sep 2005 13:55 GMT
> > For the record, ....
> One of the toughest things about this job is dealing with
> the negativity associated with dentistry by the general
> public.

<snip>

> Several ways to respond:
>
> "I'll do my best to keep you as comfortable as possible"
> "Have you had bad experiences with dental treatment in the past?"

This is curious: we were told repeatedly NOT to ask this question, as it
tend to transfer the association between the dentist/unpleasant
situation onto _your_ shoulders, as the patient relives the agony as
s/he describes it. I guess there's a way to ask for just the general
jist of the problem without getting them down to the gory details...

> Work on being as gentle and painless as possible while being kind and
> understanding.  You will get more "thank you"s and even an occasional
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> JME,
> Fawks

Thanks for these reminders

SP
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Stormin Mormon - 16 Sep 2005 00:36 GMT
I'm glad I'm not a police officer. Or a plumber.

Though, I admit I've done plenty of plumbing work for friends.

Signature

Christopher A. Young
 Do good work.
 It's longer in the short run
 but shorter in the long run.
.
.

For the record, I'm getting a little upset every time I hear from a
patient, "I hate the dentist."

It sometimes makes me think that I've chosen the wrong profession.
W_B - 16 Sep 2005 15:55 GMT
>I'm glad I'm not a police officer. Or a plumber.
>
>Though, I admit I've done plenty of plumbing work for friends.

Plumbing the bum, no doubt.
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
 
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