Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / July 2005
WSJ: Common Industrial Chemicals In Tiny Doses Raise Health Issue
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Ilena Rose - 26 Jul 2005 04:17 GMT Note from Ilena: I am in total shock ... year 2005 and the Wall Street Journal is reporting this. I finally have some hope that the issue of Multiple Chemical Sensitivies comes out of the dark ages ... and into the light. The junkscience.com/ACSH.org / quackwatch.com reporting on MCS has been over distributed and is proving more wrong all the time. This article definitely shines a bright light on many emerging issues. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ July 25, 2005
Common Industrial Chemicals In Tiny Doses Raise Health Issue
Advanced Tests Often Detect Subtle Biological Effects; Are Standards Too Lax? Getting in Way of Hormones By PETER WALDMAN Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
For years, scientists have struggled to explain rising rates of some cancers and childhood brain disorders. Something about modern living has driven a steady rise of certain maladies, from breast and prostate cancer to autism and learning disabilities.
One suspect now is drawing intense scrutiny: the prevalence in the environment of certain industrial chemicals at extremely low levels. A growing body of animal research suggests to some scientists that even minute traces of some chemicals, always assumed to be biologically insignificant, can affect such processes as gene activation and the brain development of newborns.
An especially striking finding: It appears that some substances may have effects at the very lowest exposures that are absent at higher levels.
Some scientists, many of them in industry, dismiss such concerns. But the new science of low-dose exposure is challenging centuries of accepted wisdom about toxic substances and rattling the foundation of environmental law.
Modern pollution restrictions aim to limit exposures to levels past studies have found safe. For example, it's known mercury can cause learning problems in children if it's above 58 parts per billion in the bloodstream. Dividing 58 by 10 to provide a margin of safety, U.S. regulators advise that children and young women not accumulate more than 5.8 parts per billion of mercury, by limiting consumption of certain fish such as tuna.
But what if it turned out some common substances have essentially no safe exposure levels at all? That was ultimately what the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency concluded about lead after studying its effects on children for decades. Indications some other chemicals may have no safe limits have led regulators in Europe and Japan to bar the use of certain compounds in toys and in objects used to serve food. In the U.S., federal scientists are devising new tests that could be used to screen thousands of common chemicals to make sure they're safe at extremely low exposures.
Using advanced lab techniques, scientists have found that with some chemicals, traces as minute as mere parts per trillion have biological effects. That's one-millionth of the smallest traces even measurable three decades ago, when many of today's environmental laws were written. With some of these chemicals, such trace levels exist in the blood and urine of the general population.
Some chemical traces appear to have greater effects in combination than singly, another challenge to traditional toxicology, which tests things individually.
The human body is complex, and effects seen in tests on small laboratory animals and in human cells don't necessarily mean health risks to people. "The question is what do we do about these low levels once we know they're there," says Steve Hentges of the American Plastics Council, a trade association.
For their part, companies and industry groups have attacked low-dose research as alarmist and are challenging the findings with scientific studies of their own. Some industry studies have contradicted the low-dose findings of university and government labs. One reason, says Rochelle Tyl, a toxicologist who does rodent studies on contract for industry groups, is that academics seek "to find out if a chemical has an intrinsic capacity to do harm," while industry scientists try to measure actual dangers to people.
The result is that low-dose research has sparked a number of heated scientific and regulatory controversies:
· Tiny doses of bisphenol A, which is used in polycarbonate plastic baby bottles and in resins that line food cans, have been found to alter brain structure, neurochemistry, behavior, reproduction and immune response in animals. Makers and users of the chemical maintain, citing a Harvard review of 19 studies, that the chemical is harmless to humans at such levels.
· Minute levels of phthalates, which are used in toys, building materials, drug capsules, cosmetics and perfumes, have been statistically linked to sperm damage in men and genital changes, asthma and allergies in children. The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has detected comparable levels in Americans' urine. Manufacturers say there is no reliable evidence that phthalates cause any health problems.
· A chemical used in munitions, called perchlorate, is known to inhibit production of thyroid hormone, which children need for brain development. The chemical has been detected in drinking-water supplies in 35 states, as well as in fruits, vegetables and breast milk. The EPA has spent years mulling what is a safe level in drinking water. The Defense Department and weapons makers maintain it is harmless at much higher doses than those that Americans ingest.
· The weed killer atrazine has been linked to sexual malformations in frogs that were exposed to water containing just 1/30th as much atrazine as the EPA regards as safe in human drinking water. The herbicide's main manufacturer, Syngenta AG, says other studies prove atrazine is safe. The EPA favors more study.
With so much still unknown, regulators are proceeding on different tracks in different countries. Japan's government designates about 70 chemicals as potential "endocrine disruptors" -- substances that may, at tiny doses, interfere with hormonal signals that regulate human organ development, metabolism and other functions. Japan has just completed a $135 million research push on endocrine disruptors, including setting up a national research center. The Japanese government also has banned certain phthalates in food handlers' gloves and containers, after detecting them in food. One manufacturer, Fujitsu Ltd., has pledged to phase out its use of most suspected endocrine disruptors over coming years.
The European Union has banned some kinds of phthalates in cosmetics and toys, and it is considering a ban on nearly all phthalates in household goods and medical devices. The EU also is planning to require new safety tests for thousands of industrial chemicals, many of which already exist in people's bodies at trace levels. Industry, which would have to bear the cost of proving countless current products safe, is fighting the measures, calling them a massive unnecessary burden.
In the U.S., there are divisions within the government. The White House plays down the issue, saying the low-dose hypothesis is unproved. But many federal scientists and regulators at the EPA and Health and Human Services Department are forging ahead with new methods for assessing possible low-dose dangers. Legislatures in two states, California and New York, are considering bills that would ban use of certain phthalates in toys, child-care products and cosmetics, while a California bill would restrict bisphenol A.
Earliest Concerns
One of the early scientists to focus on possible low-dose risks was biologist Theo Colborn of the World Wildlife Fund. Studying the decline of certain birds, mammals and fish in the upper Midwest, Dr. Colborn spotted some patterns: Species that struggled to survive in the industrialized Great Lakes thrived in inland areas that were less polluted. And some offspring in more-polluted regions had gender abnormalities, such as feminized sex organs in males. She theorized that trace amounts of chemicals in the environment were disrupting hormones.
Dr. Colborn and colleagues popularized low-dose concerns in a series of conferences, articles and a best-selling 1996 book called "Our Stolen Future." That year the EPA asked an outside advisory panel to consider ways of screening industrial chemicals for hormonal effects, a process still incomplete.
In 2000, a separate EPA-organized panel, after reviewing 49 studies, said some hormonally active chemicals affect animals at doses as low as the "background levels" to which the general human population is subject. The panel said the health implications weren't clear but urged the EPA to revisit its regulatory procedures to make sure such chemicals are tested in animals at appropriately small doses.
The EPA hesitated. It responded in 2002 that "until there is an improved scientific understanding of the low-dose hypothesis, EPA believes that it would be premature to require routine testing of substances for low-dose effects."
The Bush administration's regulatory czar, John Graham -- administrator of the Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs at the White House Office of Management and Budget -- later publicly dismissed as unproven the idea that the hormonal system could be disrupted by multiple low-dose exposures to industrial chemicals. For the past two years, the administration has proposed funding cuts for EPA research on suspected endocrine disrupters, but Congress has kept the funding roughly level at about $10 million a year.
Since the review panel met in 2000, scientists have published more than 100 peer-reviewed articles reporting further low-dose effects in living animals and in human cells. These findings are generating some early insights in the thorny process of translating laboratory data into conclusions about human health.
Less Is More
One of the most provocative is that some hormonally active chemicals seem to have more effects at extremely low exposures than at higher ones. This challenges an axiom of toxicology stated by the Swiss chemist Paracelsus nearly 500 years ago: The dose makes the poison.
Toxicologists traditionally derive risk by exposing rodents to chemicals to find the lowest dose that leads to tumors, birth defects or other readily observable effects. Regulators then divide the highest "no-observable-effect" dose by an "uncertainty factor" -- anywhere from 10 to 1,000 -- to set a maximum human exposure they can be confident is safe.
But now researchers have found chemicals that have hormonal effects on lab animals and on human cells in much tinier amounts than their standard no-observable-effect levels. And with some of these chemicals, as the tiny doses given to animals are increased, the effects recede. Then, at much higher levels, broad systemic impacts appear, such as reduced body weight.
An example is bisphenol A, or BPA, the ingredient in polycarbonate baby bottles and food-can linings. It evidently is widespread in the environment. In the U.S., the CDC has found traces of it in 95% of urine samples tested. In Japan, researchers have detected BPA in fetal amniotic fluid and the umbilical cords of newborns.
Studying BPA in rats in 1988, the EPA concluded the lowest exposure with an "observed adverse effect" was 50 milligrams a day per kilogram of body weight (one kilogram = 2.2 pounds). Dividing 50 by an uncertainty factor of 1,000, the agency set a daily safe limit for humans of 0.05 milligrams of BPA per kilogram of body weight. Since then, however, academic scientists in several countries have done more than 90 studies that have found BPA effects on animals and human cell cultures from exposures well below this level.
The EPA used a relatively crude measure of the chemical's effects: changes in rodents' body weights. The new studies looked at subtler, hormone-related effects. Some studies found changes in rodents' reproductive organs and brains at doses as low as 0.002 milligram per kilogram of body weight per day. That is just one-25,000th the dose that the EPA said was the lowest exposure having an observable adverse effect.
Disrupting Hormones
Seeking to explain this pattern, scientists cite the endocrine system's exquisite sensitivity. Animals and humans secrete infinitesimal amounts of various hormones, such as estrogen, that trigger responses when they occupy special receptors on the cells of various organs. BPA is among numerous chemicals that can mimic estrogen by occupying cells' estrogen receptors. When they do this at critical phases of development, the chemicals can trigger unnatural biological responses, such as brain and reproductive abnormalities.
At higher doses, however, BPA and other endocrine disruptors -- instead of triggering the unnatural responses -- appear to overwhelm the receptors. That explains, scientists say, why some chemicals seem to have more potent hormonal effects at very low doses than at higher ones.
Mr. Hentges of the American Plastics Council says studies show BPA is harmless at the tiny levels to which humans are exposed. In 2001 the plastics council agreed to pay Harvard's Center for Risk Analysis, part of the Harvard School of Public Health, $600,000 to review BPA studies. The 10 panelists found "no consistent affirmative evidence of low-dose BPA effects" on the basis of 19 studies that were selected by April 2002 for review.
However, many more BPA studies kept coming out, and when the center published its report last fall, three of the 10 panelists declined to be listed as authors. "There are other papers published after the 'cut-off' date that the panel did not review that may have altered their conclusions," says one of the three, Paul Foster of the National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences. A fourth, Claude Hughes of Quintiles Transnational Corp., a pharmaceutical consulting firm, signed but made the same point in a journal commentary criticizing the report and calling for a new EPA risk assessment. The Harvard risk center's executive director, George Gray, acknowledges that a "torrent of new papers on BPA" may have made it impossible for the panel to review everything by its deadline.
The plastics council's Mr. Hentges says his group reviews all studies on BPA and believes none have changed the basic conclusion of the Harvard report. "We continue to believe that the weight of evidence indicates BPA poses no risk to human health," he says.
Chemicals in Combination
Environmental chemicals don't exist in isolation. People are exposed to many different ones in trace amounts. So scientists at the University of London checked a mixture. They tested the hormonal strength of a blend of 11 common chemicals that can mimic estrogen.
Alone, each was very weak. But when scientists mixed low doses of all 11 in a solution with natural estrogen -- thus simulating the chemical cocktail that's inside the human body today -- they found the hormonal strength of natural estrogen was doubled. Such an effect inside the body could disrupt hormonal action.
"In isolation, the contribution of individual [estrogen-like chemicals] at the concentrations found in wildlife and human tissues will always be small," wrote the scientists, led by Andreas Kortenkamp, who directs research on endocrine disruptors for the EU. But because such compounds are so widespread in the environment, the researchers concluded, the cumulative effect on the human endocrine system is "likely to be very large."
To test chemicals, toxicologists traditionally dose animals with a single substance and then dissect them. But this method can't spot the subtle effects associated with today's multiple exposures to low-dose chemicals, says John Bucher, of the National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences.
Now he and his boss, Christopher Portier, are revamping the federal government's National Toxicology Program, which sets standards for how chemicals are tested. Over about seven years, they hope to develop a series of lab tests that will ultimately screen some 100,000 industrial compounds, individually and in mixtures, for biochemical "markers" such as effects on specific genes.
The chemicals then will be ranked by mechanism of action and suspected toxicity, and assigned priorities for further study. "It's taken us 25 years and $2 billion to study 900 chemicals," Dr. Portier says. "If this works, we can study 15,000 in a year."
Peter Meiers - 26 Jul 2005 05:38 GMT Ilena Rose schrieb:
> An especially striking finding: It appears that some substances may > have effects at the very lowest exposures that are absent at higher > levels. I´m sure that some people will tell you of an effective remedy: raise exposure levels and everything will be OK. :-(
Best, Peter
--- History of fluorine, fluoride and fluoridation: --- --- http://www.fluoride-history.de/index.htm ---
wc - 26 Jul 2005 12:05 GMT Peter Meiers:
PLEASE stop your crossposting. You and many many many others have almost destroyed the Nurses Newgroup.
If you are sincere, you know better than this. Whatever, you'll be added to my killfile as have hundreds of others.
Shame on you.
Will, crna (anesthetist)
Ilena Rose - 26 Jul 2005 16:05 GMT I can't for the life of me figure out why a nurse would be uninterested in understanding the unfolding of the controversy over chemicals and health ...
I am close to many, many nurses who are open to learning ... nurses are the ones closest to the patients and their ills ...
God help your patients if being exposed to this information 'destroys' your 'group.'
Mark & Steven Bornfeld - 26 Jul 2005 14:59 GMT > Ilena Rose schrieb: > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Best, > Peter Or, the old standby--get a stronger rat.
Steve
> --- History of fluorine, fluoride and fluoridation: --- > --- http://www.fluoride-history.de/index.htm ---
 Signature Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS http://www.dentaltwins.com Brooklyn, NY 718-258-5001
Vaughn - 26 Jul 2005 11:19 GMT > Note from Ilena: Just a bit more off-topic blast-posted sh.t from the Ilena-bot! Have you no shame?
Vaughn
Ilena Rose - 26 Jul 2005 16:40 GMT So Vaughn ... what is shameful about those interested in dentistry learning cutting edge information on the harm of chemicals ... even in small amounts??
> > Note from Ilena: > > Just a bit more off-topic blast-posted sh.t from the Ilena-bot! Have you > no shame? > > Vaughn clintonz@prodigy.net - 26 Jul 2005 18:32 GMT > So Vaughn ... what is shameful about those interested in dentistry > learning cutting edge information on the harm of chemicals ... even in > small amounts?? Learning about the information in small amounts? or that the chemicals are in small amounts?
Indeed very small amounts of information can be very harmful! That was one of my biggest concerns about Joels posts and why I think it was appropriate he was banned.
Let's see, small amounts of toxic chemicals....dentistry small amounts of toxic chemicals....dentistry
Nope. Sorry ....but, I cannot see a connection!
Except, this does however vindicate what people have said about x-rays all along. YOu see turns out that those in the sun most frequently are least likely to get skin cancer. Similary the occasional dose of dental x-rays and Hg from the environment may be FAR MORE HARMFUL than receiving regular x-rays and daily shots of Hg from amalgam. At least that is if the ADA has anything to say about it!
clintonz@prodigy.net - 26 Jul 2005 19:35 GMT > So Vaughn ... what is shameful about those interested in dentistry > learning cutting edge information on the harm of chemicals ... even in > small amounts?? Ilena, PLEASE do not tell the dentists that many chemicals are less toxic in larger amounts. Thanks
W_B - 26 Jul 2005 20:23 GMT >> So Vaughn ... what is shameful about those interested in dentistry >> learning cutting edge information on the harm of chemicals ... even in >> small amounts?? > >Ilena, PLEASE do not tell the dentists that many chemicals are >less toxic in larger amounts. Thanks Reverse Hopeopathy ?
Interesing. --
W_B Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
Ilena Rose - 27 Jul 2005 05:16 GMT >think it was appropriate he was banned. Joel was banned?
How did that happen?
Who banned him?
Thanks.
Steven Fawks - 27 Jul 2005 14:19 GMT Joel wasn't banned. Crazy J got him bounced from his ISP by saving a bunch of stuff and and cutting and pasting it in a way that made it look like Joel was violating his terms of service. He just hasn't come back to smd much since.
Typical internet terrorism.
Fawks
>>think it was appropriate he was banned. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Thanks. Ilena Rose - 27 Jul 2005 15:07 GMT I recall some years ago when Joel took Ms Drew's name and used it for his own alias ...
I have also had that done to me several times by a wacko woman working with a silicone manufacturer ... she would bulk email hate mail under my name ... it was extremely unsettling.
When I heard that Joel had done that to Ms Drew it made me respect him much less.
Some people do things on the internet that they probably wouldn't do in person (for example, I doubt if Joel would wear a Ms Drew mask and pretend to be her in 'real lifel' )
It's not really so different though ...
Joel is also connected with the maniacs at the quackwatch/healthfraud group ... they do many things using disguises that are abominable and harm people's lifes ...
I recently read of an Pharma Attorney for the Vac Machine that got caught terrorizing a discussing group on autism ... pretending to be a 'parent' when he was a paid lawyer for the Vacs ...
www.BreastImplantAwareness.org/quackbustersvsilena.htm
Steven Fawks - 27 Jul 2005 16:54 GMT > Some people do things on the internet that they probably wouldn't do in > person (for example, I doubt if Joel would wear a Ms Drew mask and > pretend to be her in 'real lifel' ) > > It's not really so different though ... It was more like me wearing a Richard Nixon mask at Halloween. There was no pretense to actually be Crazy J. It was sarcasm pure and simple. That person dominated smd with hate, bad advice, religious slurs, and virtually nothing constructive. Joel was protesting.
Most crusaders don't understand it when everyone else doesn't agree with them.
Fawks
Ilena Rose - 27 Jul 2005 17:42 GMT I disagree ... posting under your enemies name is not a joke ...
I had it done to me and I guarantee you ... it was no laughing matter ... and not 'sarcasm' ...
Joel was very wrong to do that ...
carabelli - 27 Jul 2005 18:39 GMT > I disagree ... posting under your enemies name is not a joke ... > > I had it done to me and I guarantee you ... it was no laughing matter > ... and not 'sarcasm' ... > > Joel was very wrong to do that ... Nope, Fawks had it right. Obviously you are totally unfamiliar with the particular situation. It would be similair to me posting as Ilena Petunia. Nobody except a complete idiot thought it was JD.
Nana Weedkiller - 27 Jul 2005 20:01 GMT >> I disagree ... posting under your enemies name is not a joke ... >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > particular situation. It would be similair to me posting as Ilena > Petunia. Nobody except a complete idiot thought it was JD. Yes, it was really hard to distinguish between Joel and Jan; especially when Joel signed his posts "FAKE JAN". I know I had to have someone explain it to me.
Ilena Rose - 27 Jul 2005 21:13 GMT Here are the posts that Joel Eichen posted using Jan Drew's name ... as cute as Ratbags Nidiffer finds this to be ... I find it appaling. Ratbags Nidiffer's fellow Posse member Susan Schaezler used my name to spam my support group ... it's repulsive.
www.BreastImplantAwareness.org/nanaweedkiller.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/posse/whoarewe.htm#Willa
More FACTS about Mercury Amalgams http://www.mercuryfilling.com/ Mercy Jan ... thank you so much for telling everyone that their dentist is poisoning them with metal. This is so helpful. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 5:46 am by Jan - 8 messages - 5 authors
Deep cleaning for $1200 - fraud? Hi, I just went to the first of two deep cleaning sessions with my new dentist. I was really amazed when I had to pay a copayment ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 21 2002, 7:05 am by Jan - 6 messages - 5 authors
Gold and Mercury From: Mike Williams (100755...@compuserve.com) Subject: Gold and Mercury Newsgroups: alt.health.dental-amalgam View: (This is the only article in this thread ... alt.health.dental-amalgam - Jun 19 2002, 4:32 pm by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
IS STAR TREK ANTI-SEMITIC ? Its pronounced Star-Dreck and few people are aware that those spaceships have foot pedals that you press when you want to jettison the contents of the loo. ... alt.politics.bush - Jun 26 2002, 6:37 pm by Jan - 96 messages - 47 authors
filling removal hi my dentist says that its more dangerous to remove amalgam than leave it in palce is this so or is he bullshitting me mark ***** My dentist has a unique ... alt.health.dental-amalgam - Jun 19 2002, 1:04 pm by Jan - 4 messages - 4 authors
Enron - Worldcom-Phillip Morris-ADA Try and spot the difference? Okayyyyyy..... The first three cooked the books and the fourth is either the American Disabilities ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 5:32 am by Jan - 5 messages - 3 authors
Bonding Composit with black bacterial coating You may be referring to sclerotic dentin formation. There is some feelings particularly from some respected dentists and researchers ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 6:02 am by Jan - 4 messages - 4 authors
GREAT book on Amalgam Illness: Diagnosis and Treatment! Misposted. Should have been sent to: alt.fetish.rubber.bodyrubber.strange Usenet Goon Squad ***** From: critter (critter@prontomail ... alt.health.dental-amalgam - Jun 20 2002, 4:31 am by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
Re Mercury Falling Newsgroups: sci.med.dentistry From: jdrew63...@aol.com (Jan) Subject: Re: Re Mercury Falling Date: 14 Jun 2002 02:21:50 GMT Organization: AOL http://www.aol ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 14 2002, 7:14 am by Jan - 18 messages - 7 authors
What is best way to whiten a root canal tooth? They died when the root canal was done. http://www.zip.com.au/~rgammal/ RCTframeset.htm http://www.ericdavisdental.com/root_canals ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 16 2002, 7:21 am by Jan - 12 messages - 7 authors
A vision of a reborn China No Jew$ just destroy and cheat from all ideas. REPLY: Chinese culture is around 4,000 years old. This means for the first thousand years ..... ... soc.culture.asian.american - Jun 26 2002, 6:43 pm by Jan - 9 messages - 7 authors
Tattoo and Keloid Question: I have a tattoo on my arm which became a keloid. I want to cover it up with another tattoo. Will the new one keloid and ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 10:41 am by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
Biting Tongue at Night I have a problem in that as I am falling to sleep I occasionally bite the side of my tongue, the pain then wakes me up, sometimes I can stop my mouth from ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 26 2002, 5:02 am by Jan - 5 messages - 4 authors
Temporary filling question news:<ui2hfbbok7f...@corp.supernews.com>... If you have a large cavity and the dentist puts in medicine (don't know the name of ... sci.med.dentistry - Jul 2 2002, 3:16 am by Jan - 2 messages - 2 authors
Telephone Tooth jdrew63...@aol.com (Jan) wrote in message news:<20020701221254.25449.00001241@ mb-mi.aol.com>... Thus JanDrew spaketh ..... All ... sci.med.dentistry - Jul 2 2002, 3:20 am by Jan - 46 messages - 14 authors
TERRORISM DEFINED For the obvious reasons the American lawmakers who are on Israel's payroll refer to all killing of Israelis as "Terrorism", and to all killings of Palestinians ... soc.culture.jewish - Jun 25 2002, 4:18 am by Jan - 15 messages - 7 authors
Judaism's contribution to the world zyc...@aol.com (ZYCLNB) wrote in message news gave birth to christianity, islam, reverend moon, and bagels. okay, bagels are okay. ... soc.culture.jewish - Jun 24 2002, 5:05 am by Jan - 7 messages - 6 authors
A whole what????? From: Kip King (wodi...@cox.net) Subject: Re: advice request Newsgroups: alt.health.dental-amalgam View this article only Date: 2002-04-28 11:38:44 PST Hi, ... alt.health.dental-amalgam - Jun 19 2002, 1:10 pm by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
singles looking for jewish hearts ! http://www.jewishhearts.com ! REPLY: Cool! If it were "Palestinians looking for jewish hearts," I'd be very worried. No telling ... soc.culture.jewish - Jun 25 2002, 4:39 am by Jan - 2 messages - 2 authors
Kosher Is it the 'koshering' process that makes it bad? How do you make wine kosher? interestingly, no. http://www.gemsinisrael.com/e_article000033155 ...
rec.arts.bodyart - Jul 1 2002, 5:27 pm by Jan - 767 messages - 61 authors
A possible solution...cut off the purse strings from terror Toi eradicate the terror, simply eradicate Israel and Israelis! REPLY FROM FAKEJAN Sure ..... Give those nations billions in oil ... soc.culture.jewish - Jun 25 2002, 4:03 am by Jan - 6 messages - 5 authors
Please post dental accounting software From: NoM...@this.com (NoM...@this.com) Subject: Req: Please post dental accounting software Newsgroups: alt.health.dental-amalgam View: (This is the only ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 20 2002, 4:19 am by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
Engineers develop the 'tooth phone' I got one already and when I do not want to be bothered I call forward the messages to my kidney. Fake Jan sci.med.dentistry - Jun 21 2002, 7:07 am by Jan - 2 messages - 2 authors
Dental Hygiene Education issues Jan, Where did you find this? It's an excellent statement of the issues in dental hygiene regulation. The ADA has been trying to ... sci.med.dentistry - Jul 1 2002, 5:15 pm by Jan - 15 messages - 6 authors
interesting website for professionals and non-professionals A friend sent me this URL today. It's a site built by a British dentist. Lots of interesting info. Pat Buss RDH REPLY: It is called ... sci.med.dentistry - Jul 1 2002, 5:11 pm by Jan - 2 messages - 2 authors
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an abundance of Steves There was a song .... "Too Many Steves ..... Too Little Time ....) Fake Jan I think that Mancuso is really a "Stephen". I am actually ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 20 2002, 4:37 am by Jan - 9 messages - 6 authors
tmj - nti devices For anyone that is overly concerned or perhaps mentally impaired, I recommend that whole-heartedly. -) Fawks One thing that could ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 17 2002, 4:51 am by Jan - 94 messages - 14 authors
FBI Says All Library Patrons Are Terrorists FBI Begins Visiting Libraries http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A37774- 2002Jun24.html So much for going to the library and reading a book. ...
soc.culture.jewish - Jun 25 2002, 4:23 am by Jan - 5 messages - 5 authors
6 month checkup question Newsgroups: sci.med.dentistry From: x...@hotmail.com (XQJ37) Subject: 6 month checkup question Date: 17 Jun 2002 16:59:55 -0700 Organization: http://groups ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 18 2002, 3:36 am by Jan - 8 messages - 6 authors
JEW SMELL What do you shove up your a.s for breakfast? REPLY: Sir ... let me be the first to offer you kindest Kudos. I have rarely seen such ... soc.culture.usa - Jun 25 2002, 3:53 am by Jan - 8 messages - 6 authors
Haaretz defends Turner and CNN www . haaretzdaily . com HAARETZ: "If Ted Turner wants to act like an ignorant a-hole, we defend his right be do so." JDREW (Fake) soc.culture.jewish - Jun 25 2002, 3:56 am by Jan - 5 messages - 5 authors
Just then he shouted, "I have installed my last amalgam." Hong Kong Dentist Commits Suicide. Overburdened by too much guilt from placing many amalgams. **** This ... sci.med.dentistry - Jul 2 2002, 5:48 am by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
How to best find new dentist in Bklyn, NY You should consider coming to the Stony Brook Dental School clinic. We are a short train ride or drive from Brooklyn. An initial exam is $35. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 26 2002, 4:49 am by Jan - 19 messages - 13 authors
Jan Drew and metal From: Jan (jdrew63...@aol.com) Subject: Re: Mercury damages nerve cells Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative View: Complete Thread (20 articles) | Original ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 27 2002, 4:29 am by Jan - 9 messages - 6 authors
Dental implant for feeding mother? Ah yes ... with people living longer and longer these days, we have to deal with the ravages of Alzheimer's, senile dementia, and just plain crankiness. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 26 2002, 5:09 am by Jan - 4 messages - 4 authors
Help Filtering; Jan vs. Fake Jan jdrew63...@aol.com (Jan) > Uh huh, he picked up on that to cover himself, he did not do that in the beginning. He is doing it for ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 21 2002, 7:15 am by Jan - 17 messages - 8 authors
Dentists and physicians are in denial More people need good alt treatment because doctors are in denial. Please see this EXCELLENT advice, especially the part about turning ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 23 2002, 2:29 am by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
Did anyone in smd send this to me? It could be that sneaky klez virus that is still around and mutating. Check your Symantec updates frequently. REPLY: The klez virus ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 21 2002, 7:24 am by Jan - 6 messages - 4 authors
Animals found mutilated and drained of blood. - A piercing story Frightened farmers claimed to have seen bright lights and UFOs in the area where the deaths occurred. What was never explained was ... rec.arts.bodyart - Jul 2 2002, 3:54 am by Jan - 15 messages - 7 authors
how much should it cost for oral surgeon? "snow" <dless...@prexar.com> wrote in message Re: how much should it cost for oral surgeon? Fake Jan writes: Hello Snow! Why on ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 21 2002, 6:54 am by Jan - 5 messages - 4 authors
Dentists committing suicide? A recent study shows that 74% of the dentists committing suicide also regularly accept patients from Delta Dental while only 14% of the still-living dentists do ... alt.health.dental-amalgam - Jun 20 2002, 4:26 am by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
blown weekend I recently acquired some ectasy pills in the southern Ontario area. I've never seen them before and haven't been able to find them on safedance or ecstasy.org. ... alt.drugs.ecstasy - Jun 23 2002, 1:49 pm by Jan - 6 messages - 5 authors
Abscessed Teeth It seems very unusual that since New Years, three of us middle agers have all come down with our very first abscessed teeth. Has ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 19 2002, 5:04 am by Jan - 8 messages - 6 authors
What makes someone a Nazi? Jews teach the same monstrosities in their schools! So don't think for a minute that Palestinians are the only ones. There are lots ... soc.culture.jewish - Jun 23 2002, 2:53 pm by Jan - 14 messages - 6 authors
Seeking e-mail support group for TMJ Hi everyone, I know someone with severe TMJ pain, and I am wondering if anyone can point me to a good e-mail support group for this disorder, preferably one ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 11:05 am by Jan - 2 messages - 2 authors
Implant Pros and Cons JackSF <jac...@asia.com> wrote in message news:<3D194808.1FAA2...@asia.com>... Implant pros are guys like Dave King and Stan Golosov. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 29 2002, 8:40 am by Jan - 4 messages - 3 authors
what should i do? I have always really been into tattoos, for as long as i can remember. Recently at work, one of my best friends announced she was taking an aprenticeship. ... rec.arts.bodyart - Jun 30 2002, 10:37 am by Jan - 7 messages - 6 authors
tea effects please help me? what is the effects of tea or chamellia on dental carvies? REPLY: Oh tea makes dental carvies grow big! And Chamellia ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 11:07 am by Jan - 3 messages - 3 authors
Nonsense I believe the show was "Welcome Back KOTTER" :) 2thnurse Dear Cindi, Yup, but someone who inserts Gelfoam and sutures can be called "Klotter." Of course, Jan ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 23 2002, 11:49 am by Jan - 10 messages - 7 authors
Bonding Composit with bleading gums "Mike" <no.s...@please.com> wrote in message news:<nS7S8.30364$rX.5353339@e420r- atl1.usenetserver.com>... TYPO CORRECTED: It is actually spelled bleating gums. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 29 2002, 8:34 am by Jan - 8 messages - 7 authors
Anyone recommend a mercury 'detox in a box' product? What??? Does this mean the American MEDICAL Association is also in denial along with the American Dental Association? This says ... alt.health - Jun 20 2002, 4:11 am by Jan - 42 messages - 15 authors
The patient's experiences Well I just can't seem to type or proof read today. It may have something to do with being distracted by an umbrella cockatoo sitting ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 16 2002, 10:15 am by Jan - 24 messages - 9 authors
"Show us your tits!" [snip] My left nipple is now considerably larger than my right, fwiw. You're not alone. My left nip has been done twice (once horiz ... rec.arts.bodyart - Jun 30 2002, 10:58 am by Jan - 4 messages - 4 authors
DAMS in the UK ? "Vaughn Simon" <vaughnsimonHATESS...@att.net> wrote in message news:<EEtQ8. 46576$LC3.3550...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>... ... alt.health.dental-amalgam - Jun 21 2002, 7:20 am by Jan - 6 messages - 4 authors
Japanese Abacus Math School Japanese Abacus Math School " The Art of Mental Calculation" www.jamsportland.com What is mental calculation, anyway? ... rec.arts.bodyart - Jul 2 2002, 3:27 am by Jan - 2 messages - 2 authors
Vent: Advice on possible cause for continuing pain? jdrew63...@aol.com (Jan) wrote in message All very good questions and thoughts. Wish I had all the answers. Just one point, I haven ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 29 2002, 8:44 am by Jan - 17 messages - 9 authors
Women move over 4 girls Guys I'm going to tell my women that I'm going to bring home at least two or three young girls to help out around the house when she is not up to doing all the ... rec.arts.bodyart - Jun 23 2002, 1:36 pm by Jan - 9 messages - 4 authors
Advice on possible cause for continuing pain? If you scroll down just a little on the following site there is a picture showing how referred pain from your temporal muscle may mimic tootache: http://www ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 5:48 am by Jan - 4 messages - 2 authors
I do not have a clue about ..... "Mercury detox proctology... ". What is "Mercury detox proctology... ?? Fake Jan PS- I think I had it and I do feel better and better. **** From: Hector (tristan2k ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 19 2002, 1:25 pm by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
Anyone recommend a mercury 'detox in a box' product? Charcoal tablets (can take several at a time as they're non toxic. Sun Chlorella. Going this route isn't overnight but constant use will do it for you. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 29 2002, 8:46 am by Jan - 7 messages - 6 authors
Hairy Balls If your wife has balls you are gay and couldn't really be married. Give us a break and don't post messages like this to the wrong lists. ... alt.aquaria - Jun 30 2002, 10:49 am by Jan - 6 messages - 6 authors
Local Telephone Company Assigns Same Number to Two Households MERCY! That is nothing! Can you imagine that Yahoo and AOL both assigned the same e-mail name to two different people? And I was first. ... comp.dcom.telecom - Jun 30 2002, 3:23 pm by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
Bill Gates complains to the Newpaper Guild and Yahoo! "There are too many instances of people impersonating me and now I am really mad," claimed Bill Gates of Redmond Washington. ""Anything ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 18 2002, 4:00 am by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
New tattoo - old man I have seen people get tattoos well into they're 80's which means I got alot of time left. P. REPLY: Yup ninety year old ladies ... rec.arts.bodyart - Jun 26 2002, 5:20 am by Jan - 11 messages - 8 authors
huge question "JOD2427" wrote ... IF I GOT MY TONGUE PIERCED AND DONT WANT MY DAD TO SEE IT AFTER TWO WEEKS CAN I CHANGE IT TO A CLEAR PLUG OR ... rec.arts.bodyart - Jun 30 2002, 10:46 am by Jan - 10 messages - 9 authors
Filling Question "Tear It All Down" <zyklonNOSPAMbzom...@hotmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:7UFG8.1074$ih1.826@nwrddc04.gnilink.net... I went ... alt.health.dental-amalgam - Jun 19 2002, 1:06 pm by Jan - 3 messages - 3 authors
Coffee Enemas From: pixfix (pix...@ywave.com) Subject: Re: Amalgam Illness Newsgroups: alt.health.dental-amalgam View this article only Date: 2002-04-26 02:14:25 PST I ... alt.health.dental-amalgam - Jun 19 2002, 4:29 pm by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
I'm so ill From: nicholas odonovan (nick1...@nodonovan.freeserve.co.uk) Subject: I'm so ill Newsgroups: alt.health.dental-amalgam View: (This is the only article in this ... alt.health.dental-amalgam - Jun 19 2002, 1:28 pm by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
Is it possible? I was wondering, can you get a Apadravya if you already have a prince albert? Yes. I know that they basically use the same bottom hole. ... rec.arts.bodyart - Jun 23 2002, 1:40 pm by Jan - 7 messages - 5 authors
LISTEN TO MY SHOW BTW- JEWS STINK http://members.odinsrage.com/vbs/radioshow.html ***** In a recent poll. 64% of Orthodox Rabbis admitted that they ... soc.culture.jewish - Jun 24 2002, 4:57 am by Jan - 4 messages - 4 authors
gum surgery hmm, i see doc in 2 weeks... any one got any advice or experience .. Sure ... I Recommend a one month vacation in Hawaii as substitute ..... and mercy. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 29 2002, 8:39 am by Jan - 5 messages - 3 authors
Wisconsin Dentist Measures Electrical Potentials in Metal ... Bring back the good old days when Wisconsin dentists tested their dentures by asking the patient to "Say cheese," instead of, "Say Mississippi." They tested ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 26 2002, 5:22 am by Jan - 7 messages - 4 authors
Health Canada Stumped on Amalgam? I am currently waiting for a reply to an enquiry concerning the thermoelectric properties of dental amalgams made to Philip Neufeld, Ph.D., Manager, Device ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 10:23 am by Jan - 14 messages - 7 authors
This Muslim is ONE SICK BITCH These Palestinian mothers produce an average of a dozen kids. Sacrificing say, half of them with a kill ratio of 10 to 1, and assuming ... soc.culture.jewish - Jun 25 2002, 4:33 am by Jan - 134 messages - 42 authors
Investing as a student I am currently a third year dental student set to graduate in 2004. Upon graduation I will have amassed approximately $100,000 in ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 26 2002, 4:46 am by Jan - 6 messages - 5 authors
Local orthodontist sued over horrible result! See for yourself. Jan Drew (Fake one) Before picture: http://www.foxnews. com/images/59478/0_21_175_cruise_tom.jpg After picture: http ... sci.med.dentistry - Jul 2 2002, 3:47 am by Jan - 7 messages - 5 authors
Biting back ... ouch! http://citypaper.net/articles/current/cover.shtml Biting Back Local activists say your mercury amalgam fillings could be poisoning you. ... sci.med.dentistry - May 24 2002, 4:48 pm by Jan - 5 messages - 4 authors
Just got my Mama Meucci bill. They are in denial .... Mercy! Those Canadians are in such denial. No wonder my Mama Meucci bills are so outrageous! I feel so sorry for those Canadians ..... ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 23 2002, 7:59 am by Jan - 2 messages - 2 authors
Vent: Advice on possible cause for continuing pain? Confirmed by a panoramic x ray? The first time I had a cavitation cleaned it didn't show anything on the x-ray, I requested it be cleaned anyway. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 23 2002, 6:33 am by Jan - 6 messages - 4 authors
Apparent Phenomena?! Hi Carabelli, Most patients that had amalgams removed with composite replacements have died - waited too long Aah, amalgam *is* dangerous .... I knew it! ... sci.med.dentistry - Jul 1 2002, 5:10 pm by Jan - 9 messages - 7 authors
Bonding Composit with bleading gums. Exactly the point that I was making on the last thread. *NO* restoration is meant to function with contaminated tooth structure. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 5:55 am by Jan - 12 messages - 7 authors
Olson Twins are Bi When you see them kiss each other you know they mean it and when there off camera they have sex in the open and not behind closed doors Are they the two that ... alt.genealogy - Jun 23 2002, 1:44 pm by Jan - 4 messages - 4 authors
Less flatulence after amalgam removal Researcher looks to mute the musical fruit By JACK SULLIVAN Associated Press FARGO - Sam Chang wants to mute the musical fruit. ... sci.med.dentistry - May 24 2002, 5:42 pm by Jan - 6 messages - 6 authors
Dentist burns up $250 in drills per tooth! Dentist burns up $250 in drills per tooth! "I'm not sure exactly how many but they were the bulk of the cost - approximately $250.00 ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 23 2002, 2:10 pm by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
Tom Cruise claims the US is terroristic ...... Fake Jan wrote. And cross-posted to both rab and sci.med.dentistry: .... and he wants NIC to raise their kids elsewhere, perhaps Australia. May I No. ... rec.arts.bodyart - Jul 3 2002, 7:07 pm by Jan - 32 messages - 15 authors
Need help with mouth sore I just developed some small sore areas at the back of my mouth. Its very near the tonsils' area. I took some pictures of it. I am ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 29 2002, 8:48 am by Jan - 2 messages - 2 authors
New Web Site Debuts -- Dental Watch From: Mark Thorson nos...@sonic.net Date: 6/30/02 3:49 PM Pacific Daylight Time Message-id: <3D1F8B19.ACF27620@sonic.net> Nice and untruthful for those who ... sci.med.dentistry - Jul 1 2002, 5:19 pm by Jan - 11 messages - 7 authors
Apologies to Marsha LAST POST: That was marshmallow not "marsha mallow." Now I shut up before I get in bigger trouble. sci.med.dentistry - Jun 26 2002, 5:04 am by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
Q: Changing views on restorations? keith.p.wa...@btinternet.com (Keith P Walsh) wrote in message news:<3d1e02ca.3734...@news.btinternet.com>... * REPLY BELOW ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 5:44 am by Jan - 5 messages - 5 authors
Poor man's chelation therapy Selected message from thread From: maria (mari...@planet.nl) Subject: Re: Mercury Test Results Newsgroups: alt.health.dental-amalgam View this article only Date ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 19 2002, 1:19 pm by Jan - 1 message - 1 author
I feel like an enabler. Hey SMDers, One of the women I work with has suffered with migraines for as long as I've known her. REPLY: Happened with my friend Charlie too. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 21 2002, 7:29 am by Jan - 7 messages - 4 authors
JEWISH FASCISTS news:rhOR8.12097$_r5.5465898@e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com... ISRAELI DEFACATION FORCE PRACTISES WORSE SAVAGERY AGAINST THE PALESTINIAN ... soc.culture.egyptian - Jun 25 2002, 4:27 am by Jan - 10 messages - 7 authors
crack or tooth decay? Is it some kind of crack or is it tooth decay? Do I need a root canal? Thanks for any information! Schedule an appointment with a dentist. ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 16 2002, 10:02 am by Jan - 6 messages - 6 authors
Can Porcelain inserts be drilled out? If I get a porcelain insert in a deep cavity, can it be drilled out at a later time? Or is the next step simply a crown? I hear ... sci.med.dentistry - Jun 30 2002, 5:52 am by Jan - 3 messages - 3 authors
carabelli - 27 Jul 2005 22:17 GMT > Here are the posts that Joel Eichen posted using Jan Drew's name............
we've already seen them, you missed most of them
... as
> cute as Ratbags Nidiffer finds this to be ... I find it appaling. I'm sure you do
> Ratbags Nidiffer's fellow Posse member Susan Schaezler used my name irrelevant
I don't go to those other groups and don't have the time or interest to look them up. And of course all the names and lies JD had concerning Joel are totally acceptable in your book.
bye bye
carabelli
Steven Fawks - 27 Jul 2005 21:34 GMT I would go further to state that Joel has probably annoyed and irritated each and every one of us that remain on smd at one time or another. That is not an excuse to make up a bunch of charges to cause him grief with his ISP.
It was a lowlife act of internet terrorism. If that person had any credibility before, it was certainly lost.
Fawks
> Yes, it was really hard to distinguish between Joel and Jan; especially > when Joel signed his posts "FAKE JAN". > I know I had to have someone explain it to me. clintonz@prodigy.net - 28 Jul 2005 17:11 GMT It would be similair to me posting as Ilena Petunia.
> Nobody except a complete idiot thought it was JD. Complete Idiot?
Interesting, wasn't someone recently floating a theory about Joel and Jan and something about a Hydra?
Steven Fawks - 28 Jul 2005 17:41 GMT Just for sucker bait and laughs.
Fawks
> It would be similair to me posting as Ilena Petunia. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Interesting, wasn't someone recently floating a theory > about Joel and Jan and something about a Hydra? Tony Bad - 26 Jul 2005 20:19 GMT > So Vaughn ... what is shameful about those interested in dentistry > learning cutting edge information on the harm of chemicals ... even in > small amounts?? Cutting edge? Is this really news to you...that anything you put into the body can and will have some effect? You seem to fancy yourself as some health crusader, yet you seem incapable of distinguishing news from blinding flashes of the obvious.
T
clintonz@prodigy.net - 27 Jul 2005 02:58 GMT > > So Vaughn ... what is shameful about those interested in dentistry > > learning cutting edge information on the harm of chemicals ... even in [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > health crusader, yet you seem incapable of distinguishing news from blinding > flashes of the obvious. This is the cutting edge part:
"An especially striking finding: It appears that some substances may have effects at the very lowest exposures that are absent at higher levels".
> T carabelli - 27 Jul 2005 03:18 GMT >> > So Vaughn ... what is shameful about those interested in dentistry >> > learning cutting edge information on the harm of chemicals ... even in [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > have effects at the very lowest exposures that are absent at higher > levels". Obviously homeopathicphobic
carabelli
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