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Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / May 2005

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Swaged Crown (just in case!) ... Long Lasting!

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Joel M. Eichen - 05 May 2005 15:25 GMT
HISTORICAL ONLY  ... do not try this at home ...
~ or in the dental office, come to think of it!

Long lasting ......

.....had the crown and cement placed when she was 6 years old. She died at
age 102 with the Red Copper cement exposed through her worn gold swaged
crown. No decay was present around the Red Copper cement. The crown was
placed by Doc Holliday, famous dentist and side-kick of Wyatt Earp, a famous
US sheriff in the Old West (1870's).

Joel

http://www.copalite.com/FAQ_re_DOCS_BEST_CEMENT_and_COPALITE.htm

Tell me more about copper.

Copper in low therapeutic doses promotes pulpal health and retards decay. In
nature, copper is an inorganic mineral and is reported to rebuild collagen
fibers and retard decay. The formulation for the DOC'S BESTT products has a
very low dose of copper activated by metallic salts.

How long has Red Copper Cement been used in dentistry?

For over 200 years dentists in the US and Europe cemented gold swaged crowns
with Red Copper cement. The ingredients in the  older formulations had very
high doses of copper. The swage crowns were preformed, stamped in sheets of
gold, much like our aluminum temporary crowns are today. The gold was thin
and could be crimped easily around the tooth. The gold was 22 karat, which
is soft. Through the years the patient would wear away the gold by just
normal chewing, and the Red Copper cement would be exposed. The tooth was
still protected by the Red Copper cement. It was more durable to the forces
of mastication than the gold. The oldest recorded patient with a gold swaged
crown and Red Copper cement that we could find documentation, was a woman
who had the crown and cement placed when she was 6 years old. She died at
age 102 with the Red Copper cement exposed through her worn gold swaged
crown. No decay was present around the Red Copper cement. The crown was
placed by Doc Holliday, famous dentist and side-kick of Wyatt Earp, a famous
US sheriff in the Old West (1870's).

How is the DOC'S BESTT Red Cement different from the DOC'S BESTT White
Cement?

These cements are only different in color. They have the same properties.
The DOC'S BESTT Red Cement has a slightly greater compressive strength and
is recommended to be placed in posterior teeth. The DOC'S BESTT White Cement
is more aesthetically pleasing under anterior fillings. The new White Copper
Plus formulation rivals the physical properties of any red copper cement and
better esthetics that the White.
Dr Steve - 05 May 2005 15:56 GMT
One the first things my Dad learned in Dental Technology was to make swaged
gold crowns using a hammer and die.  Then soldering the folds.
Unfortunately, I find it much more interesting to listen to how dentistry
was done in the 1940's than Dad is interested in talking about it.

Signature

~+--~+--~+--~+--~+--
Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S.
Michigan, USA
....................................................

This posting is intended for informational or conversational purposes only.
Always seek the opinion of a licensed dental professional before acting on
the advice or opinion expressed here.  Only a dentist who has examined you
in person can diagnose your problems and make decisions which will affect
your health.
......................

> HISTORICAL ONLY  ... do not try this at home ...
> ~ or in the dental office, come to think of it!
[quoted text clipped - 57 lines]
> and
> better esthetics that the White.
Joel M. Eichen - 05 May 2005 17:15 GMT
> One the first things my Dad learned in Dental Technology was to make swaged
> gold crowns using a hammer and die.  Then soldering the folds.
> Unfortunately, I find it much more interesting to listen to how dentistry
> was done in the 1940's than Dad is interested in talking about it.
>
> --

Problem was the fit around the gums ......
still, the good ones preserved teeth for decades longer!

Joel

> ~+--~+--~+--~+--~+--
> Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S.
[quoted text clipped - 68 lines]
> > and
> > better esthetics that the White.
Dr Steve - 05 May 2005 21:40 GMT
>> One the first things my Dad learned in Dental Technology was to make
> swaged
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Joel

I agree
StovePipe - 08 May 2005 18:16 GMT
> Problem was the fit around the gums ......
> still, the good ones preserved teeth for decades longer!
>
> Joel

Has anybody but me noticed a stainless steel crown or two (or five) in
someone's mouth, first noticed, say, by a quick gander at the
newly-taken bitewings? They look TERRIBLE!!! No marginal adaptation,
overhangs a mile wide, and looking like marshmallows in silhouette?

Then, with mounting apprehension, I look in the real mouth at these
things: NO inflammation. NO residual decay. In fact, NO adverse effects
to be seen, apart from the clearly verifiable overhangs.

Then I ask, and the patient says that they were temps, only meant to
stay in for a few months or so, and that was ten years ago...

What do you say to a patient like that?
SP
Signature

Finally: take out the TRASHH

W_B - 09 May 2005 17:14 GMT
>What do you say to a patient like that?
>SP

You need real crowns.
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
StovePipe - 14 May 2005 20:22 GMT
> >What do you say to a patient like that?
> >SP
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> Take out the G'RBAGE
> wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com

..And the patient replies: Why? It's been in there like that for eight
years and I've never had a problem... All the other dentists told me the
same, and I've never had any problems what ever...
SP
Signature

Finally: take out the TRASHH

W_B - 16 May 2005 16:45 GMT
>> On Sun, 8 May 2005 13:16:29 -0400, stove99pipeTRA@SHHyahoo.ca (StovePipe)
>wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>same, and I've never had any problems what ever...
>SP

Show them the bone loss and gingival inflammation.
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
StovePipe - 16 May 2005 17:12 GMT
> >> On Sun, 8 May 2005 13:16:29 -0400, stove99pipeTRA@SHHyahoo.ca (StovePipe)
> >wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
> Take out the G'RBAGE
> wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com

I _would_ if there _was_ those signs. But I can think of one guy were
this is the thing. No inflamm, no bone loss, and he is a smoker, so the
antiinflammatory is his nicotine. I have told him they will eventually
all go like dominoes, or if he quits smoking they'll go, but to date, I
can't say that has happened.

So, there ya go...
SP
Signature

Finally: take out the TRASHH

W_B - 16 May 2005 20:08 GMT
>> >..And the patient replies: Why? It's been in there like that for eight
>> >years and I've never had a problem... All the other dentists told me the
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>So, there ya go...
>SP

Then just say: "Next !"
--

W_B
Take out the G'RBAGE
wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com
StovePipe - 17 May 2005 06:13 GMT
> >> Show them the bone loss and gingival inflammation.
> >> --
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> Then just say: "Next !"

Yeah, 'guess that's about awl ah kan do....
Mighty obliged...
SP
Signature

Finally: take out the TRASHH

Roy Brown - 06 May 2005 05:38 GMT
I've got some old texts that describe it in detail. Hardcover, paper and dry.
You are welcome to borrow.

I know, they are not the same as listing to Dad while eating Mom's cooking.

Signature

Roy
rem NADA to reply

| One the first things my Dad learned in Dental Technology was to make swaged
| gold crowns using a hammer and die.  Then soldering the folds.
[quoted text clipped - 62 lines]
| > and
| > better esthetics that the White.
 
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