Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / September 2005
titanium implant and chelation
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nogggin - 07 Sep 2005 01:42 GMT I am considering chelation therapy using alpha lipoic acid and possibly oral dmsa. I am going to have all of the amalgam fillings in my teeth removed before doing so. I have however recently had a titanium dental implant done. Does anyone have any experience with chelating a person with titanium in their mouth? Is it a bad idea to chelate with titanium, as it is with mercury? Will the chelating agents act on the titanium, causing redistribution, in the same way that they do mercury?
Joel344 - 07 Sep 2005 01:55 GMT You wrote,
nogggin I am considering chelation therapy using alpha lipoic acid an possibly oral dmsa.
REPLY
Hi Nog,
I wouldn't try to stop you ......
I am going to have all of the amalgam fillings in my teeth removed before doing so. I have however recently had a titanium dental implant done. Does anyone have any experience with chelating a person with titanium in their mouth?
Nope.
Is it a bad idea to chelate with titanium, as it is with mercury? Will the chelating agents act on the titanium, causing redistribution, in the same way that they d mercury?
I dunno
-- Joel34
Joel M. Eichen - 07 Sep 2005 09:04 GMT Yo Nogster,
Unfortunately you have little idea how chelation works. We dentists do.
For example a calcified root canal space needs to be cleared. We force some EDTA (brand name RC-Prep) down into the canal, swish it up and down a bit and it CHELATES out the calcium from the mineral that is obturating the space.
EDTA is a quaternery ammonium compound that is useful as chelation product. Now tell me more about what you are trying to do?
Joel M. Eichen DDS
Joel
>You wrote, > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > >I dunno. Joel M. Eichen - 07 Sep 2005 10:51 GMT Ethylene diamine tetraacetate!
>Yo Nogster, > [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] >> >>I dunno. nogggin - 08 Sep 2005 00:01 GMT > Now tell me more about what you are trying to do? Thank you for responding to my post.
I'm trying to rid my brain of mercury, most of which was more than likely deposited there from vaccines. I have aspergers. I have four children, three of whom are affected to varying degrees by thimerosal in their vaccines. I have read much on the matter and I do believe that chelation would benefit me, as well as my children, although I am less inclined to seek treatment for them than I am for myself. Unfortunately I have a health care plan which covers only traditional medical doctors, who are told what to believe and what to say and what to treat and how by the medical organizations which are funded by the pharmaceutical companies which poisoned me to begin with. And so, I'm left to deal with the matter on my own. Faced with a lack of any information regarding how my titanium implant might react to chelating agents commonly used for lead and mercury chelation, I have no choice of course but to assume that I will cause myself more harm thru self treatment. I knew somebody years and years ago who had a young daughter who was being treated for lead poisoning. She got worse during the treatment, and he found out during the process that it was due to her amalgam fillings not having been removed prior to treatment.
Joel M. Eichen - 08 Sep 2005 01:22 GMT >> Now tell me more about what you are trying to do? > >Thank you for responding to my post. > >I'm trying to rid my brain of mercury, most of which was more than >likely deposited there from vaccines. I have aspergers. Sorry I cannot help. There is but one person who continues to help people about mercury. Perhaps she will answer your questions.
Joel M. Eichen DDS
> I have four >children, three of whom are affected to varying degrees by thimerosal [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >treatment, and he found out during the process that it was due to her >amalgam fillings not having been removed prior to treatment. nogggin - 08 Sep 2005 12:52 GMT >Sorry I cannot help. There is but one person who continues to help >people about mercury. Perhaps she will answer your questions. And who would that be?
Joel344 - 08 Sep 2005 13:00 GMT Her name is Jan Drew but she also posts under LadyLollipop.
I have loads of information about chemistry, biochemistry and nutritio and consider myself an expert on these subjects both through academi study and general interest, but I am declining to comment on thi public board as this is primarily dentistry.
Joel M. Eichen DDS
Joe
-- Joel34
Amatus Cremona - 08 Sep 2005 12:39 GMT > I'm trying to rid my brain of mercury, most of which was more than > likely deposited there from vaccines. I have aspersers. I have four > children, three of whom are affected to varying degrees by thimerosal > in their vaccines. I have read much on the matter and I do believe that > chelation would benefit me, as well as my children, although I am less > inclined to seek treatment for them than I am for myself. I figured you were not serious
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Amatus
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> >> Now tell me more about what you are trying to do? [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > treatment, and he found out during the process that it was due to her > amalgam fillings not having been removed prior to treatment. CWatters - 09 Sep 2005 08:06 GMT > > Now tell me more about what you are trying to do? > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > in their vaccines. I have read much on the matter and I do believe that > chelation would benefit me, as well as my children, Just take care... http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05237/559756.stm
CWatters - 09 Sep 2005 08:10 GMT > I knew somebody years and years ago who had a young daughter > who was being treated for lead poisoning. She got worse during the > treatment, and he found out during the process that it was due to her > amalgam fillings not having been removed prior to treatment. That was convenient. It couldn't possibly be an adverse reaction to the chelation treatment could it so lets blame the fillings.
Sdores - 09 Sep 2005 12:38 GMT Sorry I can't seem to get it off center and post it like normal. I thought this might be useful to the original poster. Thank you Peter for bringing this to everyone's attention. (this was posted to another board) I hope this is helpful. UM MOM Susan
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05237/559756.stm
Boy dies during autism treatment Thursday, August 25, 2005
By Karen Kane and Virginia Linn, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
A 5-year-old autistic boy died Tuesday in a Butler County doctor's office while undergoing an increasingly popular though controversial medical treatment touted by some as a cure for the lifelong neurological and developmental disorder.
Abubakar Tariq Nadama died while receiving chelation therapy, an intravenous injection of a synthetic amino acid that latches onto heavy metals and is then passed in the urine.
State police at Butler are investigating Nadama's death, which occurred at about 10:50 a.m. Tuesday in the office of Dr. Roy Eugene Kerry in Portersville.
Authorities said Kerry's office reported that the child was receiving an IV treatment for lead poisoning when he went into cardiac arrest.
The boy was being treated with EDTA, or ethylene diamine tetraacetic acid, which has been approved by the Food and Drug Administration for use only after blood tests confirm acute heavy-metal poisoning.
Exposure to heavy metals, especially mercury, has been linked by some researchers as a contributing cause to autism. Removing those metals, they believe, can improve a child's condition. The theory is a matter of dispute among scientists and within the autism community.
A family friend said the boy and his mother, Marwa, who are from England, moved here in the spring, specifically to receive chelation therapy, and were living in Monroeville.
In the autism community, the use of chelation as a way to detoxify environmental contaminants in children has exploded since 2000 as more and more families have reported miraculous improvements and even cures. But skeptics in the community say they fear the procedure is at best risky and possibly lethal.
"It was just a matter of time before something like this would happen," said Howard Carpenter, executive director of the Advisory Board on Autism-Related Disorders.
"Parents of children with autism are desperate. Some are willing to try anything," he said.
"I can't sit there and endorse it as a viable treatment. It's not something published in peer review journals and studies," said Dr. Gary Swanson, a child psychiatrist at Allegheny General Hospital who works with autism patients. "It's probably a quack kind of medicine."
If the child's death is tied to chelation therapy, it would be the first associated with the procedure since the 1950s, said Dr. Ralph Miranda of Greensburg. Miranda is the former president of the American College for Advancement in Medicine, a group that sets clinical practice and education standards for chelation and other, similar therapies.
Chelation can be administered through pills, skin creams or other transdermal methods, nasal sprays, sauna baths and intravenously. Miranda said it is unusual to give a young child IV treatments unless he has an extremely high level of heavy metals.
He said although EDTA is a "very safe drug" he usually administers an oral form of chelation drugs to children to remove toxins because pills are safer. It does, however, take longer to remove the toxins with the pills.
"There are people out there suggesting using the IV to get faster results. I'm not," he said.
Marwa Nadama said yesterday she did not want to comment except to say that she is not blaming chelation for her son's death, at least not at this point.
"Let's wait until we have the results of the autopsy," she said.
An autopsy conducted yesterday on the child's body by the Allegheny County coroner's office was inconclusive. Results on the cause and manner of death are pending additional testing which could take up to five months to complete, authorities said.
Kerry, who is a board-certified physician and surgeon, advertises himself as an ear, nose and throat specialist, dealing with allergies and environmental medicine. He operates out of offices in Greenville and Portersville under the name Advanced Integrative Medicine Center Inc. Kerry did not return calls to his offices yesterday.
Doctors affiliated with the National Institutes of Mental Health and American Academy of Pediatrics do not endorse the use of chelation therapy to remove heavy metals for autism. Such drugs used in the process can cause liver and kidney damage and other problems.
Cindy Waeltermann, director of the Pittsburgh-based national advocacy group AutismLink, issued a statement to members yesterday warning that caution needs to be used as parents seek help for their autistic children.
"Please, before you try any new therapies, we urge you to research the physician, the methods, and the safety. Some of these therapies are quite dangerous. We're not telling you what to do, we're just urging you to use caution. We all do what we think is best for our children, and sometimes we are desperate. While we've heard stories of chelation success, it is definitely a dangerous process," Waelterman wrote.
She said parents on her group's online forum have referred to Kerry as a known practitioner of chelation therapy.
News of the death soared across the autism community yesterday, alarming proponents and foes of the treatment.
"It's just terrible. My heart is just dying for the family," said J.B. Handley of San Francisco, who helped found Generation Rescue, an international advocacy program for the use of biomedical treatments that include chelation therapy to help autistic children.
He claims his son Jamison, now 3, has dramatically improved since undergoing chelation therapy to remove mercury, the metal most associated with autism because of its presence in some childhood vaccines. He and his wife launched their international group in May.
He said that, in 2000, perhaps a dozen autistic children were treated with chelation therapy. This year, it's more than 10,000.
Amatus Cremona - 07 Sep 2005 14:17 GMT >I am considering chelation therapy using alpha lipoic acid and possibly > oral dmsa I don't suppose you want a serious reply
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Amatus
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>I am considering chelation therapy using alpha lipoic acid and possibly > oral dmsa. I am going to have all of the amalgam fillings in my teeth [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > titanium, as it is with mercury? Will the chelating agents act on the > titanium, causing redistribution, in the same way that they do mercury? Joel M. Eichen - 07 Sep 2005 14:29 GMT >>I am considering chelation therapy using alpha lipoic acid and possibly >> oral dmsa > >I don't suppose you want a serious reply REPLY
Sadly, these chelation folks are very serious .......
W_B - 07 Sep 2005 19:34 GMT >>>I am considering chelation therapy using alpha lipoic acid and possibly >>> oral dmsa [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >Sadly, these chelation folks are very serious ....... Yes, seriously relieved of excess funds. --
W_B Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
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