Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / February 2005
Social Security -should Bush reform the system?
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Lewis Lang - 06 Feb 2005 10:56 GMT GW Bush says that he wants to switch from the current Social Security system to an individual retirement account (IRA?) system. He swears that people over 50 will not be affected. What about the people under 50? Will they get screwed?
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Lewis Lang
jsn - 06 Feb 2005 14:12 GMT > GW Bush says that he wants to switch from the current Social Security > system to an individual retirement account (IRA?) system. He swears [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Lewis Lang 2/6/05 Minneapolis Star-Tribune Editorial: Young workers/The real victims of Bush's plan
There are so many deceptions to discuss in President Bush's plan for dismantling Social Security, and many of them require complex explanations to show just how deceptive they are. For now, let's take on a couple. Please pay attention, young workers, because you get taken to the cleaners by his plan.
The structure of Bush's private accounts isn't new; it was offered as "Plan 2" by the 2004 President's Commission to Strengthen Social Security, so it has been pretty well studied.
In addition to the private accounts, the Bush plan envisions future benefit cuts for everyone. The line being peddled by the White House is that private accounts would more than offset the cuts, leaving younger people better off. That is simply not the case.
Using figures and economic assumptions from the Congressional Budget Office, the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, a highly regarded think tank in Washington, did the calculations. Here's what they found for first-year benefits for a worker now 25, of median income, who retires at age 65:
- If nothing is done to Social Security, some time between 2042 and 2052 (opinions differ) there would not be enough revenue flowing into the program from payroll taxes and its trust fund to cover the benefits flowing out. If benefits then were cut just enough to make up the difference, our hypothetical worker's annual benefits at retirement would decline $800, from $20,500 to $19,700.
- If the Bush plan is enacted, our worker puts the maximum allowable amount into a private account and the economy performs as the CBO expects, our worker would get only $13,097. Who wants to sign up?
Bush also says you own your private account and that you can pass it on to your heirs. Neither is true. In effect, the government loans you part of your Social Security tax to invest in a private account. But through a mechanism called "benefit offsets" that loan must be repaid at retirement, with interest (starting at 3 percent but adjusted for inflation).
What does that mean? Let's say you put $1,000 in your private account annually for 40 years, and you get a pretty-good 4 percent annual earnings on your investment. The value of your account would grow to $99,800. But the government would deduct $78,700 from your Social Security benefits, leaving you only $21,100, about 20 percent of what your account had accrued. If you earn only 3 percent on your investments, you don't come out a dime ahead from the private account, but you still suffer cuts in your guaranteed benefits.
In addition, most of the money in your private account could be passed to your heirs only if you die before you retire. The government would convert most of the value of your account into an annuity and give it to your heirs. If you live to retirement, the annuity goes to you, and when you die, whether one day or 20 years after retirement, the remaining value of the annuity reverts to Uncle Sam.
Younger workers should not be bamboozled. Something must be done to ensure Social Security pays them the benefits they deserve, but the system is in no danger of "bankruptcy." Bush's plan would make the existing problem worse rather than better, and younger people would bear the resulting financial pain.
MC60614 - 07 Feb 2005 02:47 GMT It's all so stupid. There Aint no money because Bush is spending it all plus and now he want's to gable with the peoples money. Remember he NEVER knew what it felt like to be without anything he wanted...MC
Joel M. Eichen - 07 Feb 2005 13:45 GMT >It's all so stupid. There Aint no money because Bush is spending it all plus >and now he want's to gable with the peoples money. Remember he NEVER knew what >it felt like to be without anything he wanted...MC I am against gabling .......... I prefer the Mansard ones myself.
Vaughn Simon - 07 Feb 2005 12:55 GMT > > GW Bush says that he wants to switch from the current Social Security > > system to an individual retirement account (IRA?) system. He swears [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > There are so many deceptions to discuss in President Bush's plan for > dismantling Social Security, And the deceptions start with the language the President is using to sell his plan. Alternately, he says the fund is either 'going bust" or "going bankrupt", when actually neither is the case. Then he offers a "plan", but if you read between the lines you find that the "plan" actually makes things worse.
Now I know what Dorothy must have felt like when she was trying to figure out the land of Oz.
Vaughn
All Things Mopar - 07 Feb 2005 14:39 GMT Vaughn Simon commented courteously ...
[snip]
> ... Alternately, he says the fund is either 'going bust" > or "going bankrupt", when actually neither is the case. > Then he offers a "plan", but if you read between the > lines you find that the "plan" actually makes things > worse. First, the Social Security Trust Fund can't actually "go bust", since it is constantly being fed by ever increasing tax revenue, and the Feds, when threatened by draconian cuts, will act hastily to prop up the system sometime in the future, whichever party is in power when it happens.
However, independent studies, not just the Federal government's ludicrous projections (the SS Administration isn't subject to party politics), strongly suggest that by around 2017 at the earliest, and likely by 2030-2035, the number of people working and paying into the trust fund compared to the number of people receiving benefits, will drop to the point that today's levels of benefits will not be sustainable, much less continue to minimally keep up with inflation.
The idea of both Democratic and Replican schemes to fix this (as announced by JFK and W during the campaign and delineated in their web site long-winded platform documents), is to tweak various aspects of the formula, including taxation percentage increases, retirement age with full benefits, inflation, differences in life expectancy between men and women, and some other things. The Donkeys and Elephants have pretty divergent views on how to repair Social Security, but they both acknowledge that something must be done. But, both agree that the flat tax, shared by employers which makes the US less competive in the world marketplace, is highly regressive.
And, the longer they wait, the more drastic the fix will be when it finally comes.
As to deception in the plan, since W did, in fact win the election, I'd like to wait until he rolls out the actual plan before making up my mind if he's an idiot or demagogue. He's empaneled a Blue Ribbon Committee to study this, let's let them do their work.
Please keep in mind that the "political 3rd rail" aspect of messing with the grey lobby's voting strenth, makes it highly likely that even the Republicans in the House and Senate will tend to be a highly moderating factor to anything radical or egregious that W might try to ram through. He's got only grudging approval for limited privitation, for example, and plenty of critics in his own party. Hence the road trip to try to drum up support for his plan (which has only been exposed in the broadest of strokes).
And, just whose ox is being gored will ultimately determine if the W plan is better or worse. For example, people older than 55, like myself, probably won't see any differences at all, since W is unlikely to cut benefits (he could up my retirement age but hasn't said anything about changing the age 62 partial-benefit start that I intend to use).
Younger people, on the other hand, may see higher taxes and/or see their retirement age stretch out, plus they will have to suffer with the clear uncertainty and risks that any plan relying on the stock and bond market for its long-term return-on-investment.
Also, please remember that even if you are a full- contributor (i.e., you will get maximum allowable benefits), you will still be at the poverty level unless your company has a retirement plan and you're one of the fortunate ones who have a private financial portfolio and a 401K plan to augment your company's plan and Social Security.
 Signature ATM, aka Jerry
MC60614 - 08 Feb 2005 08:48 GMT Yea, But OZ turned out to be a good thing...MC
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